Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Mar 30, 2012 13:57:57 GMT -5
In fact i do think there is a gender bias... if this was the woman, we would not be completely ignoring that the OP has said that her husband is the one who takes care of childcare duties in their house...
Again, she's not saying he needs to be making tons of money - she's even okay with him taking another paycut. She just wants him to be employed, and I think that's an entirely reasonable expectation unless some other plan has been working for them. But he's had a job all this time, and it's not like she's asking him to do anything different now.
Earning $38k/year is one thing when it's simply a paycut from whatever he's making now. It's quite another when you had to rack up $28k of debt and miss out on at least three years of work experience to get it. I'd definitely hesitate to pull the trigger on that one, and it would have nothing to do with not wanting my husband to be happy in his work. I WOULD want him to be happy in his work, but the career goals need to be reasonable for our family, not just for him.
Just as it's not "all about her," neither is it all about him.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Mar 30, 2012 13:58:49 GMT -5
True enough but their child is 9 not 2. Daycare can't be much as she is in school most of the time. I doubt she married someone unemployed and unemployable. She has taken the first step of sitting down with him calmly.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 14:00:20 GMT -5
Do you use a Jacuzzi and a pool for the same thing ? Ultimately, its not even remotely the same experience, except you're wet... (employed)... He seemed to find out a decade ago that IT really wasn't for him... but has been plugging away so as to keep peace in the family as best he can (yes i'm reading in... ) ...
I agree, he'd need to be committed. I'd probably see if he could substitute teach first, or volunteer somewhere to see if it realy is what he likes. My DH has subbed at the tech school... he only has an AS, but its in his field, so they take him easy as a sub... he's thought about teaching some day when labor might become difficult (most of his profs were business owners who had retired). He's been able to way the pros and cons through subbing... although it does take some flexibility of schedule to be able to do that... maybe while he was 'unemployed' in addition to looking for a job, he could also spend a day or two vollunteering in a classroom ?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 14:00:28 GMT -5
Yes, and that is a good step. But what was the problem and issue wit the job losses?
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Mar 30, 2012 14:00:43 GMT -5
I guess i didn't realize $50K was a low paying job? But, how about taking a step back and saying "gee, we are fortunate enough that we can still pay all our bills, have a roof over our head, etc"? NOT giving the SO a pass but merely saying that he may not be what you WISH he was. He is what he is.
I'm sure she's not discounting that but let's face it - it's pretty easy to say, "$50k is a great salary and we have enough to pay our bills even if I'm making nothing so why are YOU complaining?" when you're not the one holding the higher-paying job that makes that a feasible statement.
What if thecaptain feels like getting a lower paying job in ten years and DH is making $38k at that point? Would he suddenly step up and be like "Sure, honey, go ahead - you've been earning the higher salary for years and you should get to do what you want to do now, I'll be happy to go out and get a higher-paying job again to make up the difference" or would he be more likely to say "Honey, I would love for you to take that low-paying job you'd love but right now we're kinda depending on your salary to make things work"?
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Mar 30, 2012 14:01:05 GMT -5
My DH and I have always lived below or means.
When we were buying our first house we both worked for the same company - which was on extremely shaky financial ground. Before we closed I lost my job. We completed the purchase b/c we were qualifying on one income. I had pushed DH to go work somewhere else, so that helped.
I managed to go to work for someone I had worked for before, but as a contractor (no health insurance no disability). I paid my cobra (this was in the late 80's) lucky for me b/c I had a torsion of my ovary and needed surgery. Was off for a week or so, and went back to work from home (no disability). I got a FT job and DH went to work more in his field for an Alternative School. That place went under due to fraud on behalf of the President. DH landed a job in MPS due to them owing him big time for holding everything together at the alternative school. DH hated teaching elementary school (his specialty is HS) so he left to work for an educational software/hardware distributor.
I had taken a "temporary 18 month" position that offered a severance package and ended up lasting 7 years, so when I lost that job the economy was somewhat depressed and I stayed home for my severance period while looking for a job. When the severance ran out I was back at work at a construction company. I worked there about 3 years and they ended up in trouble so I again lost my job. At the same time we were looking to move from our house #2 and build. We qualified on DH's income for the house. I again went back to work within a few months (again managed to go back to another former employer) We built a house and about 2 years in I was laid off due to the housing bubble crash.
When I lost my job I was in the early stages of diagnosing a tumor. I anted up for the Cobra, and several months later it was confirmed that I did have Cancer. I was treated and cleared to go back to work...and I was extremely careful not to mention the C word when I was job hunting. After a few months I got a FT Job again.
I am at the 5 year mark cancer free, I am sure it won't return, but my energy level is not the greatest. I figure I will work as long as I can. Right now I figure I am saving for retirement/paying for the kids college. When the kids are through school I will ramp up the retirement savings.
