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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 8:55:47 GMT -5
How many times a day does he call? Usually just once. If I don't answer it's worse. He keeps calling and leaving messages. The other night he called and talked to me for a bit, then called back and said he forgot to say goodnight to his son so I gave the phone to him, and after a few minutes they were disconnected or DS hung up, so he called back again and accused me of doing it. I said no, I did not and he got mad and said "Just shut up and give my son the phone". I told him to shut up and hung up. Well, I got about 5 more calls that night that went to voicemail, one insisting I let him take our son to church the next day and saying he was going to call his attorney and get this supervised shit taken out... Then the next morning he called me again wanting to know when I was getting there for church. I told him, I don't want to go to church and he told me to just drop our son off and the hall would transport them, I said they can't they don't have car seats in thier halfway house vehicles, then he said well, then either you take me or meet me there with him.... Non stop stuff like this. No wonder all my hair has fallen out.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 8:57:25 GMT -5
I wish I knew what the court ordered minimum was! We never went to court, so nothing is spelled out. It just says he is entitled to reasonable parenting time and at this time that time would be supervised. Period. That's all it says.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 20, 2014 8:59:18 GMT -5
Oh geez, I am so sorry Minnesota. Can you delete the voicemail before it gets to his message? I'd call your phone company and see if maybe there is a way to block his number or shunt his voicemails somewhere else. Can't hurt to ask. Could you talk to someone at his center about his obessesive phone calls? Perhaps they can limit phone time if they know he's pretty much stalking/harassing you. It just says he is entitled to reasonable parenting time and at this time that time would be supervised. Period. That's all it says. IMO, time to put that $260/hr to good use and go to court. You shouldn't have to suffer. I'm pretty sure you ahve enough evidence on your side to get pretty much whatever you want. If you don't want to do that then it sounds like YOU get to decide what is "reasonable parenting time". IMHO, that would be zilch but it doesn't sound like you want to go that way. Considering his mental health I don't see any reason why you can't decide that "reasonable parenting time" is restricted to as little as you wish.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:00:13 GMT -5
Start taking action! He keeps calling? Turn off the phone.
He is in some kind of halfway house, right? Report these things! Get his behavior on record! They won't release him for anything if he's still acting irrationally. And you can help keep them updated on this kind of behavior.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Mar 20, 2014 9:02:27 GMT -5
How many times a day does he call? Usually just once. If I don't answer it's worse. He keeps calling and leaving messages. The other night he called and talked to me for a bit, then called back and said he forgot to say goodnight to his son so I gave the phone to him, and after a few minutes they were disconnected or DS hung up, so he called back again and accused me of doing it. I said no, I did not and he got mad and said "Just shut up and give my son the phone". I told him to shut up and hung up. Well, I got about 5 more calls that night that went to voicemail, one insisting I let him take our son to church the next day and saying he was going to call his attorney and get this supervised shit taken out... Then the next morning he called me again wanting to know when I was getting there for church. I told him, I don't want to go to church and he told me to just drop our son off and the hall would transport them, I said they can't they don't have car seats in thier halfway house vehicles, then he said well, then either you take me or meet me there with him.... Non stop stuff like this. No wonder all my hair has fallen out. Let him rant about calling his attorney. In one ear, out the other.
There has to be a substantial change in circumstances to change parenting time. There isn't one.
And once a week is reasonable, as is one call a day.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:03:03 GMT -5
I wish I knew what the court ordered minimum was! We never went to court, so nothing is spelled out. It just says he is entitled to reasonable parenting time and at this time that time would be supervised. Period. That's all it says. Are you allowing him to decide what's "reasonable"?!? You're not the one that's been committed so YOU decide what's reasonable! Once a week too much? Try every 10 days. Every 2 weeks....until someone in a position of power tells you otherwise. Not him.
