whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Jun 18, 2016 17:37:22 GMT -5
How is this rude? It's a present for your husband for Father's day - HIS day. Why is it rude to want to spend time with just him? May be your DD wants it to be a bonding experience for her future husband (father of her future children) with her Dad. I think it's great, not rude. Why do you think you have to be included in everything? Why does mother want to be included on everything? What kind of marriage you are in? I am with OP! You are my child. You have to consider my feelings. Apparently child doesn't really know her father that well if she is taking him to event he would hate!I am sure it was all done for the fiancé by fiancé. And she is just blindly in love and can't see how selfish it is. I would have a serious talk with daughter. I demand respect. I am THE mother!!! So far I am in a pretty good marriage, thank you for asking. And so are my parents. Neither my husband and I, nor my mom and my dad are tied to the hip and do everything together. There are times when my mom went places with my husband, there are times when my husband went to places with my dad. There are times....well, I hope you get the point. I would probably want to shoot myself in a head if we all had to go to everything together. Yes, I already said that it doesn't make sense that DD and fiance are giving a gift that recipient has no interest in. And I don't demand respect from anyone.
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justme
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Post by justme on Jun 18, 2016 17:45:22 GMT -5
Demanding respect is often the quickest way to lose it.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Jun 18, 2016 17:45:43 GMT -5
... At first my husband thought nothing of it, until I pointed out how rude it was. ... But I am sure he was very quick to agree with you once you made his feelings clear on how it was to be taken. That's funny
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 18, 2016 18:04:27 GMT -5
I would have been hurt too, because I think there was no reason to exclude the OP.
BUT, I also think the OP is overreacting. I would certainly not "draw any proverbial line in the sand", "consider this a game changer", or any of that nonsense that is more likely to impact you negatively in the future. Those who raise the point about the fact that your DD is creating a new family are absolutely right. She is, so you should talk to her. Tell her that you would have loved to have been included, and that if money was the issue, you would have been happy to pay for your own ticket.
Last Christmas, my gift from my 2 adult kids was tickets to the Cirque de Soleil for me, with the two of them. They chose to buy other (less expensive) Christmas gifts for DH and their younger 2 siblings. I know the story, so I know it came from a good place (I have taken them all to the Cirque de Soleil occasionally over the years, at great expense, so they knew I really like it. It only comes here every 3-4 years or so.)
What my DS1 and DS2 did differently from Happy Prose's DD is, they first asked my DH if he'd like to go too. He said yes, he would. DD (who works) was asked if she would like to go (and pay her way), she declined. So DH paid for his ticket and DS3's. Knowing DH, I think he didn't realize that DD had declined, or he would have paid for her ticket too.
In the end it was just three days after DS1's Lasik, DS1 still couldn't see properly or bear bright lights, so he gave his ticket to DD, so she went instead of DS1.
But I DO get Happy Prose's point. In her position, I would have been hurt too (assuming it was something I would have enjoyed seeing).
And I agree with Dannylion, if you don't see how this could be hurtful, I wouldn't know how to explain it to you. I think she did a better job of explaining than I could. The bottom line would be, are you just inviting person A, or are you also excluding person B?
We are much more about experiences than things, so it would be hurtful to either DH or me for one of us to be included in a meaningful experience, and the other excluded. I would consider tickets to a performance a meaningful experience. If we were talking about something specific to either of us, ie a car thing, or a spa day (not my thing but I get that it's a Girls' Day Out), that would be different.
And I'm sure every family has different things they would prefer to do together or separately.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 18, 2016 18:12:35 GMT -5
... Last Christmas, ... What they did differently from Happy Prose's family is, ... they set up the situation to do something with her Father and his future Father-in-Law to celebrate Father's Day.
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Artemis Windsong
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Post by Artemis Windsong on Jun 18, 2016 18:15:47 GMT -5
I would be very hurt to be left out. Not only the initial shock but clear through and well beyond the event.
