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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2011 17:03:16 GMT -5
Selective reading, Dez, as well as selective thinking?? I listen to Obama. Do YOU listen to anyone else? Easy not to with no access to video on the board and your TV stuck on Obama news networks and your internet stuck on looks favorable to Obama settings....
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henryclay
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Post by henryclay on May 22, 2011 17:32:39 GMT -5
al-jazeera is fun reading. Thanks for the fun reading. But al-jazeera speaks for Abbas, Hamas, Iran and the Palestinians about as logically as Tucson Sentinal speaks for Obama on illegal immigration.
Thanks for the fun reading.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2011 17:48:37 GMT -5
Gene Simmons, of KISS fame, Obama supporter, speaks on Obama's stance on Israel.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on May 22, 2011 18:08:38 GMT -5
Selective reading, Dez, as well as selective thinking?? I listen to Obama. Do YOU listen to anyone else? Easy not to with no access to video on the board and your TV stuck on Obama news networks and your internet stuck on looks favorable to Obama settings.... I think we have covered it..seems your now into the personals because you have run out of things to say..so the old kids poem, 'Sticks and stones may break your bones but words will never hurt you " is no in effect. "Do YOU listen to anyone else?".... NPR, Public TV, CNN, definitly the internet , search and google, fox , really never, can't say NEVER, NEVER but so long now, some weeks so never, and the round tables of talking heads..some, but interviewing by Charlie Rose, the best, and of course Zakaria, Time, Atlantic, Sporting news..and lets not forget , right here on the old Pro Boards, you and ed, Henrys ideas, those too. "no access to video" the flicks you and others put up, alas no, {sigh}unless I want to start, stop, start..and I don't choose to do so, but some how muddle through. Al Jazeer?? yep Henry, some good reports there, they are usually in on the area I am concerned about, where it seems most of todays action is coming from, and because it is alJazeer , I have no problem with it, that article I posted, I have not seen that topic addressed anywhere else iin the media, have you, and it wasn't pro Arab, anti anything, just a thought on the problems of another uprising happening very soon, author doesn't think so and gave his reasons. You disagree with his thoughts? So go for it. To just question / dismiss, because of who the media source these articles are printed in, if you notice they almost always have a blurb saying these thoughts do not represent aljazzeers ideas on the opic, what is wrong with them? I also go to about six other sites ranging from Lebonan, Iran, West Bank , Jeruselum, Debka too..don't bother with Iraq , Saudia Arabia, Pakistan, Afganistan. I guess I should google to see if there is any there , those countries , that might be unbiased , reputable. {To answer your next question, if thinking of it by you, al jazeer, reputable? Yes and that thought is from the top media sources out there}
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henryclay
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Post by henryclay on May 22, 2011 18:55:14 GMT -5
Well, desi, I have to give your al-jaeezra credit for getting one thing right, as in the article's last sentence: the fundamentals of daily life were also under sustained attack: peoples' ability to work, or go to school But I hardly think they were intending to describe life in Israel for the past 40 or so years. What do you think? Think they got it about right? I mean, it WAS a school bus the RPG was shot at wasn't it? And RPGs DO require somemone to pick out a specific target to shoot at, don't they? And yellow school busses loaded with kids IS a legitimate target for cowards aren't they? I mean, how much danger is there that some kid on a school bus might shoot back? I wonder if the shooter was the kind of coward that had to have a black diaper wrapped around his face ?
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on May 22, 2011 20:18:28 GMT -5
Granted the attackers were those who could care less about any Israeli's lives, as were the two Palestinians who snuck into the Israeli home and slaughtered most of that family, including three small young children in their beds..still can't get over the act that they wearn't killed trying to escape after being captured, great restraint from the Israeli's , possible needed the intelligence as to any others involved, think there were and who.
These events, if there is ever a peace and a treaty signed , if they continue, then the new State , Palestinian, will be responsible to stopping them, or if a attack is still carried out, then all efforts of the state to hunt down, bring to justice, or turn over to the Israeli's , one of those little but important things to be ironed out in a agreement, and no thought given to any possible justification of the events.
In a signed treaty, all that is in the past, as it is in all treaties, the State is paramount in all things, naturally by the laws and constitution that govern it, the state.
