I got a situation....

[Deleted]

I haven't been posting much lately, but I miss you all and I need some insight. I started to post this sometime last year, but I don't think I did. If I did and just can't find it, clearly the situation has not improved, and I apologize for the repeat.


My BF (I hate referring to him as that btw) and I still maintain 2 households even though we've wanted to live together for the last couple of years, either at my house or buy another house. We go back and forth between my place and his. We haven't moved yet mostly because of his teenage daughters. They are very territorial about him. He and his ex-wife (their Mom) broke up about 6 years ago. We met a couple years later, it was well over a year after that before I met his children.


I've always been mindful of giving them time with just the 3 of them, which is easy for now, since his apartment is more convenient for his time with them location-wise and I have a house I can stay at. Most weekends that they're with him, I'm at my house. When they come over on random days outside of the visitation schedule (they're always welcome regardless of the schedule), I'm usually there. When they stay for days or weeks, I don't usually stay the whole time. 



He and I have 1 day a week that we're both off work. His ex-wife assigned him that day to pick their daughters up from school. Since that's the only day we get to have the whole day together if we want, and we usually want, sometimes I'm with him when he picks them up from school. He pretty much does the same thing whether I'm with him or not, pick them up, get them something to eat, drop them off at home. 



Sooooo, if I'm in the car when he picks them up, they get an attitude with him. Even if I wasn't there the last 2 or 3 times. If I don't go home on a weekend, at some point, he hears about how I'm "always there" when they come over even though I'm honestly usually not. I went on a business trip last year and he tagged along, that was a problem because they didn't know why he "had" to go with me.



I don't take any of this personally, I believe it would be the same thing with any woman he was with. They're never mean or disrespectful to me, they direct their anger solely at him. But it's been going on for at least a year now, and its wearing on him. I don't want our relationship to ruin their relationships. Sometimes I feel so bad for him that I think maybe I should just bow out gracefully. But that would make both of us unhappy.



They butt heads regularly on some other things too, but those things have nothing to do with me that I can tell. Basically, he pays child support regularly and on time (an amount that's more than his rent and he doesn't live in a shabby apartment), and he tries to give them what they ask for beyond that. Clothes, shoes, hair done, nails done, school stuff, random stuff, money, if they ask or he knows they need it and he can do it, he does it. But it's one or both asking for something at LEAST once a week and not 5 or 10 dollars. The youngest is currently upset because he gave her $100 for a school trip, then 2 days later she asked for $40 to hang out with her friends and he didn't give it to her. Things like that. But that's another story.



Anyway, I don't know what needs to happen here. I love him and we're a good team, but I seriously dont want to cause issues between him and his children. Also, I'm kind of in limbo with the housing situation because I need to make some decisions about my house and they depend on whether it's still going to be my forever house as I originally planned, and I can't stay in limbo until the kids are adults. I need insight and opinions, please.

[MJ2.0]

Hey!  Fancy seeing you here!

Without knowing anything other than what you've said.....The first thing you should do is communicate your feelings to BF, if you haven't already done so.  After that, ask him how he feels and how he plans to address the disrespect.  This is really on him to handle.  Their his kids and he should be able to tell them to cut out the attitude.  A talk with the ex wouldn't hurt if it can be done maturely/productively.  If the girls are unable/unwilling to be better, your choices are to either just take it or make yourself scarce/leave.

Again, I don't know if there is anything else going on behind the scenes that may be causing the girls to act out.  I remember hating that my mom was dating after my parents divorced, but it was infinitely better than my dad keeping me in the dark about his relationship for years and then sending me a wedding invitation.

I'm sorry - this just sucks.

[swamp]

I don't have any words of advice for you, but I'm very happy to hear from you. 

I guess i would move on with the relationship and continue to welcome the kids into the house, and sometimes when they are there, I'd make myself scarce.    And I wouldn't go on many outings with the kids, and just have it a dad and kids moment.  I would be sure to make every school/extracurricular event and paste a smile on my face, even if i hated it. 

I can tell you though, that some friends went through something like this with the guy's teens.   My friend did marry him and move in with him, and the kids weren't very nice to either of them.  They both just kind of took the attitude and realized it wasn't about them, but did set boundaries on how far they could go with the attitude.     He was always there for them, though.

Now that the kids are grown, he has a great relationship with them, as does his wife.    They are very active grandparents to the daughter's son.  The kids are noted that "dad was always there for us." 

Good luck.  

[Tennesseer]

Out of curiosity, PC, how old are the daughters?

[billisonboard]

Feb 26, 2018 10:13:55 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

... teenage daughters. ...
...

... they get an attitude with him. ...


I don't take any of this personally, I believe it would be the same thing with any woman he was with. ...

They butt heads regularly on some other things too, ...

... I need insight and opinions, please.