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CarolinaKat
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Post by CarolinaKat on Mar 20, 2014 9:03:37 GMT -5
Start taking action! He keeps calling? Turn off the phone. He is in some kind of halfway house, right? Report these things! Get his behavior on record! They won't release him for anything if he's still acting irrationally. And you can help keep them updated on this kind of behavior. I agree. You are NOT his wife or his mommy, so stop making yourself sick over it. I know this is easier said than done, but damn. And if he asks you to sneak stuff n again, TELL SOMEONE.
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flutterby
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Post by flutterby on Mar 20, 2014 9:04:34 GMT -5
MPL, I don't want to come down on you at all, because I feel so bad for the situation you're in. But why are you talking to him about anything? Most divorced people don't chat on the phone with their exes, especially on a daily basis, unless it involves something with the kids. You are not obligated to allow this much contact. Is there any way you can block that number so he can't call you, and set it up so you and your son call him nightly instead? It seems to me you are in a position of always having to react to him. And it has to be exhausting! Instead, you need to be in the stronger position of being the ones setting the rules.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:07:19 GMT -5
I gave him his cell phone on Sunday afternoon the day he was going off about the church thing. He's not supposed to have a phone except for when he's on his "free time" otherwise it's supposed to be locked up in the office, but he gave me $200 to give it to him, and frankly, I really needed it.
He's never called me from this though. It's always the halfway house phone that he uses. I'm sure he wanted his phone mainly for internet stuff. And I'm sure there's very good reasons he's not supposed to be on it, but I was just sick of him hounding me about it and if he gets in trouble that's his problem.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:08:05 GMT -5
That's it exactly, flutterby! She's reacting to him when SHE is the one in a position of power. He's really done a number on her and I don't think anyone would fault her for wanting to limit contact. And since there is no formal agreement SHE is the one who gets to decide how things are going to go. I do hope you come to realize that you are not beholden to him anymore, minnesotapaintlady.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 20, 2014 9:08:45 GMT -5
Mental illness is a really hard thing to deal with, including for those on the outside. MPL I really encourage you to look for sliding scale/free counseling thru the county, many have family services thru the courts if you ask. How you deal with and interact with a mentally ill person is TOTALLY different than how you handle a sane person.
I understand wanting to be amicable and wanting him to have a relationship with his son, but he's not remotely close to a sane rational adult and therefore isn't going to make a sane reponsible father or ex.
This is all on him, not on you. You can't make him well and you absolutely should not be catering to his paranioa/whims.
Document and report to whoever it is is his supervisor at the half way house how many times he calls a day and what he says (save a voicemail if you have to). These people are on YOUR side. You don't want him to be released b/c they aren't operating on a complete set of information. He's going nowhere if he continues to display the behavior he is and that's EXACTLY what should happen.
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flutterby
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Post by flutterby on Mar 20, 2014 9:11:06 GMT -5
I get being hounded until you give in, believe me! But if you seriously limit the contact you're allowing him, then he can't hound you. Think how nice it would be not to always feel dread when the phone rings.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:11:36 GMT -5
And once a week is reasonable, as is one call a day.
Thank you! Good to hear that from someone that deals with these situation from a legal side. He wants to do Daddy and Me classes at the early childhood center on Tuesday nights and I'm thinking of bending on this because I just can't take the constant accusations that I'm trying to interfere in his relationship. I think he just registered and is planning on starting, but I want to talk to someone there so he at least can't be running out the back door. Not that I believe he'd do that, but you never know.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 20, 2014 9:12:24 GMT -5
And report that cell phone! The half way house people are not going to judge you. They will understand how hard it is to deal with someone with mental illness. You can't be faulted for wanting it all to go away and doing something to shut him up.
But if he's not supposed to have it, he's not supposed to have it. It's also one more point in your favor b/c it shows he's not remotely close to being ready to be released if he's violating the rules.