I wonder if you could buy a ticket for yourself. Assigned seats? But, tell the kids first that you want to go and will be getting your own ticket.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 18, 2016 18:19:34 GMT -5
they set up the situation to do something with her Father and his future Father-in-Law to celebrate Father's Day.
Thank you for reinforcing the fact that my reading comprehension skills are intact.
ETA: Billson, it's not because I don't agree with you that I can't read. It wasn't a private thing, it was an outing, there was no reason to exclude the OP, except perhaps a financial one.
If it's one-on-one, it's one-on-one. But once the fiancé was involved, it was no longer one-on-one, so there was no reason (IMO of course) for the DD's fiancé to be included, while the dad's wife (her mom) was excluded.
Plus it sounds like they are rather clueless, inviting this guy alone when he doesn't want to go anywhere. It seems more likely to me that he'd have gone if his wife was invited too, if that was their goal, getting him to go. But, that's another issue.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 18, 2016 18:34:04 GMT -5
they set up the situation to do something with her Father and his future Father-in-Law to celebrate Father's Day.
Thank you for reinforcing the fact that my reading comprehension skills are intact. ETA: Billson, it's not because I don't agree with you that I can't read. Nothing to do with your reading comprehension skills. I was questioning your example from Christmas as being relevant because the difference that mattered is that the gift was for a day that specially celebrates fathers.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 18, 2016 18:35:54 GMT -5
Ah. Sorry Billson, I missed that. To me my example was relevant because it was a gift to one of us rather than both of us, but I see your point.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2016 18:36:48 GMT -5
I can't see why it's fine for daughter, but not daughter and her husband. Dad is going to be his dad now too. They are a unit. There might even progress to a day when it's just fiancé and dad... Will that be an issue?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 18, 2016 18:37:58 GMT -5
... so there was no reason (IMO of course) for the DD's fiancé to be included, ... I think being with his future Father-in-Law as a celebration of Father's Day is a good reason.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 18, 2016 18:41:23 GMT -5
Why be exclusive when you can be inclusive? The OP is talking about 4 people. They may all create their own affinities over time, but this seems very early, why be exclusive and hurt anybody?
I wouldn't not invite both halves of a couple to anything unless I had good reason. A couple just starting out, I don't get why they would opt to do that.
And know that DH and I do plenty on our own, without the other. PLENTY. But neither of us would want to be purposely excluded by our own kids for something we both would enjoy.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 18, 2016 18:44:34 GMT -5
.. I wouldn't not invite both halves of a couple to anything unless I had good reason. ... Father's Day?
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 18, 2016 18:45:03 GMT -5
They are a unit.
Oped, the OP and her DH are a unit too.
I'm stopping, I agree (again) with Danny, we are unlikely to change anybody's mind about this.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 18, 2016 18:46:52 GMT -5
Father's Day?
I have never celebrated my father's Father's Day nor my kids' Father's Day without the rest of the family present. If they wanted to do something special, yes, why not?! But this doesn't cut it, in my book.
We'll just have to agree to disagree.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 18, 2016 18:55:26 GMT -5
They are a unit.
Oped, the OP and her DH are a unit too. I'm stopping, I agree (again) with Danny, we are unlikely to change anybody's mind about this. Yes, they are a parenting unit. For Parenting Day they should be treated as a unit. But they are also individually Mother and Father. They have their own days for that.
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Jun 18, 2016 18:55:44 GMT -5
Maybe the fiancé's father is dead?? Or lives so far away that he can't spend time with him or maybe he has a bad relationship with his dad and Well you get my drift. Maybe the OP's daughter didn't want the OP to go
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 18, 2016 18:59:33 GMT -5
The irony here is, DH and I have taught our kids that Mother's Day and Father's Day are Hallmark holidays and shouldn't even be celebrated (although we always celebrated for our parents, all of whom are long gone).
But it's good for coffee or tea in the morning and a bouquet of flowers or a plant LOL.
