NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
Posts: 48,086
Member is Online
|
Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 6, 2014 8:46:39 GMT -5
And another thing, do not fall into the trap of taking her choices upon yourself. Yes she may have been feeling neglected and you should own that and if you choose to work thru things you'll need to figure out what she needs to not feel neglected.
But the choice to cheat was 100% her own. There are other ways she could have addressed the problem, but she chose not to. She needs to own her actions. If she cannot then you're not going to have much luck salvaging your marriage.
DH relapsed when he took my pain pills post birth. Now I had every right to those pills. Where I failed was I did not confront DH when I noticed the supply was getting smaller and smaller but I wasn't the one taking them. Being married to an addict I have to carefully consider what I bring into the house and I need to account for it at all times. But HE is the one who chose to pop the pills. He takes 100% responsibility for that, I didn't *make* him do it. HE is the one who chose to violate the trust in our marriage.
He knows there were a multitude of ways to deal with things that didn't involve stealing my pain medication. He decided to take the "easy" way out (his words not mine) and slide back into old habits. I presented the opportunity, but he's the one that chose to take it.
If he didn't accept personal responsibility for his actions we wouldn't have been able to work it out.
Don't fall into the trap of becoming an enabler. Acknowledge your role in the marriage but don't absolve her of her role in the marriage at the same time.
|
|
sheilaincali
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 17:55:24 GMT -5
Posts: 4,131
|
Post by sheilaincali on May 6, 2014 9:04:08 GMT -5
I had a similar experience to yours several years ago.
My career was taking off and I was working a lot of hours- I was an interior designer and traveling from LA to San Diego to Palm Springs and back. I was putting 1000 miles a week on my car and working 70+ hours a week. We had moved from Minnesota to California and DH didn't know many people in CA yet. He re-connected with a girl from college and began a 9 month, long distance affair. They'd meet up somewhere every few weeks.
I became suspicious and found his phone (he'd taken to hiding it from me) and confronted him with the text messages. As in I went roaring into the bedroom at 6am on a Saturday morning, threw the phone at his head and said "Who the fuck is L and why does she think you love her?!?!?!"
That was 7 years ago. I kicked him out- fortunately my parents vacation house 30 minutes from our house was empty so he lived there for a few weeks. I was ready to walk away but he asked me to give him a chance. He is an addict. He wrote out a very detailed plan/promise to me. He joined a 12 step group and got a sponsor. We both started individual counseling and marriage counseling (3 different counselors). In our situation we had a son who was 9 and had been married over 10 years at that point.
It was not an easy road. 7 years later and I still have moments of doubt and paranoia. I think it was worth in my case to work on fixing my marriage. The important thing to note is that DH was willing to do whatever I asked him to do. Now our relationship is an open book and he does whatever he can to ease my fears. When he travels with his friends (a lie he used to use to meet up with L) he is sure to send me pics of the group of them at whatever con they are at. Of them all eating dinner together, etc. Plus he only goes with guys who's wives I am friends with and he'll encourage me to spend time with the wives while he is gone. It's helped.
There are still mornings in which I'll wake up after having nightmares all night about him having an affair again. We talk about it and move on.
Marriages can be fixed post affair but they take a ton of hard work and both parties have to be willing to put in the effort and have to want to save the marriage.
Sorry you are going through this. I wouldn't wish this on anyone.
|
|
giramomma
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 11:25:27 GMT -5
Posts: 22,141
|
Post by giramomma on May 6, 2014 9:27:39 GMT -5
The issue of forgiveness is an interesting one.
It's of my personal belief that we don't forgive for others, but that we do it for ourselves.
I've seen folks carry around hurts, grudges, whatever you want to call them for 40+ years. And STILL not let go. In my experience, these are not the most pleasant people to be around.
There's also a notion that forgiveness means forgetting. I don't believe that for one minute.
It took me 18 months to forgive my husband. That's when I was willing to move past the pain, to not bring it up daily, to move beyond it.