I would opine that it would be close to the same with any other woman, even if he was still with their Mother. Sounds like you are measuring against some picture perfect world and reality is coming up short

[andi9899]

Have you tried to do stuff with them without him? Maybe do a girls day or something. During this day, none of this turmoil is to be mentioned. Just go have fun. Might help with the attitude you get from them. As far as how to deal with them outside of this, I agree 100% with MJ.

[Deleted]

MJ2.0, heyyyy!   The girls aren't disrespectful to me. They're always polite to me, as I am to them. I mostly try to stay in my lane, because I agree that he has to handle the situation.

I think he and the ex -wife are beyond being able to talk productively. She tells him (and he's started to believe, their daughters) that he's basically a shitty Dad who does nothing for his children. Now idk if y'all remember, but I'm hard on deadbeat parents and I'm not defending him just because I like him. I'm there, I hear the conversations, I see the texts where he chit chats with them daily, tells them goodnight and that he loves them, I hear him say yes and watch him make arrangements to get them there and be able to be home when they ask if they can come over, I see him take off work if necessary to take them to Dr. appointments or talk to their teachers, I see the child support and family medical, dental and vision insurance coming out of his paychecks, I see him taking them fun places and out to eat, I see him stock up on food and snacks they like before they come over and cook breakfast and dinner for them, I see him watch movies, have Uno marathons, and go for walks with them, I see him buy them things and give them money. What is all that if he doesn't do anything?

I've also heard the recording he gets when he tries to call her, trying to coparent, and I've heard her play dumb and pretend his calls aren't blocked when he asks her WHY. His calls are STILL blocked, he has to text her if it's important and she may or may not respond, but she can call him. I saw the texts when she embarrassed her teenage daughters by refusing to let them take any clothes when they went to spend the weekend with him. She was mad about money and determined to make him spend some and he did because he bought them some clothes so they wouldn't have to wear the same ones every day they were with him. And he had to run out again and buy school uniforms because she was unavailable for them to come home that Sunday like they were suppose to.

All that to say, talking to her about it won't work. I use to try to give her the benefit of the doubt. But I stopped after the clothing stunt. Who does that to their kids when they are old enough to know and be embarrassed?

whew, that was long, but I don't talk about any of this with anybody IRL. Guess I'm venting lol. Sorry.

[Deleted]

swamp, thank you! I'm happy to be chatting with y'all again.

I dont expect things to be easy, but if it turns out like your friends, everybody gets through it and all is well in the end, I'll take it!

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2018 10:34:55 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Out of curiosity, PC, how old are the daughters?

Almost 16 and the youngest turns 14 later this year.

[swamp]

Feb 26, 2018 11:18:50 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

MJ2.0 , heyyyy!   The girls aren't disrespectful to me. They're always polite to me, as I am to them. I mostly try to stay in my lane, because I agree that he has to handle the situation.

I think he and the ex -wife are beyond being able to talk productively. She tells him (and he's started to believe, their daughters) that he's basically a shitty Dad who does nothing for his children. Now idk if y'all remember, but I'm hard on deadbeat parents and I'm not defending him just because I like him. I'm there, I hear the conversations, I see the texts where he chit chats with them daily, tells them goodnight and that he loves them, I hear him say yes and watch him make arrangements to get them there and be able to be home when they ask if they can come over, I see him take off work if necessary to take them to Dr. appointments or talk to their teachers, I see the child support and family medical, dental and vision insurance coming out of his paychecks, I see him taking them fun places and out to eat, I see him stock up on food and snacks they like before they come over and cook breakfast and dinner for them, I see him watch movies, have Uno marathons, and go for walks with them, I see him buy them things and give them money. What is all that if he doesn't do anything?

I've also heard the recording he gets when he tries to call her, trying to coparent, and I've heard her play dumb and pretend his calls aren't blocked when he asks her WHY. His calls are STILL blocked, he has to text her if it's important and she may or may not respond, but she can call him. I saw the texts when she embarrassed her teenage daughters by refusing to let them take any clothes when they went to spend the weekend with him. She was mad about money and determined to make him spend some and he did because he bought them some clothes so they wouldn't have to wear the same ones every day they were with him. And he had to run out again and buy school uniforms because she was unavailable for them to come home that Sunday like they were suppose to.

All that to say, talking to her about it won't work. I use to try to give her the benefit of the doubt. But I stopped after the clothing stunt. Who does that to their kids when they are old enough to know and be embarrassed?

whew, that was long, but I don't talk about any of this with anybody IRL. Guess I'm venting lol. Sorry.

I don't know if this will make you feel better,  but my friends had a similar situation with the mother of her children.  she continually dragged him back to court for more child support and brought DD with her to court.  He was paying the full 25% per the law, by direct deduction out of his paycheck, he paid the medical insurance, he paid all the medical bills, he bought all the "extras" for sports and extracuriculars, he took them on vacation, out to eat, etc.  He didn't miss a school activity. When DS got in trouble, he paid for the lawyer and rehab.    When DD wanted a car when she was 16, mom told kid that it was new wife's fault she didn't have one. 

As you can imagine, it was often ugly.   

The kids now get it.  

