This is me not responding to my XH

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Hi guys, I'm still at work, so this will be brief.
Thanks for the camaraderie. That was really what I needed.

I have not responded to the last text from him (which I suspect his girlfriend typed because the sentence structure is decent)

I don't want to get into a pissing match with him. It is futile. I've known him since he was 19. He doesn't understand money and embraces the generational poverty mentality.

Couple of responses to a few statements.

To the person who said something to the effect of "how hard to two people have to work to create a mess like this", you must not have ever been through a divorce. Or if you have, it was clearly the most amicable divorce ever.

Yes, this house has two mortgages. However, there were two houses that we both owned together when we divorced. That was a huge mistake on my part. I was trying to set both of us up to have the house. He walked away from what was supposed to be his house. Leaving me with both. Then the market crashed.

I cannot sell the house, without doing a short sale. I simply don't have $100,000 in liquid funds to bring to the table at close of the sale. If that had been an option, I would have done that seven years ago. If it were an option now I would do it now.

My only option as far as I can tell is to transfer the balance owed on the second mortgage to either a bank loan or cash advances on credit cards. The issue is that the current minimum amount that I pay toward that mortgage would double. Once we sell DH manufactured home, we will either be able to take out the bank loan in DH's name or pay a couple of thousand dollars per month toward the second mortgage on my house.

I cannot block XH from my phone because our children are ages almost (in ten days) 14 and 18. The 18-year-old has only been 18 for a week. So, until the 14-year-old turns 18 I will have to keep at least minimal open communication.

Again, thanks for letting me vent.

[Ombud]

Knee Deep in Water Chloe, even though you cannot block him you don't have to respond .... or do it in 10 words or less. "Unable to refinance while home still underwater." Huh. Only 7 words

[CCL]

I wouldn't do anything to help him out. Refinance or take out another loan for yourself if that works for you, but not to make his life easier.

[Apple]

My guess is that he got declined for a credit card, got to see his credit report or score, and one of the "negatives" is the debt to income ratio.  That one he can just blame on you because it couldn't be his fault at all!  He can just ignore the other negatives because it's obviously this one (that isn't his fault!) that's causing all the financial woes in his life.

Sorry you have to deal with this.  Deadbeat fathers/shitty exes suck.

[gregintenn]

Jan 13, 2016 17:42:07 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Hi guys, I'm still at work, so this will be brief.
Thanks for the camaraderie. That was really what I needed.

I have not responded to the last text from him (which I suspect his girlfriend typed because the sentence structure is decent)

I don't want to get into a pissing match with him. It is futile. I've known him since he was 19. He doesn't understand money and embraces the generational poverty mentality.

Couple of responses to a few statements.

To the person who said something to the effect of "how hard to two people have to work to create a mess like this", you must not have ever been through a divorce. Or if you have, it was clearly the most amicable divorce ever.

Yes, this house has two mortgages. However, there were two houses that we both owned together when we divorced. That was a huge mistake on my part. I was trying to set both of us up to have the house. He walked away from what was supposed to be his house. Leaving me with both. Then the market crashed.

I cannot sell the house, without doing a short sale. I simply don't have $100,000 in liquid funds to bring to the table at close of the sale. If that had been an option, I would have done that seven years ago. If it were an option now I would do it now.

My only option as far as I can tell is to transfer the balance owed on the second mortgage to either a bank loan or cash advances on credit cards. The issue is that the current minimum amount that I pay toward that mortgage would double. Once we sell DH manufactured home, we will either be able to take out the bank loan in DH's name or pay a couple of thousand dollars per month toward the second mortgage on my house.

I cannot block XH from my phone because our children are ages almost (in ten days) 14 and 18. The 18-year-old has only been 18 for a week. So, until the 14-year-old turns 18 I will have to keep at least minimal open communication.

Again, thanks for letting me vent.

Nope. Never been through a divorce.

Why would you marry someone like this?

Vent away!

[Deleted]

Jan 14, 2016 15:35:28 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Why would you marry someone like this?

 

The person you divorce is often not anything like the person you married, otherwise, why would you divorce them? 

[gregintenn]

Jan 14, 2016 15:48:39 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:35:28 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Why would you marry someone like this?

 

The person you divorce is often not anything like the person you married, otherwise, why would you divorce them? 

I dunno, thus the question. I was under the impression that the person you divorce is precisely the person you married.

[Deleted]

Jan 14, 2016 15:50:27 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:48:39 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

The person you divorce is often not anything like the person you married, otherwise, why would you divorce them? 