Trust is an interesting issue, too. Some folks are comfortable with being a marriage with conditional trust and love. Others are not. Some think that love and trust should be unconditional.
These are all issues you are going to have to work out on your own.
|
|
GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl
Senior Associate
"How you win matters." Ender, Ender's Game
Joined: Jan 2, 2011 13:33:09 GMT -5
Posts: 11,291
|
Post by GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl on May 6, 2014 9:29:22 GMT -5
I am sorry you are going through this.
You've received lots of good advice -- even from some who have walked the same road.
If I may, I'd like to add some succinct advice from good old Ann Landers: are you better of with, or, without her? Therein lies your future.
|
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on May 6, 2014 10:56:08 GMT -5
In some ways, I think men have more difficulty dealing with an affair than do women. Just my opinion and what I have seen. It seems harder to hold the marriage together if the wife has cheated. Doesnt' mean it is impossible. People screw up and make mistakes. With help and counseling it can be done. But, for those I know, it really is difficult for men to put that behind them. I think my DH would forgive ANYTHING but that. I don't think he could handle that.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,912
|
Post by zibazinski on May 6, 2014 10:57:13 GMT -5
I forgave a cheater ONCE. All it did was give him license to do it again. But I'm 50 per cent responsible because I knowingly married a man who had been raised dysfunctionally, which is why I counsel my children to try to marry into "healthy" families.
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 11:07:24 GMT -5
Oh so sad, I am going through the same thing. No, honey, I think he is just tried to troll after he read your story. I hope I am wrong. Not that I want anyone to have a cheating wife.
|
|
abababa
New Member
Joined: May 5, 2014 19:55:18 GMT -5
Posts: 11
|
Post by abababa on May 6, 2014 11:55:13 GMT -5
Not sure what the issue is. You admitted it is your fault. She is still banging the guy. Unless there are kids involved her ass and move on. To be clear, that's not the case. While I've done a lot of self blaming and there's certainly much I could have done better, she owns her actions. She made those conscious decisions instead of going to me when she felt neglected. She never once mentioned counseling or divorce before the affair started. She made cowardly and immature decisions. While she didn't make an immediate clean break with him, she hasn't contacted him in a week and says she hasn't slept with him since I found out. Obviously that could be up for debate, but she did show me the conversation where she broke things off. She was in it for the emotional connection while he was in it for the sex. It's still shitty regardless.
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 12:31:29 GMT -5
Not sure what the issue is. You admitted it is your fault. She is still banging the guy. Unless there are kids involved her ass and move on. To be clear, that's not the case. While I've done a lot of self blaming and there's certainly much I could have done better, she owns her actions. She made those conscious decisions instead of going to me when she felt neglected. She never once mentioned counseling or divorce before the affair started. She made cowardly and immature decisions.
While she didn't make an immediate clean break with him, she hasn't contacted him in a week and says she hasn't slept with him since I found out. Obviously that could be up for debate, but she did show me the conversation where she broke things off. She was in it for the emotional connection while he was in it for the sex. It's still shitty regardless. Do not believe one second that she never came to you with 'neglection' issue if you are approachable person. Women usually get neglected when talking about neglection. That is the fact. And no, no good husband got cheated on. It is sex or emotional disconnect. And I hardly ever saw a woman who is guilty of cheating on a good husband. Look into your faults, however if you were acknowledging them - I wouldn't be typing this right now. WOWOWOW! I had missed THAT! She made cowardly and immature decisions.
That is the way warm loving husband would never speak about his wife in my opinion. There is nothing coward in cheating. Cheating is bravery. I can't do it because I do not have stamina for it. And my husband actually warm and loving...not that he has nothing to be blamed for!!!
|
|
NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
Posts: 48,086
Member is Online
|
Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 6, 2014 12:49:10 GMT -5
There is nothing coward in cheating. Cheating is bravery
Are you f-ing serious?
Another note to the OP: don't listen to Tloony.
