If you got divorced tomorrow...

[Deleted]

Could you continue to lead your current standard of living on your own salary? 

If if you did get divorced, was there any resulting change in lifestyle? 

I am constantly hearing how sinle income families are at greater risk in a divorce... But if you've lived in a manner that is achievable with one income, how is that any more inherently risky than living a dual income lifestyle and then dropping to one...? 

[Deleted]

Well, if you're a single income family and not the income earner, it kind of sucks in a divorce.

Unfortunately, I have lots of experience here.  Been down the divorce path both as a single income and dual income.  Still in the same house, still moving forward financially, but lifestyle of course changes even if you take money out of the picture.  Unless you had a spouse that did absolutely nothing there's going to be more work involved in taking care of a household by yourself.

The gravy days were dual income, no kids. <sigh>

[TheHaitian]

I could 100% support our current lifestyle if we divorced.

Actually Plan B is for my wife to go back to school next year full time for 2 years and we live off my income.

But I also make 2X what my wife makes, we are working on bringing her income up.

--> her: she would have to make some severe cuts if we were to get Divorced tomorrow but she would survive. She wouldn't be poor depending on the government or waiting for the alimony checks
-----> main reason why we are looking for her to get out of academia: increase her income potential.


And we are not saying single income families are more at risk of getting a divorce. We are saying a dependent spouse (out of the work force for many years) is most likely to get screwed in a divorce vs a spouse that has remained in the workforce throughout her/his married years.


Goal: be like thyme and her husband. Both of us making similar money or at least over 6 figures but able to cover all expenses on one. Now we can cover everything on mine, working on bringing her income up.

[alabamagal]

I make almost 10x what my DH does. I expects DH will start earning more soon as he establishes himself in our current location. But at I will probably still be 5x

I could easily support my lifestyle on my income in case of divorce or death. In case of divorce I expect there would be some spousal support.

[TheHaitian]

May 9, 2015 14:02:33 GMT -5 oped said:

Could you continue to lead your current standard of living on your own salary? 

If if you did get divorced, was there any resulting change in lifestyle? 

I am constantly hearing how sinle income families are at greater risk in a divorce... But if you've lived in a manner that is achievable with one income, how is that any more inherently risky than living a dual income lifestyle and then dropping to one...? 

Also simple mathematics:
1 income - 1 income = 0 income if you are the stay at home spouse

2 income - 1 income = 1 income... Yes you are not living the same lifestyle (or maybe you are if you were high income earners with little debt) but you are still bringing money in.

Not all divorces are amicable and I had met many women with deadbeat ex husband that refuse to pay alimony and/or child support.

One of my cousin has been going through that for 6 years now... Her ex seem to think child support is optional and only has to pay it when he feels like it. Thank god she is a nurse and can support her kids without it.!

With the amount he owes her on back child support she could pay for college for 1 of her kids.

[Deleted]

I could easily make the amount of money needed to continue our current lifestyle with minimal changes. Our lifestyle doesn't require two incomes. It doesn't even require a full one, honestly. 

[TheHaitian]

May 9, 2015 14:26:30 GMT -5 oped said:

I could easily make the amount of money needed to continue our current lifestyle with minimal changes. Our lifestyle doesn't require two incomes. It doesn't even require a full one, honestly. 

Minimal changes as in getting a job?
Working outside of the home?
Still able to homeschool?

And again you are most likely the exception vs the rule.

Most of the stay at home parent that I have encountered, their life would take a 180 degree turn if they were to get a divorce.

Yes even the Dermatologist, NP and Pharmacist I know, they all work less than PT now and take shifts that are convenient for them. Divorce would require them to start working full time.

They won't be broke because they kept their skills and licenses current and can easily jump back to full time but to say the changes would be minimal is an understatement.

ETA :And those are highly educated women with skills that are in demand which is not the average/typical stay at home mom.

[Ombud]

May 9, 2015 14:21:43 GMT -5 alabamagal said:

In case of divorce I expect there would be some spousal support.

You might not have to pay spousal support. My xH made just a little more than me so I didn't get spousal or child support ($1 a yr dn count in my book).

And yes, standard of living does change .... friends too.

[TheHaitian]

Typical (more than average) stay at home parent I meet:
- college and work experience (check)
- once they became a stay at home parent they completely focused on that
- volunteer and do PTA but really haven't kept up their skills

7-10 years down the road they are as qualified as a newly minted college student.