[MJ2.0]

Feb 26, 2018 11:18:50 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

MJ2.0 , heyyyy!   The girls aren't disrespectful to me. They're always polite to me, as I am to them. I mostly try to stay in my lane, because I agree that he has to handle the situation.

I think he and the ex -wife are beyond being able to talk productively. She tells him (and he's started to believe, their daughters) that he's basically a shitty Dad who does nothing for his children. Now idk if y'all remember, but I'm hard on deadbeat parents and I'm not defending him just because I like him. I'm there, I hear the conversations, I see the texts where he chit chats with them daily, tells them goodnight and that he loves them, I hear him say yes and watch him make arrangements to get them there and be able to be home when they ask if they can come over, I see him take off work if necessary to take them to Dr. appointments or talk to their teachers, I see the child support and family medical, dental and vision insurance coming out of his paychecks, I see him taking them fun places and out to eat, I see him stock up on food and snacks they like before they come over and cook breakfast and dinner for them, I see him watch movies, have Uno marathons, and go for walks with them, I see him buy them things and give them money. What is all that if he doesn't do anything?

I've also heard the recording he gets when he tries to call her, trying to coparent, and I've heard her play dumb and pretend his calls aren't blocked when he asks her WHY. His calls are STILL blocked, he has to text her if it's important and she may or may not respond, but she can call him. I saw the texts when she embarrassed her teenage daughters by refusing to let them take any clothes when they went to spend the weekend with him. She was mad about money and determined to make him spend some and he did because he bought them some clothes so they wouldn't have to wear the same ones every day they were with him. And he had to run out again and buy school uniforms because she was unavailable for them to come home that Sunday like they were suppose to.

All that to say, talking to her about it won't work. I use to try to give her the benefit of the doubt. But I stopped after the clothing stunt. Who does that to their kids when they are old enough to know and be embarrassed?

whew, that was long, but I don't talk about any of this with anybody IRL. Guess I'm venting lol. Sorry.

maybe the girls just get an attitude with him regardless of if you're there or not.  Sounds like Mom is making things a lot worse than they need to be.  That's sad, and I'm sure the girls will remember all that when it comes to choosing a nursing home for her.

[Tennesseer]

Feb 26, 2018 11:23:07 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Feb 26, 2018 10:34:55 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Out of curiosity, PC, how old are the daughters?

Almost 16 and the youngest turns 14 later this year.

Thanks. I ask because the 16 year old is getting to be old enough to know the score as to what is really going on around her without even being told: parental (mother) mind games. The 14 year old in another year or two will figure it out too.

[andi9899]

Feb 26, 2018 11:36:20 GMT -5 MJ2.0 said:

Feb 26, 2018 11:18:50 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

MJ2.0 , heyyyy!   The girls aren't disrespectful to me. They're always polite to me, as I am to them. I mostly try to stay in my lane, because I agree that he has to handle the situation.

I think he and the ex -wife are beyond being able to talk productively. She tells him (and he's started to believe, their daughters) that he's basically a shitty Dad who does nothing for his children. Now idk if y'all remember, but I'm hard on deadbeat parents and I'm not defending him just because I like him. I'm there, I hear the conversations, I see the texts where he chit chats with them daily, tells them goodnight and that he loves them, I hear him say yes and watch him make arrangements to get them there and be able to be home when they ask if they can come over, I see him take off work if necessary to take them to Dr. appointments or talk to their teachers, I see the child support and family medical, dental and vision insurance coming out of his paychecks, I see him taking them fun places and out to eat, I see him stock up on food and snacks they like before they come over and cook breakfast and dinner for them, I see him watch movies, have Uno marathons, and go for walks with them, I see him buy them things and give them money. What is all that if he doesn't do anything?

I've also heard the recording he gets when he tries to call her, trying to coparent, and I've heard her play dumb and pretend his calls aren't blocked when he asks her WHY. His calls are STILL blocked, he has to text her if it's important and she may or may not respond, but she can call him. I saw the texts when she embarrassed her teenage daughters by refusing to let them take any clothes when they went to spend the weekend with him. She was mad about money and determined to make him spend some and he did because he bought them some clothes so they wouldn't have to wear the same ones every day they were with him. And he had to run out again and buy school uniforms because she was unavailable for them to come home that Sunday like they were suppose to.

All that to say, talking to her about it won't work. I use to try to give her the benefit of the doubt. But I stopped after the clothing stunt. Who does that to their kids when they are old enough to know and be embarrassed?

whew, that was long, but I don't talk about any of this with anybody IRL. Guess I'm venting lol. Sorry.

maybe the girls just get an attitude with him regardless of if you're there or not.  Sounds like Mom is making things a lot worse than they need to be.  That's sad, and I'm sure the girls will remember all that when it comes to choosing a nursing home for her.

