Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jan 4, 2017 12:56:16 GMT -5
I'm not disagreeing with you. I'm definitely working on the real estate angle because I am to the point that I just dont' want to work anymore I hope that you get a nice raise that isn't contingent on you rescinding the resignation. And that you still leave them to clean up their own messes. I don't think they are THAT generous!lol But it would be nice
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jan 4, 2017 12:56:52 GMT -5
can you extend your stay til 12/31/17 and get 24 months severance? Well I can put it on my list of demands....lol
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rob base
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Post by rob base on Jan 5, 2017 18:42:21 GMT -5
Any updates?
And have you thought about my job offer? :-)
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jan 5, 2017 21:13:54 GMT -5
Any updates? And have you thought about my job offer? :-) I don't think you would pay as well... I won't know anything until next week. And I'm trying to take time to really think what I want to do
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beergut
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Post by beergut on Jan 12, 2017 23:24:10 GMT -5
I didn't quite pull a Dark as I have to give 6 months notice or I forfeit a pretty generous non-compete.
I have never in my over 20 years professional career felt that I was paid less because I was a woman. But that changed last week. Claims of sexual discrimination in pay always irk me, because they're illogical on the face. You aren't getting paid less because you're a woman, he isn't getting paid more because he's a man. You're getting paid less because they think they can get away with paying you less, nothing more to it than that. They don't pay people more because they have a penis or less because they have a vagina, they pay people as little as they think they can get away with, because that increases their profitability, and businesses exist to make a profit. If women truly were paid less than men for the same work, companies would only hire women. Women are paid less than men for the same positions because they accept lower salaries, not because there is some huge sexual discrimination conspiracy at work.
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jan 12, 2017 23:35:27 GMT -5
Any updates? And have you thought about my job offer? :-) I don't think you would pay as well...I won't know anything until next week. And I'm trying to take time to really think what I want to do I for one pay VERY well. It just wouldn't be monetary. Is that a problem?
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justme
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Post by justme on Jan 12, 2017 23:53:37 GMT -5
I didn't quite pull a Dark as I have to give 6 months notice or I forfeit a pretty generous non-compete.
I have never in my over 20 years professional career felt that I was paid less because I was a woman. But that changed last week. Claims of sexual discrimination in pay always irk me, because they're illogical on the face. You aren't getting paid less because you're a woman, he isn't getting paid more because he's a man. You're getting paid less because they think they can get away with paying you less, nothing more to it than that. They don't pay people more because they have a penis or less because they have a vagina, they pay people as little as they think they can get away with, because that increases their profitability, and businesses exist to make a profit. If women truly were paid less than men for the same work, companies would only hire women. Women are paid less than men for the same positions because they accept lower salaries, not because there is some huge sexual discrimination conspiracy at work. *rollseyes* There's not enough women out there to do every job even of they were properly trained, so your hypothesis falls flat on its face. That being said, after a year at my first job they hired someone new. He was actually a year behind me in high school and like fuck he had better grades or extracurricular than me (his stoner ass was lucky they didn't drug test). They had me train him - for every aspect of the job. I found out not too long after, not only did they hire him at higher than what I was hired at, but higher than what was making while I trained him. With a stumbling no answer to the reason for the discrepancy and no action to correct it on their part. From that point I refused to help him, told him to go ask someone who made more than him (oh that was fun for management to drag their ass out of the office) and they were dumbfounded when I left...for a job paying almost fifty percent more. I also walked in before they posted next week's schedule and told them to leave me off it. So you tell me, why would someone with less experience and credentials be hired at a lower level than the person training them?
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Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Jan 13, 2017 0:12:07 GMT -5
Any updates? And have you thought about my job offer? :-) I don't think you would pay as well... I won't know anything until next week. And I'm trying to take time to really think what I want to do Has anything happened, and how are you doing ?
