MTG off the rails

[djAdvocate]

Feb 13, 2024 13:17:25 GMT -5 scgal said:

Feb 13, 2024 10:05:16 GMT -5 Opti said:

He had everything to do with it. He planned that rally to stir them up with words designed to get them to go to the Capitol and stop the election certification. Do the stations you listen to provide your ideas as entertainment? Trump was also asked to stop it and sat on his ass and enjoyed what he saw on TV. This is known as well. I am starting to wonder if you are really a poster from the US or a Russian bot with a great backstory.

 

Unless he said storm the capital he is totally innocent everything else does not matter. He did say fight like hell but still is no good if I was on a jury he is innocent

i don't think this assertion is quite right, except in the legal sense.  he is innocent until proved guilty.  i will give you that.  but i would point out that none of the charges against him are for "insurrection".  there are 91 counts out there, and you can choose among them, but you are raising a red herring here, because nobody in charge of these investigations felt that this charge could withstand the standards of guilt that the court ascribes.

that doesn't mean he was not guilty of numerous felonies.  i think he was.  and i think the court will find that.  and i think those serious felonies add up to a soft coup, and nearly a hard one.  it gives me no pleasure to say that, as i believe the coup attempt is STILL UNDERWAY.  this time, enabled by the GOP.  

it is really sad that this is where America finds itself.  i blame Trump for that 100%, but he could not do it without enablers.  

[djAdvocate]

have said all that blather, i do, in fact, think he is guilty of insurrection, even though he has not been charged with it.

[djAdvocate]

Feb 13, 2024 13:28:44 GMT -5 Opti said:

Feb 12, 2024 11:37:55 GMT -5 tallguy said:

Every time I read one of your posts I am exceedingly grateful that I am not forced to go through life with your brain.   

TG I wish there had been a nicer way to say that. It's both hard and interesting watching scgal, and others like her tie themselves into knots because they are afraid of facing the truth. Look at the nonsense about guardsmen she posted. The presence or absence of guardsmen has nothing to do with whether an insurrection occurred or not. It's just random silliness and yet another way to avoid looking at the truth. He's guilty. Even Trump knows that. 

Here's the definition of insurrection.


18 U.S. Code § 2383 - Rebellion or insurrection


Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.



(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(1)(L), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)


www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2383

i don't believe he has been charged with that, has he?

i find it interesting that this language is very similar to A14.3

[djAdvocate]

Feb 13, 2024 14:50:42 GMT -5 scgal said:

Feb 13, 2024 13:20:36 GMT -5 swamp said:

Wrong.  

That's not how criminal liability works.   The guy who plans the robbery and the guy who drives the get away car are just as guilty as the guys who robbed the bank. 

I agree with you on criminal liability that is why I say he is innocent. He did not plan a riot so he is innocent. 

i don't know that.  how do you know that?
isn't this something that needs to be shown to be true or not?

candidly, i think he DID plan it.  but i can't categorically say that he did without proof of it.  and that proof has not been shown, yet.  but it seems to me that at least one of the pending cases will show it.

[Cheesy FL-Vol]

Feb 13, 2024 20:46:45 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Feb 13, 2024 13:17:25 GMT -5 scgal said:

Unless he said storm the capital he is totally innocent everything else does not matter. He did say fight like hell but still is no good if I was on a jury he is innocent

i don't think this assertion is quite right, except in the legal sense.  he is innocent until proved guilty.  i will give you that.  but i would point out that none of the charges against him are for "insurrection".  there are 91 counts out there, and you can choose among them, but you are raising a red herring here, because nobody in charge of these investigations felt that this charge could withstand the standards of guilt that the court ascribes.

that doesn't mean he was not guilty of numerous felonies.  i think he was.  and i think the court will find that.  and i think those serious felonies add up to a soft coup, and nearly a hard one.  it gives me no pleasure to say that, as i believe the coup attempt is STILL UNDERWAY.  this time, enabled by the GOP.  

it is really sad that this is where America finds itself.  i blame Trump for that 100%, but he could not do it without enablers.  

I STILL want to know what the hell was said in Trump’s private meeting with Putin. There is no way a meeting with ONLY interpreters was innocuous.

[tbop77]

Ever so often I like to go back to the thread that was started Dec 22, 2020 (January 6th Bomb Exploded) and read the linked article.  No one has a problem with a peaceful protest.  Between the tweet, the planning, the speech he gave, and the events that unfolded, how can anyone be convinced this was not an insurrection?  After the riot started, the tweet about Mike Pence to spur them further into action and sitting there for 3 hours watching it unfold before calling them off.  I remember asking myself that day what is wrong with him?  Is he waiting for the shooting to start?  

