The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Nov 10, 2014 12:34:52 GMT -5
Having a sibling over-ride a "partner" on medical issues. Same for a parent or child over-riding a partner. I know of cases where families refused to allow a partner to see someone in the hospital and nursing home. If you are not married or related you don't have to right to demand access to someone. In the cases where this happened the motives were somewhat questionable IMHO. hmmm . . . . I'm his Medical POA and Financial POA. Also, we are each other's beneficiaries. My will states he can have my house. Sounds like you've got your ducks lines up. In the two cases I mentioned obviously they didn't. I've seen family over-ride a medical POA (my grandmother over-rode my mother for my great aunt) so I'd be curious if that would hold up should his family's views change from yours. Understand, curiosity only - I sincerely hope you never have to find out.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2014 12:36:57 GMT -5
Good point, chrone. I don't care about SS because I have my own. There are also rules about inheriting a 401K that differ for spouses versus everyone else. Spouses are allowed to roll an inherited 401k and not take distributions or pay taxes until they are 70. For me it is just a bunch of little things like this. The government treats spouses differently than non spouses.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Nov 10, 2014 12:51:44 GMT -5
Guess I missed that chapter in the charm book One of the things BIL needed to do to do things right was to ask for blessings/permission from his future FIL before they got engaged. I don't know. I understand it's an important tradition for some folks. Apparently, it was important for my family (they just didn't tell me, and then got upset with me when DH never obtained permission from them.) 42.5, though. Needing permission? She seems to have managed her life well enough so far. She's a PhD, has her own practice, is in shape physically, and seems to be one of the most mentally healthy family members in her family. BUT, they want to have kids and she's almost 43. I don't understand why having the semi shot gun wedding is so important, just so she has legitimate kids.. Shoot, if my daughters were nearly 43 and wanting kids, I'd tell them to hurry up and get knocked up and deal with the details of marriage later. Not every woman has fabulous fertility form 43-45. I wouldn't be saying to them. "No honey, you have GOT to get married, first. And it can't be JP or something similar. It has to be in a church. Even though your intended is not religious. I also would not dilly-dally with things like insisting that my kids get DH's blessing before they get married. Get knocked up first. ETA: Of course I would be disappointed if none of my kids got married, or if they all went to the JP. But, that's their choice, not mine. As a parent, my job isn't to stand in the way of my kids' paths. Or ask them to do things that aren't true to them so I get some sort of satisfaction.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Nov 10, 2014 13:30:40 GMT -5
Tax Benefits Filing joint income tax returns with the IRS and state taxing authorities. Creating a "family partnership" under federal tax laws, which allows you to divide business income among family members. Estate Planning Benefits Inheriting a share of your spouse's estate. Receiving an exemption from both estate taxes and gift taxes for all property you give or leave to your spouse. Creating life estate trusts that are restricted to married couples, including QTIP trusts, QDOT trusts, and marital deduction trusts. Obtaining priority if a conservator needs to be appointed for your spouse -- that is, someone to make financial and/or medical decisions on your spouse's behalf. Government Benefits Receiving Social Security, Medicare, and disability benefits for spouses. Receiving veterans' and military benefits for spouses, such as those for education, medical care, or special loans. Receiving public assistance benefits. Employment Benefits Obtaining insurance benefits through a spouse's employer. Taking family leave to care for your spouse during an illness. Receiving wages, workers' compensation, and retirement plan benefits for a deceased spouse. Taking bereavement leave if your spouse or one of your spouse's close relatives dies. Medical Benefits Visiting your spouse in a hospital intensive care unit or during restricted visiting hours in other parts of a medical facility. Making medical decisions for your spouse if he or she becomes incapacitated and unable to express wishes for treatment. Death Benefits Consenting to after-death examinations and procedures. Making burial or other final arrangements. Family Benefits Filing for stepparent or joint adoption. Applying for joint foster care rights. Receiving equitable division of property if you divorce. Receiving spousal or child support, child custody, and visitation if you divorce. Housing Benefits Living in neighborhoods zoned for "families only." Automatically renewing leases signed by your spouse. Consumer Benefits Receiving family rates for health, homeowners', auto, and other types of insurance. Receiving tuition discounts and permission to use school facilities. Other consumer discounts and incentives offered only to married couples or families. Other Legal Benefits and Protections Suing a third person for wrongful death of your spouse and loss of consortium (loss of intimacy). Suing a third person for offenses that interfere with the success of your marriage, such as alienation of affection and criminal conversation (these laws are available in only a few states). Claiming the marital communications privilege, which means a court can't force you to disclose the contents of confidential communications between you and your spouse during your marriage. Receiving crime victims' recovery benefits if your spouse is the victim of a crime. Obtaining immigration and residency benefits for noncitizen spouse. Visiting rights in jails and other places where visitors are restricted to immediate family. Tax benefits: Sometimes these can hurt more than help. They do in our case.
