milee
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Post by milee on Jan 26, 2016 9:07:23 GMT -5
And by their color, right? Because I'm getting the strong subtext here of you (and possibly Zib with the mysterious "more to the story" comment) being threatened because the people approaching you are minorities.
As for the idea that young men don't approach older women in grocery store parking lots - ridiculous. Young men have approached me to talk in various parking lots and I've yet to be robbed.
LOL! This remark took longer to show up than I expected. Interesting that you were aware that your actions might sound racist, yet you still chose to do them, write about them and even laugh when someone brought the subject up.
I'm really, really glad I don't have a black son. Sounds like there's a legit chance he might get shot if he walks up to ask someone for directions or return something - which are things both of my white sons have done without anyone apparently feeling threatened enough to pull a gun on them.
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gregintenn
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Post by gregintenn on Jan 26, 2016 9:13:55 GMT -5
LOL! This remark took longer to show up than I expected. Interesting that you were aware that your actions might sound racist, yet you still chose to do them, write about them and even laugh when someone brought the subject up.
I'm really, really glad I don't have a black son. Sounds like there's a legit chance he might get shot if he walks up to ask someone for directions or return something - which are things both of my white sons have done without anyone apparently feeling threatened enough to pull a gun on them.
You're right. I forget how sensitive and politically correct some here are. I shouldn't have included that fact in my description. It really doesn't have any bearing as race wouldn't have been a factor at all in my decisions.
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milee
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Post by milee on Jan 26, 2016 9:32:49 GMT -5
Interesting that you were aware that your actions might sound racist, yet you still chose to do them, write about them and even laugh when someone brought the subject up.
I'm really, really glad I don't have a black son. Sounds like there's a legit chance he might get shot if he walks up to ask someone for directions or return something - which are things both of my white sons have done without anyone apparently feeling threatened enough to pull a gun on them.
You're right. I forget how sensitive and politically correct some here are. I shouldn't have included that fact in my description. It really doesn't have any bearing as race wouldn't have been a factor at all in my decisions.
You must be new here. I've never once been accused of being sensitive. And PC isn't my thing, either.
The fact that you chose to indicate their race as a descriptor in a very short post indicates it was indeed a factor for you. Why else even describe it? You didn't list that they were wearing white tennis shoes, or that there was a candy wrapper on the ground or that you ate cookies for breakfast...because none of those things is relevant. Apparently, their race was relevant to you because you chose to list it.
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gregintenn
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Post by gregintenn on Jan 26, 2016 9:36:02 GMT -5
You're right. I forget how sensitive and politically correct some here are. I shouldn't have included that fact in my description. It really doesn't have any bearing as race wouldn't have been a factor at all in my decisions.
You must be new here. I've never once been accused of being sensitive. And PC isn't my thing, either.
The fact that you chose to indicate their race as a descriptor in a very short post indicates it was indeed a factor for you. Why else even describe it? You didn't list that they were wearing white tennis shoes, or that there was a candy wrapper on the ground or that you ate cookies for breakfast...because none of those things is relevant. Apparently, their race was relevant to you because you chose to list it.
Perhaps, without my realizing it, it was a factor in my mind. It's what stands out in my memory, and I endeavored to describe these scenarios as accurately as I could remember.
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Cookies Galore
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Post by Cookies Galore on Jan 26, 2016 9:36:24 GMT -5
You're right. I forget how sensitive and politically correct some here are. I shouldn't have included that fact in my description. It really doesn't have any bearing as race wouldn't have been a factor at all in my decisions.
You must be new here. I've never once been accused of being sensitive. And PC isn't my thing, either.
The fact that you chose to indicate their race as a descriptor in a very short post indicates it was indeed a factor for you. Why else even describe it? You didn't list that they were wearing white tennis shoes, or that there was a candy wrapper on the ground or that you ate cookies for breakfast...because none of those things is relevant. Apparently, their race was relevant to you because you chose to list it.
