Interactive map of the USA reporting Coronavirus cases

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 16, 2021 13:37:45 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Dec 16, 2021 13:26:42 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

You act like the medical community are idiots. You think those studies aren’t investigating this? Studies like this take time. In the meantime, people are getting sick and dying. And we have an excellent intervention to prevent that, today. You deal with the problem at hand, and change when new information becomes available. If it turns out your suspicions about prior infection is wrong, we will have more people die. The way out is vaccination, pure and simple. It will end this faster and save more lives.

But the party of life does not care about that. They would rather own the libs and rail against the elites

For the last time, and I know it is hard for you to get it, I believe in vacinations. Period.
Now I wonder just how you spend so many hours here when you claim to be fighting the good fight in the medical field. Must be skimming the web while at work instead of paying attention to your profession.

I am starting to wonder who you really are.

I am currently eating lunch. Am I allowed to do what I want at lunch, or can I relax? I also will check in when I get a few moments, like when a patient does not show up despite being confirmed. But, how I spend my time is no matter to you. I am what I claim to be. If you are going to call me a liar, screw you

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 16, 2021 13:37:45 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Dec 16, 2021 13:26:42 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

You act like the medical community are idiots. You think those studies aren’t investigating this? Studies like this take time. In the meantime, people are getting sick and dying. And we have an excellent intervention to prevent that, today. You deal with the problem at hand, and change when new information becomes available. If it turns out your suspicions about prior infection is wrong, we will have more people die. The way out is vaccination, pure and simple. It will end this faster and save more lives.

But the party of life does not care about that. They would rather own the libs and rail against the elites

For the last time, and I know it is hard for you to get it, I believe in vacinations. Period.
Now I wonder just how you spend so many hours here when you claim to be fighting the good fight in the medical field. Must be skimming the web while at work instead of paying attention to your profession.

I am starting to wonder who you really are.

You believe in vaccination. Wonderful. Welcome to the 19th century. The problem is that your side is spreading disinformation and being obstinate when it comes to stopping the spread of the virus. I really do not care about your belief. If people who are refusing vaccination and ignoring mitigation methods would change their behavior, lives would be saved. Instead we continue to have over 1k deaths a day

[djAdvocate]

Dec 16, 2021 13:37:45 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Dec 16, 2021 13:26:42 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

You act like the medical community are idiots. You think those studies aren’t investigating this? Studies like this take time. In the meantime, people are getting sick and dying. And we have an excellent intervention to prevent that, today. You deal with the problem at hand, and change when new information becomes available. If it turns out your suspicions about prior infection is wrong, we will have more people die. The way out is vaccination, pure and simple. It will end this faster and save more lives.

But the party of life does not care about that. They would rather own the libs and rail against the elites

For the last time, and I know it is hard for you to get it, I believe in vacinations. Period.
Now I wonder just how you spend so many hours here when you claim to be fighting the good fight in the medical field. Must be skimming the web while at work instead of paying attention to your profession.

I am starting to wonder who you really are.

VB- a few things:

I would call your attention to the word THEY above.  I have noted recently your propensity to take stuff personally.  I think you are making a mistake there.  liberals like me are EXTREMELY frustrated.  when I use the term THEY, I mean the anti-vaxxer, anti-mask community.  there are plenty of leftists out there in that community.  I don't think you are a leftist, but you seem to be getting very defensive when pmd levels a claim against THEM.

second, you SHOULD doubt who people really are on this board.  I doubt who you are.  I doubt who everyone is, here.  no offense, but we are anonymous posters on a backwater board.  you could be the King of Siam, or some dirty hobo.  how would I know?  I don't.  so I take your posts at face value, and comment on them or ignore them.  I think most people here do the same.

finally, I believe pmd is who he says he is.  knowing people in the medical profession, they generally work long shifts and then get long breaks.  I notice that pmd does not post every day, but even if he did, a 20 hour shift would allow for that.  not that I really care.  the information he brings to the discussion is generally spot on, in cases where I have researched it.

"doubting who you are" is ad hominem.  it is irrelevant to the topic.  if you have specific claims to make against him, you should do so, rather that insinuating that he is not the medical professional he claims to be.