Typical example my old boss and his wife. They had kids, she quit her job to focus on the kids. Husband make about 120k

Haven't work since then and their oldest is 13 and youngest is 9. Handle everything at home while he earns the money. Awesome lady, really nice and I like her.

But she hasn't work in 13-14 years and pushing late 30's to mid 40's. If he divorces her and decide to be a jerk like my cousin ex (move out of state with his new trophy wife) what are her options? He is not paying child support and alimony? she got 50% in the divorce and that using that and balance start getting low.

Again not all guys are assholes and some will abide by the divorce decree and pay child support. I have met many women that would have said "not my husband" only to find out they were wrong later when push come to shove.

[Miss Tequila]

May 9, 2015 14:26:30 GMT -5 oped said:

I could easily make the amount of money needed to continue our current lifestyle with minimal changes. Our lifestyle doesn't require two incomes. It doesn't even require a full one, honestly. 

Maybe that's ture and maybe it isn't If you haven't worked in camping years, how quickly can you find a job and what will you truly make?

If I quit working 16 years ago I would make less than a quarter of what I make now. We would have been forced into a much different way of living. Living on my own is more expensive for the simple fact that I now have to hire out projects that my husband would have done. He was very handy and I'm not.

Together we made very good money (I made more but he bought our house outright with an inheritance and investments so it balanced). We were very frugal so weived on about 20% of our take home pay. So far, the only major changes in my lifestyle is that I can't drop $10k-$15k a year on big vacations. Right now I don't have a cleaning lady but that is going to change soon because who the hell wants to clean?

I'm definitely more cautious with money but as long as nothing changes with my job, our lifestyle took no significant hits

I also get zero child support and we reached walked away with what was ours. So I can officially say I don't need a man to support me :-p

[zibazinski]

That's why I'm totally on board with DD going to PA school. If she gets married and stays married, cool. If she doesn't, she can more than support herself. If she has kids, she will be able to support them, too. If she doesnt, she can support a horse.

[Blonde Granny]

Being retired and on SS brings different problems for the surviving spouse, especially if that is the woman. Right now we both receive SS and DH receives VA disability. If he dies before me, and that is usually what happens, I would continue to receive HIS SS but lose mine.  The surviving spouse receives whatever is greater and his is more than mine. As for VA disability, that also stops.  As long as he dies from a service connected disability, and he probably will, I can then apply for something called DIC which stands for Disability Indemnity Compensation.  That would be about 1/3 of his former disability amount.

Because DH is not at all well, we even sat down and did a prospective budget based on what my total income would be after DIC is granted.  Many of my expenses would decrease as I would not be spending the money that we do together, and some things like cable TV would be cut back as I seldom watch it.  Food costs would decrease (just as marvholly) as would my gasoline expense as I don't mind staying home like DH does.

The numbers came out that I would perhaps need no more than $500 month from investments for my lifestyle to remain as it is today.

WOW, this is way more than anyone asked, but as you get as old as me, you see how things really work.

[lynnerself]

We  are 7 weeks out from retirement. I believe I could have the same projected lifestyle even in a divorce living on just my assets.   I would drain my retirement account faster and not be leaving any legacy.
The main issue would be if I got part of DH pension. I expect I would be awarded something of it.  In which case, I would be even better.

[Deleted]

I could work tomorrow if I wanted. I do now without pay/much pay. (Ie. Most SAH people don't sit on their asses all day...) I could have three things on the go tomorrow. Part of being a bright and educated SAH... I think 'the norm' may be changing more than you realize... Is to stay current with skills and contacts. And always haven a plan. I could keep homeschooling. Minimal changes means we might eat out a bit less and use the library a bit more. 

[muttleynfelix]

If we got divorced today, neither one of us would be able to keep our standard of living.  We would suddenly have $1000+ daycare bill.  Probably more like $1200 to $1500. I don't know how much day care is in my new location. With that bill neither one of us could keep the house.  We would both be screwed if we split. It isn't just the SAHS that is up shit creek when you have young children.

[whoisjohngalt]

Ironically, I think my lifestyle would improve.

I would go out and get a job.  And while I am very well aware of the fact that I won't make the same amount of money right away, I have no doubt that in a few years, I will get there again.

My husband, however, will have to pay child support for the next 15 yrs and I once looked up calculation for our state - it would be a substantial amount.