Estate planning: You can do this with a will and all the other documents. I'm very well taken care of should TD die.
Government benefits: My own that I have earned under my own name are better than I would receive as TD's spouse.
Employment benefits: This largely depends upon company. For instance, TD was able to take FMLA to deal with my issues when I got sick. Not every company is as flexible with FMLA benefits, even for those with a license. You can deal with retirement benefits as appointing beneficiaries (I'm his on his 401k, he's mine on my 403b). Bereavement is also very dependent upon company. Should I choose, I can go on TD's health insurance as a domestic partner and had he moved to KY, he could have gone on my insurance as a domestic partner.
Death benefits: This is largely a function of who holds the POA. For TD, it is held jointly with his mom and myself.
Medical issues: This is generally not a problem, TD was with me at times where there was only family allowed. He was also with me before/after surgery, and I have signed a release that the doctors can talk to him. Again, he can make my medical decisions if I become incapacitated as I also have a medical POA.
Housing benefits: Really a non issue.
Family benefits: This largely depends upon state. Not an issue for us because of WA laws and our circumstances. You hae to realize, this is not the discussion - these are largely for those who have children and are looking at raising a family. The discussion is for those 50+, where this is very likely not an option.
Consumer benefits: This is largely dependent upon having the same mailing address. For instance, I can put him on my car insurance through USAA. By having the same mailing address, for most car rental companies, I am considered a spouse and can drive a rental car. We use this a lot.
My point is that a LOT of these can be worked around. In the 3 years I have lived with TD, there has not been a single instance where I have not been afforded the same benefits as a spouse.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Nov 10, 2014 13:33:35 GMT -5
Visiting your spouse in a hospital intensive care unit or during restricted visiting hours in other parts of a medical facility. Making medical decisions for your spouse if he or she becomes incapacitated and unable to express wishes for treatment.To me, this one is near the top of the list and that would go double if I were older when I wanted to get married. I would want to make sure my spouse could always visit me. The idea of DH not being able to visit me in hospital if my family (hypothetically) didn't want him to is truly heartbreaking. I was talking to one of the nurses in the hospital about this. She told me that they restrict even family members if it is upsetting to the patient. They tend to look at this as a case by case visit rather than a strict rules.
For instance, TD stayed overnight with me in my room several nights - long after families should have left. He was not upsetting to me and he could get me to do things (mainly eat and drink and breathe) that the nurses could not/did not have the time to do.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 10, 2014 13:52:01 GMT -5
The main reason I am going to marry DF is because even though legally all our ducks were in a row, his bio child overrode me and his wishes. Because he was "out" he was unable to tell anyone anymore. He had told 3 nurses who conveniently "forgot" even though they were his primary care nurses so what are the chances of all 3 forgetting? The hospital just didn't want a ruckus and this is a conservative religious town and me as a shackup wasn't looked upon with any respect no matter what the legal papers said. as far as taxes go, my rate will go up. No benefit there. I can collect a little more social security as half of his than I could on my own but not enough to worry about. Collecting on his is another matter, of course, but it isn't worth it to me because I'm sure because we have saved and invested, our social security will be stolen to support those that didn't.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2014 14:00:33 GMT -5
DH and I married when I was 50 and he was 65, for religious reasons. I'd do it again with DH but if I outlive him (likely given the age difference and his health issues), I don't think I'll marry again. Companionship? Heck, yes. But I've seen the crap the state imposes on married couples- the $6-7K we've paid in taxes on DH's SS every year, the fact that one spouse can be practically impoverished to pay for the LTC of the one who enters a nursing home first, other debts for which one spouse can be held responsible for the other's obligations, etc. I don't need Spousal or Widow benefits; I can get the maximum SS on my own record. Nor do I want the complications of someone's kids by a previous marriage getting part of my estate. There are some pretty ugly possible scenarios if I remarried that I don't want to deal with. Issues such as making each others' medical decisions can be handled with the right legal paperwork and it's a heck of a lot cheaper than the costs of marriage.
