The kid thread: Planning, pregnancy & parenting

[minnesotapaintlady]

Four months on the waiting list and I finally got a message today that they can get Carrot in Oct 3rd for ADHD testing.  Now I'm not so sure I want to do it.   I have until Friday to get back to them if that date works so I think we'll have a family discussion about this tonight.  Older son has been through it all recently and should be able to give some insight.

[finnime]

What could be the downside, minnesotapaintlady?

[minnesotapaintlady]

Well, there's the 2K cost and having to pull him out of school and take off work part.   But mainly I'm just not sure this is really an issue for him and I don't want to cause future problems due to quick to label psychiatrist putting something in his file that follows him forever. 

For example, my older son has been doing flight training this summer and just found out he can't get his private pilots license due to his ADHD diagnosis, which has really got him bummed out. I have no idea what else it would be an issue with.

I'm also very leery of meds...especially ADHD meds.  Adderal is what sent his dad over the edge and triggered his psychotic break back in 2012. I'm the one that suggested he look into getting treated for ADHD because he had all the symptoms of it.  Well...it wasn't ADHD...and the meds were a horrible mistake.

[finnime]

In that case, it makes sense to not pursue the assessment. Unless Carrot were to gain something substantial from the diagnosis, don't go there. There are techniques anyone can use to stay focused, if that's a concern. And exercise to get the ya-ya's out.

[minnesotapaintlady]

He's never been hyperactive, but such a scatterbrain with getting homework done and being disorganized.  His room, locker, backpack....all disasters.  Is that just 14 year old boy or is it something more?

I would never have even considered ADHD if it wasn't for his brother went to see a counselor at college and they were like "whoa...have you ever been evaluated for ADHD?  Because just talking to you now you're exhibiting tons of signs".  So, they referred him to an evaluation center.  Now I'm thinking, well maybe I'm missing it again??  They are different though.  Older son was the class clown in grade/middle school, always interrupting people and just doing stupid things at inappropriate times. Carrot is not like that at all, he would be mortified to call attention to himself.

[lurkyloo]

Couple thoughts:  first off this is heavily genetic, but since your boys have different fathers, which side do you think it might have come from for your older one?  Bc you really don’t strike me as ADHD…

Second, my litmus test is always what do you hope to gain from evaluation/diagnosis.  Do you want to try medication?  Are you looking for accommodations at school?  Do you need a diagnosis in order to qualify/tick an insurance box for therapy?

We’ve been encouraged to have DS evaluated for autism, with the psych noting that even she can’t distinguish severe ADHD from high functioning autism without a two day evaluation.  If it doesn’t make a difference in terms of accommodations or medication and a diagnosis is not likely to improve anything materially, I see no point in going through the stress and expense to almost certainly rule it out, so we haven’t bothered.  ADHD meds on the other hand have been life changing, and he also needed the diagnosis to continue to receive accommodations at school.

Also that really sucks about the pilots license.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I agree with Lurky, what do you hope carrot will gain from the diagnosis?

I have a family history of people not doing well on stimulant medication and there is also the concern regarding my anxiety causing me to go manic on them.  The genetic test I did lends credence to both because most of the ADHD meds were either in the yellow or red columns.  So having a formal ADHD diagnosis doesn't help me there.

I am not in school anymore and actually did just fine there so it's not like this would get me an IEP and open doors to therapies I wouldn't otherwise be able to get.  I've looked it up and there isn't a whole lot of accommodations in the workforce and like it or not there is still a shit load of stigma surrounding it that makes me cautious to disclose it at work.

Right now I have a micromanager that feels it is all just a matter of willpower and deliberate inattention on my part.  Getting formally diagnosed won't solve anything at my current job.  At my other jobs apparently my bosses intuited it and were working around it without me even realizing it.

To be able to get formally diagnosed for either ADHD or dyslexia I'd have to travel to Iowa City as the nearest location, pay $3k-$5k out of pocket because my insurance doesn't cover it and would probably be waiting months.

No thanks.  Prestiq works pretty good to control my depression and anxiety which allows me the brain space to use CBT methods to control my ADHD.  I pick therapists who have experience/knowledge in ADHD and they don't need me formally diagnosed to talk about it with me.

Then ADHD presents differently in everyone.  I can understand the concerns about overdiagnosis because it is such a grab bag of criteria that just about anyone at certain stages in their life can qualify.