They will. The girls saw it and as adults choose to have nothing to do with their father. I tried making excuses for him with them and finally just gave up. They got tired of being burned by him and finally just cut off all contact. I never asked for his $225/month (seriously, that's all he's ordered to pay) child support to be increased for fear that he'd show up at my house with the police again and make me hand my kids over for visitation. I don't talk crap about him to the girls even though he did all the time. They get it. They likely won't even attend his funeral when the time comes. Either way it's their choice and I will stay out of it.

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2018 10:59:12 GMT -5 andi9899 said:

Have you tried to do stuff with them without him? Maybe do a girls day or something. During this day, none of this turmoil is to be mentioned. Just go have fun. Might help with the attitude you get from them. As far as how to deal with them outside of this, I agree 100% with MJ.

No, I haven't. I wouldn't mind, but I'm hesitant because of possible backlash from their Mom, for them or him. One day she was bringing them to the apartment, realized I was there and made them go home. Because she "didn't realize they had a babysitter" and she didn't want somebody she didn't know around her kids. 

Never mind that it would've been almost midnight before he got home from work that night. Or that I've been there with them until he got off before. Or that she's had opportunities to meet me and get to know me, she doesn't want to. Or that they're both bigger than me, (the oldest is taller than me AND outweighs me by over 100 lbs) so really, what am I gonna do to them? Or that he would never be ok with somebody treating his kids badly, we all know he's not having that.

Maybe I'm overthinking it, but I feel like while a girls day could be good for bonding, it could potentially cause more problems for him and them. Does that make sense?

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2018 11:36:15 GMT -5 swamp said:

Feb 26, 2018 11:18:50 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

MJ2.0 , heyyyy!   The girls aren't disrespectful to me. They're always polite to me, as I am to them. I mostly try to stay in my lane, because I agree that he has to handle the situation.

I think he and the ex -wife are beyond being able to talk productively. She tells him (and he's started to believe, their daughters) that he's basically a shitty Dad who does nothing for his children. Now idk if y'all remember, but I'm hard on deadbeat parents and I'm not defending him just because I like him. I'm there, I hear the conversations, I see the texts where he chit chats with them daily, tells them goodnight and that he loves them, I hear him say yes and watch him make arrangements to get them there and be able to be home when they ask if they can come over, I see him take off work if necessary to take them to Dr. appointments or talk to their teachers, I see the child support and family medical, dental and vision insurance coming out of his paychecks, I see him taking them fun places and out to eat, I see him stock up on food and snacks they like before they come over and cook breakfast and dinner for them, I see him watch movies, have Uno marathons, and go for walks with them, I see him buy them things and give them money. What is all that if he doesn't do anything?

I've also heard the recording he gets when he tries to call her, trying to coparent, and I've heard her play dumb and pretend his calls aren't blocked when he asks her WHY. His calls are STILL blocked, he has to text her if it's important and she may or may not respond, but she can call him. I saw the texts when she embarrassed her teenage daughters by refusing to let them take any clothes when they went to spend the weekend with him. She was mad about money and determined to make him spend some and he did because he bought them some clothes so they wouldn't have to wear the same ones every day they were with him. And he had to run out again and buy school uniforms because she was unavailable for them to come home that Sunday like they were suppose to.

All that to say, talking to her about it won't work. I use to try to give her the benefit of the doubt. But I stopped after the clothing stunt. Who does that to their kids when they are old enough to know and be embarrassed?

whew, that was long, but I don't talk about any of this with anybody IRL. Guess I'm venting lol. Sorry.

I don't know if this will make you feel better,  but my friends had a similar situation with the mother of her children.  she continually dragged him back to court for more child support and brought DD with her to court.  He was paying the full 25% per the law, by direct deduction out of his paycheck, he paid the medical insurance, he paid all the medical bills, he bought all the "extras" for sports and extracuriculars, he took them on vacation, out to eat, etc.  He didn't miss a school activity. When DS got in trouble, he paid for the lawyer and rehab.    When DD wanted a car when she was 16, mom told kid that it was new wife's fault she didn't have one. 

As you can imagine, it was often ugly.   

The kids now get it.  

Sighhhh.

[hoops902]

Is it possible that the "limbo" is really the problem for everyone here?

This may or may not be their actual perspective...but here's probably how I'd see it if I were them:

Dad and this lady are dating...they aren't living together, they don't see each other all the time. We don't get to see him THAT much...why in the hell would he pick the times that we're supposed to be having daddy/daughter time to have HER around? He can see her ALL THE TIME when we're not there.

Also if I were them...I'd think you didn't like me all that much...which would make me even angrier that dad brings you around during those times.  Your posts don't sound like you particularly care for these kids even though you'd been dating their father at least a few years now. It doesn't sound like you dislike them, just that you're ambivalent about them. You're the adult, if you want a relationship with them...then you probably have to go out of your way to make it happen...even if they resist it.  You don't have to be overbearing...but it sounds like you're actively finding ways to avoid spending time together as a family unit (which is fine if that's what you want...but that paired with then occasionally being around on "their time" is going to be annoying to them). 

