workpublic
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Post by workpublic on Dec 9, 2013 15:49:00 GMT -5
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Dec 9, 2013 16:04:35 GMT -5
While I support a business's right to decide it's clientele I do not understand being dumb enough to voice out loud you refuse to bake the cake because they're gay when you live in a state that has a law saying you can't do that. You just declared open season on yourself.
Just say you're booked solid. They might figure out what's going on but you have deniability.
As far as the ruling I do think it's stupid and a hollow victory. There should be a consequence (maybe a fine?) for breaking the law but I don't think forcing them to bake a cake really solves anything.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Dec 9, 2013 16:09:09 GMT -5
Do you really want to force someone to make you food that doesn't want to? Loogie covered wedding cake, anyone? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2013 16:10:33 GMT -5
I wonder if prostitutes at the Bunny ranch could be forced to have gay sex. I mean if you offer straight sex you can't discriminate against gay sex, right? |
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Malarky
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Post by Malarky on Dec 9, 2013 16:14:16 GMT -5
Do you really want to force someone to make you food that doesn't want to? Loogie covered wedding cake, anyone? If you force me to make your cake, I assure you that you won't want to eat the result. It wouldn't contain any non food items, but you won't like the flavor. Baking is chemistry.  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2013 16:16:27 GMT -5
It's a bit of a hollow victory for gay people. Do you really want to force someone to make you food that doesn't want to? If it were me, I would rather know upfront that they didn't want my business. Wouldn't you want to patronize places that wanted your business and support your ideals? Truthfully I have very little to comment on the actual issue. ETA: maybe ideals isn't the right word to use. Lifestyle maybe? you havent been paying attention same case as the washington/oregon one only this time being threatened with fines so far (not closure) and no....the lgbt groups dont like the word "no" |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2013 16:18:09 GMT -5
Do you really want to force someone to make you food that doesn't want to? Loogie covered wedding cake, anyone? the chocolate pie in "the help" all kinds of mean spirited ways of getting back at the couple |
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 9, 2013 16:33:20 GMT -5
It's a bit of a hollow victory for gay people. Do you really want to force someone to make you food that doesn't want to? If it were me, I would rather know upfront that they didn't want my business. Wouldn't you want to patronize places that wanted your business and support your ideals? Truthfully I have very little to comment on the actual issue. ETA: maybe ideals isn't the right word to use. Lifestyle maybe? It is not a victory (great or hollow) for gay people. It is a victory (if one must use the word) for the non-discrimination laws of Colorado.
My guess is gay people would not use the services of the bakery in question after the rejection.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Dec 9, 2013 16:34:17 GMT -5
Under the sole proprietorship, you and your business are viewed as one in the same. Therefore, you have unlimited personal liability for all of the debts and legal liabilities of your sole proprietorship. Your personal assets, such as your home or personal bank account, could be at risk to satisfy unpaid debts, legal judgments, and other legal obligations of your start-up. On the other hand, an LLC is a separate legal entity ... www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/sole-proprietorships-vs-llcs.html If the bakery is a sole proprietorship, I disagree with the ruling. If it is an LLC, I agree with the ruling. Business people should not be allowed the advantages of an LLC and then be able to claim that they are the business. |
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 9, 2013 16:41:43 GMT -5
Loogie covered wedding cake, anyone? the chocolate pie in "the help" all kinds of mean spirited ways of getting back at the couple And just think about the police investigation and forensic food analysis of the foul-tasting cake. Why the baker(y) could be doing some serious hard time. |
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Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Dec 9, 2013 16:43:48 GMT -5
HELLO, I would stay ten miles from any business that done that to me. Some things just are not worth the damn headache, they need to find another baker.
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workpublic
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Post by workpublic on Dec 9, 2013 16:44:57 GMT -5
imho this wasn't about the cake. it was about activism, the ACLU and a test case.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 9, 2013 16:45:23 GMT -5
HELLO, I would stay ten miles from any business that done that to me. Some things just are not worth the damn headache, they need to find another baker.
They did.  |
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 9, 2013 16:47:26 GMT -5
imho this wasn't about the cake. it was about activism, the ACLU and a test case. Are you saying these two guys (I think it was two guys) went to this bakery knowing they would be refused? Keep in mind, this couple got nothing out of this financially. The state of Colorado went after the bakery-not the couple. |
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workpublic
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Post by workpublic on Dec 9, 2013 16:48:56 GMT -5
the colorado couple filed the lawsuit/complaint not the state
When Phillips refused, the pair went to the American Civil Liberties Union, which filed a complaint with the Colorado Civil Rights Commission (CCRC) on their behalf.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 9, 2013 16:51:49 GMT -5
the colorado couple filed the lawsuit not the state No. Read your own link. The state charged the bakery.