He wants to do Daddy and Me classes at the early childhood center on Tuesday nights and I'm thinking of bending on this because I just can't take the constant accusations that I'm trying to interfere in his relationship
You have every right to interefere. If he was cognizant of the issues then he wouldn't be accusing you of things, he'd 100% agree with you that he has no business being in charge of his son in any size/shape or form. Unfortunately most mentally ill people are not capable of that level of awarness. YOU will continue to be the problem until he accepts that this is HIS problem and HE created the situation that limits his relationship with his son.
You need ot do your best to not give into that and stay strong. Don't let him think you're doing anything wrong. You are doing what is best for your child and if he was sane he would see that.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:15:20 GMT -5
And once a week is reasonable, as is one call a day.
Thank you! Good to hear that from someone that deals with these situation from a legal side. He wants to do Daddy and Me classes at the early childhood center on Tuesday nights and I'm thinking of bending on this because I just can't take the constant accusations that I'm trying to interfere in his relationship. I think he just registered and is planning on starting, but I want to talk to someone there so he at least can't be running out the back door. Not that I believe he'd do that, but you never know. How is he going to get to these classes? Are YOU supposed to drive him? Why are you catering to his whims? Again, he can WANT to do these classes, but since the State has decided he is not well enough to care for himself he is just going to have to keep wanting. IMHO.
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flutterby
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Post by flutterby on Mar 20, 2014 9:16:22 GMT -5
And once a week is reasonable, as is one call a day.
Thank you! Good to hear that from someone that deals with these situation from a legal side. He wants to do Daddy and Me classes at the early childhood center on Tuesday nights and I'm thinking of bending on this because I just can't take the constant accusations that I'm trying to interfere in his relationship. I think he just registered and is planning on starting, but I want to talk to someone there so he at least can't be running out the back door. Not that I believe he'd do that, but you never know. "No!" "Nope!" "Not gonna happen!" "No, I'm not able to do that at this time!" "Ha, ha f**k that!" These are all reasonable answers to his request. The word no should be your new best friend!!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:17:35 GMT -5
The thing is, he'll be released. This is a 90 day program. It's not a place where they just keep you there forever. He's already leveled up to level 3 of 5 or something like that. At the end of 90 days they have a kind of men's house he can go to if he doesn't have an apartment lined up and if the extended unemployment gets reinstated like they're talking he'll be sitting pretty good for money for the next 6 months. He makes more than me!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:19:10 GMT -5
And the only reason he is leveling up is because they don't know what he's REALLY doing! REPORT HIM! Report his phone! Report his irrational behavior!!!!!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:19:14 GMT -5
Thank you! Good to hear that from someone that deals with these situation from a legal side. He wants to do Daddy and Me classes at the early childhood center on Tuesday nights and I'm thinking of bending on this because I just can't take the constant accusations that I'm trying to interfere in his relationship. I think he just registered and is planning on starting, but I want to talk to someone there so he at least can't be running out the back door. Not that I believe he'd do that, but you never know. How is he going to get to these classes? Are YOU supposed to drive him? Why are you catering to his whims? Again, he can WANT to do these classes, but since the State has decided he is not well enough to care for himself he is just going to have to keep wanting. IMHO. They'll take him or if they're close enough to walk, which I think they might be, he can go himself. He gets something like 2 hours a day of free time now.
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flutterby
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Post by flutterby on Mar 20, 2014 9:21:37 GMT -5
MPL, I hate to say it, but I think you need to pay that lawyer and get a visitation and support schedule set up NOW before he's released.
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CarolinaKat
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Post by CarolinaKat on Mar 20, 2014 9:22:37 GMT -5
The thing is, he'll be released. This is a 90 day program. It's not a place where they just keep you there forever. He's already leveled up to level 3 of 5 or something like that. At the end of 90 days they have a kind of men's house he can go to if he doesn't have an apartment lined up and if the extended unemployment gets reinstated like they're talking he'll be sitting pretty good for money for the next 6 months. He makes more than me! He's going to KEEP leveling up unless you TELL THEM he's breaking rules, and showing that he's not ok. He's manipulating them just like he's still manupliating you. And you're letting him get away with it. I know it's hard, but you really need to tell them about the phone and the treatment you're getting from him. I don't think he's as well as they think he is.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Mar 20, 2014 9:23:42 GMT -5
What happens when he's not well at the 90 days?