When several of the GOP came out after and said he was responsible, I was elated.  I hated for that to happen to get them to finally admit what a POS he really is.  Of course, that didn't last long.  


"Peter Navarro releases 36-page report alleging election fraud 'more than sufficient' to swing victory to Trump," the president tweeted Saturday. "A great report by Peter. Statistically impossible to have lost the 2020 Election. Big protest in D.C. on January 6th. Be there, will be wild!"


"He didn't win the Election. He lost all 6 Swing States, by a lot. They then dumped hundreds of thousands of votes in each one, and got caught. Now Republican politicians have to fight so that their great victory is not stolen. Don't be weak fools!" Trump tweeted Saturday.

But several vehemently pro-Trump Republicans—Alabama's Mo Brooks and Georgia's Representative-elect Marjorie Taylor Greene, along with Alabama's senator-elect Tommy Tuberville—say they plan to disrupt the rudimentary process next month.

www.newsweek.com/trump-encourages-wild-protests-dc-date-electoral-college-vote-count-1556153

[scgal]

Feb 13, 2024 15:27:09 GMT -5 Opti said:

Feb 13, 2024 14:57:08 GMT -5 scgal said:

I don't claim to know more than an experienced physician. I go to DR's all the time. What I do know just because someone has a piece of paper on the wall don't make them good in their field. You can usually separate them out easily they are the ones who think they know more than anyone else you know the ones who think they are heros for going to work in the pandemic.

This is a major baggage issue for you, isn't it? It was other people who pushed the hero line in order to keep nurses and doctors from quitting.  Instead of being jealous or whatever you are about that, you should be grateful you weren't working on the front lines of healthcare or forced by Trump and employers to risk your life at a meat packing plant. 

Front lines OMG that is another one. 

Any Dr or nurse that would quit because of the pandemic is a POS. But the indusstry would be better off without the losers

[Opti]

Feb 16, 2024 4:26:00 GMT -5 scgal said:

Feb 13, 2024 15:27:09 GMT -5 Opti said:

This is a major baggage issue for you, isn't it? It was other people who pushed the hero line in order to keep nurses and doctors from quitting.  Instead of being jealous or whatever you are about that, you should be grateful you weren't working on the front lines of healthcare or forced by Trump and employers to risk your life at a meat packing plant. 

Front lines OMG that is another one. 

Any Dr or nurse that would quit because of the pandemic is a POS. But the indusstry would be better off without the losers

Pretty big talk for someone who did not work in person with a disease that killed millions. I respect the choices of people who quit whether it was because they had health conditions that made it riskier for them to be there or were pregnant and wanted to protect their child. I don't see you as someone being willing to die in the line of duty, especially be on a machine for 5 weeks and in the end not make it.

[Cheesy FL-Vol]

Feb 16, 2024 7:03:07 GMT -5 Opti said:

Feb 16, 2024 4:26:00 GMT -5 scgal said:

Front lines OMG that is another one. 

Any Dr or nurse that would quit because of the pandemic is a POS. But the indusstry would be better off without the losers

Pretty big talk for someone who did not work in person with a disease that killed millions. I respect the choices of people who quit whether it was because they had health conditions that made it riskier for them to be there or were pregnant and wanted to protect their child. I don't see you as someone being willing to die in the line of duty, especially be on a machine for 5 weeks and in the end not make it.

In addition, the psychological toll because they knew there was nothing they could do for many. The choices they had to make to help only those they were fairly sure would make it. I have no doubt many health care workers had/have PTSD or a form of it due to the pandemic. Many got sick themselves.

I do not blame any health care worker for taking stock of their lives and making the decision for themselves and/or their families to leave their chosen field. Especially when they have to deal with verbal abuse from the public and those who question medicine and science. Millions of people in other fields make the decision to change careers every day.

I have nothing but respect for those who work in health care and those who make the decision to leave. 

[djAdvocate]

Feb 16, 2024 7:17:37 GMT -5 Cheesy FL-Vol said:

Feb 16, 2024 7:03:07 GMT -5 Opti said:

Pretty big talk for someone who did not work in person with a disease that killed millions. I respect the choices of people who quit whether it was because they had health conditions that made it riskier for them to be there or were pregnant and wanted to protect their child. I don't see you as someone being willing to die in the line of duty, especially be on a machine for 5 weeks and in the end not make it.