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 12:54:34 GMT -5
There is nothing coward in cheating. Cheating is bravery
Are you f-ing serious? Another note to the OP: don't listen to Tloony. Have you ever cheated, DQ? I AM serious. Because when I am thinking of how people get together under this circumstances... I am thinking of 'where' and 'what if someone sees you' and 'what if another spouse finds out and comes to bust your butt?' How embarrassing I think... How bad is your life supposed to be so you would subject yourself to a cheating hence embarrassment like that? This is why I am saying I do not think people are cheating out of good life! Over...
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 12:56:14 GMT -5
There is nothing coward in cheating. Cheating is bravery
Are you f-ing serious? Another note to the OP: don't listen to Tloony. And how come you had nothing to say to OP but you had thing to say to me? It is not a question if I am serious or right. OP posted post, so go ahead, give him some wisdom of yours...
|
|
abababa
New Member
Joined: May 5, 2014 19:55:18 GMT -5
Posts: 11
|
Post by abababa on May 6, 2014 12:57:10 GMT -5
tloonya, I can only assume you are a troll or a very troubled soul yourself.
I love my wife but absolutely hate some of the decisions she has made. Yes, I do think they were cowardly and immature acts. There is nothing brave about cheating. There are certainly times when it takes bravery to separate or divorce from a terrible marriage, but that is much different.
|
|
sheilaincali
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 17:55:24 GMT -5
Posts: 4,131
|
Post by sheilaincali on May 6, 2014 13:02:33 GMT -5
Looney likes to say sensational things for the dramatic effect and the attention.
Only you and your wife can decide if you both want to work on your marriage or not. Some of us have BTDT. Some divorced and some stayed together. Outcome depends on you and your wife. I shared my story so I won't rehash it.
Best of luck with whatever you decide to do.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on May 6, 2014 13:05:02 GMT -5
tloonya, I can only assume you are a troll or a very troubled soul yourself. I love my wife but absolutely hate some of the decisions she has made. Yes, I do think they were cowardly and immature acts. There is nothing brave about cheating. There are certainly times when it takes bravery to separate or divorce from a terrible marriage, but that is much different. What does your wife have to say about the decisions she's made? What is her outlook with regard to your current situation?
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 13:11:46 GMT -5
tloonya, I can only assume you are a troll or a very troubled soul yourself. I love my wife but absolutely hate some of the decisions she has made. Yes, I do think they were cowardly and immature acts. There is nothing brave about cheating. There are certainly times when it takes bravery to separate or divorce from a terrible marriage, but that is much different. if I was I would be the longest living troll. And calling me a troll because I had just assumed you were a troll (for absence in this thread) is just plain immature and shows the character of the man.
|
|
abababa
New Member
Joined: May 5, 2014 19:55:18 GMT -5
Posts: 11
|
Post by abababa on May 6, 2014 13:16:51 GMT -5
Okay tloonya, do your thing.
For the rest of you, sorry, let me take a step back here. I got a little caught up and only responded to a couple of posts that I took particular exception to. I know, I should just ignore and focus on the many others. I owe you all a big thanks for all the thoughtful responses. I've read through them all...twice. It's provided me some very useful perspective, particularly those that have gone through a similar situation.
We're kind of in the cooling off period right now. We're back under the same roof for the time being but in separate beds. We have both lined up individual counseling for starters. I feel like I need to at least try or there will always be the 'what ifs'. She is slowly getting on board with at least trying...good that she's getting there but bad that it doesn't seem more emphatic. Maybe she just needs time.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 9, 2024 12:17:06 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 6, 2014 13:16:57 GMT -5
There is nothing coward in cheating. Cheating is bravery
Are you f-ing serious? Another note to the OP: don't listen to Tloony. Have you ever cheated, DQ? I AM serious. Because when I am thinking of how people get together under this circumstances... I am thinking of 'where' and 'what if someone sees you' and 'what if another spouse finds out and comes to bust your butt?' How embarrassing I think... How bad is your life supposed to be so you would subject yourself to a cheating hence embarrassment like that? This is why I am saying I do not think people are cheating out of good life! Over... Loony, if your marriage is bad you don't stay in it and cheat on your spouse. You man (or woman) up and let your spouse know how you feel. If together you can't change things after these feelings are brought to light, then you go your separate ways. Cheating is for those too chicken shit to confront or to leave. Had my first husband come to me with his true feelings instead of pretending for years he was happy and then finding another woman on the side I think we would still be married. I truly do.