ETA-nice backtracking. |
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 9, 2013 16:52:38 GMT -5
the colorado couple filed the lawsuit/complaint not the state When Phillips refused, the pair went to the American Civil Liberties Union, which filed a complaint with the Colorado Civil Rights Commission (CCRC) on their behalf. A complaint is not a lawsuit. |
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workpublic
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Post by workpublic on Dec 9, 2013 16:52:41 GMT -5
how did the state know to charge them?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 9, 2013 16:54:57 GMT -5
how did the state know to charge them? The ACLU filed the complaint. The ACLU did not file a lawsuit. What is it you don't understand?
You can file a complaint with the Labor Department about unfair labor practices. Is that a lawsuit against your employer?
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Dec 9, 2013 17:01:55 GMT -5
I am sure Brown v. Board of Education made some people giddy and some livid too. |
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jkapp
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Post by jkapp on Dec 9, 2013 18:33:01 GMT -5
Loogie covered wedding cake, anyone? If you force me to make your cake, I assure you that you won't want to eat the result. It wouldn't contain any non food items, but you won't like the flavor. Baking is chemistry. LOL! Yes, they would get my patented yellow frosting...don't mind the ammonia smell  |
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 9, 2013 19:18:00 GMT -5
Loogie covered wedding cake, anyone? If you force me to make your cake, I assure you that you won't want to eat the result. It wouldn't contain any non food items, but you won't like the flavor. Baking is chemistry. I said the same in the other thread about the other bakery. Oopsie, did I forget the sugar? Silly me ...no charge, of course ;-) |
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Dec 9, 2013 19:18:06 GMT -5
Forcing others to accept your choices doesnt make it any better. I'm quite sure there are gay bakers as well as bakers who don't give a rats rear who you screw as long as your money's green. Go to one of them.
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EVT1
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Post by EVT1 on Dec 10, 2013 0:25:34 GMT -5
That is what it boils down to- I doubt any gay people will give them business. But that is not the point is it? Can't hang a sign saying no gays, no blacks, etc. They deserve the ruling.
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ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ
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Post by ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ on Dec 10, 2013 0:37:42 GMT -5
Forcing others to accept your choices doesnt make it any better. I'm quite sure there are gay bakers as well as bakers who don't give a rats rear who you screw as long as your money's green. Go to one of them.
If they're smart, they'll snub this baker (while giving them the middle-finger salute) and take their wedding cake order to another baker who's in the business of actually building cakes - not judging people on their lifestyle..
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 10, 2013 6:10:10 GMT -5
That is what it boils down to- I doubt any gay people will give them business. But that is not the point is it? Can't hang a sign saying no gays, no blacks, etc. They deserve the ruling. What is the point then? Do you think this name or anyone like him will suddenly welcome the gays wih open arms? Nope...they will just get smarter and make up lame excuses as to how they are overbooked. He doesn't want to make the cake...move in and find someone who will. I don't see the big deal. |
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marvholly
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Post by marvholly on Dec 10, 2013 6:44:30 GMT -5
Quote: It's a bit of a hollow victory for gay people.
Do you really want to force someone to make you food that doesn't want to? If it were me, I would rather know upfront that they didn't want my business.
Exactly. Who knows what 'extra' ingredient (spit? cayanne?) might get 'accidently' included.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 10, 2013 7:26:11 GMT -5
Quote: It's a bit of a hollow victory for gay people. Do you really want to force someone to make you food that doesn't want to? If it were me, I would rather know upfront that they didn't want my business. Exactly. Who knows what 'extra' ingredient (spit? cayanne?) might get 'accidently' included. Exactly...let me preface my next statement with the fact that I am a business person and one person's money is as good as the next, regardless of whether I agree with whatever the hell they are doing. But, if there was something that I was deadset against and just couldn't bring myself to do business with them, I would be pissed as hell that I would be forced to do business with them. I would NEVER put any non food ingredients into the cake (that would deserve to have charges filed) but I would totally fuck up their cake. Whether I forgot the sugar or completely fucked up the design, I WOULD fuck it up. Shit happens |
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Dec 10, 2013 8:01:47 GMT -5
Yes, they did force the baker to bake gays a cake by bringing a lawsuit. They won but what did they really win? A hollow victory. My mom is right, forcing others to accept your lifestyle means you aren't comfortable with it yourself. Always have to "prove" something. Well, you surely showed that baker, huh? Showing the baker with your business and other like minded individuals taking their business elsewhere is the way to do it. They aren't the only baker in town.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Dec 10, 2013 8:36:06 GMT -5
Well, it is a clear call to business. Find other ways to turn down the business. Perhaps by being too "busy" or something. People who don't want to do something will find ways not to do it.
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