Only the blacks dudes. He "inadvertently" left out the white guy descriptor, after all.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2016 9:38:12 GMT -5
I don't know milee, I'm almost convinced he really would draw a gun on just about anyone, regardless of race.
Then again, he didn't bother to describe the guy picking up stone from the mountain as a white guy...
eta: crossed with cg...
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milee
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Post by milee on Jan 26, 2016 9:40:57 GMT -5
You must be new here. I've never once been accused of being sensitive. And PC isn't my thing, either.
The fact that you chose to indicate their race as a descriptor in a very short post indicates it was indeed a factor for you. Why else even describe it? You didn't list that they were wearing white tennis shoes, or that there was a candy wrapper on the ground or that you ate cookies for breakfast...because none of those things is relevant. Apparently, their race was relevant to you because you chose to list it.
Perhaps, without my realizing it, it was a factor in my mind. It's what stands out in my memory, and I endeavored to describe these scenarios as accurately as I could remember. OK. That's an honest answer and reasonable. I'd like to very, very respectfully request that you do a little soul searching. Like Mich, I'm a big believer in trusting your gut and honoring the gift of fear. On the other hand, if you're always carrying a gun and someone just being black is enough to cause or aggravate a gut reaction in you, that could end very badly for both the other person and for you.
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gregintenn
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Post by gregintenn on Jan 26, 2016 9:45:25 GMT -5
Perhaps, without my realizing it, it was a factor in my mind. It's what stands out in my memory, and I endeavored to describe these scenarios as accurately as I could remember. OK. That's an honest answer and reasonable. I'd like to very, very respectfully request that you do a little soul searching. Like Mich, I'm a big believer in trusting your gut and honoring the gift of fear. On the other hand, if you're always carrying a gun and someone just being black is enough to cause or aggravate a gut reaction in you, that could end very badly for both the other person and for you. If a group of young, black men are surrounding you and all walking toward you in an otherwise unattended gas station, I feel you have are reasonable to expect trouble. They didn't exactly appear to be Jehovah's Witnesses. If that's racist, lay it on me.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 26, 2016 9:49:13 GMT -5
As many of you have pointed out, everybody lives a different life in a different area with different levels of risk. We can't say, "Well...something like that has never happened to me." and expect that it's never happened to anyone else. Obviously, we know better.
Also, as many of you have pointed out, we don't know what would have happened in the instances of those who have drawn their weapons in different situations. But we do know what DID happen. They escaped without injury. That's my goal. To escape without injury - hopefully to escape without injuring someone else.
I was in a situation once where I had no means to defend myself. It did not turn out well for me. I can guarantee nobody will find me without the means to defend myself ever again.
I would never advise someone to carry a weapon. I would never advise someone not to. Serious harm could come from my advice either way. It's a personal decision made after weighing the pros and cons.
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ArchietheDragon
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Post by ArchietheDragon on Jan 26, 2016 9:56:32 GMT -5
OK. That's an honest answer and reasonable. I'd like to very, very respectfully request that you do a little soul searching. Like Mich, I'm a big believer in trusting your gut and honoring the gift of fear. On the other hand, if you're always carrying a gun and someone just being black is enough to cause or aggravate a gut reaction in you, that could end very badly for both the other person and for you. If a group of young, black men are surrounding you and all walking toward you in an otherwise unattended gas station, I feel you have are reasonable to expect trouble. They didn't exactly appear to be Jehovah's Witnesses. If that's racist, lay it on me. maybe they wanted to serenade you with some Boyz II Men.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2016 10:06:30 GMT -5
Green Eyed Lady, while I understand what you are saying, the fact remains that many people who carry guns seem to mistake 'escape' from just went about their daily business. The statistics show that people who carry weapons are more likely to die. I'm not saying don't carry them. Just that it isn't an end all situation. It requires thought and planning and frankly disposition. The fact is that people who carry guns are more likely to escalate a situation which would not normally have ended in violence/death. They are more likely to die than they are to save themselves or anyone else with the gun. That is just numbers, no injection of opinion. And what I saw in this thread seems to back that up. The first instinct to reach for a gun when its perfectly possible that there was in reality NO risk... is problematic and indicative of the statistics.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 26, 2016 10:37:10 GMT -5
Nobody said it was and end all situation, oped. At least I certainly didn't. Statistics and links don't mean shit when it comes to real life - and I have experienced the worst side of real life. You don't get that from links and stats. You get it from experience.