If the State , Palestinian, is not willing to pay those dues, and I believe it would be, they finally have their own country, state, then these attacks would be addressed by the State that is being attacked, and if major ones, like rocket attacks, State sponsored or large militia groups in the country uncontrolled by the State, those are acts of war and would be dealt with.
Some how you might think I am naive in these things, expect once a treaty , a peace , boundaries are drawn , everything will become kum by Yaa . Nothing is further from the truth. There is to much history here, there will always will be a remembering, a country, land lost , homes lost, deaths and maiming on both sides. Personally, thinking of the character of the Arab , it may be forever, never forget and I mean forever.
Possible after every daily prayer, done five times a day, in Arabic now, not Hebrew, but the same statement may be said, muttered, thought , as it was done after Yom Kippor services in the Jewish worship, "Next year Jerusalem ", which was repeated for millennium, till finally, Jerusalem was again in the hands of the Jews.
If so, so be it, as long as it is said, muttered, thought of..there thing , as long as it was not actively acted on it.
I would guess if there ever was a peace, shortly something along those lines would be spread from lips to lip throughout the Globe, and again, if so, so be it.
The Jews, Israeli's have had a very good relationship with the Germans, a bit less then 70 years since e the fall of that vile regime. Germany has been a very good friend to the Israeli's, have taught their young the truth of what happened so no one can say they didn't know. Prominently in their capital of Berlin is a stark memorial to that event so no one will ever forget what happened there.
Do I expect in time the same possible relationship between the Palestinians and the Israeli's?
No. But I think they will learn to interact, those who want to, do business together, even cooperate together on mutual projects on a State Level, even individuals as friends, even, happens now, some intermarriages, but a love fest, ever? No.
If I am wrong , I would be glad to be so proven, but they would survive together. If there was peace, what more could you ask for.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2011 20:22:10 GMT -5
Germany is not trying to kill the Jews. Relations cannot improve when someone wants to kill you.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on May 22, 2011 20:27:14 GMT -5
Germany is not trying to kill the Jews. Relations cannot improve when someone wants to kill you. HUH..who said they were Krickett. It was a comparison between what was , and yet even with what happened by who against who, for most, not all, but for most, and definitly the States involved, Israel and Germany, relations are beyond good, but in my mind, I would never expect that type of , not foriveness, but mutual good will if you will, to be the case between the two parties here, just my thinking, but if not, so be it, they both would do nicely. Krickett , I don't think you understand one word of what I am trying to suggest or say, sorry, just the way it is.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2011 20:56:39 GMT -5
Do you read your articles, Dez. It said that Germany and Israel have a good relationship. I said what I said. Not sure what is leading you to think I do not understand. Why do you expect Israel to have anything to do with peace talks with people that want to kill them? Should WE sit down with Al Quaeda(sp) and have peace talks? Or Hamas? Hezbollah?? Maybe sign some peace papers with al-Awlaki?
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SweetVirginia
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Post by SweetVirginia on May 22, 2011 21:41:01 GMT -5
One would think the Palestinians would be ecstatic to have Israel pull back to the 1967 borders, but they were at leastr as unhappy with Obama's idea as the Israelis were. Why? Because they are still in the "death to Israel" mode. They want it ALL. They don't want borders. Thye wany Israel GONE. Obama's "speech" today will just make it plainer to them that they won't get it handed to them on a plate, and they will be even more cowardly biligerent. Look for more RPG's being fired at yellow Jewish school busses. I think the same can be said for some Israelis and even some evangelicals who would love nothing more than to have no Palestinian state.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2011 21:59:03 GMT -5
One would think the Palestinians would be ecstatic to have Israel pull back to the 1967 borders, but they were at leastr as unhappy with Obama's idea as the Israelis were. Why? Because they are still in the "death to Israel" mode. They want it ALL. They don't want borders. Thye wany Israel GONE. Obama's "speech" today will just make it plainer to them that they won't get it handed to them on a plate, and they will be even more cowardly biligerent. Look for more RPG's being fired at yellow Jewish school busses. I think the same can be said for some Israelis and even some evangelicals who would love nothing more than to have no Palestinian state. Funny, I have not not heard the death to Palestinians chants coming from Israel.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on May 22, 2011 22:03:41 GMT -5
They say it to each other with bombs, bombs and more bombs.
Actions some times speak louder than words.
