doxieluvr
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Post by doxieluvr on Apr 23, 2013 8:14:52 GMT -5
" Well - for everyone who thinks enough is not being done to help, put your money where your mouth is - that's right - reach into your pocket - pull out 10-20% more your gross pay (in addition to whatever taxes you pay now) and find some underserved parent and offer to pay for their daycare and to feed and cloth their child. This would be a great solution if only we had enough people willing to adopt a needy family. Who oversees to make sure everyone in need has food and shelter?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:18:02 GMT -5
So much this... A few months ago my dd came home from schools spouting off that her liberal ass teacher told her that it was our responsibility to take care of those "less fortunate" (ie, don't want to pull themselves up by the boostraps and do what needs to be done). Instead of getting angry (well, I was that her teacher had the nerve to try to brainwash my child) I told her that if her heart truly believes that, then she has to put her money where her mouth is. She gets $100 a month allowance so I told her that on the first of the month I would give her $70 and I would give the other $30 to children who were less fortunate than she. She suddenly joined the republican party when she thought of it coming directly out of her pocket and went from "it is our responsibility" to "tell them to get jobs"!lol So, your daughter thinks children should get jobs so they can eat and have heat, etc. as long as she doesn't have to give up a portion of her discretionary spending... Which I assume she works for... Right? Yeah, proud moment there... Sorry, but this really kind of pisses me off...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:20:36 GMT -5
I think it's extremely short-sighted to say that all impoverished people (including their children) should languish in the streets. Who knows what potential these children have that would be wasted. And yes, it would be freakin' FANTASTIC if people waited until they could afford kids to have them. Here's an idea - let's teach abstinence! That's always worked so well in the past. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/rolleyes2.gif) The truth is, people don't. Accidents happen, mistakes are made. We hope that people will get responsible and take care of themselves and their own, but they don't always do. And unless you want to take the children away from every person on welfare (and put them where, now?), IMO we need some type of temporary assistance for those families - if nothing than to make sure the children are getting the care they need.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:22:52 GMT -5
Apparently personal responsibility is out the window. 1. Everyone has the right to breed, regardless of the ability to support such asserted rights 2. Everyone has the right to have children, regardless of how rotten a job they do parenting (we don't want to start down that slipperly slope now do we?) 3. Everyone has the right to expect their choices to be subsidized by those who chose to wait or limit the number of kids they have until they could support them
And if you DARE to challenge any of the above assertions you are:
Those are not the assertions I operate under. I think every child has aright to have their basic, safety, security needs met, regardless of the ability of their parents to provide them. every child has the certain unalienable rights and should have he same basic opportunities, regardless of how rotten. Job their parents do. subsidizing our nation's youth can only benefit our nation. And I do spend more than 10-20% of my gross on helping others, both here and abroad.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Apr 23, 2013 8:25:17 GMT -5
So much this... A few months ago my dd came home from schools spouting off that her liberal ass teacher told her that it was our responsibility to take care of those "less fortunate" (ie, don't want to pull themselves up by the boostraps and do what needs to be done). Instead of getting angry (well, I was that her teacher had the nerve to try to brainwash my child) I told her that if her heart truly believes that, then she has to put her money where her mouth is. She gets $100 a month allowance so I told her that on the first of the month I would give her $70 and I would give the other $30 to children who were less fortunate than she. She suddenly joined the republican party when she thought of it coming directly out of her pocket and went from "it is our responsibility" to "tell them to get jobs"!lol So, your daughter thinks children should get jobs so they can eat and have heat, etc. as long as she doesn't have to give up a portion of her discretionary spending... Which I assume she works for... Right? Yeah, proud moment there... Sorry, but this really kind of pisses me off... Actually she said their parents should get jobs...and my dd does chores for her allowance so yeah, she actually does work. I'm ok with you being pissed off at my expectation that people support themselves...you are liberal, I'd be worried if you agreed with something I said ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/wink.png)
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Queen of Interesting Nuts
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"In the end, we remember not the words of our enemies but the silence of our friends"
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Post by Queen of Interesting Nuts on Apr 23, 2013 8:26:51 GMT -5
I am just waiting for mutt to head down here cos she said we could flog her, I like to "flog" ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/wink.png)
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Apr 23, 2013 8:26:59 GMT -5
I think it's extremely short-sighted to say that all impoverished people (including their children) should languish in the streets. Who knows what potential these children have that would be wasted. And yes, it would be freakin' FANTASTIC if people waited until they could afford kids to have them. Here's an idea - let's teach abstinence! That's always worked so well in the past. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/rolleyes2.gif) The truth is, people don't. Accidents happen, mistakes are made. We hope that people will get responsible and take care of themselves and their own, but they don't always do. And unless you want to take the children away from every person on welfare (and put them where, now?), IMO we need some type of temporary assistance for those families - if nothing than to make sure the children are getting the care they need. I'm a conservative but I don't believe in teaching abstinence because it doesn't work. I do believe that women should be given teh Depo shot if they are receiving government benefits. If you can't support the kids you have, you shouldn't have the right to pop out more.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:29:24 GMT -5
I just worry about your daughter. I hope she never falls on a time when she might need a service not provided by you, or which she can't earn outright for herself.