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beergut
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Post by beergut on Jan 13, 2017 6:48:47 GMT -5
Claims of sexual discrimination in pay always irk me, because they're illogical on the face. You aren't getting paid less because you're a woman, he isn't getting paid more because he's a man. You're getting paid less because they think they can get away with paying you less, nothing more to it than that. They don't pay people more because they have a penis or less because they have a vagina, they pay people as little as they think they can get away with, because that increases their profitability, and businesses exist to make a profit. If women truly were paid less than men for the same work, companies would only hire women. Women are paid less than men for the same positions because they accept lower salaries, not because there is some huge sexual discrimination conspiracy at work. *rollseyes* There's not enough women out there to do every job even of they were properly trained, so your hypothesis falls flat on its face. That being said, after a year at my first job they hired someone new. He was actually a year behind me in high school and like fuck he had better grades or extracurricular than me (his stoner ass was lucky they didn't drug test). They had me train him - for every aspect of the job. I found out not too long after, not only did they hire him at higher than what I was hired at, but higher than what was making while I trained him. With a stumbling no answer to the reason for the discrepancy and no action to correct it on their part. From that point I refused to help him, told him to go ask someone who made more than him (oh that was fun for management to drag their ass out of the office) and they were dumbfounded when I left...for a job paying almost fifty percent more. I also walked in before they posted next week's schedule and told them to leave me off it. So you tell me, why would someone with less experience and credentials be hired at a lower level than the person training them? Because when they hired you, you accepted a lower salary to work there, and when they hired him, he demanded a higher salary to work there.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Jan 13, 2017 6:59:05 GMT -5
That is a very valid point. Men are often paid more simply because they ask for more upfront. And you can't fault someone for asking and getting more. I learned that myself years ago. That I have to negotiate better as well.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jan 13, 2017 7:28:02 GMT -5
*rollseyes* There's not enough women out there to do every job even of they were properly trained, so your hypothesis falls flat on its face. That being said, after a year at my first job they hired someone new. He was actually a year behind me in high school and like fuck he had better grades or extracurricular than me (his stoner ass was lucky they didn't drug test). They had me train him - for every aspect of the job. I found out not too long after, not only did they hire him at higher than what I was hired at, but higher than what was making while I trained him. With a stumbling no answer to the reason for the discrepancy and no action to correct it on their part. From that point I refused to help him, told him to go ask someone who made more than him (oh that was fun for management to drag their ass out of the office) and they were dumbfounded when I left...for a job paying almost fifty percent more. I also walked in before they posted next week's schedule and told them to leave me off it. So you tell me, why would someone with less experience and credentials be hired at a lower level than the person training them? Because when they hired you, you accepted a lower salary to work there, and when they hired him, he demanded a higher salary to work there. Its much more than that. Most hiring decisions are not about logic. If they were, employers would be snapping up older folk with experience willing to take lower salaries. But they aren't. Its because it offends their sensibilities of the natural world order, so they look for younger people they have to train more. Its isn't logic that compels them.
Studies have shown ageist and gender bias repeatedly. Men are allowed to and expected to ask for more money. Women are punished in most cases for acting the same way. That's not logic. That's emotional and societal bias at play. You pay men more because you feel men are better. Not because they actually are.
And if companies really only hired people to pay them the lowest they can, why does anyone ever reach the high end of a salary band? Why aren't companies continually letting go of people and hiring people at the low end? (Because there's more in play than simply pay ... duh.)
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justme
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Post by justme on Jan 13, 2017 9:04:42 GMT -5
*rollseyes* There's not enough women out there to do every job even of they were properly trained, so your hypothesis falls flat on its face. That being said, after a year at my first job they hired someone new. He was actually a year behind me in high school and like fuck he had better grades or extracurricular than me (his stoner ass was lucky they didn't drug test). They had me train him - for every aspect of the job. I found out not too long after, not only did they hire him at higher than what I was hired at, but higher than what was making while I trained him. With a stumbling no answer to the reason for the discrepancy and no action to correct it on their part. From that point I refused to help him, told him to go ask someone who made more than him (oh that was fun for management to drag their ass out of the office) and they were dumbfounded when I left...for a job paying almost fifty percent more. I also walked in before they posted next week's schedule and told them to leave me off it. So you tell me, why would someone with less experience and credentials be hired at a lower level than the person training them? Because when they hired you, you accepted a lower salary to work there, and when they hired him, he demanded a higher salary to work there. Wrong. I talked to him...that's how I found out the difference. What he made was what he was offered. This was a stupid high school job...you were happy to find one no one was making demands.