In addition, the psychological toll because they knew there was nothing they could do for many. The choices they had to make to help only those they were fairly sure would make it. I have no doubt many health care workers had/have PTSD or a form of it due to the pandemic. Many got sick themselves.

I do not blame any health care worker for taking stock of their lives and making the decision for themselves and/or their families to leave their chosen field. Especially when they have to deal with verbal abuse from the public and those who question medicine and science. Millions of people in other fields make the decision to change careers every day.

I have nothing but respect for those who work in health care and those who make the decision to leave. 

i think our new cultish fervor for all things un-sciency is the thing that is going to send us spiraling backwards to Making America Grim Again.  back to the days of Leave It To Beaver, Jim Crow, and single income homes.  it is appalling. 

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Feb 16, 2024 13:56:11 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Feb 16, 2024 7:17:37 GMT -5 Cheesy FL-Vol said:

In addition, the psychological toll because they knew there was nothing they could do for many. The choices they had to make to help only those they were fairly sure would make it. I have no doubt many health care workers had/have PTSD or a form of it due to the pandemic. Many got sick themselves.

I do not blame any health care worker for taking stock of their lives and making the decision for themselves and/or their families to leave their chosen field. Especially when they have to deal with verbal abuse from the public and those who question medicine and science. Millions of people in other fields make the decision to change careers every day.

I have nothing but respect for those who work in health care and those who make the decision to leave. 

i think our new cultish fervor for all things un-sciency is the thing that is going to send us spiraling backwards to Making America Grim Again.  back to the days of Leave It To Beaver, Jim Crow, and single income homes.  it is appalling. 

IDK back in the Leave it to Beaver days we went to the moon or were shortly going to.  We greatly believed in science and progress, in some areas at least.

They want to take us back to pre-enlightenment days.  When your entire life was ruled by what "God" told you and anything bad that happens to you is clearly because "God" hates you and you deserve it.  No need for us proper godly folks to do anything to help you.   Women needs to be covered up at all times, don't spare the rod on your kids and everyone who isn't a white evangelical Christian knows their place or will soon be taught it.

So about the 1600s where I would put they want to take us back to when the Puritans first landed on this rock. 

[scgal]

Feb 16, 2024 13:56:11 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Feb 16, 2024 7:17:37 GMT -5 Cheesy FL-Vol said:

In addition, the psychological toll because they knew there was nothing they could do for many. The choices they had to make to help only those they were fairly sure would make it. I have no doubt many health care workers had/have PTSD or a form of it due to the pandemic. Many got sick themselves.

I do not blame any health care worker for taking stock of their lives and making the decision for themselves and/or their families to leave their chosen field. Especially when they have to deal with verbal abuse from the public and those who question medicine and science. Millions of people in other fields make the decision to change careers every day.

I have nothing but respect for those who work in health care and those who make the decision to leave. 

i think our new cultish fervor for all things un-sciency is the thing that is going to send us spiraling backwards to Making America Grim Again.  back to the days of Leave It To Beaver, Jim Crow, and single income homes.  it is appalling. 

Not Jim Crow, but what is wrong with leave it to beaver and single income homes. 

[happyhoix]

Feb 17, 2024 8:16:21 GMT -5 scgal said:

Feb 16, 2024 13:56:11 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i think our new cultish fervor for all things un-sciency is the thing that is going to send us spiraling backwards to Making America Grim Again.  back to the days of Leave It To Beaver, Jim Crow, and single income homes.  it is appalling. 

Not Jim Crow, but what is wrong with leave it to beaver and single income homes. 

Leave it to Beaver and all the other 50’s sitcoms featured suburban white families with Stepford moms - not a true reflection of American society, but a a pretend society many MAGA folks would like to return to. 

Nothing wrong with single income homes, if that’s what you want. However, my mother in law had a clerical job back in the 50’s when she got pregnant with DH. She had to quit her job, because the company she worked for didn’t employ married women. The company I work for was in business back in the 50’s, and we found the building plans from that time period, which showed the colored women’s restrooms, the white women’s restrooms, and the white men’s restrooms. We couldn’t find the black men’s restrooms, until it occurred to us that was because they didn’t hire black men.  That’s the kind of 50’s shit most of the non MAGAs want to avoid. 