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Mar 20, 2014 9:25:02 GMT -5
Can you set up a Skype phone # that he can call? That # will be on once a day at a certain time and he can talk to yds on speaker phone. Then block the halfway house phone number.
If you haven't already I would suspend saving for yds college and direct those funds to your lawyer. I don't think he should get much of a vote with this stuff until he has shown considerable improvement.
Most of all, I am so, so sorry you're dealing with this.
Sent from my ADR6410LVW using proboards
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Mar 20, 2014 9:31:28 GMT -5
I was just reading a CCS where the judge determined reasonable parenting time to be 4 hours (supervised) every 2 weeks (judging from how the filings read, the noncustodial parent also suffers from some undiagnosed mental issues). I know you feel powerless and are afraid to piss him off/give him ammo because he'll be out soon, but I'd start limiting the phone calls to one a day and visits to once a week or less. That's perfectly "reasonable" under the guidelines.
The fact that he believes the rules don't apply to him is a pretty big indicator of narcissistic personality disorder or sociopathy, and the powers that be should be made aware of that. (Does he have an official diagnosis? I thought I read bipolar but that may have been another poster).
Is there a c/s order in place? If he can give you $200 for a phone, he can pay child support.
I also agree with Zib's suggestion of a Guardian Ad Litem, if one hasn't already been appointed. Their role is to determine the best interests of the child and make recommendations to the court. Given what you've posted, I would imagine that the GAL would recommend that your son be given limited (and supervised) contact with his father. That would give you a neutral third party to "blame" instead of having your ex accuse you of trying to keep his son from him...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:32:32 GMT -5
The thing is, he'll be released. This is a 90 day program. It's not a place where they just keep you there forever. He's already leveled up to level 3 of 5 or something like that. At the end of 90 days they have a kind of men's house he can go to if he doesn't have an apartment lined up and if the extended unemployment gets reinstated like they're talking he'll be sitting pretty good for money for the next 6 months. He makes more than me! He's going to KEEP leveling up unless you TELL THEM he's breaking rules, and showing that he's not ok. He's manipulating them just like he's still manupliating you. And you're letting him get away with it. I know it's hard, but you really need to tell them about the phone and the treatment you're getting from him. I don't think he's as well as they think he is. All the calls he makes to me are from the office where they listen in, so they know what he's saying. This is going to make some of you flip out, but I don't know that he's really treating me badly, he just wants to see his son and I'm the one saying no all the time, to him for no apparent reason except to be a bitch.
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swasat
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Post by swasat on Mar 20, 2014 9:35:33 GMT -5
Thank you! Good to hear that from someone that deals with these situation from a legal side. He wants to do Daddy and Me classes at the early childhood center on Tuesday nights and I'm thinking of bending on this because I just can't take the constant accusations that I'm trying to interfere in his relationship. I think he just registered and is planning on starting, but I want to talk to someone there so he at least can't be running out the back door. Not that I believe he'd do that, but you never know. Gosh , you are dealing with a lot in life MPL. I am so sorry this is happening. Regarding the above, be a bitch and take a stand. Had it been me I would have just told him that I agree with all his accusations. That I am taking a responsible decision for OUR kid because I am not in rehab/prison and because the court trusted ME with the son . Seriously, why do you care what he thinks? He can think he is an angel from God. Doesn't make him one. I agree with other posters....go to court NOW and get everything spelled out before he is released. I know its easy to say all this while not being in the position that you are in. I really hope you get out of this mess.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 20, 2014 9:37:49 GMT -5
he just wants to see his son and I'm the one saying no all the time, to him for no apparent reason except to be a bitch.