The entire thing sounds a lot more like you're some random woman he's dating and insists on bringing you around during their time than a serious relationship. You're not a step-motherly figure...you're just "stealing their time with dad".

Regardless of whether you live together or not...I think it needs to be either more hot or cold...not lukewarm like it is now.  Either daddy/daughter time is theirs...and you're the woman dad dates when the kids aren't around.  Or you take more steps to become some sort of family unit where you're not just some woman intruding on their time, and they aren't just some hurdle to seeing your boyfriend alone more often.  The latter probably requires a lot more effort on your part to become their friend, but no matter how much the kids protest about you making more of an effort...NOBODY wants a tag-along when it's their time to spend with their parent like that.  You have to make yourself more than just a tag-along...or don't actually tag along.

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2018 11:38:22 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Feb 26, 2018 11:23:07 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Almost 16 and the youngest turns 14 later this year.

Thanks. I ask because the 16 year old is getting to be old enough to know the score as to what is really going on around her without even being told: parental (mother) mind games. The 14 year old in another year or two will figure it out too.

Sometimes she sees it, sometimes she doesn't. She definitely saw it with the clothing issue that weekend. 

[hoops902]

Feb 26, 2018 11:58:45 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Feb 26, 2018 10:59:12 GMT -5 andi9899 said:

Have you tried to do stuff with them without him? Maybe do a girls day or something. During this day, none of this turmoil is to be mentioned. Just go have fun. Might help with the attitude you get from them. As far as how to deal with them outside of this, I agree 100% with MJ.

No, I haven't. I wouldn't mind, but I'm hesitant because of possible backlash from their Mom, for them or him. One day she was bringing them to the apartment, realized I was there and made them go home. Because she "didn't realize they had a babysitter" and she didn't want somebody she didn't know around her kids. 

Never mind that it would've been almost midnight before he got home from work that night. Or that I've been there with them until he got off before. Or that she's had opportunities to meet me and get to know me, she doesn't want to. Or that they're both bigger than me, (the oldest is taller than me AND outweighs me by over 100 lbs) so really, what am I gonna do to them? Or that he would never be ok with somebody treating his kids badly, we all know he's not having that.

Maybe I'm overthinking it, but I feel like while a girls day could be good for bonding, it could potentially cause more problems for him and them. Does that make sense?

Forget a "girls day"...what do you do to interact with them when dad is there? What you do in the random, inane times...tends to form a lot better bonds than some premeditated outing.

Figure out a way to be their "advocate" with their dad a few times (even if he knows about it). Take their side in voting for a movie you don't really want to see but they do.  Do things that make them say "oh, she kinda likes me" as opposed to "we're being forced on this girl's day because she's...(putting on a show, trying to be our mom, etc, etc)." You've got a natural shared viewpoint in being the same gender...play it up a little occasionally to "beat dad". You want to move from "dad's girlfriend" to "that's Pink Cashmere".

[Tiny]

I don't have any real experience. And this advice is more or less to think about how your guy's daughters might perceive you and the relationship with their dad and with them.

I'm wondering if it's the "limbo" thing too.   You've been in a relationship with their dad for several years (not the limbo part) - but it sounds like you aren't ever really around when the girls are there (the limbo part).    If you are part of their dad's life - maybe they wonder why you don't want to be more "involved" with their life?       

I get (and appreciate) that you are giving them 'space' but are you also creating some "memories" with the girls and their dad?    If you are planning to stay in a relationship with their dad - it might now be time to start building a closer relationship with his daughters.   Other than just being their dad's girlfriend who hangs out on the sidelines. 

(Could it be the daughters think you don't "like" them?? I know that's not what it is... but think about it from their point of view.)

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2018 12:06:10 GMT -5 hoops902 said:

Is it possible that the "limbo" is really the problem for everyone here?

This may or may not be their actual perspective...but here's probably how I'd see it if I were them:

Dad and this lady are dating...they aren't living together, they don't see each other all the time. We don't get to see him THAT much...why in the hell would he pick the times that we're supposed to be having daddy/daughter time to have HER around? He can see her ALL THE TIME when we're not there.

Also if I were them...I'd think you didn't like me all that much...which would make me even angrier that dad brings you around during those times.  Your posts don't sound like you particularly care for these kids even though you'd been dating their father at least a few years now. It doesn't sound like you dislike them, just that you're ambivalent about them. You're the adult, if you want a relationship with them...then you probably have to go out of your way to make it happen...even if they resist it.  You don't have to be overbearing...but it sounds like you're actively finding ways to avoid spending time together as a family unit (which is fine if that's what you want...but that paired with then occasionally being around on "their time" is going to be annoying to them). 

The entire thing sounds a lot more like you're some random woman he's dating and insists on bringing you around during their time than a serious relationship. You're not a step-motherly figure...you're just "stealing their time with dad".

