THIS dumbass is our new speaker?

[chiver78]

Nov 11, 2023 12:43:53 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Nov 11, 2023 10:36:33 GMT -5 scgal said:

I eat meat, shot and killed animals for food, killed insects....on and on and on it doesn't mean anything to the subject actually this subject should be carried back to the abortion thread.

i disagree.  it means a great deal if you care about developmental biology.

there is certainly no consciousness at fertilization.  even the most zealous Christian doesn't believe that.  otherwise, all of the miscarriages, etc would get funerals and court hearings.  literally nobody wants that for women that have that misfortune.

so, yeah.  it matters.  just not to you.  and that is ok with me.  but you need to at least recognize that it is a consideration for OTHERS if you care about this debate.

and here is your logic flaw - she doesnt care about the debate. in her mind, her opinion is the only one that matters, and fuck everyone else. she's been parroting the same thing, almost verbatim, in every post she makes on the topic. she's inflexible and unwavering on her opinion that "medically necessary" abortions should be the only ones allowed, but isn't interested in discussing what those might actually be. similar to the Republicans railing against the ACA, but not entertaining any discussion of an alternative. it's tiring, and it's never going to change as it's like trying to talk to a brick wall. 🤦‍♀️

[Tennesseer]

Nov 11, 2023 10:36:33 GMT -5 scgal said:

Nov 10, 2023 19:06:57 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

moving on, have you ever had a hamburger?

I eat meat, shot and killed animals for food, killed insects....on and on and on it doesn't mean anything to the subject actually this subject should be carried back to the abortion thread.

Insects, deer, cows, humans etc. are all animals. My guess is your randomly kill insects with no consideration for why they exist on earth. They do have a purpose.

You are no better than the women you scorn for receiving abortions.

[Tennesseer]

It isn't Democrats who are lying about abortion but the author of this article (and others like her here and elsewhere) sure are lying.

Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

Democrats are lying to Americans about abortion. They are both dishonest about where Republicans stand on the issue and misrepresenting their own position. Since they intend to make abortion a key issue in the 2024 election, it is important to set the record straight.

Simply put, most Republicans are moving toward where the majority of Americans are, wanting abortion to be legal but limited to the first 15 weeks of pregnancy. For proof, look no further than the stance of former president Donald Trump, who is leading the GOP primary race by a wide margin; he has called Florida’s six-week abortion ban “terrible” and is pushing back against a nationwide law outlawing the procedure.

Democrats, though they deny it, seek to make abortion access available through the entire nine months of pregnancy That is abhorrent.

Vice President Harris’s husband, Doug Emhoff, told a group of supporters that the 2024 presidential race will be about “Dobbs and democracy”; the White House certainly hopes that will be the case, given their abysmal approval ratings on the economy, immigration, crime and every other matter critical to voters.

Given the outcome of the most recent elections, it makes sense for Democrats to pursue their one winning issue. Axios reports: “After Ohio’s vote Tuesday to protect abortion rights, Democrats are rushing to get similar measures on the ballot next year in key states such as Arizona, Nevada and Florida — partly to boost President Biden and down-ballot Democrats.”

Getting abortion resolutions on ballots in critical swing states would help Democrats turn out young voters who otherwise might not show up and who are now defecting from Joe Biden in droves. The recent New York Times/Siena poll that showed Biden losing to former president Trump in five key swing states also showed Uncle Joe barely ahead with young voters — a group favored him by 26 points in 2020.

Rest of article here: Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

[pulmonarymd]

Nov 11, 2023 12:50:29 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

Nov 11, 2023 12:43:53 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i disagree.  it means a great deal if you care about developmental biology.

there is certainly no consciousness at fertilization.  even the most zealous Christian doesn't believe that.  otherwise, all of the miscarriages, etc would get funerals and court hearings.  literally nobody wants that for women that have that misfortune.

so, yeah.  it matters.  just not to you.  and that is ok with me.  but you need to at least recognize that it is a consideration for OTHERS if you care about this debate.

and here is your logic flaw - she doesnt care about the debate. in her mind, her opinion is the only one that matters, and fuck everyone else. she's been parroting the same thing, almost verbatim, in every post she makes on the topic. she's inflexible and unwavering on her opinion that "medically necessary" abortions should be the only ones allowed, but isn't interested in discussing what those might actually be. similar to the Republicans railing against the ACA, but not entertaining any discussion of an alternative. it's tiring, and it's never going to change as it's like trying to talk to a brick wall. 🤦‍♀️

Actually, it is even worse. She has no care about what the consequences are for the person who is forced to give birth because their reason for an abortion doesn't meet her definition. The pregnancy will result in a child with a horrible genetic disease who will be chronically ill and suffer, leading to an early death. Sucks to be you. Should have planned better before you opened your legs. If it bankrupts you or your family falls apart, oh well. Not my problem. You mean I have to pay more in taxes so those poor people who I would not let get an abortion can get SNAP assistance. Hell no! Let them suffer. She is either the most callous individual or incredibly stupid, because she is unwilling or unable to recognize what she wants to condemn people to have to deal with. But we are the ones without morals.