Have you read any of those stories about nutball parents making off with their kids? We had one recently the mother picked her kid up from school early went to a remote area of Lake Manawa then strangled her kid to death with fishing twine and then killed herself. You are NOT a bitch to keep your son away from his mentally ill father. His current behavior is already extremely damaging to both you and his son. He has no business being put in a position where there is even the slightest chance he could do worse. He's not remotely capable of deciding if he's well enough to be a father. If he was capable he wouldn't currently be sitting in a half way house. MPL, please please please seek out counseling. He's done a real number on your head and his family is doing one as well (his mother sounds just as nuts as he is). You should know how very rare it is that YM is ever 100% in agreement about anything, the fact that everyone here, who has absolutely no stakes whatesover in the outcome, is telling you that you are doing the right thing should tell you something.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:37:51 GMT -5
I was just reading a CCS where the judge determined reasonable parenting time to be 4 hours (supervised) every 2 weeks (judging from how the filings read, the noncustodial parent also suffers from some undiagnosed mental issues). I know you feel powerless and are afraid to piss him off/give him ammo because he'll be out soon, but I'd start limiting the phone calls to one a day and visits to once a week or less. That's perfectly "reasonable" under the guidelines. The fact that he believes the rules don't apply to him is a pretty big indicator of narcissistic personality disorder or sociopathy, and the powers that be should be made aware of that. (Does he have an official diagnosis? I thought I read bipolar but that may have been another poster). Is there a c/s order in place? If he can give you $200 for a phone, he can pay child support. I also agree with Zib's suggestion of a Guardian Ad Litem, if one hasn't already been appointed. Their role is to determine the best interests of the child and make recommendations to the court. Given what you've posted, I would imagine that the GAL would recommend that your son be given limited (and supervised) contact with his father. That would give you a neutral third party to "blame" instead of having your ex accuse you of trying to keep his son from him... I applied through Family Services last September when we were still married, but then it got tabled when he was put in jail and was no longer receiving unemployment. They just called me last week to clarify a few things and tell me that they didn't think his preschool would count as daycare costs. I don't see why not, but whatever, and I let them know that he was getting unemployment again which they didn't know. However, if they don't reinstate the EU, then it will be done in 3 weeks and it will all get thrown aside again until he gets a job and since his plan now is to start his own business, I'm going to take the occasional $200 for smuggling a cell phone. Diagnosis is bipolar and severe depressive disorder and anxiety. He was also being treated for ADHD in the past, but they think all the Adderal triggered the bipolar and took him off of it.
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swasat
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Post by swasat on Mar 20, 2014 9:38:39 GMT -5
He's going to KEEP leveling up unless you TELL THEM he's breaking rules, and showing that he's not ok. He's manipulating them just like he's still manupliating you. And you're letting him get away with it. I know it's hard, but you really need to tell them about the phone and the treatment you're getting from him. I don't think he's as well as they think he is. All the calls he makes to me are from the office where they listen in, so they know what he's saying. This is going to make some of you flip out, but I don't know that he's really treating me badly, he just wants to see his son and I'm the one saying no all the time, to him for no apparent reason except to be a bitch. NO. Good heavens NO. You are doing all this to PROTECT your son. He hasn't been showing any good fatherhood qualities off late. Keeping contact with the kid does not make a good father. YOU are being responsible and a good mother by trying to keep negative influences away from you son. Once you Ex gets his shit together you can also stop being the bitch. Till then, you DS should be the first and foremost in your mind.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2014 9:38:55 GMT -5
It's not your fault that he is mentally ill. It's not anyone's. But he is.
If safeguarding your kids against someone who is mentally unstable makes you a bitch then own being a bitch. My first priority would be to my children and their safety. And I would not give a flying fuck what XH wants.
He's already fucked with your head. Do you want to be the one who ALLOWS him to mess with your son's too? It's sad that he needs to be protected from his Dad. But he does. At least for now. And you are the one who needs to do it.
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