Regardless of whether you live together or not...I think it needs to be either more hot or cold...not lukewarm like it is now.  Either daddy/daughter time is theirs...and you're the woman dad dates when the kids aren't around.  Or you take more steps to become some sort of family unit where you're not just some woman intruding on their time, and they aren't just some hurdle to seeing your boyfriend alone more often.  The latter probably requires a lot more effort on your part to become their friend, but no matter how much the kids protest about you making more of an effort...NOBODY wants a tag-along when it's their time to spend with their parent like that.  You have to make yourself more than just a tag-along...or don't actually tag along.

Thank you!!! What you wrote makes sense. I DO like them, but I can see how I might have given them the same impression you got. 

Its just that I thought I was doing the right thing by giving them space to be alone with their Dad and go places without me, I'm not trying to avoid them at all. And I thought it would be best to build a relationship with them at a pace they are comfortable with. I've been trying so hard to not do too much, but maybe I'm not doing enough in some ways? I'm pretty quiet and reserved by nature and I can understand how all of that together may be coming off the wrong way to them.

Clearly, I have no idea what the hell im doing. I've been thinking all along that there's nothing I can do, but you've made me think maybe there is. But I need somebody to tell me how to show them that the impression you got is not reality. I would like the family-unit sort of situation. I'm not trying to mother them, I respect that they already have a mother and they're not babies, but I would love for them to feel like I'm family. HELP!

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I don't have any experience but I would think that if you want them to feel like you are family that's not something you can do solo.   Your boyfriend is also helping to reinforce the idea that this is "some woman dad dates" than "this is someone I want in my life for the long haul".   They are going to look to their dad for signals on how to treat you.

It's probably time to sit down with you boyfriend and have "the talk".   Based on your post it sounds like you have both been dancing around the issue but have never actually taken the bull by the horns. It's time to "shit or get off the pot" as the saying goes.

I am going to go against everyone else and say I wouldn't take any steps to involve yourself more in his daughter's lives if neither of you have actually committed to you taking on that kind of role.   That's only going to lead to more confusion.

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2018 12:18:57 GMT -5 hoops902 said:

Feb 26, 2018 11:58:45 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

No, I haven't. I wouldn't mind, but I'm hesitant because of possible backlash from their Mom, for them or him. One day she was bringing them to the apartment, realized I was there and made them go home. Because she "didn't realize they had a babysitter" and she didn't want somebody she didn't know around her kids. 

Never mind that it would've been almost midnight before he got home from work that night. Or that I've been there with them until he got off before. Or that she's had opportunities to meet me and get to know me, she doesn't want to. Or that they're both bigger than me, (the oldest is taller than me AND outweighs me by over 100 lbs) so really, what am I gonna do to them? Or that he would never be ok with somebody treating his kids badly, we all know he's not having that.

Maybe I'm overthinking it, but I feel like while a girls day could be good for bonding, it could potentially cause more problems for him and them. Does that make sense?

Forget a "girls day"...what do you do to interact with them when dad is there? What you do in the random, inane times...tends to form a lot better bonds than some premeditated outing.

Figure out a way to be their "advocate" with their dad a few times (even if he knows about it). Take their side in voting for a movie you don't really want to see but they do.  Do things that make them say "oh, she kinda likes me" as opposed to "we're being forced on this girl's day because she's...(putting on a show, trying to be our mom, etc, etc)." You've got a natural shared viewpoint in being the same gender...play it up a little occasionally to "beat dad". You want to move from "dad's girlfriend" to "that's Pink Cashmere".

Ok, we already interact like that. If he's teasing me (or irritating me lol), they'll defend me or just take my side. I do the same. Kind of a "girls stick together" thing in a playful way. We're amicable, but I admit not really close. 

We we don't really actively do anything together on our own around the house. They're teenagers, they're good just glued to their phones all day. But I'm willing to try to be more engaged with them, I just need to figure out how. Any more ideas?

[hoops902]

Feb 26, 2018 12:27:31 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Feb 26, 2018 12:06:10 GMT -5 hoops902 said:

Is it possible that the "limbo" is really the problem for everyone here?

This may or may not be their actual perspective...but here's probably how I'd see it if I were them:

Dad and this lady are dating...they aren't living together, they don't see each other all the time. We don't get to see him THAT much...why in the hell would he pick the times that we're supposed to be having daddy/daughter time to have HER around? He can see her ALL THE TIME when we're not there.

Also if I were them...I'd think you didn't like me all that much...which would make me even angrier that dad brings you around during those times.  Your posts don't sound like you particularly care for these kids even though you'd been dating their father at least a few years now. It doesn't sound like you dislike them, just that you're ambivalent about them. You're the adult, if you want a relationship with them...then you probably have to go out of your way to make it happen...even if they resist it.  You don't have to be overbearing...but it sounds like you're actively finding ways to avoid spending time together as a family unit (which is fine if that's what you want...but that paired with then occasionally being around on "their time" is going to be annoying to them). 

The entire thing sounds a lot more like you're some random woman he's dating and insists on bringing you around during their time than a serious relationship. You're not a step-motherly figure...you're just "stealing their time with dad".