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 13:17:02 GMT -5
Looney likes to say sensational things for the dramatic effect and the attention.
Only you and your wife can decide if you both want to work on your marriage or not. Some of us have BTDT. Some divorced and some stayed together. Outcome depends on you and your wife. I shared my story so I won't rehash it.
Best of luck with whatever you decide to do. But I am seriously believing it, cali! Please, let's hear from person who cheated. How was it? Pleasantly calm and enjoyable? Only if you are an amoral to the core person imo
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 13:19:41 GMT -5
Have you ever cheated, DQ? I AM serious. Because when I am thinking of how people get together under this circumstances... I am thinking of 'where' and 'what if someone sees you' and 'what if another spouse finds out and comes to bust your butt?' How embarrassing I think... How bad is your life supposed to be so you would subject yourself to a cheating hence embarrassment like that? This is why I am saying I do not think people are cheating out of good life! Over... Loony, if your marriage is bad you don't stay in it and cheat on your spouse. You man (or woman) up and let your spouse know how you feel. If together you can't change things after these feelings are brought to light, then you go your separate ways. Cheating is for those too chicken shit to confront or to leave. Had my first husband come to me with his true feelings instead of pretending for years he was happy and then finding another woman on the side I think we would still be married. I truly do. In ideal world, not that we are living in such...
|
|
whoami
Well-Known Member
Joined: Jan 8, 2011 12:43:49 GMT -5
Posts: 1,292
|
Post by whoami on May 6, 2014 13:20:05 GMT -5
Why don't you ask your mothers boyfriend who has been cheating his wife for all these years? Hows that working out for him?
Your mother will end up with squat. Hows that working for her?
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 9, 2024 12:17:06 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 6, 2014 13:22:21 GMT -5
Loony, if your marriage is bad you don't stay in it and cheat on your spouse. You man (or woman) up and let your spouse know how you feel. If together you can't change things after these feelings are brought to light, then you go your separate ways. Cheating is for those too chicken shit to confront or to leave. Had my first husband come to me with his true feelings instead of pretending for years he was happy and then finding another woman on the side I think we would still be married. I truly do. In ideal world, not that we are living in such... In ideal world what? I suppose in other countries getting out of a marriage might not be so easy, but it's not really an issue here. You're not forced to stay with this person.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on May 6, 2014 13:24:40 GMT -5
Let's not let this turn into a discussion of Tloonya's mother and her BF, please. Abababa has come here hoping for some guidance and shared experience. Let's try to stick with that subject and not let the discussion be derailed. Thanks, all.
mmhmm, Administrator
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 13:24:42 GMT -5
Why don't you ask your mothers boyfriend who has been cheating his wife for all these years? Hows that working out for him? Your mother will end up with squat. Hows that working for her? He had not been cheating, his ex left him years ago. What does it have to do with anything except you want to spew the hate and you did? And they are very happy together. Thanks for bringing it up. For whatever reason...oh, that was hate.
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 13:25:17 GMT -5
Was it putty dough before?