I dunno, thus the question. I was under the impression that the person you divorce is precisely the person you married.

Well, you've never been divorced, so....

[NancysSummerSip]

Why would you marry someone like this?

You had to go there....

I've never divorced either, but seen enough of it to know why it happens...

1) Sometimes, the person you hitch up with at the altar turns out to be very different once the "I dos" are done. Not that marriage changes people for the better or worse. If you suck as a person, marriage won't fix that. But people will show one side of themselves to get a mate, and when that's accomplished, they figure they can go back to being themselves again.

2) Drugs and alcohol may not factor into the relationship until later on. People get hooked at all stages of life.

3) The OP and her XH were apparently young at the time of the marriage (she said she knew him since he was 19) and youth can be impetuous.

4) Pregnancy doesn't necessarily force a marriage to happen, but depending on who you are, what you believe and where you live, it can strongly encourage it to take place.

5) Financial independence. Getting away from mom and dad is easier when you have money of your own. If you get married, and two of you have money of your own, then both of you get away from your moms and dads. It's a pretty fantasy, that whole playing house thing.

FWIW, I don't know if any of these apply to the OP. Just some of the reasons I could think of.

[gregintenn]

Jan 14, 2016 15:51:54 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:50:27 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

I dunno, thus the question. I was under the impression that the person you divorce is precisely the person you married.

Well, you've never been divorced, so....

....so I asked someone with experience?

[Deleted]

I'm not the same person I was 25 years ago. My experiences in life have changed the way I think about/look at things. My priorities are different, the way I deal with finances is different, the things I like to do, the things that I consider intolerable...

In an ideal marriage, you change together and stay on the same general track.  That does not always happen as I can attest to unfortunately.

[emma1420]

Jan 14, 2016 15:50:27 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:48:39 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

The person you divorce is often not anything like the person you married, otherwise, why would you divorce them? 

I dunno, thus the question. I was under the impression that the person you divorce is precisely the person you married.

I've never been divorced or married, but I've seen enough marriages and divorces to know that people change over time.  

Marriages end for all sorts of reasons.  Sometimes a person cheats who you never thought would cheat.  Sometimes a person puts on a great facade until they are married (and then their true colors are revealed).  Sometimes people just change and want different things.  And, sometimes circumstances change.

There are a lot of reasons why marriages end.  I don't think anyone goes into a marriage thinking that it will end in divorce.

[gregintenn]

Jan 14, 2016 15:58:57 GMT -5 emma1420 said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:50:27 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

I dunno, thus the question. I was under the impression that the person you divorce is precisely the person you married.

I've never been divorced or married, but I've seen enough marriages and divorces to know that people change over time.  

Marriages end for all sorts of reasons.  Sometimes a person cheats who you never thought would cheat.  Sometimes a person puts on a great facade until they are married (and then their true colors are revealed).  Sometimes people just change and want different things.  And, sometimes circumstances change.

There are a lot of reasons why marriages end.  I don't think anyone goes into a marriage thinking that it will end in divorce.

If not, I don't know why prenuptial agreements are so popular. 

[Deleted]

Jan 14, 2016 16:01:04 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:58:57 GMT -5 emma1420 said:

I've never been divorced or married, but I've seen enough marriages and divorces to know that people change over time.  

Marriages end for all sorts of reasons.  Sometimes a person cheats who you never thought would cheat.  Sometimes a person puts on a great facade until they are married (and then their true colors are revealed).  Sometimes people just change and want different things.  And, sometimes circumstances change.

There are a lot of reasons why marriages end.  I don't think anyone goes into a marriage thinking that it will end in divorce.

If not, I don't know why prenuptial agreements are so popular. 

I'm not sure they're all THAT popular, but even so.  I have term life insurance, but I'm not planning on dying in the next 20 years either. 

[Wisconsin Beth]

Does your divorce paperwork say anything about getting him off the mortgage? I don't remember.

[gregintenn]

Jan 14, 2016 16:03:38 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jan 14, 2016 16:01:04 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

If not, I don't know why prenuptial agreements are so popular. 

I'm not sure they're all THAT popular, but even so.  I have term life insurance, but I'm not planning on dying in the next 20 years either. 

Me too, but I don't have a policy precisely designed to insure against my wife killing me? Perhaps I should look into one.

[TheHaitian]

Jan 14, 2016 15:48:39 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:35:28 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Why would you marry someone like this?