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sesfw
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Post by sesfw on Nov 10, 2014 18:04:24 GMT -5
Issues such as making each others' medical decisions can be handled with the right legal paperwork and it's a heck of a lot cheaper than the costs of marriage.
DH#2 and I married when I was 59 and he 63. Both widowed and have pre-nups in place. I had a job and home in AZ, he had a job and home in MI. We had 2 attorneys tell us not to marry but I was not going to move 1800 miles to a different community without marriage. I sold my home, quit my job, and moved into the home he and DW#1 and built. She lived there about 18 months before she died.
Just signing the marriage (legal contract) license gives us all the legal fu-fa that signing a dozen papers does and we don't get writers cramp. We don't have to remember whether or not a certain paper is signed. The cost of marriage is the cost of legal document and paying someone to say the correct words.
In emergency situations there is no question on decision making. The SS death benefit of $255 is for legal spouse only.
Personally I like being called 'wife' instead of 'girl friend' or 'significant other'.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2014 18:22:21 GMT -5
A friend of my mothers is getting married.
The bride is 73, the groom 82.
I sort of wondered why. I also wonder how their children feel about it? Inheritance and other issues arise.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Nov 10, 2014 18:26:50 GMT -5
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2014 18:29:38 GMT -5
The SS death benefit of $255 is for legal spouse only.
Well, THERE's something to mitigate the $70K or so in extra taxes we've paid over the last 11 years because we're married.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Nov 10, 2014 19:11:26 GMT -5
Um, actually, that's not true. I collected it for my dad because my mom was in no shape to do anything after he died. Of course I spent it toward his cremation.
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haapai
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Post by haapai on Nov 10, 2014 19:49:31 GMT -5
Why do people in their 40s or 50s that are already "established" get married? By established, I mean own a home and have other investments. They also have their own employer health and retirement plans. When my parents turned 75, I started thinking about tying the knot a lot more. I don't want them called if I break my leg at work (they live four hours away) and I do want my partner to be eligible for FMLA leave should I require care. I doubt that I am exceptional in this regard. There are probably a lot of folks who tie the knot to take these next-of-kin duties off of their elderly relatives, burdened siblings, and bewildered nieces and nephews. Please do not tell me that enough paperwork will get me the same treatment as being married. My aunts spend a grand a year on their legal paperwork which they haul around in a three-ring binder and they'll be the first to tell you that it's a pale, frail, partial simulation of being legally married.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Nov 10, 2014 20:38:57 GMT -5
My nephew said they got married because it helps them get jobs at the same college. Otherwise, it might or might not happen that way.
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sunshinegal1981
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Post by sunshinegal1981 on Nov 10, 2014 20:47:11 GMT -5
So that your SO can't be forced to testify against you in a court of law.
;-)
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Nov 10, 2014 21:03:22 GMT -5
Why do people in their 40s or 50s that are already "established" get married? By established, I mean own a home and have other investments. They also have their own employer health and retirement plans. When my parents turned 75, I started thinking about tying the knot a lot more. I don't want them called if I break my leg at work (they live four hours away) and I do want my partner to be eligible for FMLA leave should I require care. I doubt that I am exceptional in this regard. There are probably a lot of folks who tie the knot to take these next-of-kin duties off of their elderly relatives, burdened siblings, and bewildered nieces and nephews. Please do not tell me that enough paperwork will get me the same treatment as being married. My aunts spend a grand a year on their legal paperwork which they haul around in a three-ring binder and they'll be the first to tell you that it's a pale, frail, partial simulation of being legally married. Haapai.....you do not have to be married to be eligible for FMLA. FMLA covers domestic partners too. TD took it to help me, when I got sick, and he was my go-to person for medical issues, not my parents. I have both medical and financial POA for TD, it was part of his estate planning. The paperwork isn't anywhere near a 3 ring binder, maybe a folder, if that. No need to renew it yearly, only when something changes.
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Cookies Galore
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I don't need no instructions to know how to rock
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Post by Cookies Galore on Nov 10, 2014 21:03:45 GMT -5
I got married for the gifts.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Nov 10, 2014 21:03:49 GMT -5
It is kind of awkward for to see a 50 year old woman talk about her "boyfriend."