[djAdvocate]

Dec 14, 2021 14:12:06 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Dec 14, 2021 12:25:56 GMT -5 azucena said:

Life insurance industry study www.soa.org/globalassets/assets/files/resources/experience-studies/2021/covid19-es2.pdf

My favorite chart is Figure 18 where you can literally see covid sweep across the nation.  Couldn't figure out how to post it here.

thank you!  the link is awesome.     

yeah, excess mortality is the way to do this.

because not every hospital will CORRECTLY diagnose the cause of death.

when that is done, we will surpass 1M.

remember a year and a half ago, when OldCoyote called me to task for claiming that the death toll could be as high as 1M? he basically laughed me out of the room.

I am NOT laughing now. I am crying. but I was right. and he was dead wrong.

[djAdvocate]

Dec 16, 2021 10:22:46 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/?fbclid=IwAR2uBN4t68ssk2c9o7bwC5lcPwXn7zy39HVGBS4kBCa_0Qv0S4ebeOo-4vw
This mornings totals
51,290,000 confirmed cases
823,000 deaths.
Numbers, rounded downward.
With that many confirmed cases in the country, I have to wonder when our government will start talking about the actual herd immunity there is in the country.
I would "guess" half of the people who have had the virus have also now had the vaccination for a rough estimate on my part. Why will our government not do any analysis of these potential 25,00,000 citzens who are unvaccinated but survived the virus? Do unvaccinated people who have had the virus also transmit the delta virus at the same rate as vaccinated people do.
We now know people who are double vaxxed and even have the booster can spread the virus, and I am assuming they are spreading the deadly delta virus since that is the primary one in the country, at least for another week or so.
Instead of attacking the unvaccinated publicy, let the government do some analysis of all the groups. If 25,000,000 or more citizens are naturally immunized add them to the vaccinated number if they do not present a potential issue.

when 85-95% of us have either been infected or vaccinated.

right now, that number is quite a bit below that.

so, if we get about half the unvaccinated population vaccinated, "the government" can talk about that.

the odds of that are zero, btw.  so, we will have to wait for the virus to infect the unvaccinated, with all of the attendant loss that one can anticipate from that, first.

[mollyc]

Dec 16, 2021 13:21:45 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Dec 16, 2021 13:08:53 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Wrong yet again. Herd immunity is when viruses cannot be propagated in any significant fashion due to there being to few susceptible individuals being present. Do you see any signs of that happening? Hospitalizations and deaths continue to increase. That is not herd immunity. It will eventually happen. It will happen more quickly and at a lower cost in deaths and illness of people get vaccinated. If they do not, we will see over another 100k deaths. And you still want to give the unvaccinated a break? All the resources devoted to caring for the unnecessary victims(at this point) of the pandemic takes away from everyone else. In addition, we are spending a ridiculous amount of money caring for them. Money that should not need to be spent.

So no, it is not time to give the unvaccinated a break. When deaths from Covid approach that of the flu(about 50k), then we can talk about herd immunity

Again, you simply ignore the intent of my posts.
I wonder why the government does not do any surveying of the people who have had covid. What does their bloodwork actually tell them?
This is not a conspiracy theory here. It seems strange the government does not follow up on this issue. Who knows? Maybe the previously sick covid survivor's blood has some answers for us. 

Any particular government doesn't have to do such a survey. Various public health depts and research hospitals world wide have been collecting and reporting on all kinds of info re the vaccinated and non-vaccinated and have given public access to many reports.

The issue if you look for this data is they may not have asked the exact question you want answered. I know because I was looking for similar answers last night for my sister.

I'm not going to try to link anything with my phone. Going on my memory (which won't be exact), one U.S. study of 9000+ individuals who had severe covid found that less then 1% of them had severe covid again. Of that less then 1%, 6 people died. It doesn't say anything about how many of the original group were reinfected because that wasn't what that particular report was studying. Their data may have had more info but I didn't have time to look.

And you can't say no one has studied the blood of infected people since one treatment tried was blood transfusions from infected people.

Lunch is over so I have to go

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 16, 2021 16:44:27 GMT -5 mollyc said:

Dec 16, 2021 13:21:45 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Again, you simply ignore the intent of my posts.
I wonder why the government does not do any surveying of the people who have had covid. What does their bloodwork actually tell them?
This is not a conspiracy theory here. It seems strange the government does not follow up on this issue. Who knows? Maybe the previously sick covid survivor's blood has some answers for us. 

