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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2014 20:40:42 GMT -5
I think time to put your foot down was prior to both of the pregnancies (i am not at all saying it is your fault by any means). At this point, i would take her and grandkids in. You are her mother and the babies' grandmother. Would you really be able to sleep at night if your daughter and grandkids are in a shelter? Yes everyone thinks it would be enabling her but she only has one mom, the person she should be able to trust no matter how old she is.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2014 5:59:06 GMT -5
Pink it's a tough situation, and I don't really have any advice for you, just hugs. I'm sorry you are hurting like this.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2014 6:37:31 GMT -5
Pink it's a tough situation, and I don't really have any advice for you, just hugs. I'm sorry you are hurting like this. X 2
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Feb 7, 2014 8:41:11 GMT -5
I personally would not have a problem if one if my children wants to live at home. As long asthere is so cocontribution physical help, financial etc.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 7, 2014 8:44:05 GMT -5
But there isn't going to be. Pinks DD had time to pull head out of butt and chose to do otherwise. Thought ANOTHER man would fix whatever is wrong with her life. Smart women know men complicate lives not fix them but for some women, it takes years to figure that out. Like me!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2014 8:45:14 GMT -5
I personally would not have a problem if one if my children wants to live at home. As long asthere is so cocontribution physical help, financial etc. LOL ya, I don't mind living with people that behave perfectly either. That is kinda the sticking point here Shooby.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Feb 7, 2014 8:48:01 GMT -5
I couldn't turn out my daughter. I just couldn't.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2014 8:50:15 GMT -5
I couldn't turn out my daughter. I just couldn't. Oooooh Shooby, don't tempt fate like that. Just pray you are never in a position to have to make that choice.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Feb 7, 2014 8:53:03 GMT -5
I am not criticizing the op she should do what she feels she she should do.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Feb 7, 2014 8:55:04 GMT -5
I would also look into Catholic Charities. Depending on where you live, housing could be an an issue. My city no longer accepts applications for section 8 housing. It's been like that for at least 2-3 years now, because the wait list is so long. I know my city is not the only one. I'm catholic, and my church's community center houses a pregnancy crisis center. My church is also part of a bunch of churches that provides limited term housing for homeless folks with kids. Catholic Charities may also help your daughter decide if she should adopt or keep the child. I'd also call the United Way. They would know of pregnancy crisis centers, etc. I'm sorry you are going through this. Like other hard decisions in life, we can presume how we would act ahead of time, but until we actually experience the situation, we really don't know what we are going to do. I've heard really good things about Lutheran services too. I've not used them but I think my BIL and his wife did, prior to adopting DN#6. It's LSSWis - Lutheran Social Services (LSS) of Wisconsin and Upper Michigan for us. Illinois is www.lssi.org/ (because I have a vague thought you're in Chicago...)
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ginpin
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Post by ginpin on Feb 7, 2014 8:55:55 GMT -5
I am sorry for your troubles, as well. I had a similar thing happen, but it was with my mom. She didn't really know how to manage money, so ended up having to move in with me for nine months in 2010. My dad then passed away, so she was able to move out on her own. It took her just a little over a year to blow what I estimate was over $100,000 in insurance money...so she had to move back in. This time I had laid down rules...like her dogs couldn't stay with me, that I was buying a house and she had to figure out what she was going to do because there wasn't room in the new house for her, that she had to get a job, etc etc. It was horrible. My sister & her friends gave me hell for not allowing the dogs to stay (I had a dog-aggressive Akita at the time, not a good mix), for not allowing her to stay indefinitely, other things. What no one understood was, my mom just wanted someone to support her. She did not want to work. She wanted to be able to stay home, play with the dogs, read, watch TV...that was it. She didn't want to help with chores, and it was making my kids so very resentful. I got where I didn't want to even come home at night, and didn't want to stay at home on the weekends, because she was ALWAYS there. It was a tough time for all of us. I closed on my new house, she went and moved to a over-55 apartment. The thing was, she didn't have a job at the time, so was only able to stay like 6 months before she was kicked out. I didn't let her move back. I still feel like shit today, because she had to move in with her cousin. He told her she could stay as long as she needed...I just don't know if he envisioned 1.5 years and counting. My mom did get a job, but it is part time. She is holding out for my dad's retirement, so she can quit. I know this wasn't helpful, but I hope that things work out alright for you and your daughter. It is really tough because there are kids involved. Good luck.