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justme
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Post by justme on Jun 18, 2016 19:00:43 GMT -5
Why be exclusive when you can be inclusive? The OP is talking about 4 people. They may all create their own affinities over time, but this seems very early, why be exclusive and hurt anybody? I wouldn't not invite both halves of a couple to anything unless I had good reason. A couple just starting out, I don't get why they would opt to do that. And know that DH and I do plenty on our own, without the other. PLENTY. But neither of us would want to be purposely excluded by our own kids for something we both would enjoy. I don't like the idea of always having to invite both halves of the couple. Formal things like weddings or where there's lots of other couples, sure it's rude. But always? I think that rule is really shitty to the single folks out there. In my friend group we're in a struggle right now with one anyways assuming her bf is invited without us actually inviting him. Married girls in the group don't automatically assume their husbands are invited, but every time we ask this one to do something she immediately says let me see if he's free. I think it's rude to invite someone not invited to a gathering. I know family dynamics are different.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 18, 2016 19:04:55 GMT -5
I don't like the idea of always having to invite both halves of the couple. Formal things like weddings or where there's lots of other couples, sure it's rude. But always? I think that rule is really shitty to the single folks out there.
Justme, I agree! I'm only taking about Mother's Day or Father's Day, when both parents are together, or when stepparents have been around for a very long time (my kids' case). Because that is what this thread was about.
Sorry if I caused any offense, it was definitely not my intention. My ex left 24 years ago, he's still with the woman he left me for, and my DH and I have been together for 23 years.
Again; I was talking about Mother's Day / Father's Day / long-term couples.
My DH and I do a lot of things on our own. He's in a band, I'm in a book club, we are both in a theater troupe but we don't always have the same rehearsal schedule. That's all fine, but we'd both be hurt if one of our kids excluded the other without good reason.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 18, 2016 19:05:42 GMT -5
Father's Day?
I have never ... Neither have I. But this isn't what you or I ... Two adults decided how they will celebrate their Father and future Father-in-Law. They chose how to do that and I consider it disrespectful to not honor their decision.
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Jun 18, 2016 19:12:29 GMT -5
Father's Day?
I have never ... Neither have I. But this isn't what you or I ... Two adults decided how they will celebrate their Father and future Father-in-Law. They chose how to do that and I consider it disrespectful to not honor their decision. That would be the adult thing to do. Geeze, tried to bold the last sentence but on iPad and don't know how.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2016 19:23:26 GMT -5
They were all together to celebrate. The event was HIS gift. The father. For Father's Day. From the kids.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2016 19:29:11 GMT -5
To me the biggest thing isn't that she was upset. I don't get it, but we all feel slighted sometimes by things others let us we probably just need to let go.
To me the biggest issue is the 'game changer' 'shocked at daughter' 'want to be mean mom/mil'
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msventoux
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Post by msventoux on Jun 18, 2016 19:35:27 GMT -5
I don't like the idea of always having to invite both halves of the couple. Formal things like weddings or where there's lots of other couples, sure it's rude. But always? I think that rule is really shitty to the single folks out there.Justme, I agree! I'm only taking about Mother's Day or Father's Day, when both parents are together, or when stepparents have been around for a very long time (my kids' case). Because that is what this thread was about. Sorry if I caused any offense, it was definitely not my intention. My ex left 24 years ago, he's still with the woman he left me for, and my DH and I have been together for 23 years. Again; I was talking about Mother's Day / Father's Day / long-term couples. My DH and I do a lot of things on our own. He's in a band, I'm in a book club, we are both in a theater troupe but we don't always have the same rehearsal schedule. That's all fine, but we'd both be hurt if one of our kids excluded the other without good reason. From a kids point of view, please try to get over that. When my mom was alive I really resented that I could never have any one-on-one time with her without my father tagging along and dominating the interaction. I wouldn't have excluded either of them all of the time, but it would have been wonderful to have been able to have a girls day out without having to accommodate the wants of another person who didn't have the same interests.