You are obviously passionate about this issue. I respect passion even when I don't agree with it. Handing out advice regarding the choice to carry a weapon is like practicing medicine without a license. I'm not saying you are doing that - you are simply writing what you have read. I'm not arrogant enough to think I know it all - just what works for me. You know what works for you. All the statistics in the world aren't going to change my mind because I know exactly what those stats are worth if it comes down to it. Absolutely nothing.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2016 10:40:26 GMT -5
Oh I didn't mean you. I do think some people seem to think it is the solution to everything.
I am sorry for whatever violence you survived. I am glad you survived it however. I appreciate your perspective.
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 26, 2016 10:42:32 GMT -5
Oh I didn't mean you. I do think some people seem to think it is the solution to everything.
I am sorry for whatever violence you survived. I am glad you survived it however. I appreciate your perspective. That was a nice thing to say. Thank you.
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Jan 26, 2016 10:43:39 GMT -5
If I pulled into a random driveway and the owner approached me with a gun I'd absolutely burn rubber getting away. Same if I was near someone in a parking lot or on a gravel road. I don't know that there aren't people online somewhere telling about how they were almost killed/attacked by some guy with a gun but they quickly ran.
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imawino
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Post by imawino on Jan 26, 2016 10:50:29 GMT -5
OK, maybe I had to be there, but I'm not understanding why a young man approaching you in a grocery store parking lot at 9 AM is threatening.
I've had people come up to me in public parking lots before - one person to return something that dropped out of my cart, one person to return my toddler's shoe that fell off, the cart guys who come get my cart from me if they happen to be in the lot (sometimes you see their work uniform, sometimes they're wearing a jacket over it so you don't know right away if they're an employee). It didn't occur to me in any of those incidents that the guy had hostile intentions. And they didn't. Could this guy have had completely innocent intentions?
This reminds me of when my DH came with me on a business trip to Chicago back in the 80's. He was 29, our DS was a baby, and DH wanted to go to a baseball game while I was working. He was standing on the train platform, DS in a swaddle carrier on his chest, holding a big blue diaper bag with kid supplies, and he attempted to walk up to a middle age woman to ask her what train he should get on. The woman looked horrified and ran away from him. He felt bad for frightening her, but there he was, in the middle of the day, on a busy subway platform, carrying both a baby and a big bag - how was that threatening?
This is my problem with stories people tell about how they saved themselves with their guns. I have to wonder if they were actually threatened at all, or just assumed they were threatened but were wrong. Impossible to know for sure.
You will never know. But I am pretty sure that when someone you don't know backs into your driveway, then guns away (pun intended) when you approach their vehicle with a rifle, they aren't there to ask directions to the highway.
My shooting instructor is a strong supporter of that hinky feeling you get when someone is up to no good. He is also a strong supporter of getting the hell out of dodge rather than pulling your firearm, if the option is there. About you husband on the subway platform, you have no idea why she felt threatened. It could have been so simple in that she just lost her child and absolutely nothing to do with your DH, but the infant he was carrying. What?? It means no such thing. Who in the hell wouldn't "gun it" and drive away if someone walked up to their car carrying a rifle?? The answer is no one, regardless of whether they had any ill intent.
eta: SK just beat me
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imawino
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Post by imawino on Jan 26, 2016 10:53:54 GMT -5
Well, I was day dreaming leaving publix today. Broad daylight, 9 am. I was approached by a young man. My own fault. I'm usually more aware of my surroundings and was dawdling putting the groceries in my car. I was damn lucky I "woke up" before he got too close and jumped in my car and locked the door. Wished like hell my gun had been in the car just in case but he walked away. I totally blame myself for thinking broad daylight and a public parking lot in a good neighborhood was safe. But my real guilt was in not being aware of my surroundings and dawdling while putting away stuff. I learned years ago a woman's most vulnerable time was messing with the kids in the car seats. I put myself in the same situation today. I was just damn lucky it didn't end badly for me. I don't need to get into race because mayhem comes in all colors. OK, maybe I had to be there, but I'm not understanding why a young man approaching you in a grocery store parking lot at 9 AM is threatening.