For me it manifests itself mostly in my ability to utilize executive functioning.  It wasn't as present when I was a kid and only had school it's become more so as my life has grown more complicated.  I have a hard time making decisions and the more things people throw at me I get overwhelmed and will either shut down or snap.

I get hyperactive when I am really tired/stressed but have shoved that down pretty far.  It instead manifests as anxiety because I have slowly been conditioned overtime to be more "lady like" with my behavior and that is common in girls.

I have sensory issues.  Right now too many noises really gets to me.  The kids and DH have figured out to start turning the TV down if it appears I am getting overwhelmed.  I've always had issues with clothes.

I have a very strong ability to hyperfocus which can be both a blessing and a curse.

Dyslexia usually goes hand in hand with ADHD.

Autism tends to overlap so I have had a few people speculate I should get tested for that but I don't fit the majority of the symptoms so I am not going thru the hassle to rule it out.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Aug 22, 2024 10:07:20 GMT -5 lurkyloo said:

Couple thoughts:  first off this is heavily genetic, but since your boys have different fathers, which side do you think it might have come from for your older one?  Bc you really don’t strike me as ADHD…

Second, my litmus test is always what do you hope to gain from evaluation/diagnosis.  Do you want to try medication?  Are you looking for accommodations at school?  Do you need a diagnosis in order to qualify/tick an insurance box for therapy?

Wow.  That was really helpful.

My initial thought is Carrot's dad is of course the one with all the psychological issues, but older son's dad might have ADHD tendencies now that I think about it, and older son's 10 year old brother?  Holy hell.   That kid is off the charts in the hyperactive department.  He drives me up a wall.  He has to have ADHD, it's like the classic presentation of it.

What I hope to gain is hard, because...like I said...leery of the meds after what happened with his dad.  I just want him to have all the tools necessary to be successful in school and I feel bad when older son tells me how much he struggled all through high school and college.  It's nothing I noticed as he was for the most part a straight A student in high school. Now I'm like, omg, what if Carrot being an unorganized mess is because of the same thing!  So...after writing that...I think my main goal is to check the box that he does NOT have ADHD and I'm afraid they will say he does just because I'm perusing it.  You know...parent has concerns...pediatrician feels it's worthy of a referral...psychiatrist goes with the flow and slaps on the diagnosis.  

[Opti]

Aug 22, 2024 11:23:58 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Aug 22, 2024 10:07:20 GMT -5 lurkyloo said:

Couple thoughts:  first off this is heavily genetic, but since your boys have different fathers, which side do you think it might have come from for your older one?  Bc you really don’t strike me as ADHD…

Second, my litmus test is always what do you hope to gain from evaluation/diagnosis.  Do you want to try medication?  Are you looking for accommodations at school?  Do you need a diagnosis in order to qualify/tick an insurance box for therapy?

Wow.  That was really helpful.

My initial thought is Carrot's dad is of course the one with all the psychological issues, but older son's dad might have ADHD tendencies now that I think about it, and older son's 10 year old brother?  Holy hell.   That kid is off the charts in the hyperactive department.  He drives me up a wall.  He has to have ADHD, it's like the classic presentation of it.

What I hope to gain is hard, because...like I said...leery of the meds after what happened with his dad.  I just want him to have all the tools necessary to be successful in school and I feel bad when older son tells me how much he struggled all through high school and college.  It's nothing I noticed as he was for the most part a straight A student in high school. Now I'm like, omg, what if Carrot being an unorganized mess is because of the same thing!  So...after writing that...I think my main goal is to check the box that he does NOT have ADHD and I'm afraid they will say he does just because I'm perusing it.  You know...parent has concerns...pediatrician feels it's worthy of a referral...psychiatrist goes with the flow and slaps on the diagnosis.  

Consider research on diet that can help if you want to avoid meds. Also, therapy dealing with how to accomplish things, I forget what it is called, is better than the usual 'so how do you feel about that'. The issue is native wiring, and some kids/adults can learn techniques and processes to manage how they are. I think the usual go easy on sugar and avoid bad additives like bad food dyes etc. applies. 