Plus there are legal and practical benefits to it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2014 21:06:25 GMT -5
I don't know.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 10, 2014 21:12:03 GMT -5
because they are suckers. TO: Mrs. A. T. Dragon Meridan, Connecticut 06450 Dear Mrs. Dragon FYI. Regards, NOTMSNMONEY.PROBOARDS.COM
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 10, 2014 21:15:52 GMT -5
I got married for the gifts. Atta girl.
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marvholly
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Post by marvholly on Nov 11, 2014 7:39:07 GMT -5
I am even older at 68, already retired & a widow so been there & done that & have the kids (and grands) to prove it.
I would like to have a SO to travel with, do activities with and generally go out to dinner with BUT do not need another spouse. In fact, I think it would cost me some income if I were to remarry (loss of pension + lower soc).
I am at the point in my life that I do NOT care about society’s expectations. I am not particularly religious and do NOT belong to a religion that is against unmarried interpersonal relationships.
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NoNamePerson
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Is There Anybody OUT There?
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Post by NoNamePerson on Nov 11, 2014 7:54:41 GMT -5
Ok I'll admit that I got married because my now EX needed a date for his wedding.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2014 8:44:34 GMT -5
Neither one of us would be eligible for FMLA. Bother of our employers have less than 50 employees.
I can mark that excuse off my list.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2014 8:51:45 GMT -5
I would like to have a SO to travel with, do activities with and generally go out to dinner with BUT do not need another spouse. In fact, I think it would cost me some income if I were to remarry (loss of pension + lower soc). Oh, yeah, I forgot another "benefit" of being married- can't collect Widow benefits on my late Ex's SS because I remarried. I'm 61 so it's too early to collect DH's and I plan to postpone getting my own till I'm 70.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 11, 2014 10:56:01 GMT -5
Why do people in their 40s or 50s that are already "established" get married? By established, I mean own a home and have other investments. They also have their own employer health and retirement plans. I could see if they wanted to have children some day, but these people don't want children. Also, I can see some people doing it for religious reasons, but the couple I know are not religious. The things that make you go hhhmmmmm . . . . Why does it make you go "hhhmmmmm"? Do you think it is for some nefarious reason?
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vonna
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Post by vonna on Nov 11, 2014 13:04:47 GMT -5
A friend of my mothers is getting married. The bride is 73, the groom 82. I sort of wondered why. I also wonder how their children feel about it? Inheritance and other issues arise. Well, I can speak as a child in this situation. My mom died when my dad was only 66. He was lucky to find love again at the age of 73 and remarried. I really think before he remarried, he was dying of loneliness.
He is a millionaire (mostly in IRA's) and his beneficiary is his wife.
I'm completely okay with that! I'm thrilled he found love again. They have a great life together, and if he predeceases her, I would hate for her standard of living to plummet. She has brought so much happiness to his life (he is now 80) and NO amount of inheritance could come close to watching my dad truly "live" again.
The money he earned and invested was so he and mom could live a happy life. That was cut short. Now he has the happy life back. How could I begrudge that? I just don't think he owes me an inheritance -- he was and is a great dad!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2014 13:10:32 GMT -5
A friend of my mothers is getting married. The bride is 73, the groom 82. I sort of wondered why. I also wonder how their children feel about it? Inheritance and other issues arise. Well, I can speak as a child in this situation. My mom died when my dad was only 66. He was lucky to find love again at the age of 73 and remarried. I really think before he remarried, he was dying of loneliness.
He is a millionaire (mostly in IRA's) and his beneficiary is his wife.
I'm completely okay with that! I'm thrilled he found love again. They have a great life together, and if he predeceases her, I would hate for her standard of living to plummet. She has brought so much happiness to his life (he is now 80) and NO amount of inheritance could come close to watching my dad truly "live" again.
The money he earned and invested was so he and mom could live a happy life. That was cut short. Now he has the happy life back. How could I begrudge that? I just don't think he owes me an inheritance -- he was and is a great dad!
That's awesome! I'm so happy for your Dad and I love your attitude.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2014 13:19:19 GMT -5
Mostly marriage is about property even love marriage.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Nov 11, 2014 13:19:52 GMT -5
I don't think I would feel the need to get married again that late in the game, assuming no minor children. But the majority of people in their 70s/80s, I would imagine, probably don't feel right about a live-in relationship with no legal tie.
Not sure though. It would depend on the person and, frankly, whether the relationship warranted marriage. I really hope DH is my only husband.
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