I've had people come up to me in public parking lots before - one person to return something that dropped out of my cart, one person to return my toddler's shoe that fell off, the cart guys who come get my cart from me if they happen to be in the lot (sometimes you see their work uniform, sometimes they're wearing a jacket over it so you don't know right away if they're an employee). It didn't occur to me in any of those incidents that the guy had hostile intentions. And they didn't. Could this guy have had completely innocent intentions?
This reminds me of when my DH came with me on a business trip to Chicago back in the 80's. He was 29, our DS was a baby, and DH wanted to go to a baseball game while I was working. He was standing on the train platform, DS in a swaddle carrier on his chest, holding a big blue diaper bag with kid supplies, and he attempted to walk up to a middle age woman to ask her what train he should get on. The woman looked horrified and ran away from him. He felt bad for frightening her, but there he was, in the middle of the day, on a busy subway platform, carrying both a baby and a big bag - how was that threatening?
This is my problem with stories people tell about how they saved themselves with their guns. I have to wonder if they were actually threatened at all, or just assumed they were threatened but were wrong. Impossible to know for sure.
he was probably trying to sell magazines or some such nonsense. I can't even tell you how many young men have tried to sell me magazines in a Publix parking lot.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 26, 2016 10:54:14 GMT -5
Oh I didn't mean you. I do think some people seem to think it is the solution to everything.
I am sorry for whatever violence you survived. I am glad you survived it however. I appreciate your perspective. I don't think that anyone has said that carrying is the solution to everything. In fact, if you go through any sort of training whatsoever, the first thing you learn is your goal is to NOT pull your weapon unless you are backed into a corner, you ONLY pull it as a last resort. My shooting instructor says "always imagine that beyond the muzzle of your gun is a daycare center containing a lawyer's child". His wife (who also conceal carries) was attacked by a dog while she was out walking her elderly dog. The large dog was on top of her and biting her, the owner was utterly useless. Instructor's wife had a gun on her, but even though she was on the on the ground and being attacked by a dog, she was cognizant enough that there were too many people and she was concerned about a stray bullet. In the shooting in the mall in Oregon, there was someone who was carrying and had a clear shot at the shooter. However, he saw someone beyond the shooter and he backed down because he too was concerned about a stray bullet. legacy.kgw.com/story/news/2014/07/24/12405148/While most stories you hear on the news are those who are not trained, you very rarely (if ever) hear about those who have chosen the prudent action.
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imawino
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Post by imawino on Jan 26, 2016 10:54:59 GMT -5
Green Eyed Lady, while I understand what you are saying, the fact remains that many people who carry guns seem to mistake 'escape' from just went about their daily business. The statistics show that people who carry weapons are more likely to die. I'm not saying don't carry them. Just that it isn't an end all situation. It requires thought and planning and frankly disposition. The fact is that people who carry guns are more likely to escalate a situation which would not normally have ended in violence/death. They are more likely to die than they are to save themselves or anyone else with the gun. That is just numbers, no injection of opinion. And what I saw in this thread seems to back that up. The first instinct to reach for a gun when its perfectly possible that there was in reality NO risk... is problematic and indicative of the statistics.