DH's career is going very well he earns over 6 figures and would get $300,000 if he decides to walk or they force him out. If they forced him out, he will do the same thing for someone else or he will probably go teach at the college level. DH had his master's nearly finished but I don't know if he would be able to finish it now.
I probably set up our conservative situation, but I think I have trained DH. He recognizes that my working and our savings enabled him to pursue the sales job opportunity b/c we could take the uncertain earnings risk. We bounce purchases back and forth. It takes us a long time to make a decision. Right now I am contemplating a car. I am torn between a conservative car and a more expensive car. This week a dealer called an offered me a screaming deal on a luxury car. Called DH to see what he thought and he said it is a good deal but do you really want such an expensive car. So I called the sales guy back and said we were just not ready to make a decision.
My car is old but it is running fairly good and my DH actually has 2 cars so if mine breaks down, I have a back up.
I think I hang out here too much. There are a lot of posters here who think that cars should get well over 200,000 miles. Mine is only at about 150,000. Car/Investment/Car/Investment...well maybe I should have less car and pad my investment account.
DH could really use me in his office, but I am not sure I want to work for him. We may be forced to make a decision on that in the next year or two b/c of demands the company is making/compensation tied to staffing to their satisfaction. I hold the needed certifications, so push may come to shove.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 14:01:25 GMT -5
I don't necessarily agree that he should go into teaching. Sorry , priority #1 for him should be helping to support his family.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 14:02:53 GMT -5
I guess i didn't realize $50K was a low paying job? But, how about taking a step back and saying "gee, we are fortunate enough that we can still pay all our bills, have a roof over our head, etc"? NOT giving the SO a pass but merely saying that he may not be what you WISH he was. He is what he is. I'm sure she's not discounting that but let's face it - it's pretty easy to say, "$50k is a great salary and we have enough to pay our bills even if I'm making nothing so why are YOU complaining?" when you're not the one holding the higher-paying job that makes that a feasible statement. What if thecaptain feels like getting a lower paying job in ten years and DH is making $38k at that point? Would he suddenly step up and be like "Sure, honey, go ahead - you've been earning the higher salary for years and you should get to do what you want to do now, I'll be happy to go out and get a higher-paying job again to make up the difference" or would he be more likely to say "Honey, I would love for you to take that low-paying job you'd love but right now we're kinda depending on your salary to make things work"? Well, you don't just snap your fingers and get whatever income you want so that isn't a very likely scenario anyway.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 14:03:14 GMT -5
The College of Education and Professional Studies at Eastern Illinois University offers an alternative route to certification program in accordance with state legislation and guidelines from the Illinois State Board of Education. Secondary Certification is available in the following areas: •MATH •FOREIGN LANGUAGES •TECHNOLOGY EDUCATION •SCIENCE •BUSINESS EDUCATION •FAMILY AND CONSUMER SCIENCES EDUCATION
The Alternative Route to Teacher Certification program is aimed at helping school districts find a new source of teachers through a cohort program. This program enables individuals who have earned a bachelor’s degree but no teacher certification to enroll in coursework consisting of: •A Web-based course in May. •An eight-week summer program running from mid-June to mid-August. •A one-year internship as a paid teacher. This will occur during the academic year following the eight-week summer program. •A two-week follow-up assessment during June after the internship. Those who successfully complete the program after the internship will obtain the four-year Initial Teaching Certificate (Type 09) from the state of Illinois (Type 10 for Foreign Languages).
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Mar 30, 2012 14:05:04 GMT -5
Do you use a Jacuzzi and a pool for the same thing ? Ultimately, its not even remotely the same experience, except you're wet... (employed)... He seemed to find out a decade ago that IT really wasn't for him... but has been plugging away so as to keep peace in the family as best he can (yes i'm reading in... ) ...
Which is also time he could have been using to find something else that he'd enjoy doing that made sense for their family. I don't take the statement "bah, I hate my job, I want to go into another field" very seriously. We all hate our jobs from time to time.
Do some research on other careers, find out starting salaries and potential for growth and demand in our area and so forth, THEN we can talk about you potentially changing careers. Approach it like an adult, not a petulant child.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Mar 30, 2012 14:07:11 GMT -5
Well, you don't just snap your fingers and get whatever income you want so that isn't a very likely scenario anyway.
It's much easier if you have achieved that kind of income in the past. I make $70-80k+ right now. I'm pretty confident that I'll always be able to achieve at least $60k in this field (assuming that I'm reasonably close to the right kind of area), so if I were to drop to $30k for awhile so I could follow my dream career and it didn't work out, I could always go back to the better-paying career.
thecaptain's DH would always have that same option.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 14:08:41 GMT -5
Where does it say he is acting like a petulant child? He takes care of the kid and household. He carries benefits. He has made well over 50K up until now, given that he thought that was 'too low' to apply for.... Again... exactly how many months has he been unemployed all together? And did you see how it takes from May-August unpaid, and then a one year PAID internship to get a techers certification through Eastern Illinois University ??