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SweetVirginia
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Post by SweetVirginia on May 22, 2011 22:07:48 GMT -5
I think the same can be said for some Israelis and even some evangelicals who would love nothing more than to have no Palestinian state. Funny, I have not not heard the death to Palestinians chants coming from Israel. Funny, I dont believe I made the claim that Israelis chanted death to the Palestinians. What I said was that I believe there are some Israelis and evangelicals who would like to to have no Palestinian state. That does not translate to "death to Palestinians." That translates to some wishing Palestinians would relocate to Arab countries. You righties exaggerate A LOT.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2011 22:12:12 GMT -5
The Jews in Israel do not have a thing for killing people of other religions. That seems to be reserved for Islamic Jihadists.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2011 22:16:00 GMT -5
Funny, I have not not heard the death to Palestinians chants coming from Israel. Funny, I dont believe I made the claim that Israelis chanted death to the Palestinians. What I said was that I believe there are some Israelis and evangelicals who would like to to have no Palestinian state. That does not translate to "death to Palestinians." That translates to some wishing Palestinians would relocate to Arab countries. You righties exaggerate A LOT. maybe I misunderstood as the post above yours was referencing school busses being blown up. You lefties are so INARTICULATE.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on May 22, 2011 22:21:51 GMT -5
"You lefties are so INARTICULATE." Tennesseer/Moderator
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SweetVirginia
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Post by SweetVirginia on May 22, 2011 22:23:10 GMT -5
Funny, I dont believe I made the claim that Israelis chanted death to the Palestinians. What I said was that I believe there are some Israelis and evangelicals who would like to to have no Palestinian state. That does not translate to "death to Palestinians." That translates to some wishing Palestinians would relocate to Arab countries. You righties exaggerate A LOT. maybe I misunderstood as the post above yours was referencing school busses being blown up. You lefties are so INARTICULATE. I think you just have comprehension problems. I don't even think you know what articulate means if you are implying that I am inarticulate.
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SweetVirginia
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Post by SweetVirginia on May 22, 2011 22:23:48 GMT -5
"You lefties are so INARTICULATE." Tennesseer/Moderator Uh, yeah.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2011 22:34:23 GMT -5
"You lefties are so INARTICULATE." Tennesseer/Moderator Uh, yeah. Not clear. better for you ? And as I already said, I misunderstood.
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henryclay
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Post by henryclay on May 22, 2011 22:49:51 GMT -5
Since it was my post that Virginia took notice of, reposted, and then made this comment: I think the same can be said for some Israelis and even some evangelicals who would love nothing more than to have no Palestinian state. I wonder if she could be more explicit and clear up exactly what it is that she feels "the same can be said for some Israelis and even some evangelicals"? In so doing, I'd also ask if there are enough evangilicals in Israel to be identified as such, or is she speaking of some other evangelicals?
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SweetVirginia
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Post by SweetVirginia on May 22, 2011 22:59:19 GMT -5
Since it was my post that Virginia took notice of, reposted, and then made this comment: I think the same can be said for some Israelis and even some evangelicals who would love nothing more than to have no Palestinian state. I wonder if she could be more explicit and clear up exactly what it is that she feels "the same can be said for some Israelis and even some evangelicals"? In so doing, I'd also ask if there are enough evangilicals in Israel to be identified as such, or is she speaking of some other evangelicals? Henry, I explained my comment on the following post. I think there are Israelis and evangelicals (not Israelis) who would like the Palestinians to relocate to Arab countries (eg: Jordan) and have all of the land go to Israel.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on May 22, 2011 23:10:40 GMT -5
Sweet...their defense minister , Lieberman, is one...all in favor of that , has proposed it, out loud, not quietly behind their doors..also ame of the Israeli Arabs, 1.2 million, worried in x amount of years, israel will not be a State of majority Jews due to the much larger families the Palastinians have , Obama mentioned that problem as one theState is faced with in todays speech. The ultra right beleive West bank, provinces are Judea, Samaria, part of G-d's grant to the Israelites , their home land, feel they have a perfect right to it, whicjh is fine but so many million Palastinians there now..but if they were moved to Arab lands...I don't know about Evangelist but from what i do known of them, they believe when the time comes, Messiah comes back, and the big battle, the Jews in this land are needed. Not sure if they really care what happens to us when the battle comes about but it's important we are there. Actually any one know about us, are we supposed to sit on the sidelines just watching, making book on the out come, act as a cheering squad, would like to know if we have a role in all this actually.