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Nazgul Girl
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Post by Nazgul Girl on Feb 7, 2014 8:57:23 GMT -5
I had a rough time with my DD while she was in her late teens, until she was about 19-20 y.o. Ultimately, I had to back off and let her make her own decisions. It was hard to see her go through what I had never had to experience, but she kept making bad decisions for a few years. At the end, she is much wiser than she would have been if I had just bailed her out over and over.
You don't want to set a pattern of letting your daughter live with you while she gets her act together, then go out in the world, make unwise (dumb-ass) decisions such as moving in with this guy and then getting pregnant by him even though he's a total loser, and then letting her come back "home" to flop at your house when the going gets tough.
She will probably be responsible for two kids, so there is no reason why she should start growing up right now. She can get a job even if she is pregnant. Grocery stores, mall stores, whatever, have openings. It doesn't matter if what she can find is selling earrings at Claires in the mall, or getting drinks for people at the local eatery.
If she needs to depend on the welfare system, then she needs to learn how to navigate through it. She needs to know where to go and how to get her son signed up for your state's child medicaid plan.
She needs to learn how to shop thrift stores, cook cheap meals, go to garage sales to get home furnishings and baby clothes. She needs to learn that she can get educated for little cost on scholarship at her local community college, or learn a skill in the adult education courses at the local high school in the evenings.
So, no, sad as it is, I would absolutely not let her move home.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 7, 2014 9:01:07 GMT -5
Most of those places are going to strongly encourage you to adopt your baby. It's the RIGHT call but most people are unable to make it. The hardest thing in the world I ever did was tell DD that she could no longer come around and bring losers with her. I knew I could totally lose my daughter forever but I couldn't take it anymore and I told her that, too. She, at least, dated better after that. She's 25 now and is she perfect? No, she has too much of her father in her but she is much better person than I ever thought she would be. She will be okay. Unfortunately Pink's daughter already has one child and now will be having another. She may someday rise above this but it's very hard when the govt pays you to make bad choices, one after the other. LOVE is not all you need to raise children. A child or someone with a child's mentality and maturity should not have a child but we, as taxpayers, fund this behavior, so it continues.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Feb 7, 2014 9:05:12 GMT -5
I'm not totally against letting a grown child move back home, by the way. In this case I am because you've already done it once. Helping somebody deal with a mistake is help. Helping them after they make the same mistake again is enabling. At least to me. I agree. Technically I moved back into my parents' house twice. The first time I paid off some bills and Dad and I couldn't live together so I moved out again. Second time was in name only, I was basically living with my now DH but mail and my stuff was at Mom and Dad's. DH had a shock when we moved my crap into his house... My younger brother's never moved out. And I know I've said it before but my siblings and I are damn glad he's there because Dad's got heart issues now. And Mom still isn't ready for a completely empty nest....
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2014 10:13:29 GMT -5
She had a job interview 2 weeks ago. She said it went well when she got back. They didn't hire her though. I don't think too many employers are eager to hire an obviously pregnant woman when there are so many other applicants.
She's willing to work fast-food, retail, whatever. To be fair, she was looking for jobs when she was living with me, not as diligently as I wanted, but she WAS applying and had a few interviews that didn't pan out.
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NancysSummerSip
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Post by NancysSummerSip on Feb 7, 2014 11:34:31 GMT -5
At this stage, obviously pregnant, she very likely will have a difficult time finding work. So schooling/training, particularly online training, which she can do around the birth, would be a good idea at this point.
And this time, it's time for diligence. And the timeline idea still stands, in my book. Tossing the kids into the street isn't the idea. But if you don't set some ground rules and don't look at this with the idea that she will have to get up on her own two feet and stay there, she will wind up thinking this is an OK way to live, and you will wind up looking for a place to escape to yet again. Why should any situation make you that miserable? It's your house! And you did not screw up as a parent. And even if you did, there comes a time when adults make decisions to stop blaming the people who raised them and work with what life has presented to them, whether it's on a silver platter or a paper plate, so to speak.