[thyme4change]

Feb 17, 2024 8:16:21 GMT -5 scgal said:

Feb 16, 2024 13:56:11 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i think our new cultish fervor for all things un-sciency is the thing that is going to send us spiraling backwards to Making America Grim Again.  back to the days of Leave It To Beaver, Jim Crow, and single income homes.  it is appalling. 

Not Jim Crow, but what is wrong with leave it to beaver and single income homes. 

The tax rate on the very wealthy was 70%. Wealth was more evenly distributed and the middle class was thriving. We won’t get back there without measures to decrease the wealth gap. Cutting taxes on the rich have only made the rich richer.

[resolution]

Even as recently as the 1980s, my mom went to a dealership to buy a truck (for cash) and they refused to sell it to her without my dad there to approve it. She also wasn't allowed to hook up our electric when we moved in the early 70s. 

It feels like paranoia to worry about things like that happening again, except there is a whole movement to remove the right to vote from women, with plenty of trad wives supporting it.

[Tennesseer]

Feb 17, 2024 8:16:21 GMT -5 scgal said:

Feb 16, 2024 13:56:11 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i think our new cultish fervor for all things un-sciency is the thing that is going to send us spiraling backwards to Making America Grim Again.  back to the days of Leave It To Beaver, Jim Crow, and single income homes.  it is appalling. 

Not Jim Crow, but what is wrong with leave it to beaver and single income homes. 

So you still put on your makeup, pretty floral dresses, and stiletto heels every day to make supper for your family? June did.

[happyhoix]

Feb 17, 2024 9:43:39 GMT -5 resolution said:

Even as recently as the 1980s, my mom went to a dealership to buy a truck (for cash) and they refused to sell it to her without my dad there to approve it. She also wasn't allowed to hook up our electric when we moved in the early 70s. 

It feels like paranoia to worry about things like that happening again, except there is a whole movement to remove the right to vote from women, with plenty of trad wives supporting it.

Yeah in 84 when we got our first car the salesman ignored me except for when he asked what color we wanted ‘because the wives like to pick out the color.’ Then when we bought our next car in 88 and went to take a test drive and the salesman got alarmed because I was going to drive it (it was a stick.) He said women usually can’t drive sticks. My husband insisted I should do the test drive because it was going to be my car. The sales guy sweated bullets but after the test drive said I shifted well and halfway apologized for assuming I couldn’t. I wanted to tell him you don’t need a dick to shift but I was a nicer person back then.

[busymom]

Feb 17, 2024 11:09:04 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Feb 17, 2024 9:43:39 GMT -5 resolution said:

Even as recently as the 1980s, my mom went to a dealership to buy a truck (for cash) and they refused to sell it to her without my dad there to approve it. She also wasn't allowed to hook up our electric when we moved in the early 70s. 

It feels like paranoia to worry about things like that happening again, except there is a whole movement to remove the right to vote from women, with plenty of trad wives supporting it.

Yeah in 84 when we got our first car the salesman ignored me except for when he asked what color we wanted ‘because the wives like to pick out the color.’ Then when we bought our next car in 88 and went to take a test drive and the salesman got alarmed because I was going to drive it (it was a stick.) He said women usually can’t drive sticks. My husband insisted I should do the test drive because it was going to be my car. The sales guy sweated bullets but after the test drive said I shifted well and halfway apologized for assuming I couldn’t. I wanted to tell him you don’t need a dick to shift but I was a nicer person back then.

     Oh, have I got a story for you.  I went car shopping, did all the research, worked with the salesman in person, but DH had to cosign the deal.  It gets worse.  When the car title arrived, it had DH's name on it, while I did all the work, and the car was for me.  DH wrote a letter to the dealership telling them what they'd done, and while they "corrected" the title, it ended up with my first name on it, and DH's middle name.     I guess women just aren't supposed to own expensive things, even when they're using their own money.  

[busymom]

Feb 17, 2024 10:19:02 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Feb 17, 2024 8:16:21 GMT -5 scgal said:

Not Jim Crow, but what is wrong with leave it to beaver and single income homes. 

So you still put on your makeup, pretty floral dresses, and stiletto heels every day to make supper for your family? June did.

     My Mom & her friends did NOT like that woman.  Who wears a dress & pearls while keeping house?  Even traditional wives dressed casually when cleaning house & taking care of the kids.

[busymom]

Feb 16, 2024 7:17:37 GMT -5 Cheesy FL-Vol said:

Feb 16, 2024 7:03:07 GMT -5 Opti said:

Pretty big talk for someone who did not work in person with a disease that killed millions. I respect the choices of people who quit whether it was because they had health conditions that made it riskier for them to be there or were pregnant and wanted to protect their child. I don't see you as someone being willing to die in the line of duty, especially be on a machine for 5 weeks and in the end not make it.