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henryclay
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Post by henryclay on May 22, 2011 23:12:51 GMT -5
Virginia, that is a new position that has never been publicized. Or certinly one that I have missed. Do you have anything you can point to that substantiates it? Or, do you know where the idea came from? That's a rough accusation to make against anybody. I hope it is based on something that can be researched, and not on your own personal assumptions.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 22, 2011 23:16:45 GMT -5
Virginia, that is a new position that has never been publicized. Or certinly one that I have missed. Do you have anything you can point to that substantiates it? Or, do you know where the idea came from? That's a rough accusation to make against anybody. I hope it is based on something that can be researched, and not on your own personal assumptions. A new poll has shown that a majority of Israelis - 51 percent - oppose the creation of a Palestinian state, as opposed to merely 32 percent that favor its establishment. The poll, conducted by Brain's Trust (Maagar Mohot) Research Institute during February 2-3, 2009 www.israelpolicyforum.org/blog/poll-israelis-oppose-palestinian-state-51-32
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on May 22, 2011 23:22:12 GMT -5
Virginia, that is a new position that has never been publicized. Or certinly one that I have missed. Do you have anything you can point to that substantiates it? Or, do you know where the idea came from? That's a rough accusation to make against anybody. I hope it is based on something that can be researched, and not on your own personal assumptions. Henry, I know you don't care for my position on anything, but I think you know I don't lie when it comes to facts. I may be mistaken on something, you might not like my interpretation of something but I never lie as a purposely done item. This is one link there are many, i am surprised you are not familiar with it, Virginia is correct as I was in my post above. It is not the feeling of the majority of Israeli's , remember most Israeli's are Jews but that does not guarantee they are observant Jews, most are not. The right do look on the West bank, Judea and Samaria as lost provinces, some even have a dream. antiwar.com/hacohen/?articleid=11754
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henryclay
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Post by henryclay on May 22, 2011 23:41:27 GMT -5
desi, that is a far different thing than I read. What I read was a response to this: Because they are still in the "death to Israel" mode. They want it ALL. They don't want borders. Thye wany Israel GONE. I didn't read any qualifiers. The entire quote is one thought, and the post I read said straight out that "some" Israelis and "even some exangelicals" want the same thing for the Palestinians. I still haven't seen anything to support that claim..
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SweetVirginia
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Post by SweetVirginia on May 22, 2011 23:44:54 GMT -5
Virginia, that is a new position that has never been publicized. Or certinly one that I have missed. Do you have anything you can point to that substantiates it? Or, do you know where the idea came from? That's a rough accusation to make against anybody. I hope it is based on something that can be researched, and not on your own personal assumptions. Henry, here is Pat Robertson's position on Israel and a Palestinian State. He feels that there should not be a Palestinian state because it could compromise Israel's security. www.patrobertson.com/Speeches/IsraelLauder.asp
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SweetVirginia
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Post by SweetVirginia on May 22, 2011 23:46:43 GMT -5
Bill provided a link to show that there are some Israelis that do not support a Palestinian state. (thanks bill)
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 22, 2011 23:46:43 GMT -5
desi, that is a far different thing than I read. What I read was a response to this: Because they are still in the "death to Israel" mode. They want it ALL. They don't want borders. Thye wany Israel GONE. I didn't read any qualifiers. The entire quote is one thought, and the post I read said straight out that "some" Israelis and "even some exangelicals" want the same thing for the Palestinians. I still haven't seen anything to that effect. You are comparing "Israel" a country and "Palestinians" a people. I posted a poll that stated that a majority of Israelis support the non-existence of Palestine - a country.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on May 22, 2011 23:47:53 GMT -5
desi, that is a far different thing than I read. What I read was a response to this: Because they are still in the "death to Israel" mode. They want it ALL. They don't want borders. Thye wany Israel GONE. I didn't read any qualifiers. The entire quote is one thought, and the post I read said straight out that "some" Israelis and "even some exangelicals" want the same thing for the Palestinians. I still haven't seen anything to support that claim.. I was responding to , I think there are Israelis and evangelicals (not Israelis) who would like the Palestinians to relocate to Arab countries (eg: Jordan) and have all of the land go to Israel. Sorry , thought you were referring to to that post, little confused there. Called the Judea , Samaria two step.
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