 

The person you divorce is often not anything like the person you married, otherwise, why would you divorce them? 

Actually many times I see the opposite : the guy remain the same person and the woman is the one that wizen up.

Things you could excuse when you were in love (ex:he is a dreamer that never follows through ) is no longer acceptable when dreamer is no longer bringing in any income and you have to work 2-3 jobs to support the family.

A cheater : will change until they cheat 1 too many times:

Wife beater : will change, not his fault till he beats her one to many times, almost kill her or the abuse is extended to the kids.

The signs were there: we just excused them, we can change them...

[midjd]

"A woman marries a man thinking he will change... a man marries a woman thinking she will never change. Both are wrong."

[Deleted]

Jan 14, 2016 16:29:43 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:48:39 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

The person you divorce is often not anything like the person you married, otherwise, why would you divorce them? 

Actually many times I see the opposite : the guy remain the same person and the woman is the one that wizen up.

Things you could excuse when you were in love (ex:he is a dreamer that never follows through ) is no longer acceptable when dreamer is no longer bringing in any income and you have to work 2-3 jobs to support the family.

A cheater : will change until they cheat 1 too many times:

Wife beater : will change, not his fault till he beats her one to many times, almost kill her or the abuse is extended to the kids.

The signs were there: we just excused them, we can change them...

Well, either way, SOMEBODY changes in the relationship, even if it is one getting smarter and realizing things they didn't before. 

[NastyWoman]

I've said this IRL many times before "I am not quite sure that I married the right man but there were many really good years in the 30 years we were married, so my choice must not have been all that bad.  However, I am 100% certain I divorced the right man" -yes we had changed in ways that we could not handle.  We were always different in our approach to life with him being rather conservative and I started out as a social liberal.  In the end we were both "raging" conservative/lberal respectively and the differences just became too much!  That, plus some other things that I don't need to get into here.

[techguy]

Why is divorce so expensive?

Because it's worth it!

[TheHaitian]

Jan 14, 2016 16:47:17 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jan 14, 2016 16:29:43 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Actually many times I see the opposite : the guy remain the same person and the woman is the one that wizen up.

Things you could excuse when you were in love (ex:he is a dreamer that never follows through ) is no longer acceptable when dreamer is no longer bringing in any income and you have to work 2-3 jobs to support the family.

A cheater : will change until they cheat 1 too many times:

Wife beater : will change, not his fault till he beats her one to many times, almost kill her or the abuse is extended to the kids.

The signs were there: we just excused them, we can change them...

Well, either way, SOMEBODY changes in the relationship, even if it is one getting smarter and realizing things they didn't before. 

I would not call it someone changing as it is more someone getting fed up with the actions and saying f it.

I see it in my own relationship. Something that used to be mildly annoying becomes more annoying to the point it is intolerable.

Goes back to : the straw that broke the camel's back.

Happened to us the other day... Something minor that my wife has done for the 13 days I have known her. Every year it gets more annoying when she does it and more aggravating. Did it last week and I just lost my shit and I am a scary guy when I lose my shit.

To her I overreacted and it scared her; to me it was just that 1 time to many and I had enough of it.

Per wiki:

"The idiom the straw that broke the camel's back, alluding to the proverb "it is the last straw that breaks the camel's back", describes the seemingly minor or routine action which causes an unpredictably large and sudden reaction, because of the cumulative effect of small actions."

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_that_broke_the_camel%27s_back

The person never felt that being cheating on was cute or being beaten was awesome so they never changed.
They just reached the point where they had enough!

And the reason I use woman because I remember a lawyer telling me: if a husband start divorce proceeding there is a 50% chance they will reconcile but it if it a woman there is a 100% chance they will divorce.

Why? Woman in general deal with shit for longer than men before they say enough is enough, but once they say enough is enough they usually mean it and never go back.

They did not change, they have just reached their level of : enough with this shit!

[quince]

Eh, I got married thinking it MIGHT end in divorce. Divorce, which could be amicable or...not.

My husband knows that I can put up with significant bullshit for a decade, and still be generous and kind to my ex. (He saw the end of my last relationship)  He's got some evidence that even if we split up and he's a tool at the time, I will be nice about it.

I've got mutual friends with a decade plus of experience with him, a reasonable sense of self-preservation, insistence on contributing to retirement accounts for BOTH of us, regardless of who has the income, insistence on amassing instead of depleting assets, significant evidence that he does not have any little tics that will become large issues once the shiny wears off, and that he too puts up with BS from people and remains generous.