In addition, the psychological toll because they knew there was nothing they could do for many. The choices they had to make to help only those they were fairly sure would make it. I have no doubt many health care workers had/have PTSD or a form of it due to the pandemic. Many got sick themselves.

I do not blame any health care worker for taking stock of their lives and making the decision for themselves and/or their families to leave their chosen field. Especially when they have to deal with verbal abuse from the public and those who question medicine and science. Millions of people in other fields make the decision to change careers every day.

I have nothing but respect for those who work in health care and those who make the decision to leave. 

    When my relative was fading, and in intensive care, I spent a lot of time at the hospital, and one of the nurses there was telling me stories of what she'd seen during the Covid crisis.  She was literally on the front lines, and she said what still bothered her is how you never really knew which patients would survive, and who would die from the virus.  She said the worst part was seeing young, healthy men die.  She was remembering one man in his 30's who didn't make it, but she added that because he was young & healthy, he thought he didn't need the vaccine.  That poor decision probably killed him.  These health care workers put in their best, and still they lost patients.  I cannot imagine the guilt they must feel, even though it isn't the fault of the healthcare provider. 

[thyme4change]

Feb 17, 2024 11:09:04 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Feb 17, 2024 9:43:39 GMT -5 resolution said:

Even as recently as the 1980s, my mom went to a dealership to buy a truck (for cash) and they refused to sell it to her without my dad there to approve it. She also wasn't allowed to hook up our electric when we moved in the early 70s. 

It feels like paranoia to worry about things like that happening again, except there is a whole movement to remove the right to vote from women, with plenty of trad wives supporting it.

Yeah in 84 when we got our first car the salesman ignored me except for when he asked what color we wanted ‘because the wives like to pick out the color.’ Then when we bought our next car in 88 and went to take a test drive and the salesman got alarmed because I was going to drive it (it was a stick.) He said women usually can’t drive sticks. My husband insisted I should do the test drive because it was going to be my car. The sales guy sweated bullets but after the test drive said I shifted well and halfway apologized for assuming I couldn’t. I wanted to tell him you don’t need a dick to shift but I was a nicer person back then.

In 2003 a salesman told me “Ladies get sick of driving stick - why would you want one?”

I told him I’m such a control freak that I have to tell my car when to change gears. If he had a problem with that, I could go elsewhere.

[azucena]

Unfortunately, I had a similar car buying experience around 2004. The first and only brand new car I ever bought - an orange vibe. I researched the heck out of what I wanted and walked into the local dealership after exchanging emails with them and confirming that they could order what I wanted. In person, they only wanted to talk to DH even though he quickly said this is my wife's car and she pays the bills so talk to her. They didn't heed his warning so we quickly walked out and bought what I wanted somewhere else that same day. You can be sure that I drove my new car up onto their lot honking my horn and waving at them to point out the sale they missed out on.

[ken a.k.a OMK]

I taught my wife how to drive a stick in 1970 and all our cars have been sticks until we couldn't get one on the cars we want. We both still drive with our right hand on the console automatic shift control. 

[Cheesy FL-Vol]

Feb 17, 2024 12:33:05 GMT -5 ken a.k.a OMK said:

I taught my wife how to drive a stick in 1970 and all our cars have been sticks until we couldn't get one on the cars we want. We both still drive with our right hand on the console automatic shift control. 

I love stick. I was in my late 20s when I learned. I picked it up so quick, it was almost as if it was an innate skill. I felt like it was something I always knew how to do.

[pulmonarymd]

Feb 17, 2024 9:43:39 GMT -5 resolution said:

Even as recently as the 1980s, my mom went to a dealership to buy a truck (for cash) and they refused to sell it to her without my dad there to approve it. She also wasn't allowed to hook up our electric when we moved in the early 70s. 

It feels like paranoia to worry about things like that happening again, except there is a whole movement to remove the right to vote from women, with plenty of trad wives supporting it.

My wife went to look at cars in NC in 1987, salesman told her to come back with her husband. She actually made more than I did back then. Bought our car at another dealership. They called for months asking if we were still looking to buy a car. But sure, things were better in the old days if you weren't a white male.