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 13:28:21 GMT -5
In ideal world, not that we are living in such... In ideal world what? I suppose in other countries getting out of a marriage might not be so easy, but it's not really an issue here. You're not forced to stay with this person. I suppose she wasn't cheating right from the beginning. Woman was caught up in the moment while living in less than good marriage. I do not think it was 6 month of pure intercourse between 2. So it might just got there a week ago and she might thinking of leaving. He just found out before his time. I am not saying this is what had happened but possible? Why not?
|
|
NancysSummerSip
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 19:19:42 GMT -5
Posts: 36,689
Today's Mood: Full of piss and vinegar
Favorite Drink: Anything with ice
|
Post by NancysSummerSip on May 6, 2014 13:31:25 GMT -5
Okay tloonya, do your thing. For the rest of you, sorry, let me take a step back here. I got a little caught up and only responded to a couple of posts that I took particular exception to. I know, I should just ignore and focus on the many others. I owe you all a big thanks for all the thoughtful responses. I've read through them all...twice. It's provided me some very useful perspective, particularly those that have gone through a similar situation. We're kind of in the cooling off period right now. We're back under the same roof for the time being but in separate beds. We have both lined up individual counseling for starters. I feel like I need to at least try or there will always be the 'what ifs'. She is slowly getting on board with at least trying...good that she's getting there but bad that it doesn't seem more emphatic. Maybe she just needs time. I think you've chosen a good path, or at least the best one, under the circumstances. Breathing space without breaking up your space, so to speak. And separate counseling is a good start. It could lead to joint counseling, or the end of things, depending on what you hear and how you handle it. A friend of mine went through this. Like you, a very hard worker, good provider and wanted to give his wife everything she never had in her first very bad marriage. The wife, my former best friend, dumped him for a guy she was seeing in a long-distance (three hour drive) relationship. The guy turned around and dumped her in return. As my friend says, "My ex-wife got all the stuff in our relationship, but I kept all the friends and support. It's what I needed more than anything else."
|
|
sheilaincali
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 17:55:24 GMT -5
Posts: 4,131
|
Post by sheilaincali on May 6, 2014 13:37:13 GMT -5
No- my husband's affair was not a shiny, happy relationship. She went psycho and started threatening to kill herself. After he broke things off for good she started sending my son letters and packages telling him that she was going to be his new mommy.
She started sending me dozens upon dozens of emails a day. Calling the house at all hours.
We had to take her to court to get a restraining order. Had she not died a few months later (natural causes, I was in a different state) I assume she would have started stalking and harassing us again.
So no- his affair did not end up being very enjoyable for him.
|
|
sheilaincali
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 17:55:24 GMT -5
Posts: 4,131
|
Post by sheilaincali on May 6, 2014 13:40:23 GMT -5
Many therapists will recommend you see a separate therapist for the joint counseling sessions. That way there is no conflict of interest, no "I wonder what she says about me in her sessions with the therapist", etc.
It can get a little expensive with all the therapy. I'm a big proponent of therapy. Even if you ultimately decide to part ways I think you are doing yourself a favor by starting to see someone now. What you're going through is almost a PTSD situation (or at least that's how my therapist described it).
|
|
tloonya
Junior Associate
What status?
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 16:22:13 GMT -5
Posts: 8,452
|
Post by tloonya on May 6, 2014 13:46:43 GMT -5
No- my husband's affair was not a shiny, happy relationship. She went psycho and started threatening to kill herself. After he broke things off for good she started sending my son letters and packages telling him that she was going to be his new mommy.
She started sending me dozens upon dozens of emails a day. Calling the house at all hours.
We had to take her to court to get a restraining order. Had she not died a few months later (natural causes, I was in a different state) I assume she would have started stalking and harassing us again.
So no- his affair did not end up being very enjoyable for him.
That is what I said! Affair is NOT an easy and enjoyable thing to do! And if person doing it - it is not because her life was all that good! And woman intuitively knows if her husband will listen to her 'problems' in marriage. A lot of women afraid to end up alone - this is why they are not divorcing until they have a safe harbor (same as men never leave unless there is place for them and bed made) and no matter how stupid it is - this is what MAJORITY of women ending up doing. Cheating and trying to make sure 'he is the one who will take me in...AFTER'.
|
|