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 14:10:07 GMT -5
Well, you don't just snap your fingers and get whatever income you want so that isn't a very likely scenario anyway. It's much easier if you have achieved that kind of income in the past. I make $70-80k+ right now. I'm pretty confident that I'll always be able to achieve at least $60k in this field (assuming that I'm reasonably close to the right kind of area), so if I were to drop to $30k for awhile so I could follow my dream career and it didn't work out, I could always go back to the better-paying career. thecaptain's DH would always have that same option. Um, no. Not necessarily. Depends on the market, the economy and your field.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 30, 2012 14:11:00 GMT -5
I guess I don't see where he is behaving like a petulant child. I'll give that it wasn't the most thought out reasoning and I would raise an eyebrow if DH came to me with that logic, but I certainly would not treat him like he was acting like a petulant child either.
I'd ask him to put more thought into the matter and we'll revisit it.
The OP has a valid reason for not jumping on the idea of sending him back to school.
But I don't think her spouse is a child for suggesting the idea. He just didn't present the most brilliant logical reason to switch careers that all YM-ers desire.
ETA: if he does the majority of the child care duties MAYBE he was expressing the idea that he gets summers off not becaue he is a lazy POS who doesn't want to work like some posters suggest but because he'd be on the same schedule as their kid, thus needing no childcare during the summer (prices do go up, at least around here they do during the summer).
Rates for summer at our daycare are approx 126 a week. That is $504 a month. If DH or I could get summers off that'd be aprox $1512 in savings.
That's not chump change.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Mar 30, 2012 15:04:12 GMT -5
Yup, florida has the same thing and he could get a teacher certificication while he was working. He needs to get his paperwork in order to even sub though. Copy of transcript background check finger printing. This all takes time. But before that, even see if the system needs subs. With so many teachers out of work, sub lists are closed in most districts.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 15:07:07 GMT -5
Just FYI, that Alternative Certification Program at Eastern Illinois... How much does the program cost, and is financial aid available? Using tuition and fees in effect for the 2009-2010 academic year, cost of the program is estimated at the following amounts (contact the program coordinator for current tuition and fee rates): Rates Tuition: $292.95 per hour Continuing Education Fee: $44.00 per hour Textbook Rental Fee: $9.95 per hour Total: $292.95 per hour
Summer Tuition and Fees: Candidates enroll for 16 or 17 semester hours for a total ranging from approximately $4,400 to $4,700. Fall/Spring Tuition and Fees: Candidates enroll for six semester hours of internship each term for a total of slightly less than $1,700.00. Summer After the Internship: Candidates enroll for one semester hour for a total of aproximately $293.
Tuition and fees for the entire program total about $8,200 to $8,500.
and
We are currently accepting applications for the 2012-2013 cohort, which includes teaching full time in the 2012-2013 school year. The application deadline is April 30, 2012. Internships must be secured by May 31, 2012. Note: To be eligible for the 2012-2013 program, candidates must pass both state tests (Basic Skills and Appropriate Content Area). The last date to take these tests is April 14, 2012. Click here for help in preparing for the Illinois Basic Skills test.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Mar 30, 2012 15:08:36 GMT -5
It sounds like the OP's spouse wants to take more than a $3,000 pay cut. So, it will have a lifestyle effect. However, I agree. The reasons for wanting the summers off might not be entirely based on laziness.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Mar 30, 2012 15:11:20 GMT -5
Get info before you start. Can he sub. Are there any openings? What actually can he teach? Wouldn't he be better off with another job since his DD is 9 and probably would have more fun in camp in the summer with friends than home with dad?
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 30, 2012 15:12:40 GMT -5
It sounds like the OP's spouse wants to take more than a $3,000 pay cut. So, it will have a lifestyle effect. I agree with you there. I would be hesitant to jump on board making that big of a cut in salary as well. Just commiting a YM sin by pointing out it might not be because he is a lazy slob who wants the OP to pick up the slack for him.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 15:12:47 GMT -5
My husband has gotten called to sub in the Masonry program at the tech school before certified subs... because he is a Mason. Specialized Math and Science and Tech people generally have an easier time getting in... not saying it would be cake, but its a lot better prospect than general ed elementary ...