Yeah that. Times a million.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 26, 2016 10:59:33 GMT -5
If I pulled into a random driveway and the owner approached me with a gun I'd absolutely burn rubber getting away. Same if I was near someone in a parking lot or on a gravel road. I don't know that there aren't people online somewhere telling about how they were almost killed/attacked by some guy with a gun but they quickly ran. Most people, if they need directions, they pull into a driveway and go up to the front door. They don't back into a driveway up to the open garage (which was at the rear of the property). You have to understand that there was looting going on and people were breaking into houses on the road, stealing what they could. The National Guard had been called in by then, to try to help control things.
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imawino
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Post by imawino on Jan 26, 2016 11:24:04 GMT -5
As many of you have pointed out, everybody lives a different life in a different area with different levels of risk. We can't say, "Well...something like that has never happened to me." and expect that it's never happened to anyone else. Obviously, we know better.
Also, as many of you have pointed out, we don't know what would have happened in the instances of those who have drawn their weapons in different situations. But we do know what DID happen. They escaped without injury. That's my goal. To escape without injury - hopefully to escape without injuring someone else.
I was in a situation once where I had no means to defend myself. It did not turn out well for me. I can guarantee nobody will find me without the means to defend myself ever again.
I would never advise someone to carry a weapon. I would never advise someone not to. Serious harm could come from my advice either way. It's a personal decision made after weighing the pros and cons. I am very sorry for whatever violence you went through. Truly. I hope that you fully recovered, physically and emotionally. I am very happy for you that you are alive and well to post about it today. The introduction of a gun into the situation would have made that a much less likely possibility, in most situations. I can't speak to your incident specifically, that may not have been the case for you. I can speak to my own incidents. I was attacked at a gas station when I was 17. To make a long story short, neither of us was armed and luckily after a physical struggle I was largely unharmed. I have not one single doubt in my mind that if I had been holding a gun it would have been taken away and that situation would have ended very, very differently for me. (for the record, he was white - blond and blue-eyed I think)
I was also approached on a street in Lisbon by a guy who asked me if I spoke English and then told me to come with him or he was going to kill me. He had his hand in his pocket and was trying to give the impression he had a gun, but I have no idea if he did. After standing there open mouthed like an f-ing moron thinking "is this really happening??" I ran away and tagged on to a group of people walking back in the direction of my hotel. Had I had a gun he was definitely close enough to have taken it from me, although I don't know that he would have. I do know that in my dumbfounded panic, I would have been in no position to use or be in control of a gun.
These are obviously just a couple of random experiences, and everyone's personal story is different. But it really has been factually born out (and I believe there were some good links above) that a gun can make a lot of situations less safe, rather than more.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jan 26, 2016 11:24:29 GMT -5
See, I'm willing to take Mich's example as a gun successfully being used to deter crime. But I'm a lot more skeptical of the parking lot type reports.
I'm white, middle class and have worked and been in sketchy areas of town at odd times. I have NEVER felt threatened when approached. I'm also damn oblivious to my surroundings 95% of the time so I'd be easy pickings.
But I've never been mugged or anything. I don't know if I'm lucky or what. My experience says most people will leave you alone, except for the panhandlers. Maybe I'm in the minority.
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Post by mojothehelpermonkey on Jan 26, 2016 11:28:13 GMT -5
I have lived in some high crime areas over the past 15 years. I don't carry a gun, but sometimes I think it would be nice to have one if I am walking through a parking garage at night or something like that. However, I have only been assaulted once, and I was sleeping when it started so I would not have been able to use a gun to prevent it. It still might have felt nice to shoot him, but I probably would have gone to prison for that. I also felt like I was in danger when I had to share a hotel room with my crazy ex after we had a fight. If either of us had had a gun, it probably would have been used on me. There is a homeless (black) guy who gathers cans in the alley of my apartment complex. You have to go through the alley pretty early to get the most cans, so I have run into him a few times before the sun is even up. He usually coughs or clears his throat if I don't notice him. I appreciate it because then I don't get startled. I wonder if he worries about getting shot.
Edit: Just to clarify, I didn't mention that the homeless guy was black to imply that he was somehow extra scary. There was a white homeless guy taking shelter from the rain in my parking spot a few months ago, and he just about gave me a heart attack because I didn't notice him at first. He wasn't trying to mug me or anything either, but I wish he would have announced himself instead of just popping up behind me.
