Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jan 16, 2015 12:39:45 GMT -5
They can ask for whatever they want. I'm pretty sure there's no duty to comply without a warrant. exactly/
However, the standard for ID is lower than probable cause. You also have a right to refuse. But if the cops have my kids, I'm showing my ID to get them back. Even if I think he's a dick.
I don't know about your kids Swamp but mine would have been running to give me a hug. The cops/social workers would either have to keep them in their cars or physically hold them back from coming to me. Or then pry them off me. Which is a different kettle of fish.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jan 16, 2015 12:41:08 GMT -5
Why are they safer today? Stats show that kids are kidnapped at a lower rate now then in the 70s and 80s. WE just hear about them now due to 24 hour media needing a new headline story to try to stand out from the rest of the news media.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 16, 2015 12:41:19 GMT -5
exactly/
However, the standard for ID is lower than probable cause. You also have a right to refuse. But if the cops have my kids, I'm showing my ID to get them back. Even if I think he's a dick.
I don't know about your kids Swamp but mine would have been running to give me a hug. The cops/social workers would either have to keep them in their cars or physically hold them back from coming to me. Or then pry them off me. Which is a different kettle of fish. Mine too. While telling me all about the ride in the cop car.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2015 12:43:19 GMT -5
Why are they safer today? Stats show that kids are kidnapped at a lower rate now then in the 70s and 80s. WE just hear about them now due to 24 hour media needing a new headline story to try to stand out from the rest of the news media. But are they kidnapped at a lower rate BECAUSE we are more cautious?
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Green Eyed Lady
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Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jan 16, 2015 12:44:41 GMT -5
To play Devil's Advocate here....let's say this nosy neighbor called and the incident didn't get investigated. Next week, those two kids get hit crossing the street, or kidnapped off the street...or something else horrible. We all know where it goes from there. CPS doesn't do their job, the police don't do their job...yada yada.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 16, 2015 12:45:44 GMT -5
Stats show that kids are kidnapped at a lower rate now then in the 70s and 80s. WE just hear about them now due to 24 hour media needing a new headline story to try to stand out from the rest of the news media. But are they kidnapped at a lower rate BECAUSE we are more cautious? I'd guess that because everywhere you go there is a camera on you, and as soon as you take the kid, amber alerts are everywhere?
Kids are being taught "stranger danger."
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2015 12:46:57 GMT -5
All violent crime can't be down because we are more cautious?
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 16, 2015 12:49:30 GMT -5
All violent crime can't be down because we are more cautious? It could, but it also has to do with an aging population. Most violent crime is committed by young men, 18 to 25. When you have more of them, you have more crime. Criminal activity decreases with age. We are older, hence, less crime.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jan 16, 2015 12:52:47 GMT -5
To play Devil's Advocate here....let's say this nosy neighbor called and the incident didn't get investigated. Next week, those two kids get hit crossing the street, or kidnapped off the street...or something else horrible. We all know where it goes from there. CPS doesn't do their job, the police don't do their job...yada yada. We had a week last fall where 3 kids got hit by car/buses in 2 incidents in 1 week. I don't think any of them were free range kids. I don't recall details but I think they were all on their way to school. The problem was more that daylight savings was so late it was still pitch dark when they got hit. And I think 2 of them were on their way to the bus stop. So no walking to school on their own, more like walking across 1 street and down a few houses.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 16, 2015 12:53:34 GMT -5
Or criminals being shot so they can't have the chance to commit more crimes.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 16, 2015 12:54:10 GMT -5
Or criminals being shot so they can't have the chance to commit more crimes. I'm pretty sure that's not it..............
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 16, 2015 12:57:24 GMT -5
I'm always relieved when I hear that someone committing a crime is dead. I think about the countless other crimes and victims that are now safe.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 16, 2015 12:58:42 GMT -5
I'm always relieved when I hear that someone committing a crime is dead. I think about the countless other crimes and victims that are now safe. Didn't you admit to tax fraud but not declaring income about a year ago?
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 16, 2015 12:59:21 GMT -5
I'm not sure why the cops were supposed to take the parents word that the kids were in no danger when they were found by themselves on a busy street and the dad wouldn't give up his ID or speak to them. which is why you aren't a dick to the cops. They will assume the worst.
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Iggy aka IG
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Post by Iggy aka IG on Jan 16, 2015 12:59:35 GMT -5
Or criminals being shot so they can't have the chance to commit more crimes. I'm pretty sure that's not it.............. Dang, I was gonna send a shout out to Smith and Wesson.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 16, 2015 13:00:50 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure that's not it.............. Dang, I was gonna send a shout out to Smith and Wesson. I would think the rate of cop shootings is significantly less then in the past based on training and the crap that a cop has to go through when he discharges his weapon.
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Iggy aka IG
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Post by Iggy aka IG on Jan 16, 2015 13:02:35 GMT -5
Dang, I was gonna send a shout out to Smith and Wesson. I would think the rate of cop shootings is significantly less then in the past based on training and the crap that a cop has to go through when he discharges his weapon. Based on what has happened in our country recently, I agree.