Regardless of whether you live together or not...I think it needs to be either more hot or cold...not lukewarm like it is now.  Either daddy/daughter time is theirs...and you're the woman dad dates when the kids aren't around.  Or you take more steps to become some sort of family unit where you're not just some woman intruding on their time, and they aren't just some hurdle to seeing your boyfriend alone more often.  The latter probably requires a lot more effort on your part to become their friend, but no matter how much the kids protest about you making more of an effort...NOBODY wants a tag-along when it's their time to spend with their parent like that.  You have to make yourself more than just a tag-along...or don't actually tag along.

Thank you!!! What you wrote makes sense. I DO like them, but I can see how I might have given them the same impression you got. 

Its just that I thought I was doing the right thing by giving them space to be alone with their Dad and go places without me, I'm not trying to avoid them at all. And I thought it would be best to build a relationship with them at a pace they are comfortable with. I've been trying so hard to not do too much, but maybe I'm not doing enough in some ways? I'm pretty quiet and reserved by nature and I can understand how all of that together may be coming off the wrong way to them.

Clearly, I have no idea what the hell im doing. I've been thinking all along that there's nothing I can do, but you've made me think maybe there is. But I need somebody to tell me how to show them that the impression you got is not reality. I would like the family-unit sort of situation. I'm not trying to mother them, I respect that they already have a mother and they're not babies, but I would love for them to feel like I'm family. HELP!

Kids see extremes.  Best Friend.  Worst Enemy.  To adults, indifference and space mean "meh, I don't care anyways".  To kids, that probably reads as "she hates me and wishes I wasn't around so she could spend time with dad".  The real pain in the ass is that even if you're super nice to them...they might outwardly really dislike you.  You have to be ok with that.  You want to send the message that no matter how much they might despise YOU...YOU think they're amazing young women.  I think you're on the right track not mothering them.  I think your goal should really be the "fun neighbor lady" "friend's cool mom" type. 

It's probably a slow road now that this has been going on for so long...jumping in with both feet now would seem fake in some ways.  I think your goal at this point should be that their view is "we want Pink around, when she's around we have a lot more fun". So things like letting dad be the bad guy a few times for trivial stuff and letting you play hero (movie choice, dinner choice, etc).  You need to find ways to reinforce that you like having them around, not that they're a barrier to you spending time with their dad.  All it really takes is finding one thing you can bond over...there has to be 1 at least.  That becomes the thing you are "friends" over...you'd do the same if you were trying to make a new friend with a random woman right?  You'd find something you have in common, and you'd bond over that one thing...eventually spreading out to other aspects of life. 

You're probably in an enviable position in that there isn't really much need for you to be "pseudo parent" and disciplining them given the custody situation, living situation, etc.  You basically get to be "the fun one".  Fun is contagious...even if displaying it isn't easy for someone quiet and reserved.  It probably involves stepping way out of your comfort zone.

[MJ2.0]

Feb 26, 2018 12:35:50 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I don't have any experience but I would think that if you want them to feel like you are family that's not something you can do solo.   Your boyfriend is also helping to reinforce the idea that this is "some woman dad dates" than "this is someone I want in my life for the long haul".   They are going to look to their dad for signals on how to treat you.

It's probably time to sit down with you boyfriend and have "the talk".   Based on your post it sounds like you have both been dancing around the issue but have never actually taken the bull by the horns. It's time to "shit or get off the pot" as the saying goes.

I am going to go against everyone else and say I wouldn't take any steps to involve yourself more in his daughter's lives if neither of you have actually committed to you taking on that kind of role.   That's only going to lead to more confusion.

I agree with this.  Come up with an approach together and execute.

[Deleted]

It's probably time to sit down with you boyfriend and have "the talk". Based on your post it sounds like you have both been dancing around the issue but have never actually taken the bull by the horns. It's time to "shit or get off the pot" as the saying goes.

I wouldn't take any steps to involve yourself more in his daughter's lives if neither of you have actually committed to you taking on that kind of role. That's only going to lead to more confusion.

NomoreDramaQ1015, I'm not sure what issue you are referring to and what bull we need to take by the horns. Can you please clarify?

As far as committing to a role, he wants us all to be a family like I do. Is that what you meant? 

Im sorry I'm so confused.

[Deleted]

Feb 26, 2018 12:41:37 GMT -5 MJ2.0 said:

Feb 26, 2018 12:35:50 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I don't have any experience but I would think that if you want them to feel like you are family that's not something you can do solo.   Your boyfriend is also helping to reinforce the idea that this is "some woman dad dates" than "this is someone I want in my life for the long haul".   They are going to look to their dad for signals on how to treat you.

It's probably time to sit down with you boyfriend and have "the talk".   Based on your post it sounds like you have both been dancing around the issue but have never actually taken the bull by the horns. It's time to "shit or get off the pot" as the saying goes.

I am going to go against everyone else and say I wouldn't take any steps to involve yourself more in his daughter's lives if neither of you have actually committed to you taking on that kind of role.   That's only going to lead to more confusion.