You do know that the majority of people who get support actually have jobs, right?
You know that no where near 30% of your income goes to social services you hate, right, that in fact the programs people love to hate amount to pretty much the late factor in our budget...
Im actually not 'liberal'. But if it makes you feel better, go right head.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:30:24 GMT -5
I think it's extremely short-sighted to say that all impoverished people (including their children) should languish in the streets. Who knows what potential these children have that would be wasted. And yes, it would be freakin' FANTASTIC if people waited until they could afford kids to have them. Here's an idea - let's teach abstinence! That's always worked so well in the past. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/rolleyes2.gif) The truth is, people don't. Accidents happen, mistakes are made. We hope that people will get responsible and take care of themselves and their own, but they don't always do. And unless you want to take the children away from every person on welfare (and put them where, now?), IMO we need some type of temporary assistance for those families - if nothing than to make sure the children are getting the care they need. I'm a conservative but I don't believe in teaching abstinence because it doesn't work. I do believe that women should be given teh Depo shot if they are receiving government benefits. If you can't support the kids you have, you shouldn't have the right to pop out more. I would be 100% in favor of this. I would NOT be in favor of tubal ligation for them though.
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Apr 23, 2013 8:30:38 GMT -5
::We hope that people will get responsible and take care of themselves and their own, but they don't always do.::
Apparently a slim majority of those with schoolage children don't agree with you. In addition, providing free education and food is not enough, we are now supposed to subsidize daycare even more than we presently are according to some posters.
Education I agree with 100% as it is in the best interest of our society to have as well educated a population as possible. It's a shame approximately 25% of those receiving those benefits choose not to take full advantage of them. However, that's ok because even if they can't support their families, the rest of us will.
::IMO we need some type of temporary assistance for those families ::
Agreed 100%.
Now define temporary...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:32:18 GMT -5
I think we should have pay for tubals.
what 'welfare' would depo go with? EITC? Subsidized CHIP? Food stamps? WIC?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:36:26 GMT -5
well, I would love to see some cooking/life skills/parenting/"the importance of education" classes as a requirement for accepting food stamps/welfare. Skip any class and your benefits are terminated. I also think there should be a 5 year maximum where you are allowed to collect. Women MUST receive BC shot upon first receipt of benefits. Food stamps shouldn't allow processed garbage and should allow paper goods (TP, feminine products).
That's all I can think of for now.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:38:30 GMT -5
We already have program in place to help the needy that need a helping hand.
We already have assistance in place.
My issue is we feel that we need more, more and more. So where does it stop?
Here is a few we already have: - low income housing - reduce rent - EBT - WIC - Headstart - Job assistance / training - and for MA we have free daycare or reduced daycare
How much more money do we want to throw at the problem instead of trying to fix the issue we have in our hands now? Just throw more money at it hoping it will magically fix itself.
In my building some neighbors are paying $850 for the same apartment that I am paying $1,375 for.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:39:51 GMT -5
throwing money at it is actually easier and cheaper than addressing the real issues.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:40:58 GMT -5
What is/are the real issue(s)?
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doxieluvr
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Post by doxieluvr on Apr 23, 2013 8:52:08 GMT -5
I'm a conservative but I don't believe in teaching abstinence because it doesn't work. I do believe that women should be given teh Depo shot if they are receiving government benefits. If you can't support the kids you have, you shouldn't have the right to pop out more. I would be 100% in favor of this. I would NOT be in favor of tubal ligation for them though. Depo has some unfavorable health risks. An iud would be a realistic alternative.
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doxieluvr
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Post by doxieluvr on Apr 23, 2013 8:53:59 GMT -5
I posted a very real and common scenario and not one person addressed it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:55:57 GMT -5
I posted a very real and common scenario and not one person addressed it. Maybe everyone has blocked you?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:57:04 GMT -5
I posted a very real and common scenario and not one person addressed it. Maybe everyone has blocked you? Would seem unlikely given that most threads that Doxie start become double digit pages long within hours.
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doxieluvr
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Post by doxieluvr on Apr 23, 2013 8:59:12 GMT -5
I posted a very real and common scenario and not one person addressed it. Maybe everyone has blocked you? Nah, I am pretty sure it is because most want to believe that low income single moms do not exist and therefore do not need assistance. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/wink.png)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 8:59:44 GMT -5
This is the real problem. "I priced daycare last week. For an in home daycare it is $185 a week for a 2 1/2 year old. It drops to $175 once he turns three. I bring home roughly $450 -$500 a week working. As a single mom in MD it would take every bit of $350, if not $400 a week to have a roof over your head and utilities. At that point a single mom would have to have food stamps for food. Hope and pray they could find daycare for $100 a week and save the EITC to pay for gas and auto insurance for a car that they own free and clear. No idea where clothes and shoes, birthdays and christmas would come from." until you can offer a real solution your always going to have a need for welfare. Your real problem? In MA that mother would qualify for - reduce rent - EBT and WIC - free or reduce daycare - financial aid to go to school and a better job later on - a NICE/FAT tax refund at tax time Again, we have programs out there already that are set up for situations like this, give the person a helping hand and getting out of poverty. My problem is when people start acting as if in America there is no safety net or programs in place to do just that, and we need to spend more money (where are we going to get it) or throw more money at the issue.