(I'm not even saying husband in the OP needs to be a teacher, just that the alternative to giving him a hard time about it is to actually see what it takes to make it happen and see if he can/will commit to that... again, i'm not sure i'd jump RIGHT into a program before he spent at least a few days in a classroom vollunteering.... Teaching is not generally exactly what people think it will be ... )
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 15:13:01 GMT -5
Yes, you can Sub in many schools with a basic BS degree and no teaching cert.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Mar 30, 2012 15:13:31 GMT -5
Besides all that, teaching is a passion not just a JOB. It can get pretty rough with all the bs and mandates and Politics and touchy feely crap. You have to be able to keep your head down and do your job while crap swirls around it. From what you have said, he seems to not have that skill.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2012 15:14:13 GMT -5
Just to be clear, i was not suggesting being a sub as a career path... just that subbing has allowed my husband to see the pros and cons of teaching first hand... i think you could do that through vollunteering.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 30, 2012 15:17:27 GMT -5
He might not in a job he hates, but if he really wanted to be a teacher he might. There are things I refuse to put up with as a server but I can keep my head down and do my job as a lab technician. It's because I enjoy what I do here, I HATE being a server.
Not saying that the OP should just go ahead and give the green light, but I don't think he should be treated like a petulant child either.
I still think the OP's husband could benefit enormously meeting with a career counseler. He could bring up his proposed job switch and get a professional's advice on it.
I know DH always does better taking constructive critisism from a professional/netural party. When it comes from me it just sounds like bitching.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on Mar 30, 2012 15:37:56 GMT -5
I didn't necessarily mean that he WAS acting like a petulant child, but if he's complaining about his current line of work without figuring out what steps he needs to take in order to start up in a career he wants, then yes, I'd consider that petulant. Whether it's actually going down that way or not, I agree we can't tell from the information given.
It sounds like he just doesn't know what he wants. Which is fine but until he figures it out, he shouldn't make sudden and expensive moves into different careers that he may or may not like better.
I totally agree with the idea of career counseling.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Mar 30, 2012 15:38:11 GMT -5
I totally agree with the career counselor. He might just need a little tweaking to find the right path and a permanent one.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Mar 30, 2012 15:40:54 GMT -5
You know, I did not comment on this before but my DS has an Accounting/Technology teacher that has a background in Programming. She burned out in industry and decided to teach.
She loves teaching and IMO is a great teacher. The high school kids really seem to like her and I think she is an effective teacher.
Teaching is not for everyone, but some people do find it a rewarding career. Him wanting summers off - well hell who doesn't want summers off. I also think 1 demanding job and 1 less demanding job/less hours is beneficial. There is a lot of family business that needs to be handled during working hours.
Meet the Assessor/Meet the Appraiser/Appliance Repair Person/Pick up a sick kid from school Run your non-driving age kid to the Dr. Escort teens to Dr b/c they need to pay before they are seen and on and on.
I don't know about division of labor. That seems to always be an issue, but I think sometimes when we get bogged down in thinking we are doing more than our "share" we miss seeing what our partner is contributing. The other day I started dinner, and DH came home. He is a better cook so I turned it over to him. He never starts the washing machine unless I am not at home. He will unload the dryer though. I can live with that. It saves me from ironing a lot of times. My DH never cleans the bathroom but he will Mop the floors. I do agree if someone is not working at all, they need to pick up more chores especially if your spouse gets home so late they go right to bed.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Mar 30, 2012 15:43:22 GMT -5
Complaining is usually my first step in trying to figure things out. First, I have to figure out all the things I don't like. Then I have to figure out which ones are important. Then I have to figure out what to do about it.
My process is very audible - I can't do it all in my head, or on a notepad. It takes months of "discussion" for me to figure all of that out. During that time, my sounding board could easily say I spend months "complaining" and not doing anything. And, technically, it is true. But the venting process is useful to me.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 30, 2012 15:45:58 GMT -5
but if he's complaining about his current line of work without figuring out what steps he needs to take in order to start up in a career he wants, then yes, I'd consider that petulant
I don't know. I don't particularly like academia at the moment but I am not 100% sure how to move out of it with all the responsbilties I have (I carry the benefits, the kiddo etc).
I don't think it makes me petulant to not be thrilled with how the academic system works and not having made the leap into private.
If I was laid off that's probably when I'd start doing more reflection on the situation vs now where I have a pretty good thing going on, I just am not entirely thrilled with it.
I'd probably start with all the things I WANT to do, then narrow it down by comparing my current skill set with that list.
He might just be tossing ideas around at the moment not expecting the OP to jump on board with them right off the bat.
I don't think teaching is entirely crazy. At least it sounds like he has never mentioned "pot farmer" that was one of my brother's brilliant career ideas.
Sounds like he wants to make a change but isn't sure how to do it. I don't think that is petulant, especially if he's been in the same field for a long time.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Mar 30, 2012 15:48:48 GMT -5
I don't agree with volunteering giving you the complete picture on how it is to be a teacher. It can give you an idea of how a schools run and whether the teachers and other staff seem to be happy and how the kids are. You may not end up at that school anyway.
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