Any particular government doesn't have to do such a survey. Various public health depts and research hospitals world wide have been collecting and reporting on all kinds of info re the vaccinated and non-vaccinated and have given public access to many reports.

The issue if you look for this data is they may not have asked the exact question you want answered. I know because I was looking for similar answers last night for my sister.

I'm not going to try to link anything with my phone. Going on my memory (which won't be exact), one U.S. study of 9000+ individuals who had severe covid found that less then 1% of them had severe covid again. Of that less then 1%, 6 people died. It doesn't say anything about how many of the original group were reinfected because that wasn't what that particular report was studying. Their data may have had more info but I didn't have time to look.

And you can't say no one has studied the blood of infected people since one treatment tried was blood transfusions from infected people.

Lunch is over so I have to go

Another study showed that infection followed by vaccination lead to better antibody levels and protection than infection alone. If we want to get through this, having people better protected is the goal

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 16, 2021 16:29:14 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Dec 16, 2021 10:22:46 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/?fbclid=IwAR2uBN4t68ssk2c9o7bwC5lcPwXn7zy39HVGBS4kBCa_0Qv0S4ebeOo-4vw
This mornings totals
51,290,000 confirmed cases
823,000 deaths.
Numbers, rounded downward.
With that many confirmed cases in the country, I have to wonder when our government will start talking about the actual herd immunity there is in the country.
I would "guess" half of the people who have had the virus have also now had the vaccination for a rough estimate on my part. Why will our government not do any analysis of these potential 25,00,000 citzens who are unvaccinated but survived the virus? Do unvaccinated people who have had the virus also transmit the delta virus at the same rate as vaccinated people do.
We now know people who are double vaxxed and even have the booster can spread the virus, and I am assuming they are spreading the deadly delta virus since that is the primary one in the country, at least for another week or so.
Instead of attacking the unvaccinated publicy, let the government do some analysis of all the groups. If 25,000,000 or more citizens are naturally immunized add them to the vaccinated number if they do not present a potential issue.

when 85-95% of us have either been infected or vaccinated.

right now, that number is quite a bit below that.

so, if we get about half the unvaccinated population vaccinated, "the government" can talk about that.

the odds of that are zero, btw.  so, we will have to wait for the virus to infect the unvaccinated, with all of the attendant loss that one can anticipate from that, first.

Based on our previous experiences with coronaviruses, herd immunity, is unlikely. We get reinfected with coronaviruses all the time. But those other viruses cause the common cold. What needs to happen is that people have enough immunity or the virus mutates that infection does not lead to death or hospitalization. The reality of that is that everyone needs to be infected or vaccinated. I think achieving herd immunity as we were hoping was likely a pipe dream given our current understanding of this virus.

[Tennesseer]

Dec 16, 2021 10:22:46 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/?fbclid=IwAR2uBN4t68ssk2c9o7bwC5lcPwXn7zy39HVGBS4kBCa_0Qv0S4ebeOo-4vw
This mornings totals
51,290,000 confirmed cases
823,000 deaths.
Numbers, rounded downward.
With that many confirmed cases in the country, I have to wonder when our government will start talking about the actual herd immunity there is in the country.
I would "guess" half of the people who have had the virus have also now had the vaccination for a rough estimate on my part. Why will our government not do any analysis of these potential 25,00,000 citzens who are unvaccinated but survived the virus? Do unvaccinated people who have had the virus also transmit the delta virus at the same rate as vaccinated people do.
We now know people who are double vaxxed and even have the booster can spread the virus, and I am assuming they are spreading the deadly delta virus since that is the primary one in the country, at least for another week or so.
Instead of attacking the unvaccinated publicy, let the government do some analysis of all the groups. If 25,000,000 or more citizens are naturally immunized add them to the vaccinated number if they do not present a potential issue.

The Trump administration made 'deliberate efforts to undermine the nation's coronavirus response for political purposes,' report finds

A new report from the House Committee on Oversight and Reform — the main investigative body of the House of Representatives — found that the Trump administration undermined the country's COVID-19 pandemic response for political

The report, first written about by CNN and conducted under the auspices of the Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Crisis, includes numerous findings that have already been released this year. But the report also includes new evidence of what the committee called "deliberate efforts to undermine the nation's coronavirus response for political purposes."