So, his lifestyle will decrease, while mine might be tough for a bit, but will get much better.

Now, if I wanted to be a complete bitch, I would sue for spousal support as I have been out of work for 7 yrs, but I don't see myself doing that

ETA;  I would also be very much OK living either in an appt or much smaller house.  While I love our house and our property, if my kids are not home all day, there is absolutely no need for it at all (among other reasons)

[cronewitch]

I divorced 31 years ago and lifestyle changed. I went from a house to apartment. I was able to work much more overtime and do things he didn't want like open an IRA. I had the same job as when married so enough income to live pretty well in an apartment. I had to budget tightly when I got a house but then got a roommate so could afford to pay off the house early and go back to school and increase income. Now rich compared to what I would have been if I stayed married. He died many years ago so I would be a widow with no investments and small SS check.

[CCL]

May 9, 2015 15:48:50 GMT -5 lynnerself said:

We  are 7 weeks out from retirement. I believe I could have the same projected lifestyle even in a divorce living on just my assets.   I would drain my retirement account faster and not be leaving any legacy.
The main issue would be if I got part of DH pension. I expect I would be awarded something of it.  In which case, I would be even better.

When the time comes to sign up for the pension be sure your husband opts for survivor benefits, assuming it's available. Of course that is more pertinent once you are retired. I know for ours it was required that I sign off on it if he chose to opt-out, which we did not do.

Another thing about pensions is sometimes they are reduced once the recipient is eligible for SS.

[mroped]

So after working my ass off to build you a stone house mind you, you are toying with that reprehensible idea?
What did I do?
I'm sorry! I won't do it again! 

[Deleted]

Don't worry. I won't let you

[Deleted]

When I got divorced, I earned $18,000 to his $100,000+.  My lifestyle changed, of course, but it was fine. I actually enjoyed my second job so much (retail) that I kept it even after I doubled my salary two years later by moving to public school teaching. Working two jobs wasn't conducive to relationships, but I wasn't really ready for that, anyway.  When I was, I quit.

Fast forward, and I now have a house, a pension, retirement accounts, etc. I have $0 debt whereas we were in deep credit card debt.  (We took out a second mortgage right before I left and subtracted it from the house value so I definitely paid my share.)  I did have to give up the house, but I bought my own. 

If I become a widow (DH and I are not divorcing), I will be fine.  DH is living off SS.  He contributes $500 to the house expenses.  I would get his higher SS instead of my lower one so it would definitely make that up.  I don't even use his $500 for the house expenses.  It goes into a house maintenance account just like my extra money from doing extra work does.

I am better off financially being divorced.  I am better off emotionally.  That doesn't mean it was a win/win situation, though. 

[NoNamePerson]

Heck, I was unemployed when I filed for divorce. But I would have rather dumpster dived that stay married. I went to work within a month of divorcing and I did just fine. Maybe not by anyone else's standards but I was OK as was my 16 old son.

I did get $50 a week in child support for a while till even that fell by the wayside at some point but I said piss on it.

Was my standard of living the same? No, I no longer lived in a 3,000 sqft house but other than that I marched on and was happy as a bug in a rug.  

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

No, I would not, but part of that would be okay. 
I would not have his truck and camping trailer payment, the payment for his house that we rent out, and the electric bill would probably be at 75% of what we have together. 
I wouldn't have as nice of a house, but I can afford my house (that is currently rented out) on my  current income (assuming I get another job since I'm being laid off effect mid-June) and that house is just fine. 

[flamingo]

I would be ok. I would downgrade my housing asap, but more out of a desire to save money than because I can't afford where I live or actually want to move. I make the money; my DH is semi-retired and makes enough to help pay for housing and his spending money. But we've purposely structured our lives to be ok on our own should this happen. Mostly, I'd just have to downgrade the "no thought given to what I'm spending" shopping trips that happen. Actually, maybe I should do that anyway.....  

[quince]

If I got divorced tomorrow, my lifestyle would definitely change. I don't work at the moment and my husband is a high earner. I don't expect him to be petty about child support/alimony, and he already has evidence that I won't be petty in the event of a split ( he saw how I handled my not-awesome ex) 

I don't expect I'd lose anything I really care about. Obviously would have to get a job, which is fine. We have a reasonable amount of assets, and my parents live close enough/have a large enough house/would be happy to have me, so it wouldn't be a mad rush to get back on my feet, and I've spent part of the time since my employment ended developing some new skills. I might even take the time to get formal training/certification in those new skills before diving back into the workforce. My hypothetical ex husband would probably encourage me to do so, as well, because he's not an asshole.  I wouldn't be able to save as much. I would not be living in a 2400 1BR apartment. I would need to choose a less expensive neighborhood. Less eating out. I don't shop much anyway.