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doxieluvr
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Post by doxieluvr on Apr 23, 2013 9:03:20 GMT -5
This is the real problem. "I priced daycare last week. For an in home daycare it is $185 a week for a 2 1/2 year old. It drops to $175 once he turns three. I bring home roughly $450 -$500 a week working. As a single mom in MD it would take every bit of $350, if not $400 a week to have a roof over your head and utilities. At that point a single mom would have to have food stamps for food. Hope and pray they could find daycare for $100 a week and save the EITC to pay for gas and auto insurance for a car that they own free and clear. No idea where clothes and shoes, birthdays and christmas would come from." until you can offer a real solution your always going to have a need for welfare. Your real problem? In MA that mother would qualify for - reduce rent - EBT and WIC - free or reduce daycare - financial aid to go to school and a better job later on - a NICE/FAT tax refund at tax time Again, we have programs out there already that are set up for situations like this, give the person a helping hand and getting out of poverty. My problem is when people start acting as if in America there is no safety net or programs in place to do just that, and we need to spend more money (where are we going to get it) or throw more money at the issue. Just because it says so on your state website does not make it true. sure MD says they offer all that but the reality is that the programs have long waiting lists or currently froze due to lack of funding. Now what? I posted a very real scenario. What should that mother do?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 9:03:58 GMT -5
. My problem is when people start acting as if in America there is no safety net or programs in place to do just that, and we need to spend more money (where are we going to get it) or throw more money at the issue. Who said this?
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doxieluvr
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Post by doxieluvr on Apr 23, 2013 9:04:58 GMT -5
And Carl, yes it would very much be my problem if dh died or rolled out.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 9:07:14 GMT -5
What is/are the real issue(s)? we are battling an attitude/mentality which in a lot of cases is multi-generational. I know for poor urban blacks there is an added element of the almost expectation to not do well for yourself - to the point of ridiculing/ostracising people who try.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 9:08:44 GMT -5
SO the real issue is that blacks are lazy?
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Apr 23, 2013 9:10:38 GMT -5
What is/are the real issue(s)? we are battling an attitude/mentality which in a lot of cases is multi-generational. I know for poor urban blacks there is an added element of the almost expectation to not do well for yourself - to the point of ridiculing/ostracising people who try. How do we fix that?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 9:11:44 GMT -5
Your real problem? In MA that mother would qualify for - reduce rent - EBT and WIC - free or reduce daycare - financial aid to go to school and a better job later on - a NICE/FAT tax refund at tax time Again, we have programs out there already that are set up for situations like this, give the person a helping hand and getting out of poverty. My problem is when people start acting as if in America there is no safety net or programs in place to do just that, and we need to spend more money (where are we going to get it) or throw more money at the issue. Just because it says so on your state website does not make it true. sure MD says they offer all that but the reality is that the programs have long waiting lists or currently froze due to lack of funding. Now what? I posted a very real scenario. What should that mother do? Get herself a boy toy and send him off to work 70 hours a week? ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/angel2.png)
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doxieluvr
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Post by doxieluvr on Apr 23, 2013 9:12:18 GMT -5
What is/are the real issue(s)? we are battling an attitude/mentality which in a lot of cases is multi-generational. I know for poor urban blacks there is an added element of the almost expectation to not do well for yourself - to the point of ridiculing/ostracising people who try. Well this is not common amongst the rural single moms. In my area, they have full time jobs but not enough income, even with college degrees. So it is not necessarily an education issue.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2013 9:12:36 GMT -5
Your real problem? In MA that mother would qualify for - reduce rent - EBT and WIC - free or reduce daycare - financial aid to go to school and a better job later on - a NICE/FAT tax refund at tax time Again, we have programs out there already that are set up for situations like this, give the person a helping hand and getting out of poverty. My problem is when people start acting as if in America there is no safety net or programs in place to do just that, and we need to spend more money (where are we going to get it) or throw more money at the issue. Just because it says so on your state website does not make it true. sure MD says they offer all that but the reality is that the programs have long waiting lists or currently froze due to lack of funding. Now what? I posted a very real scenario. What should that mother do? No I know so because I am living 2 doors down from a real life case. They have a 2 year old, pregnant with #2 due in August. They pay $850 rent vs my $1,375, get vouchers for their daycare which would have been $400/week if they had to pay and she gets WIC. Why? Because she has been living with her boyfriend/fiancée and not "married". So she gets to not have to claim his 37k/year salary. Yes I can report them but what good would that do? Why do you think baby daddy and baby mama is so predominant in low income families? It is more advantageous for them to remain unmarried vs married.
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