According to the report, the Trump administration also weakened COVID-19 testing guidelines set by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) while blocking media briefings by the public health agency.

After a February 25, 2020 briefing in which then-CDC National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases Director Dr. Nancy Messonnier warned about the dangers of the virus, former President Donald Trump was angered and blocked the health agency's requests to conduct public briefings for three months.

"That is the feeling that we had, many of us had," said Dr. Anne Schuchat, a CDC official, when asked by the committee about whether she and others at the agency felt "muzzled" by the administration.

Dr. Deborah Birx, who served as the White House Coronavirus Response Coordinator under Trump, wrote in an email released by the committee that she would be skipping a meeting that included many proponents of a "herd immunity" response to the pandemic.

"I can't be part of this with these people who believe in herd immunity," Birx wrote in an August 2020 email to Marc Short, then the chief of staff to Vice President Mike Pence. "They are a fringe group without grounding in epidemics, public health or on the ground common sense experience."

The report also found that Trump administration officials "neglected the pandemic response to focus on the 2020 presidential election and promote the Big Lie that the election results were fraudulent."

"The narrow focus on campaigning 'took people's time away from and distracted them away from the pandemic,'" read the committee's summary of Birx's remarks.

The Trump administration made 'deliberate efforts to undermine the nation's coronavirus response for political purposes,' report finds

[djAdvocate]

Dec 16, 2021 17:34:45 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Dec 16, 2021 16:29:14 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

when 85-95% of us have either been infected or vaccinated.

right now, that number is quite a bit below that.

so, if we get about half the unvaccinated population vaccinated, "the government" can talk about that.

the odds of that are zero, btw.  so, we will have to wait for the virus to infect the unvaccinated, with all of the attendant loss that one can anticipate from that, first.

Based on our previous experiences with coronaviruses, herd immunity, is unlikely. We get reinfected with coronaviruses all the time. But those other viruses cause the common cold. What needs to happen is that people have enough immunity or the virus mutates that infection does not lead to death or hospitalization. The reality of that is that everyone needs to be infected or vaccinated. I think achieving herd immunity as we were hoping was likely a pipe dream given our current understanding of this virus.

hadn't considered that we might MUTATE out of this problem.

interesting.

[djAdvocate]

Dec 17, 2021 11:33:42 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Dec 16, 2021 10:22:46 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/?fbclid=IwAR2uBN4t68ssk2c9o7bwC5lcPwXn7zy39HVGBS4kBCa_0Qv0S4ebeOo-4vw
This mornings totals
51,290,000 confirmed cases
823,000 deaths.
Numbers, rounded downward.
With that many confirmed cases in the country, I have to wonder when our government will start talking about the actual herd immunity there is in the country.
I would "guess" half of the people who have had the virus have also now had the vaccination for a rough estimate on my part. Why will our government not do any analysis of these potential 25,00,000 citzens who are unvaccinated but survived the virus? Do unvaccinated people who have had the virus also transmit the delta virus at the same rate as vaccinated people do.
We now know people who are double vaxxed and even have the booster can spread the virus, and I am assuming they are spreading the deadly delta virus since that is the primary one in the country, at least for another week or so.
Instead of attacking the unvaccinated publicy, let the government do some analysis of all the groups. If 25,000,000 or more citizens are naturally immunized add them to the vaccinated number if they do not present a potential issue.

The Trump administration made 'deliberate efforts to undermine the nation's coronavirus response for political purposes,' report finds

A new report from the House Committee on Oversight and Reform — the main investigative body of the House of Representatives — found that the Trump administration undermined the country's COVID-19 pandemic response for political

The report, first written about by CNN and conducted under the auspices of the Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Crisis, includes numerous findings that have already been released this year. But the report also includes new evidence of what the committee called "deliberate efforts to undermine the nation's coronavirus response for political purposes."

According to the report, the Trump administration also weakened COVID-19 testing guidelines set by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) while blocking media briefings by the public health agency.

After a February 25, 2020 briefing in which then-CDC National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases Director Dr. Nancy Messonnier warned about the dangers of the virus, former President Donald Trump was angered and blocked the health agency's requests to conduct public briefings for three months.

"That is the feeling that we had, many of us had," said Dr. Anne Schuchat, a CDC official, when asked by the committee about whether she and others at the agency felt "muzzled" by the administration.