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Iggy aka IG
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Post by Iggy aka IG on Jan 16, 2015 13:05:48 GMT -5
Regarding the article, I think the cops/authorities overreacted.
That being said, I admit I worry a bit when I see the middle schoolers walking home alone on less traveled side streets. Yeah, I live in a small town, but we still have crime, and there is evil everywhere. I am glad they are getting exercise and fresh air, but still.... I'm not a mom, and I guess it would depend on the child(ren), maturity level, and a few other factors.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jan 16, 2015 13:07:19 GMT -5
I live out in the country, so my kids can't walk anywhere, but I let them walk places in town. I worry, but I also worry that they won't be able to function as teens if I don't give them some latitude now.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 16, 2015 13:09:37 GMT -5
If the youngest child had been alone, I'd be upset, too. But the youngest child was NOT alone.
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lexxy703
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Post by lexxy703 on Jan 16, 2015 13:19:14 GMT -5
I live in the burbs & we have an elementary school in the subdivision. The HS & MS buses drop the kids off there also instead of bussing through the neighborhood. There are always groups of kids walking home from school. They also play outside in the road & go to the playground. Sometimes you'll see a small group of parents standing on the corner talking & keeping an eye out but more often than not the kids are unsupervised. Again this is within the subdivison where the max speed limit is 35mph less on the residential areas.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Jan 16, 2015 13:21:54 GMT -5
I live out in the country, so my kids can't walk anywhere, but I let them walk places in town. I worry, but I also worry that they won't be able to function as teens if I don't give them some latitude now. Yeah, it's a balancing act on how to raise happy, healthy productive members of society. And the damn balancing wire keeps changing.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jan 16, 2015 13:27:40 GMT -5
Glad mine are grown. If they have kids let them stress about this!
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Abby Normal
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Post by Abby Normal on Jan 16, 2015 13:30:18 GMT -5
I think it depends on the circumstances. The article said they were only 1/2 block from their home. Here, elementary kids have to walk to school unless they live over 1 mile away. If in this area they allow kids to walk to school- then the issue is ridiculous.
But if all kids are required to ride the bus due to the busy nature of the area, then I might tend to agree.
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Iggy aka IG
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Post by Iggy aka IG on Jan 16, 2015 13:49:30 GMT -5
I think it depends on the circumstances. The article said they were only 1/2 block from their home. Here, elementary kids have to walk to school unless they live over 1 mile away. If in this area they allow kids to walk to school- then the issue is ridiculous.But if all kids are required to ride the bus due to the busy nature of the area, then I might tend to agree. Good point.
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Bluerobin
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Post by Bluerobin on Jan 16, 2015 13:49:47 GMT -5
So, what law was broken? I see a big hole in CPS' case.
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Abby Normal
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Post by Abby Normal on Jan 16, 2015 14:00:45 GMT -5
That being said, I admit I worry a bit when I see the middle schoolers walking home alone on less traveled side streets. Yeah, I live in a small town, but we still have crime, and there is evil everywhere. I am glad they are getting exercise and fresh air, but still.... I'm not a mom, and I guess it would depend on the child(ren), maturity level, and a few other factors. Apparently, I am the worst parent ever. We live in a small town and my middle schooler rides his bike or walks to school, his friends, the library, baseball practice, the pool in summer.... The alternative is letting him sit at home all day rotting his mind with TV and video games. Of course- I did get him a cell phone so he could call if he needed anything and so that I could get ahold of him.
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wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on Jan 16, 2015 14:00:59 GMT -5
I doubt it was a nosy neighbor calling the cops. Where they were picked up by cops isn't residential. It's a busy industrial area. If I saw the kids walking through my neighborhood I wouldn't think anything of it. Where the cops found them at yes I would wonder what in the heck they were doing there. It's not a quiet little two lane street.
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wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on Jan 16, 2015 14:02:49 GMT -5
That being said, I admit I worry a bit when I see the middle schoolers walking home alone on less traveled side streets. Yeah, I live in a small town, but we still have crime, and there is evil everywhere. I am glad they are getting exercise and fresh air, but still.... I'm not a mom, and I guess it would depend on the child(ren), maturity level, and a few other factors. Apparently, I am the worst parent ever. We live in a small town and my middle schooler rides his bike or walks to school, his friends, the library, baseball practice, the pool in summer.... The alternative is letting him sit at home all day rotting his mind with TV and video games. Of course- I did get him a cell phone so he could call if he needed anything and so that I could get ahold of him. Small town is a whole different kettle of fish versus a busy DC suburb that isn't the safest. Two very different things. If I hadn't walked that street myself I might not object to them being alone either.
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Jan 16, 2015 14:07:58 GMT -5
Geeze, and to think when my kiddo was little and pestering the hell outta me I would tell him to go play in the traffic
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