I agree with this.  Come up with an approach together and execute.

I think I'm missing something, or maybe I haven't explained well. When I say we want to live together, it's not just that. For us, that's pretty much the same thing as when other couples say they are getting married. Except we don't want to get married.

Well, don't tell anyone... but lately we've been dancing around the idea of getting married. I think he's trying to ease me into thinking about it, because I've been very clear for the past 20 years that I was never getting married again. Now.... I don't know. Typing that.... I feel like the world just shook. 

ETA: and whatever idea I get, I would talk with him before I went off on a tangent. Those are his children and he'd have to agree before I did anything concerning them. We're pretty good about communicating, even if we get lost with solutions.

[giramomma]

I would press the relationship issue, but I would also do my due diligence with making a blended family work...reading books, etc.

I might also suggest that the two of you see a therapist that specializes in blended families...and help the both of you to present a united front, in terms of boundaries, at some point.

You likely won't be able to schedule sessions to include his kids..but it should be enough that you two are on the same page.

[azucena]

Feb 26, 2018 12:27:31 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Feb 26, 2018 12:06:10 GMT -5 hoops902 said:

Is it possible that the "limbo" is really the problem for everyone here?

This may or may not be their actual perspective...but here's probably how I'd see it if I were them:

Dad and this lady are dating...they aren't living together, they don't see each other all the time. We don't get to see him THAT much...why in the hell would he pick the times that we're supposed to be having daddy/daughter time to have HER around? He can see her ALL THE TIME when we're not there.

Also if I were them...I'd think you didn't like me all that much...which would make me even angrier that dad brings you around during those times.  Your posts don't sound like you particularly care for these kids even though you'd been dating their father at least a few years now. It doesn't sound like you dislike them, just that you're ambivalent about them. You're the adult, if you want a relationship with them...then you probably have to go out of your way to make it happen...even if they resist it.  You don't have to be overbearing...but it sounds like you're actively finding ways to avoid spending time together as a family unit (which is fine if that's what you want...but that paired with then occasionally being around on "their time" is going to be annoying to them). 

The entire thing sounds a lot more like you're some random woman he's dating and insists on bringing you around during their time than a serious relationship. You're not a step-motherly figure...you're just "stealing their time with dad".

Regardless of whether you live together or not...I think it needs to be either more hot or cold...not lukewarm like it is now.  Either daddy/daughter time is theirs...and you're the woman dad dates when the kids aren't around.  Or you take more steps to become some sort of family unit where you're not just some woman intruding on their time, and they aren't just some hurdle to seeing your boyfriend alone more often.  The latter probably requires a lot more effort on your part to become their friend, but no matter how much the kids protest about you making more of an effort...NOBODY wants a tag-along when it's their time to spend with their parent like that.  You have to make yourself more than just a tag-along...or don't actually tag along.

Thank you!!! What you wrote makes sense. I DO like them, but I can see how I might have given them the same impression you got. 

Its just that I thought I was doing the right thing by giving them space to be alone with their Dad and go places without me, I'm not trying to avoid them at all. And I thought it would be best to build a relationship with them at a pace they are comfortable with. I've been trying so hard to not do too much, but maybe I'm not doing enough in some ways? I'm pretty quiet and reserved by nature and I can understand how all of that together may be coming off the wrong way to them.

Clearly, I have no idea what the hell im doing. I've been thinking all along that there's nothing I can do, but you've made me think maybe there is. But I need somebody to tell me how to show them that the impression you got is not reality. I would like the family-unit sort of situation. I'm not trying to mother them, I respect that they already have a mother and they're not babies, but I would love for them to feel like I'm family. HELP!

Maybe you tell them exactly this.  I've found being transparent with my kids when I'm at a parenting loss of what to do has worked wonders for our relationship.  Things like unexpected questions - hmm, I want to talk to you about that but I need to think about it because I wasn't expecting it.

[MJ2.0]

Feb 26, 2018 12:57:43 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

Feb 26, 2018 12:41:37 GMT -5 MJ2.0 said:

I agree with this.  Come up with an approach together and execute.

I think I'm missing something, or maybe I haven't explained well. When I say we want to live together, it's not just that. For us, that's pretty much the same thing as when other couples say they are getting married. Except we don't want to get married.

Well, don't tell anyone... but lately we've been dancing around the idea of getting married. I think he's trying to ease me into thinking about it, because I've been very clear for the past 20 years that I was never getting married again. Now.... I don't know. Typing that.... I feel like the world just shook. 

I only meant that the two of you make sure you are 100% on the same page about how to approach your relationship/involvement with his kids, and then take action.

[gs11rmb]

I think you should only get married if you really want to be married.  At the same time, I do think there is a difference between being married and living together and the girls may well be viewing you as just Dad's girlfriend.  It's fortunate they are not rude to you and they probably will grow out of being obnoxious to their dad.  Just have to wait it out and allow them to realize that their mother is manipulating the situation.