I was not raised by perfect parents, either. But they are both dead now. Blaming them for any parental shortcomings, real or imagined, is pointless, and would be even if they were alive. They cannot fix whatever might have happened in the past. Neither can you. Make a list of what you have to work with here, what you can accomplish with the situation as it is now. And make a list of what you will NOT put up with. Sounds a little mean to say that, but it's important. You are not a doormat, you are a parent with a difficult choice to make. It does not mean anyone has license to take advantage of you.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Feb 7, 2014 11:55:38 GMT -5
I couldn't turn out my daughter. I just couldn't. Oooooh Shooby, don't tempt fate like that. Just pray you are never in a position to have to make that choice. I didn't know giving my opinion on a current situation is "tempting fate" so I really don't appreciate you trying to wish ill will on me.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Feb 7, 2014 12:01:55 GMT -5
She had a job interview 2 weeks ago. She said it went well when she got back. They didn't hire her though. I don't think too many employers are eager to hire an obviously pregnant woman when there are so many other applicants. She's willing to work fast-food, retail, whatever. To be fair, she was looking for jobs when she was living with me, not as diligently as I wanted, but she WAS applying and had a few interviews that didn't pan out. Can she look into a temp agency?
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Feb 7, 2014 12:05:13 GMT -5
Very tough situation. I don't know what I would do in your circumstances.
DH's boss has a situation very like this. His step daughter began a jr college program, then got pregnant, dropped out, and shacked up with her BF. After the baby was born, she broke up with the BF and moved back home for a bit. Then she got pregnant again, by dad #2, and moved in with him for a while. Then they broke up, and this time they told her the kids could live with them, but she couldn't. So the step daughter has shacked up with some other guy (she doesn't work or go to school) while grandma and step grandpa are raising her two kids for her.
At least, she hasn't had baby #3.
I feel bad for DH's boss- he's told DH he never saved anything for retirement, and now all his extra money is going to support his step grandkids, rather than trying to make a nest egg. He doesn't agree with how his wife is enabling her daughter, but his wife refuses to give her daughter any ultimatums, and as a step dad, he doesn't get a vote, apparently. He's now looking at working well past retirement age to be able to support his grandkids, as it's been four years now and step daughter still hasn't done anything besides shack up with a series of boyfriends. At least she doesn't get any welfare benefits, all the support checks to go the grandmother, since she has custody of the kids.
Very sad situation, unfortunately all too common anymore. Good luck to you, and I hope your DD gets help with her depression.
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tloonya
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Post by tloonya on Feb 7, 2014 12:21:56 GMT -5
Thecaptain has covered the situation very well, IMO. Have you and your dd actually sat down and talked this out, Pink? Has she told you what plans she has for her current situation and what she expects of herself, and of you? Has she thought about this mess any further than to realize she's in a mess and it's HER mess? Too often, young people who make bad decisions just sit there and expect someone else to pull them out of the mud. Once enabled, they'll continue to make bad decisions because they don't have to reap the results - someone else does. The young person, therefore, learns little other than to use others. My daughter went through a very rough spot in her early twenties. Thankfully, there were no children involved. DH and I did all we could to try to teach her what was going wrong but she wasn't having any. Finally, DH and I had to tell her we'd washed our hands of it. She was on her own. If she became ill, or had an accident, or was otherwise incapacitated, we'd be there for her. Otherwise, she was going to have to work her life out and make some plans that included something beyond the current moment. It took a couple of years for her to get herself straightened out and it was a mean learning curve. Still, she did it and she did it on her own, for the most part. The lessons learned, according to her, have been invaluable to her. Today, in her 50s, she's one of the most resourceful, kind, giving people I know and lives a happy, productive life. I like this post, however it doesn't mean anything for Pink. She has her daughter WITH almost 2 kids. She will not see her innocent grandchildren running streets of some ghetto. She will not lose 3 people her flesh and blood to see 'are they gonna make it?'