[scgal]

Nov 11, 2023 12:57:53 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Nov 11, 2023 10:36:33 GMT -5 scgal said:

I eat meat, shot and killed animals for food, killed insects....on and on and on it doesn't mean anything to the subject actually this subject should be carried back to the abortion thread.

Insects, deer, cows, humans etc. are all animals. My guess is your randomly kill insects with no consideration for why they exist on earth. They do have a purpose.

You are no better than the women you scorn for receiving abortions.

All are part of our eco system. Deer hunting is managed to keep the population under control. Me killing a black widow spider in my home is not going to disrupt the eco system. It is not like I'm spraying insecticide all over to kill every living thing on my property. This is a red herring and you know it. Typical democrat points 

[scgal]

Nov 11, 2023 12:50:29 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

Nov 11, 2023 12:43:53 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i disagree.  it means a great deal if you care about developmental biology.

there is certainly no consciousness at fertilization.  even the most zealous Christian doesn't believe that.  otherwise, all of the miscarriages, etc would get funerals and court hearings.  literally nobody wants that for women that have that misfortune.

so, yeah.  it matters.  just not to you.  and that is ok with me.  but you need to at least recognize that it is a consideration for OTHERS if you care about this debate.

and here is your logic flaw - she doesnt care about the debate. in her mind, her opinion is the only one that matters, and fuck everyone else. she's been parroting the same thing, almost verbatim, in every post she makes on the topic. she's inflexible and unwavering on her opinion that "medically necessary" abortions should be the only ones allowed, but isn't interested in discussing what those might actually be. similar to the Republicans railing against the ACA, but not entertaining any discussion of an alternative. it's tiring, and it's never going to change as it's like trying to talk to a brick wall. 🤦‍♀️

I don't devulge into the medically necessary because I'm not a qualified physician. Like the ACA you can be against something without having a solution for something better. ACA was and is a failure, but I come to accept it is what it is. 

[pulmonarymd]

Nov 11, 2023 13:53:14 GMT -5 scgal said:

Nov 11, 2023 12:50:29 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

and here is your logic flaw - she doesnt care about the debate. in her mind, her opinion is the only one that matters, and fuck everyone else. she's been parroting the same thing, almost verbatim, in every post she makes on the topic. she's inflexible and unwavering on her opinion that "medically necessary" abortions should be the only ones allowed, but isn't interested in discussing what those might actually be. similar to the Republicans railing against the ACA, but not entertaining any discussion of an alternative. it's tiring, and it's never going to change as it's like trying to talk to a brick wall. 🤦‍♀️

I don't devulge into the medically necessary because I'm not a qualified physician. Like the ACA you can be against something without having a solution for something better. ACA was and is a failure, but I come to accept it is what it is. 

ACA is a failure in what way? Millions more people have health insurance. More hospitals have closed in states that did not expand medicare. it is only a failure if you think these things are worthless.

And yes, being against something without a plan on how to fix the problem is ridiculous. But you do not believe that millions o funinsured people is a problem, so I can see why you are against the ACA-because you think it caused your premiums to go up or you have to pay taxes. It is all about you.

[thyme4change]

The 15 week ban still leaves us with medical definition problems. It should be legal for all medical problems - health of the baby, health of the mother.

[Opti]

Nov 11, 2023 13:14:04 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

It isn't Democrats who are lying about abortion but the author of this article (and others like her here and elsewhere) sure are lying.

Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

Democrats are lying to Americans about abortion. They are both dishonest about where Republicans stand on the issue and misrepresenting their own position. Since they intend to make abortion a key issue in the 2024 election, it is important to set the record straight.

Simply put, most Republicans are moving toward where the majority of Americans are, wanting abortion to be legal but limited to the first 15 weeks of pregnancy. For proof, look no further than the stance of former president Donald Trump, who is leading the GOP primary race by a wide margin; he has called Florida’s six-week abortion ban “terrible” and is pushing back against a nationwide law outlawing the procedure.

Democrats, though they deny it, seek to make abortion access available through the entire nine months of pregnancy That is abhorrent.

Vice President Harris’s husband, Doug Emhoff, told a group of supporters that the 2024 presidential race will be about “Dobbs and democracy”; the White House certainly hopes that will be the case, given their abysmal approval ratings on the economy, immigration, crime and every other matter critical to voters.