[djAdvocate]

Feb 17, 2024 8:16:21 GMT -5 scgal said:

Feb 16, 2024 13:56:11 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i think our new cultish fervor for all things un-sciency is the thing that is going to send us spiraling backwards to Making America Grim Again.  back to the days of Leave It To Beaver, Jim Crow, and single income homes.  it is appalling. 

Not Jim Crow, but what is wrong with leave it to beaver and single income homes. 

other than their impossibility in the US for most Americans, nothing.

do you think it is good to idealize things that are impossible to obtain?

[djAdvocate]

Feb 17, 2024 9:42:12 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Feb 17, 2024 8:16:21 GMT -5 scgal said:

Not Jim Crow, but what is wrong with leave it to beaver and single income homes. 

The tax rate on the very wealthy was 70%. Wealth was more evenly distributed and the middle class was thriving. We won’t get back there without measures to decrease the wealth gap. Cutting taxes on the rich have only made the rich richer.

only?  no, it has ALSO driven up the debt and driven down economic growth.  and yes, i can back that up.

[scgal]

Feb 17, 2024 18:01:21 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Feb 17, 2024 8:16:21 GMT -5 scgal said:

Not Jim Crow, but what is wrong with leave it to beaver and single income homes. 

other than their impossibility in the US for most Americans, nothing.

do you think it is good to idealize things that are impossible to obtain?

It is impossible unfortunately. Not to say it wouldn't be better. It would be great if 1 income could sustain a family. It would be great to have a parent home with the children. I don't want to go back to women not having right and racism everywhere that is not what i'm saying. Women dressing with pearls and high heels is a stretch but look at society no one cares how they go out in public anymore wearing pj's, pants hanging off their ass. There is no self respect anymore. 

Before everyone gets on my ass about some people cannot afford nice clothes etc...I get that but more and more people who have the means dress like shit all the time not the occasional sweatpants and messy bun.  Our society went to shit and we can thank the liberals for that. 

[tallguy]

Feb 18, 2024 6:02:11 GMT -5 scgal said:

Feb 17, 2024 18:01:21 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

other than their impossibility in the US for most Americans, nothing.

do you think it is good to idealize things that are impossible to obtain?

It is impossible unfortunately. Not to say it wouldn't be better. It would be great if 1 income could sustain a family. It would be great to have a parent home with the children. I don't want to go back to women not having right and racism everywhere that is not what i'm saying. Women dressing with pearls and high heels is a stretch but look at society no one cares how they go out in public anymore wearing pj's, pants hanging off their ass. There is no self respect anymore. 

Before everyone gets on my ass about some people cannot afford nice clothes etc...I get that but more and more people who have the means dress like shit all the time not the occasional sweatpants and messy bun.  Our society went to shit and we can thank the liberals for that. 

Bullsh**.

Pretty much everything that conservatives claim to value was originally a liberal idea.  If conservative ideas had held sway, we would still have feudal lords and vassals, peasants and serfs.  Our society owes its existence to liberals.  You can perhaps by one measure blame a culture that elevates personal freedoms for allowing a "decline", and personal freedoms are ENTIRELY due to liberals, but it's a serious stretch to say that society would be better without those freedoms.

[scgal]

Feb 18, 2024 7:55:01 GMT -5 tallguy said:

Feb 18, 2024 6:02:11 GMT -5 scgal said:

It is impossible unfortunately. Not to say it wouldn't be better. It would be great if 1 income could sustain a family. It would be great to have a parent home with the children. I don't want to go back to women not having right and racism everywhere that is not what i'm saying. Women dressing with pearls and high heels is a stretch but look at society no one cares how they go out in public anymore wearing pj's, pants hanging off their ass. There is no self respect anymore. 

Before everyone gets on my ass about some people cannot afford nice clothes etc...I get that but more and more people who have the means dress like shit all the time not the occasional sweatpants and messy bun.  Our society went to shit and we can thank the liberals for that. 

Bullsh**.

Pretty much everything that conservatives claim to value was originally a liberal idea.  If conservative ideas had held sway, we would still have feudal lords and vassals, peasants and serfs.  Our society owes its existence to liberals.  You can perhaps by one measure blame a culture that elevates personal freedoms for allowing a "decline", and personal freedoms are ENTIRELY due to liberals, but it's a serious stretch to say that society would be better without those freedoms.

But it never stopped. Personal freedom to dress like shit. Personal freedom to demand people to call you what you gendar you feel  you are not what you actually are. Personal freedom to demand a person to bake you a cake even if it goes against your personal religious belief. The world turned to shit and is only going to get worse.