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Feb 7, 2014 12:22:03 GMT -5
I couldn't turn out my daughter. I just couldn't. Depends on the circumstances. If DS was capable of supporting himself and didn't apply himself, or was a drug or alcohol addict, I wouldn't let him move in with me. It would only coddle him and prevent him from hitting rock bottom, which would give him the opportunity to make changes in his life. If he had a car accident and was disabled, or lost his job temporarily, certainly I would help him out. I know a woman who moved herself and her daughter in with her mom for just a few months, so she could earn enough money to set aside for rent. She had a fairly good paying job, she just couldn't budget her money, and can't say no to her spoiled daughter when she demands the latest electronic gadgets. Fast forward ten years, the woman is still living with mom, she's never scraped enough money together to be able to move out, has no money set aside for retirement or school for her teenage daughter, and now she's considering filing for bankruptcy. So her mom allowing her to move in ten years ago probably wasn't the best idea.
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tloonya
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Post by tloonya on Feb 7, 2014 12:30:37 GMT -5
...A child or someone with a child's mentality and maturity should not have a child but we, as taxpayers, fund this behavior, so it continues. I am not being any mean or anything. zib, what would had happened if we didn't fund it? I can not imagine if it would be different. I know in many countries were there is no welfare - situation with kids having kids just the same. I think sex will never be figured out. They just doing it...who can ever predict or prevent?
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 7, 2014 12:34:53 GMT -5
Yes, it would. Before we paid people to have children they couldn't support, they were given up for adoption. Exactly what should be happening now.
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mollyanna58
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Post by mollyanna58 on Feb 7, 2014 12:44:33 GMT -5
Seriously?
Prehistoric humans figured out pretty quickly that sex results in babies. And there is a drug store or supermarket on every block selling condoms to prevent pregnancy.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2014 12:45:42 GMT -5
China figured it out.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Feb 7, 2014 12:46:54 GMT -5
Pink--I know you said that you've tried counseling with your daughter, but you can't make her go. That is true, but I might consider making that one of the ground rules *if* she moves in with you. You still can't make her engage in the counseling process, but maybe she'll be more ready and open to it now? It sounds like she is freaking out about her situation at this point so hopefully she is ready to make some changes.
As always hugs and best of luck.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 7, 2014 13:10:39 GMT -5
She knows that Pink will take her in. There's zero incentive to fix herself.
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NancysSummerSip
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Post by NancysSummerSip on Feb 7, 2014 14:30:54 GMT -5
She knows that Pink will take her in. There's zero incentive to fix herself. I'd like to disagree with this. But given past history, it's difficult to do so. Having a roof over one's head that held up by guilt and the feeling of parental duty certainly makes maintaining a status quo a whole lot easier.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Feb 7, 2014 14:35:35 GMT -5
She knows that Pink will take her in. There's zero incentive to fix herself. I get that this is your hot button topic, but try to remember that this is Pink's daughter not some statistic you can rip apart based on personal bias. Pink said she IS looking for work. Living with parents isn't usually a source of pride for young adults. I'm sure her daughter was happy when she felt like she was in a position to move out on her own, and isn't thrilled at the idea of having to tuck tail and come back especially so soon and under these circumstances.
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NancysSummerSip
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Post by NancysSummerSip on Feb 7, 2014 14:48:51 GMT -5
She knows that Pink will take her in. There's zero incentive to fix herself. I get that this is your hot button topic, but try to remember that this is Pink's daughter not some statistic you can rip apart based on personal bias. Pink said she IS looking for work. Living with parents isn't usually a source of pride for young adults. I'm sure her daughter was happy when she felt like she was in a position to move out on her own, and isn't thrilled at the idea of having to tuck tail and come back especially so soon and under these circumstances. Rae, under different circumstances, I'd agree with you. But this is a second go-round for Pink's DD. A second pregnancy, a second baby daddy, and a second return to the nest. You're right about it not being a source of pride for anyone to return home to mom and dad. In this case, I don't think pride is an issue or an option. I think the DD sees this as a default option and knows she can do it when she makes mistakes and does not want to clean up a mess of her own making. I'm not saying the fathers are not responsible, too. But it does not appear that either will be taking much part in what they did - one does not live nearby and the other has another child to contend with. As it stands, there's no knight in shining armor coming in to fix any of this. If Pink decides to take mother and child (and soon to be second child) in, she will be facing a repeat of the misery she faced the last time - the misery that literally drove her out of her own home. I called that unfair and I still do. Unless, of course, Pink faces the hard task of spelling out how things will be done this time. Even from a parent in this situation, it should be a hand up, not a handout.
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