Even if he went full-asshole, half of our assets gives me enough to live on for 2 years WITHOUT moving in with my parents, without any additional income or actual cutbacks, and still having the kid in daycare. I've been unemployed for 6 months thus far. I feel OK about being able to be on my feet again with that kind of buffer, which will only grow as life goes on. I don't mind not being at the income level I would have been at if I had never stopped employment.

If we were living paycheck to paycheck, I would already be seeking employment, because my security comes from still contributing to retirement even while not employed, and having an ever-increasing non-retirement savings pile.

I figure there are 3 options:

1) Make decisions to minimize how badly a divorce will affect you, even if it leads to a current situation you aren't happy with.)

2) Make decisions to maximize how "perfect" the current situation is , even if it leads to you being in a position that a split or fatality/illness would devastate you/your spouse.

3) Make decisions that give you a current life/lifestyle that you enjoy, while also make sure there is a reasonable safety net in case things fall apart. This option is my favorite.

We moved to a HCOLA that I cannot support myself in as easily as I did the MCOLA we left.  Even if I was still working, my potentially divorced future is worse off than it would have been if I was making decisions under the conditions of option 1.

We're 90% on trying for a second child, which will obviously make both our post-divorced lives harder. That's fine. 

When talking about having kids/buying a house/being a SAHP, people often say just do it and make it work. I am not a fan of looking at the intended circumstances of the future, seeing that things look difficult/impossible, and charging ahead anyway. I'm kind of OK with looking at worse-case scenarios, seeing that they suck, and still going ahead with your plans. 

[Deleted]

To my surprise I do much better financially on my own than I did with partners. That has a lot to do with the character of the men I was with, but that is my reality. I have the house, retirement savings, a paid off car, take nice vacations...and like someone else mentioned, that doesn't even count how much better I am doing mentally and emotionally.

[Deleted]

No, I could not live my current lifestyle and that would be OK except for the cat we both love.  We have almost no joint debt and I think I would still get my SS, so I could move to Mexico and do mission work.  Which is where I would rather be if the cat was cool.  I have been rock-bottom poor, live-in-the-shelter poor so it would not be a big surprise.  Self respect is way better than cohabiting with an a-hole.

[resolution]

I would probably hire a house cleaner and a lawn guy, so my living standard would go up but my savings rate would go down. DH helps to keep some of my spending in check, so if he left then my spending would probably go up. Right now we are living on one salary and use the other for investing and house projects, so we would both be fine but investments would go way down.

[lynnerself]

May 9, 2015 16:35:18 GMT -5 CCL said:

May 9, 2015 15:48:50 GMT -5 lynnerself said:

We  are 7 weeks out from retirement. I believe I could have the same projected lifestyle even in a divorce living on just my assets.   I would drain my retirement account faster and not be leaving any legacy.
The main issue would be if I got part of DH pension. I expect I would be awarded something of it.  In which case, I would be even better.

When the time comes to sign up for the pension be sure your husband opts for survivor benefits, assuming it's available. Of course that is more pertinent once you are retired. I know for ours it was required that I sign off on it if he chose to opt-out, which we did not do.

Another thing about pensions is sometimes they are reduced once the recipient is eligible for SS.

Back to the question. When the kids were younger and I stayed home it would have been difficult but manageable. Now days, I could easily do just fine without needing a job.

Trust me, I know all the in and outs of the pension. It's been analyzed to death for the last year. We just put in the retirement paperwork. There were 13 different ways to receive benefit payments. After much discussion, we chose the one that pays the same monthly amount for as long as either of us lives (and no lump sum pay out).

If, at this point we were to divorce (unlikely since we just had our 40th anniversary) I know I would continue to have rights to part of it.
But even without, I could probably maintain my lifestyle on my accounts.

[weltschmerz]

I know a lot of divorced women, but only one who collects alimony.

She's living with a guy who makes very good money, but they won't get married because she wants to ride the alimony gravy train for as long as possible.

I think that's so wrong.

She's well educated and can support herself but just doesn't feel like working, so the poor sap will just have to keep paying.