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Kolt!
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Post by Kolt! on Jun 18, 2016 20:38:24 GMT -5
Being that they've also had mom, fiancee, girlfriend time and not much father, fiancee, daughter time I think it's important as well.
They've had time to bond all three of them together but not the other three. I think it's important in relationships to have that time to bond and sometimes always having the other parent there makes it difficult. As I'm mentioned from my own experience if I hadn't had just my girlfriend and me with her father I don't think we'd ever had bonded.
There's going to need to be times where it's just the three of them where the other person shouldn't always be invited. Sure the father has been invited before and he refused which allowed the three of you to get together without him and help in bonding.
Maybe your daughter finds it important that her fiancee and father bond therefore she's wanting it to be three of them. She's not going to want them to go off by themselves at first but it's not as easy for them to bond when the other parent is there. It can make the parent that isn't bonding as much with the two use the other significant other as a clutch and they'll talk less.
Maybe it isn't there intention. But I personally 100 percent believe it's important to have outings where the other parent isn't always there for bonding reasons.
This honestly just sounds like A. You're jealous that he gets to go to a game you want to go to or B. You don't want your daughter and her fiancee to bond with them more then you.
You can't always expect to be there every time your husband, daughter and fiancee want to spend time together so why does it matter if it's this game or if it's say going to the movies and out to eat? It's important they do things without you.
And this is also Father's Day this will soon be his Father in Law and it's your daughter's father. "Father's Day" ...I certainly hope the man isn't your father.
It sounds like you all had a little get together for Father's Day and this is a gift a gift that just so happens to be them doing something together. A gift for "Father's Day" isn't meant to benefit the mother too hence "Mother's Day" a Birthday gift isn't meant to benefit the person's significant other.
-- And the fact you'd want to be "mean mom" because you didn't get to go to the game too is quite crazy. You're only hurting yourself more if you react this way.
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Kolt!
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Post by Kolt! on Jun 18, 2016 20:41:07 GMT -5
ALSO even if it isn't the case and that's not why she wants it the three of them I think you need to back down.
From the sounds of it THEY have yet to have it be just the three of them and I think this will be a GREAT opportunity for them to finally have it.
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tloonya
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Post by tloonya on Jun 19, 2016 0:51:41 GMT -5
He is taking his future Father-in-Law to a game as a gift for Father's Day. That's what I was trying to say earlier, I should have kept it simple. Except he is forgetting : 1. Father hated the games 2. Mother in law is fathers wife and can And will his life miserable to the rest of (Whom ever) life! Stupid move!!!! He got to go...
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tloonya
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Post by tloonya on Jun 19, 2016 0:58:10 GMT -5
They were all together to celebrate. The event was HIS gift. The father. For Father's Day. From the kids. And the fact that FATHER hates this kind of outing is off the table ? Are you listening? Or just typing ?
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tloonya
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Post by tloonya on Jun 19, 2016 1:02:54 GMT -5
Why be exclusive when you can be inclusive? The OP is talking about 4 people. They may all create their own affinities over time, but this seems very early, why be exclusive and hurt anybody? I wouldn't not invite both halves of a couple to anything unless I had good reason. A couple just starting out, I don't get why they would opt to do that. And know that DH and I do plenty on our own, without the other. PLENTY. But neither of us would want to be purposely excluded by our own kids for something we both would enjoy. I don't like the idea of always having to invite both halves of the couple. Formal things like weddings or where there's lots of other couples, sure it's rude. But always? I think that rule is really shitty to the single folks out there. In my friend group we're in a struggle right now with one anyways assuming her bf is invited without us actually inviting him. Married girls in the group don't automatically assume their husbands are invited, but every time we ask this one to do something she immediately says let me see if he's free. I think it's rude to invite someone not invited to a gathering. I know family dynamics are different. Why go assume when it is all clear that both families have mothers and fathers all alive and toghether?
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