Like Sheldon in Big Bang Theory your son might find similar minded souls at college and they might have ways they cope that they can teach him. Not sure what's available but you could also reach out to the Dean of Students and other depts and just ask basic Qs. HTH

[lurkyloo]

Aug 22, 2024 11:23:58 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Aug 22, 2024 10:07:20 GMT -5 lurkyloo said:

Couple thoughts:  first off this is heavily genetic, but since your boys have different fathers, which side do you think it might have come from for your older one?  Bc you really don’t strike me as ADHD…

Second, my litmus test is always what do you hope to gain from evaluation/diagnosis.  Do you want to try medication?  Are you looking for accommodations at school?  Do you need a diagnosis in order to qualify/tick an insurance box for therapy?

Wow.  That was really helpful.

My initial thought is Carrot's dad is of course the one with all the psychological issues, but older son's dad might have ADHD tendencies now that I think about it, and older son's 10 year old brother?  Holy hell.   That kid is off the charts in the hyperactive department.  He drives me up a wall.  He has to have ADHD, it's like the classic presentation of it.

What I hope to gain is hard, because...like I said...leery of the meds after what happened with his dad.  I just want him to have all the tools necessary to be successful in school and I feel bad when older son tells me how much he struggled all through high school and college.  It's nothing I noticed as he was for the most part a straight A student in high school. Now I'm like, omg, what if Carrot being an unorganized mess is because of the same thing!  So...after writing that...I think my main goal is to check the box that he does NOT have ADHD and I'm afraid they will say he does just because I'm perusing it.  You know...parent has concerns...pediatrician feels it's worthy of a referral...psychiatrist goes with the flow and slaps on the diagnosis.  

Like cronewitch hoping the dr wouldn’t give her diabetes!  i am still pissed at the dentist that tried really hard to “give” DS sleep apnea.

I’d give pretty heavy weight to what Carrot thinks, at 14.  I might also reach out to the school or even individual teachers to see if accommodations could be made, like occasional but key reminders, without a diagnosis.

[Works4me]

MinnesotaPaintLady - Over the years, I've been exposed to several pilots, both private and commercial. I strongly recommend your son thoroughly research the issue for himself. This could be a good place to start:

pilotpassion.com/can-i-become-a-pilot-if-i-have-adhd/

[minnesotapaintlady]

Aug 22, 2024 14:53:32 GMT -5 Works4me said:

MinnesotaPaintLady - Over the years, I've been exposed to several pilots, both private and commercial. I strongly recommend your son thoroughly research the issue for himself. This could be a good place to start:

pilotpassion.com/can-i-become-a-pilot-if-i-have-adhd/

He's been looking into it quite a bit and has decided to just get his sport license.  It's a lot more restricted than a private pilot license but does not require the class 3 medical.  If he does pursue the private pilot he would need to be ADHD med free for 90 days and then pass the medical.  If he failed the medical then he cannot get any license, not even the sport so he's afraid to risk it.  He's not on any meds, but wants to try them (he's in the middle of a battle with the doctor that diagnosed him to get his records transferred so can't until then) and he doesn't feel confident that he would pass the ADHD supplemental portion of the medical he'd have to take now that he has been formally diagnosed.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Well, after all that hemming and hawing I accepted the appointment.  I tried getting Carrot's input and after asking how much it was going to cost (not sure and told him it didn't matter).  He said, "nah, I don't think I need it", but then he made one of his teenager under the breath comments about how he used to think he had it when he was 6 or 7 but since I told him he didn't he just accepted that.   

It's not until October, so if I really want I can still cancel.

[raeoflyte]

Oh the attitude that rears up in our house on the days when I am already running on fumes. Always fun times.

[azucena]

Long awaited oral surgeon consult this morning. Teen absolutely hates the dentist now plus we will have to see Nut so tough night and she completely shut down. I walked in to find her in a weird state and in retrospect hounded her way too much to tell me what was wrong and she couldn't/wouldn't. She may have even been disassociated (open to insights about this and will be asking both our therapists about better methods). I apologized to her last night and will do so again today.

[finnime]

Ouch, sorry, raeoflyte and azucena. Tween and teen are not for the faint-hearted.

[Peace77]

Aug 23, 2024 7:46:06 GMT -5 azucena said:

Long awaited oral surgeon consult this morning. Teen absolutely hates the dentist now plus we will have to see Nut so tough night and she completely shut down. I walked in to find her in a weird state and in retrospect hounded her way too much to tell me what was wrong and she couldn't/wouldn't. She may have even been disassociated (open to insights about this and will be asking both our therapists about better methods). I apologized to her last night and will do so again today.

Hope she is soon pain free.