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chen35
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Post by chen35 on Jan 13, 2017 10:23:23 GMT -5
In 7 years I've only had two people negotiate salary (out of probably 15?). Both men, and both were just using our offer to get a counteroffer at the company they were with (turns out). It's left me a little jaded.
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emma1420
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Post by emma1420 on Jan 13, 2017 10:38:26 GMT -5
In 7 years I've only had two people negotiate salary (out of probably 15?). Both men, and both were just using our offer to get a counteroffer at the company they were with (turns out). It's left me a little jaded. I've tried to negotiate salary at every job I've ever been offered. Of those attempts, two withdrew the offers when I tried to negotiate. Four held firm, and the rest negotiated upwards by a very modest amount (but every penny counts). I know that when I talked to my co-workers the men I work with all expected to negotiate and none of them had had an offer withdrawn because of an attempt to negotiate. I do think it's a case of where every woman needs to try and negotiate so that employers expect it, but employers also need to realize that women expect to paid the same as men with the same skills and responsibilities.
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HoneyBBQ
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Post by HoneyBBQ on Jan 13, 2017 10:39:31 GMT -5
*rollseyes* There's not enough women out there to do every job even of they were properly trained, so your hypothesis falls flat on its face. That being said, after a year at my first job they hired someone new. He was actually a year behind me in high school and like fuck he had better grades or extracurricular than me (his stoner ass was lucky they didn't drug test). They had me train him - for every aspect of the job. I found out not too long after, not only did they hire him at higher than what I was hired at, but higher than what was making while I trained him. With a stumbling no answer to the reason for the discrepancy and no action to correct it on their part. From that point I refused to help him, told him to go ask someone who made more than him (oh that was fun for management to drag their ass out of the office) and they were dumbfounded when I left...for a job paying almost fifty percent more. I also walked in before they posted next week's schedule and told them to leave me off it. So you tell me, why would someone with less experience and credentials be hired at a lower level than the person training them? Because when they hired you, you accepted a lower salary to work there, and when they hired him, he demanded a higher salary to work there. True. But it's been well studied that even when women ask in the same tone and use the same words to try to negotiate they are seen in a different light than a man who asks for the same thing. Ultimately men are always more successful in negotiation because a)they usually are negotiating with a man and b) they are expected to negotiate whereas women are not. If that's not sexism.... lol.
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chen35
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Post by chen35 on Jan 13, 2017 10:43:51 GMT -5
In 7 years I've only had two people negotiate salary (out of probably 15?). Both men, and both were just using our offer to get a counteroffer at the company they were with (turns out). It's left me a little jaded. I've tried to negotiate salary at every job I've ever been offered. Of those attempts, two withdrew the offers when I tried to negotiate. Four held firm, and the rest negotiated upwards by a very modest amount (but every penny counts). I know that when I talked to my co-workers the men I work with all expected to negotiate and none of them had had an offer withdrawn because of an attempt to negotiate. I do think it's a case of where every woman needs to try and negotiate so that employers expect it, but employers also need to realize that women expect to paid the same as men with the same skills and responsibilities. I agree women are more penalized for negotiating. And I agree in theory that everyone should try to negotiate. My experience just makes me a little annoyed by it. Both men who negotiated got a slight bump in offer, they just didn't take it.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 13, 2017 10:48:09 GMT -5
Interesting.
Miss T finds out she is paid less than a guy that she has to assist in his job duties.
It's her fault for not negotiating better.
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milee
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Post by milee on Jan 13, 2017 10:53:29 GMT -5
Interesting.
Miss T finds out she is paid less than a guy that she has to assist in his job duties.
It's her fault for not negotiating better.
And we should probably find out what she was wearing. That could be a critical factor here.
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Bonny
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Post by Bonny on Jan 13, 2017 10:57:14 GMT -5
You're never going to get sane hours and I think that's your biggest issue aside from all the crap they on you to clean up. I'm not sure how they fix that aside from hire more staff and I don't see that happening. Find somewhere new to go and get that real estate booming I'm not disagreeing with you. I'm definitely working on the real estate angle because I am to the point that I just dont' want to work anymore You know the real estate is work too, right?