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imawino
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Post by imawino on Jan 26, 2016 11:30:29 GMT -5
See, I'm willing to take Mich's example as a gun successfully being used to deter crime. But I'm a lot more skeptical of the parking lot type reports. I'm white, middle class and have worked and been in sketchy areas of town at odd times. I have NEVER felt threatened when approached. I'm also damn oblivious to my surroundings 95% of the time so I'd be easy pickings. But I've never been mugged or anything. I don't know if I'm lucky or what. My experience says most people will leave you alone, except for the panhandlers. Maybe I'm in the minority. It may well have been, who knows. It wasn't really that I quibbled with. It was the assertion that driving away when someone walks up to your car carrying a rifle is somehow indicative of ill intent. It's really just indicative of having a functioning brain cell.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 26, 2016 11:47:47 GMT -5
You will never know. But I am pretty sure that when someone you don't know backs into your driveway, then guns away (pun intended) when you approach their vehicle with a rifle, they aren't there to ask directions to the highway.
My shooting instructor is a strong supporter of that hinky feeling you get when someone is up to no good. He is also a strong supporter of getting the hell out of dodge rather than pulling your firearm, if the option is there. About you husband on the subway platform, you have no idea why she felt threatened. It could have been so simple in that she just lost her child and absolutely nothing to do with your DH, but the infant he was carrying. What?? It means no such thing. Who in the hell wouldn't "gun it" and drive away if someone walked up to their car carrying a rifle?? The answer is no one, regardless of whether they had any ill intent.
eta: SK just beat me
Let me see.... The house is not immediately off the highway. You have to drive 7 miles down a long, curvy road to get to this road, which is fairly isolated in upstate NY. The first 100 yards of this road are no houses, so you would not expect houses further down there if you were looking for directions to the highway. IOW, no one wanders into this neighborhood unless they are looking for a house. There are 20 houses on the road, each clearly marked with name and number. The truck had driven up and down the road several times, the truck (or owner) did not live on the road. It was in a middle of an ice storm, where looting was prevalent. Generators were prime pickings, as they have to be maintained outside to avoid fumes. The truck backed into the driveway up to the garage. Had the truck pulled into the driveway head first rather than backing up to the end of the property (where the garage was located), then this point would be moot. My dad was elderly. There was a disparity of force. Which means that had he not had the gun, then the man could have easily overtaken both my dad and his (also) elderly neighbor who were sharing said generator. Now, what possible reason could there be for someone 'looking for directions' to back into a driveway?
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 26, 2016 11:51:28 GMT -5
It was the assertion that driving away when someone walks up to your car carrying a rifle is somehow indicative of ill intent.
In the middle of an ice storm, with suggestions to stay off the road, who goes trolling through neighborhoods unless there is ill intent?
Would you really wait until they were hauling the generator into the back of their truck in order to assume that they had ill intent?
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 26, 2016 11:52:09 GMT -5
As many of you have pointed out, everybody lives a different life in a different area with different levels of risk. We can't say, "Well...something like that has never happened to me." and expect that it's never happened to anyone else. Obviously, we know better.
Also, as many of you have pointed out, we don't know what would have happened in the instances of those who have drawn their weapons in different situations. But we do know what DID happen. They escaped without injury. That's my goal. To escape without injury - hopefully to escape without injuring someone else.
I was in a situation once where I had no means to defend myself. It did not turn out well for me. I can guarantee nobody will find me without the means to defend myself ever again.