Dr. Deborah Birx, who served as the White House Coronavirus Response Coordinator under Trump, wrote in an email released by the committee that she would be skipping a meeting that included many proponents of a "herd immunity" response to the pandemic.

"I can't be part of this with these people who believe in herd immunity," Birx wrote in an August 2020 email to Marc Short, then the chief of staff to Vice President Mike Pence. "They are a fringe group without grounding in epidemics, public health or on the ground common sense experience."

The report also found that Trump administration officials "neglected the pandemic response to focus on the 2020 presidential election and promote the Big Lie that the election results were fraudulent."

"The narrow focus on campaigning 'took people's time away from and distracted them away from the pandemic,'" read the committee's summary of Birx's remarks.

The Trump administration made 'deliberate efforts to undermine the nation's coronavirus response for political purposes,' report finds

of course.  can anyone doubt this?

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 17, 2021 13:11:34 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Dec 16, 2021 17:34:45 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Based on our previous experiences with coronaviruses, herd immunity, is unlikely. We get reinfected with coronaviruses all the time. But those other viruses cause the common cold. What needs to happen is that people have enough immunity or the virus mutates that infection does not lead to death or hospitalization. The reality of that is that everyone needs to be infected or vaccinated. I think achieving herd immunity as we were hoping was likely a pipe dream given our current understanding of this virus.

hadn't considered that we might MUTATE out of this problem.

interesting.

Nature does interesting and surprising things. Some data suggest omicron causes less severe disease. Would actually be a positive outcome if it does

[Tiny]

Dec 17, 2021 13:11:34 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Dec 16, 2021 17:34:45 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Based on our previous experiences with coronaviruses, herd immunity, is unlikely. We get reinfected with coronaviruses all the time. But those other viruses cause the common cold. What needs to happen is that people have enough immunity or the virus mutates that infection does not lead to death or hospitalization. The reality of that is that everyone needs to be infected or vaccinated. I think achieving herd immunity as we were hoping was likely a pipe dream given our current understanding of this virus.

hadn't considered that we might MUTATE out of this problem.

interesting.

Does that mean:   once all the Covid19 susceptible old people die off   we will have mutated out of the problem?   

 

[haapai]

Dec 17, 2021 13:20:08 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:11:34 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

hadn't considered that we might MUTATE out of this problem.

interesting.

Nature does interesting and surprising things. Some data suggest omicron causes less severe disease. Would actually be a positive outcome if it does

I call this the "happy cowpox" theory.  It's terribly attractive until you remember that Omicron has an awful lot of mutations on it, so while getting infected with it may give you a whole lot of immunity to Omicron and it's successors in the same lineage, it seems unlikely that getting infected with Omicron will give you immunity to Delta or any of the other variants in circulation now. 

I think that it is more rational to hope that it scares folks into getting their shots. 

[Tiny]

Dec 17, 2021 13:20:08 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:11:34 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

hadn't considered that we might MUTATE out of this problem.

interesting.

Nature does interesting and surprising things. Some data suggest omicron causes less severe disease. Would actually be a positive outcome if it does

Isn't that one of the most likely reasons the "Spanish Flu" pandemic ended  - the virus changed and was less severe and it just kind of faded out because deaths from it dropped dramatically?   I'm pretty sure that pandemic didn't end because of "herd immunity" 
 

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 17, 2021 13:29:34 GMT -5 haapai said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:20:08 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Nature does interesting and surprising things. Some data suggest omicron causes less severe disease. Would actually be a positive outcome if it does

I call this the "happy cowpox" theory.  It's terribly attractive until you remember that Omicron has an awful lot of mutations on it, so while getting infected with it may give you a whole lot of immunity to Omicron and it's successors in the same lineage, it seems unlikely that getting infected with Omicron will give you immunity to Delta or any of the other variants in circulation now. 

I think that it is more rational to hope that it scares folks into getting their shots. 