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Jan 13, 2017 11:00:27 GMT -5
Interesting.
Miss T finds out she is paid less than a guy that she has to assist in his job duties.
It's her fault for not negotiating better.
And we should probably find out what she was wearing. That could be a critical factor here. I'm sure it's because she dresses too feminine.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2017 11:02:28 GMT -5
Or not 'feminine' enough...
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Jan 13, 2017 11:04:37 GMT -5
Y'all went there... Lmao
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milee
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Post by milee on Jan 13, 2017 11:16:21 GMT -5
And we should probably find out what she was wearing. That could be a critical factor here. I'm sure it's because she dresses too feminine. I'm going to make sure I teach my daughters not to wear things like that. Not that I'm implying this was Miss Ts fault, but ... (Do I really have to put the sarcasm emoji here?)
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Bonny
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Post by Bonny on Jan 13, 2017 11:18:20 GMT -5
In 7 years I've only had two people negotiate salary (out of probably 15?). Both men, and both were just using our offer to get a counteroffer at the company they were with (turns out). It's left me a little jaded. This is interesting.
I have only pushed back on one job offer. It was the unsolicited offer from the other agency which I wound up not taking. But I really did go through a soul searching process about what I wanted to do.
In the other cases I was grateful to have a job. I was looking for work during a slow economy. In hindsight I probably could have negotiated harder with the last two paid gigs but I wanted to buy houses. In one case we closed escrow the day I got the job offer. In the other, the day I got the job offer I bumped my across the street neighbor's contingent offer for a house four doors up the street from our house and bought the house non contingent.
The choices I've made...
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Bonny
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Post by Bonny on Jan 13, 2017 11:26:59 GMT -5
Or not 'feminine' enough... You mean the plunging neckline?
I heard a really funny story recently from DH's former boss with whom we've become friends. He was telling the story about how several of his employees were complaining about a co-worker who was so proud of her boob-job that she felt the need to have them on constant display. FWIW both male and female employees were complaining. We were busting up about how he had to give her a "talk".
These stories make me grateful I wasn't in upper management or HR.
I'm sure Tennesseer has some tales about how unprofessional dress can go the wrong way for BOTH sexes.
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Regis
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Post by Regis on Jan 13, 2017 11:47:39 GMT -5
Or not 'feminine' enough... You mean the plunging neckline?
I heard a really funny story recently from DH's former boss with whom we've become friends. He was telling the story about how several of his employees were complaining about a co-worker who was so proud of her boob-job that she felt the need to have them on constant display. FWIW both male and female employees were complaining. We were busting up about how he had to give her a "talk".
These stories make me grateful I wasn't in upper management or HR.
I'm sure Tennesseer has some tales about how unprofessional dress can go the wrong way for BOTH sexes.
You had to put "busting up" in there, didn't ya?
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Jan 13, 2017 12:06:08 GMT -5
I'm sure it's because she dresses too feminine. I'm going to make sure I teach my daughters not to wear things like that. Not that I'm implying this was Miss Ts fault, but ... (Do I really have to put the sarcasm emoji her?) Daughters? Are you making an announcement? J/k.
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Jan 13, 2017 12:06:59 GMT -5
You mean the plunging neckline?
I heard a really funny story recently from DH's former boss with whom we've become friends. He was telling the story about how several of his employees were complaining about a co-worker who was so proud of her boob-job that she felt the need to have them on constant display. FWIW both male and female employees were complaining. We were busting up about how he had to give her a "talk".
These stories make me grateful I wasn't in upper management or HR.
I'm sure Tennesseer has some tales about how unprofessional dress can go the wrong way for BOTH sexes.
You had to put "busting up" in there, didn't ya? Tit happens.
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milee
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Post by milee on Jan 13, 2017 12:18:27 GMT -5
I'm going to make sure I teach my daughters not to wear things like that. Not that I'm implying this was Miss Ts fault, but ... (Do I really have to put the sarcasm emoji her?) Daughters? Are you making an announcement? J/k. No way - remember, I don't have maternity coverage. As a responsible YMer, I wouldn't reproduce without the proper insurance in place.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2017 12:21:11 GMT -5
You really must plan ahead, because we'll soon be back to pregnancy as a pre existing condition.
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