[azucena]

Nut was 45 mins late and didn't have ins card but appt happened. Two teeth to be pulled 9/10 and they gave mom proxy paperwork to fill out but she declined to do it there. She also managed to take the pre-op instructions with her. I'll call a couple days before and check on all of that.

Her siblings were able to stay in our school district so that's an unknown weight off.

[TheOtherMe]

Nut goes out of her way to make the lives of her children more difficult.  I do not understand.  

It will be painful but good to have those two teeth gone.

[raeoflyte]

Aug 23, 2024 13:12:30 GMT -5 azucena said:

Nut was 45 mins late and didn't have ins card but appt happened. Two teeth to be pulled 9/10 and they gave mom proxy paperwork to fill out but she declined to do it there. She also managed to take the pre-op instructions with her. I'll call a couple days before and check on all of that.

Her siblings were able to stay in our school district so that's an unknown weight off.

So painful to have to keep waiting.

[minnesotapaintlady]

So they sent me some assessment surveys I'm supposed to fill out about Carrot and they are obviously designed for a kid much younger so it's really hard to answer the questions. 

[azucena]

Call them and ask if they have an older assessment. Maybe even for older teens. I'd rather answer too old than too young.

[minnesotapaintlady]

I might be getting to that one.  They've emailed 4 of them today, one of them for Carrot to complete, the other three for me.  I am on section 3 of 12 of the first one.

[lurkyloo]

They usually want people from multiple settings to fill them out, I’m surprised they didn’t ask you to have one or more of his teachers fill one out.

[minnesotapaintlady]

He just started the school year last week and it's all new teachers. It's probably kind of pointless in high school with 8 teachers that don't see him much in the day anyhow. 

Carrot said his questionnaire was for the most part age appropriate.

I got questions like, "uses the toilet independently" and "can ride a tricycle for more than 10 feet without help". 

Luckily they numbered the questionnaires or I wouldn't have realized some were missing.  A couple went to my junk email for some reason.  I just found one that's called ASRS 6-18 years of age so hopefully that one is better.

[Opti]

Aug 23, 2024 14:09:21 GMT -5 TheOtherMe said:

Nut goes out of her way to make the lives of her children more difficult.  I do not understand.  

It will be painful but good to have those two teeth gone.

She's one of those who had a sucky life and wants others to as well, instead of pushing them forward. There are people like that. And then there are people who will push forward those they like and trash everyone they do not. Too many of the population in the latter bucket.

[Opti]

Aug 22, 2024 23:17:37 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Well, after all that hemming and hawing I accepted the appointment.  I tried getting Carrot's input and after asking how much it was going to cost (not sure and told him it didn't matter).  He said, "nah, I don't think I need it", but then he made one of his teenager under the breath comments about how he used to think he had it when he was 6 or 7 but since I told him he didn't he just accepted that.   

It's not until October, so if I really want I can still cancel.

Men ... or boys ... or just kids. What do you think he wants? I think he wants the eval. 

[raeoflyte]

High-school band/orchestra/choir trip in 2026 to Germany that ds wants to go on. Cost is $5500 with insurance, payments start in Oct for $300 a month. I think dh or I have to go as well for medical care/back up which brings the total cost up significantly. But we'll work out money for it. I told ds that I got a job to pay for my high-school trips. I don't expect him to cover all of it, but I think he could cover 50% of his trip costs and spending money. Seem fair?

[Peace77]

Aug 28, 2024 20:42:27 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

High-school band/orchestra/choir trip in 2026 to Germany that ds wants to go on. Cost is $5500 with insurance, payments start in Oct for $300 a month. I think dh or I have to go as well for medical care/back up which brings the total cost up significantly. But we'll work out money for it. I told ds that I got a job to pay for my high-school trips. I don't expect him to cover all of it, but I think he could cover 50% of his trip costs and spending money. Seem fair?

I had to pay for any extras that I wanted such as letter jacket and class ring.  Paying for at least part of the trip is fair.

[NastyWoman]

Long time ago, but when we lived in Singapore DS1 had some pretty cool class trips. Those too were very expensive so we told him that he had to work three weeks in the sum.er (max allowed at the time for foreign students) and his salary would be ours. He worked as a bell boy in 4 and 5 star hotels. We let him keep the tips. 

While we could afford to pay for those trips we wanted him to know that money does not grow on trees but has to be earned. He now is the worst workaholic I have ever known and that is saying something.