Not entirely true

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 17, 2021 13:31:05 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:20:08 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Nature does interesting and surprising things. Some data suggest omicron causes less severe disease. Would actually be a positive outcome if it does

Isn't that one of the most likely reasons the "Spanish Flu" pandemic ended  - the virus changed and was less severe and it just kind of faded out because deaths from it dropped dramatically?   I'm pretty sure that pandemic didn't end because of "herd immunity" 
 

Part of the reason. Eventually, viruses become less of a problem due to our immune system, their predilection to mutations, and our response to them. All pandemics eventually end, otherwise we would not be here as a society

[Tennesseer]

Southwest Airlines CEO Gary Kelly tests positive for coronavirus after Senate hearing
Kelly sat beside senior executives from competing airlines and a top labor leader, none of whom wore masks.

Southwest Airlines chief executive Gary Kelly tested positive for the coronavirus, the company announced Friday, two days after he testified at a Senate hearing in Washington.

Kelly sat beside senior executives from competing airlines and a top labor leader, none of whom wore masks while facing questions from members of the Committee on Commerce, Science, and Transportation.

Southwest said Kelly, who was vaccinated and had received a booster, tested negative multiple times before the hearing, but tested positive after getting home. He has mild symptoms and “each day he is moving closer to a full recovery,” the airline said, adding that he is “following all notification procedures.”

During the hearing, Kelly was pressed on when he believed masks would no longer be required on planes. He and other executives spoke of the high frequency and effectiveness of filtration systems commonly used on planes.

“I think the case is very strong that masks don’t add much, if anything, in the air cabin environment. It’s very safe, very high quality, compared to any other indoor setting,” Kelly said.

Complete article here: Southwest Airlines CEO Gary Kelly tests positive for coronavirus after Senate hearing

[djAdvocate]

Dec 17, 2021 13:20:08 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:11:34 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

hadn't considered that we might MUTATE out of this problem.

interesting.

Nature does interesting and surprising things. Some data suggest omicron causes less severe disease. Would actually be a positive outcome if it does

indeed. and the fact that it is 3x as communicable means that it will help us reach herd immunity that much faster in unvaccinated places like North Dakota, thus reducing the chances of future infection and mutation.

[djAdvocate]

Dec 17, 2021 13:31:05 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:20:08 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Nature does interesting and surprising things. Some data suggest omicron causes less severe disease. Would actually be a positive outcome if it does

Isn't that one of the most likely reasons the "Spanish Flu" pandemic ended  - the virus changed and was less severe and it just kind of faded out because deaths from it dropped dramatically?   I'm pretty sure that pandemic didn't end because of "herd immunity" 
 

i studied the Spanish Flu for a couple of weeks early last year. it seemed to me to be quite similar to what was happening and that turned out to be quite true.

the best article i found was THIS ONE: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3291398/

i highly recommend reading that.  it is only about 10 pages, but it discusses the lineage between the Spanish Flu and later H1N1 viruses.  to be brief, the Spanish Flu never stopped.  we reached herd immunity, then we developed a vaccine, and then it mutated into different forms, and it is STILL OUT THERE.  CV19 will do the same thing.  it will mutate into a different form (unlikely more virulent, but certainly possible), it will branch off, and it will be covered by a vaccine.

if you find anything i just said WRONG, please let me know.  i am no expert.  i just read a lot about stuff like this that interests me. 

[djAdvocate]

Dec 17, 2021 13:26:50 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:11:34 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

hadn't considered that we might MUTATE out of this problem.

interesting.

Does that mean:   once all the Covid19 susceptible old people die off   we will have mutated out of the problem?   

 

by "we" i meant the virus. that it might mutate into something more resembling your standard annual influenza.

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 19, 2021 4:29:49 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:26:50 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Does that mean:   once all the Covid19 susceptible old people die off   we will have mutated out of the problem?   

 

by "we" i meant the virus. that it might mutate into something more resembling your standard annual influenza.

The end game is that it mutates into something more like the other human coronaviruses. Omicron appears to have picked up some genetic material from one of them. We can help this process along by vaccination. It puts selection pressure on the virus. I hope the initial impression that omicron is less severe. Lots to learn before that is confirmed however

[Opti]

Dec 19, 2021 4:27:15 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Dec 17, 2021 13:31:05 GMT -5 Tiny said:

Isn't that one of the most likely reasons the "Spanish Flu" pandemic ended  - the virus changed and was less severe and it just kind of faded out because deaths from it dropped dramatically?   I'm pretty sure that pandemic didn't end because of "herd immunity" 
 

i studied the Spanish Flu for a couple of weeks early last year. it seemed to me to be quite similar to what was happening and that turned out to be quite true.