And we still maintain separate bank accounts/credit cards, mostly because my "just in case" involves him NOT being able to completely clean me out and leave me high and dry in case of a personality change due to TBI.

And if we had started with significant assets, prenups for everyone!

[Deleted]

Jan 14, 2016 17:04:41 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

And the reason I use woman because I remember a lawyer telling me: if a husband start divorce proceeding there is a 50% chance they will reconcile but it if it a woman there is a 100% chance they will divorce.

Why? Woman in general deal with shit for longer than men before they say enough is enough, but once they say enough is enough they usually mean it and never go back.

Yep. I married my first husband because:

I was pregnant and marrying seemed the right thing to do (although I would have been capable of supporting a child myself).

He had his faults but I thought his good qualities made up for them.

He got much, much worse after he lost his job 8 years into the marriage and never found another.

I do put up with too much crap but when I finally decide I'm done, I'm done.

[zibazinski]

Jan 14, 2016 16:59:21 GMT -5 techguy said:

Why is divorce so expensive?

Because it's worth it!

The last time bio brat maneuvered her father into speaking to his ex, when he got into the car with me, he said exactly that! Ex, to draw attention to herself, told people that he was "saying goodbye to her before he died ." 

[bean29]

Jan 14, 2016 16:01:04 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:58:57 GMT -5 emma1420 said:

I've never been divorced or married, but I've seen enough marriages and divorces to know that people change over time.  

Marriages end for all sorts of reasons.  Sometimes a person cheats who you never thought would cheat.  Sometimes a person puts on a great facade until they are married (and then their true colors are revealed).  Sometimes people just change and want different things.  And, sometimes circumstances change.

There are a lot of reasons why marriages end.  I don't think anyone goes into a marriage thinking that it will end in divorce.

If not, I don't know why prenuptial agreements are so popular. 

Under Wisconsin Marital Property law, if you have a prenup and it is not disclosed to the lender, the lender can come after both parties just as if it does not exist. Your only rights are to sue the one who ignored the prenup and try to collect.

Did you ever hear the saying "You Can't get blood from a turnip" well you can't collect $$ from a deadbeat. I am convinced my ExDH changed (for the worse). I used to call him every month trying to collect his 1/2 of the bills we remained "jointly and severally liable" for after our divorce. It was always I'll pay you in 3 days or 5 days or whatever. My Mom finally told me to pay the bills off and be done with him, that she felt he was deriving some type of macabre enjoyment out of jerking me around. I have always felt it was some of the best advice I have ever been given.

Chloe, I really am left wondering if all your struggling to right the ship is worthwhile. If you filed bankruptcy, it would be behind you and you could start over. It is going to take you way longer than 7 years to get this ship righted.

[zibazinski]

But she has remarried and it'd affect her husband too.

[Ombud]

Jan 14, 2016 15:50:27 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 14, 2016 15:48:39 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

The person you divorce is often not anything like the person you married, otherwise, why would you divorce them? 

I dunno, thus the question. I was under the impression that the person you divorce is precisely the person you married.

I married a really nice guy who decided to try Crack and got addicted. It made him mean. Beat us up. I divorced him when he told the kids I told him to beat them (of course not!) Tolerated his beating me and the walls .... but not them

His current wife says he's a nice guy .... uh, where did those bruises come from? And why are you always broke despite his reasonable income?

[beergut]

Jan 12, 2016 23:43:33 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

So here's the response I want to send: 

Oh, well not to make it sound bad, but since you're still $11,000 in arrears on child support, I could have used that to pay 25% of the mortgage down. I don't mean to make it sound bad, but since I finally took you through Family Services and you lied to the mediator about your income and got your child support reduced , I could have used that money to pay down the mortgage. Oh, well not to make it sound bad, but you have a 401k loan, a car loan, and a garnishment against you from Discover, so I'm pretty sure it's not just the mortgage that is causing you a problem. In fact, since that mortgage has NEVER had a late payment, it's actually helping your credit score in that way. I don't mean to make it sound bad, but since you are 40 years old and make $14/hour and work 30 hours per week, it's not really my fault that you don't have enough to make it through the end of the month. But, hey, keep blaming your shitty life on me. Whatever. 




Thank you for letting me vent. 

I think teens today would term your response: Killshot or Savage. 

Good job. 

[gregintenn]

Ever meet anyone who divorced and says "It was my fault"?

Me either.