I would never advise someone to carry a weapon. I would never advise someone not to. Serious harm could come from my advice either way. It's a personal decision made after weighing the pros and cons. I am very sorry for whatever violence you went through. Truly. I hope that you fully recovered, physically and emotionally. I am very happy for you that you are alive and well to post about it today. The introduction of a gun into the situation would have made that a much less likely possibility, in most situations. I can't speak to your incident specifically, that may not have been the case for you. I can speak to my own incidents. I was attacked at a gas station when I was 17. To make a long story short, neither of us was armed and luckily after a physical struggle I was largely unharmed. I have not one single doubt in my mind that if I had been holding a gun it would have been taken away and that situation would have ended very, very differently for me. (for the record, he was white - blond and blue-eyed I think)
I was also approached on a street in Lisbon by a guy who asked me if I spoke English and then told me to come with him or he was going to kill me. He had his hand in his pocket and was trying to give the impression he had a gun, but I have no idea if he did. After standing there open mouthed like an f-ing moron thinking "is this really happening??" I ran away and tagged on to a group of people walking back in the direction of my hotel. Had I had a gun he was definitely close enough to have taken it from me, although I don't know that he would have. I do know that in my dumbfounded panic, I would have been in no position to use or be in control of a gun.
These are obviously just a couple of random experiences, and everyone's personal story is different. But it really has been factually born out (and I believe there were some good links above) that a gun can make a lot of situations less safe, rather than more.
I'm fine physically and emotionally. I was always a bit nuts so that hasn't changed!
But you are right. In that particular situation at that particular time, a weapon wouldn't have helped me. There are several reasons for that. A. I was stupid and took no steps any half-way intelligent person would take to ensure their own safety. B. I lived in LaLa Land where I thought everybody was basically good and if some guy was approaching me in a secluded place, it was probably because he wanted directions to the nearest Salvation Army to donate gently used clothing. C. As Zib mentioned, I was oblivious to my surroundings. Scatterbrain used to be my middle name. D. I wasn't trained to deal with such a situation.
That is no longer the case and if I find myself in the same situation (although I hope I'm not stupid twice), somebody is going to be seriously hurt and it's not going to be me. Any criminal who doubts that is more than likely going to be dead wrong. On the off chance I do something wrong and get hurt or killed...well...that's a risk I'm willing to take. Others get to decide that for themselves.
I should add I'm trained to the teeth. I can fully understand those people who are nervous about the average Jane/Joe running around, indiscriminately firing away. It makes me nervous sometimes, too, but I'm not them and I don't live their lives. I'm in no position to advise anyone to do anything one way or the other...except for maybe my sister. I'd move to Antarctica if she stated carrying.
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Deleted
Joined: Oct 13, 2024 13:20:07 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2016 11:58:53 GMT -5
How about someone turning around? I never back in places, but according to the boards here, lots of people back in everywhere.
And it's possible with looting going on you are correct and they had other intentions... But the idea that most people wouldn't run, even if they had no evil intent, when being approached with a shotgun, isn't really accurate.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jan 26, 2016 12:05:34 GMT -5
My dad's property is 1/2 acre, The garage is at the rear of the property, past the house and the front door. Why would someone back all the way up to the garage (a good 50 yards) to turn around?
My dad approached the vehicle, rifle pointed down, saying 'What are you looking for?'.
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imawino
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 22:58:16 GMT -5
Posts: 5,370
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Post by imawino on Jan 26, 2016 12:08:39 GMT -5
It was the assertion that driving away when someone walks up to your car carrying a rifle is somehow indicative of ill intent.In the middle of an ice storm, with suggestions to stay off the road, who goes trolling through neighborhoods unless there is ill intent? Would you really wait until they were hauling the generator into the back of their truck in order to assume that they had ill intent? I have no idea what they were doing. Could have been up to something very bad. That doesn't have anything to do with what I said. My point is that I could have pulled in your driveway to hand deliver the winning check for the publisher's clearinghouse, but if you greet me with a gun I am driving the fuck away. It would not make me guilty of anything except having a will to live.
Although I do contend that there is someplace in the middle between pointing a gun at someone before ever exchanging a word, and letting them load your generator on their truck and drive away. I'm not saying they were necessarily wrong to do what they did - they didn't hurt anyone, after all - but to present those as the only two viable alternatives is silly.
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