the best article i found was THIS ONE: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3291398/

i highly recommend reading that.  it is only about 10 pages, but it discusses the lineage between the Spanish Flu and later H1N1 viruses.  to be brief, the Spanish Flu never stopped.  we reached herd immunity, then we developed a vaccine, and then it mutated into different forms, and it is STILL OUT THERE.  CV19 will do the same thing.  it will mutate into a different form (unlikely more virulent, but certainly possible), it will branch off, and it will be covered by a vaccine.

if you find anything i just said WRONG, please let me know.  i am no expert.  i just read a lot about stuff like this that interests me. 

Interesting. Makes more sense than it just disappearing in two to three years.

[seriousthistime]

Dec 18, 2021 18:35:27 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Southwest Airlines CEO Gary Kelly tests positive for coronavirus after Senate hearing
Kelly sat beside senior executives from competing airlines and a top labor leader, none of whom wore masks.

Southwest Airlines chief executive Gary Kelly tested positive for the coronavirus, the company announced Friday, two days after he testified at a Senate hearing in Washington.

“I think the case is very strong that masks don’t add much, if anything, in the air cabin environment. It’s very safe, very high quality, compared to any other indoor setting,” Kelly said.

Complete article here: Southwest Airlines CEO Gary Kelly tests positive for coronavirus after Senate hearing

It took me a long time from the early COVID days to feel okay (not comfortable, but okay) getting on a plane.  And I double-mask in the airports and on the plane.  Considering that most of my flights since COVID have been cross country, that's not an insignificant amount of a day to be double-masked.

If it gets to a point where the COVID numbers have not dropped significantly but the mask mandate for planes and airports ends, it will be some time before I get on another plane, and even then I will likely mask up. 

Thinking back to the pre-2020 days when I and everyone else would get on a plane without even for a split second considering a mask, there were generally people sitting around me that were coughing, sneezing, blowing their noses, etc.  I can't tell you how often I would come down with a nasty cold within 2 days of a flight, especially when heading out on vacation.    

[djAdvocate]

we passed 1M excess deaths, according to this study:

www.abc.net.au/news/2021-11-01/five-million-covid19-deaths-but-real-toll-hidden/100568156

congratulations, US. you get a fucking F for handling this virus.

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 29, 2021 15:54:37 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

we passed 1M excess deaths, according to this study:

www.abc.net.au/news/2021-11-01/five-million-covid19-deaths-but-real-toll-hidden/100568156

congratulations, US. you get a fucking F for handling this virus.

It's no worse than the flu
It is killing only old people
My risk of dying is low, why do I need a vaccination, wear a mask, stay home, etc
We will kill the economy if we shut down
It is my right to do what I want, consequences be damned.

Did I miss any of the reasons for why so many people do not care? Add another 100-200K deaths next year. anyone who guessed 1.25 million dead wins the gold star. I never thought we would do this poorly.

[dondub]

Dec 29, 2021 15:59:43 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Dec 29, 2021 15:54:37 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

we passed 1M excess deaths, according to this study:

www.abc.net.au/news/2021-11-01/five-million-covid19-deaths-but-real-toll-hidden/100568156

congratulations, US. you get a fucking F for handling this virus.

It's no worse than the flu
It is killing only old people
My risk of dying is low, why do I need a vaccination, wear a mask, stay home, etc
We will kill the economy if we shut down
It is my right to do what I want, consequences be damned.

Did I miss any of the reasons for why so many people do not care? Add another 100-200K deaths next year. anyone who guessed 1.25 million dead wins the gold star. I never thought we would do this poorly.

I have heard “It’s a poison”. “Why trust an untested vaccine when I can rely on my own immune system”.

[djAdvocate]

if everyone could rely on their immune system NOBODY would die from disease. ever.

[Spellbound454]

Can hardly call it untested, hundreds of millions of doses have been given.

[djAdvocate]

Jan 3, 2022 5:43:30 GMT -5 Spellbound454 said:

Can hardly call it untested, hundreds of millions of doses have been given.

this has to do with confidence in science.

the bleach injection community prefers brands they know.  like Chlorox.**

(** even though name brand bleaches are nearly 2x as expensive as their chemically equal generic counterparts)