Given the outcome of the most recent elections, it makes sense for Democrats to pursue their one winning issue. Axios reports: “After Ohio’s vote Tuesday to protect abortion rights, Democrats are rushing to get similar measures on the ballot next year in key states such as Arizona, Nevada and Florida — partly to boost President Biden and down-ballot Democrats.”

Getting abortion resolutions on ballots in critical swing states would help Democrats turn out young voters who otherwise might not show up and who are now defecting from Joe Biden in droves. The recent New York Times/Siena poll that showed Biden losing to former president Trump in five key swing states also showed Uncle Joe barely ahead with young voters — a group favored him by 26 points in 2020.

Rest of article here: Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

They love peddling the lie that abortion is OK even at birth. They are sick liars who care nothing about truth and constantly bear false witness. I think its been more than a decade at least that Dems conceded abortions in the third trimester for only medically necessary reasons. And I think its on the order of only 3.6% of all abortions anyway.

Fifteen weeks is too early especially since its been shown over and over again some HS girls don't even realize they are pregnant for certain until they give birth. Safe harbor laws hopefully address saving these surprise infants. 

The author is a bit of a fear monger as who would put up an abortion bill in a conservative state that asked for full access for the entire term of pregnancy. Although, being they are disingenuous types, medically necessary affecting 3.6% or less of all abortions probably emotionally gives them the feels it is for any reason. Wish I could sentence them to a life of being poor having to raise a disabled child or one with serious medical issues.

[dondubble]

Nov 11, 2023 14:28:13 GMT -5 Opti said:

Nov 11, 2023 13:14:04 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

It isn't Democrats who are lying about abortion but the author of this article (and others like her here and elsewhere) sure are lying.

Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

Democrats are lying to Americans about abortion. They are both dishonest about where Republicans stand on the issue and misrepresenting their own position. Since they intend to make abortion a key issue in the 2024 election, it is important to set the record straight.

Simply put, most Republicans are moving toward where the majority of Americans are, wanting abortion to be legal but limited to the first 15 weeks of pregnancy. For proof, look no further than the stance of former president Donald Trump, who is leading the GOP primary race by a wide margin; he has called Florida’s six-week abortion ban “terrible” and is pushing back against a nationwide law outlawing the procedure.

Democrats, though they deny it, seek to make abortion access available through the entire nine months of pregnancy That is abhorrent.

Vice President Harris’s husband, Doug Emhoff, told a group of supporters that the 2024 presidential race will be about “Dobbs and democracy”; the White House certainly hopes that will be the case, given their abysmal approval ratings on the economy, immigration, crime and every other matter critical to voters.

Given the outcome of the most recent elections, it makes sense for Democrats to pursue their one winning issue. Axios reports: “After Ohio’s vote Tuesday to protect abortion rights, Democrats are rushing to get similar measures on the ballot next year in key states such as Arizona, Nevada and Florida — partly to boost President Biden and down-ballot Democrats.”

Getting abortion resolutions on ballots in critical swing states would help Democrats turn out young voters who otherwise might not show up and who are now defecting from Joe Biden in droves. The recent New York Times/Siena poll that showed Biden losing to former president Trump in five key swing states also showed Uncle Joe barely ahead with young voters — a group favored him by 26 points in 2020.

Rest of article here: Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

They love peddling the lie that abortion is OK even at birth. They are sick liars who care nothing about truth and constantly bear false witness. I think its been more than a decade at least that Dems conceded abortions in the third trimester for only medically necessary reasons. And I think its on the order of only 3.6% of all abortions anyway.

Fifteen weeks is too early especially since its been shown over and over again some HS girls don't even realize they are pregnant for certain until they give birth. Safe harbor laws hopefully address saving these surprise infants. 

The author is a bit of a fear monger as who would put up an abortion bill in a conservative state that asked for full access for the entire term of pregnancy. Although, being they are disingenuous types, medically necessary affecting 3.6% or less of all abortions probably emotionally gives them the feels it is for any reason. Wish I could sentence them to a life of being poor having to raise a disabled child or one with serious medical issues.

I’ve seen <1%.

[chiver78]

Nov 11, 2023 13:14:57 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Nov 11, 2023 12:50:29 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

and here is your logic flaw - she doesnt care about the debate. in her mind, her opinion is the only one that matters, and fuck everyone else. she's been parroting the same thing, almost verbatim, in every post she makes on the topic. she's inflexible and unwavering on her opinion that "medically necessary" abortions should be the only ones allowed, but isn't interested in discussing what those might actually be. similar to the Republicans railing against the ACA, but not entertaining any discussion of an alternative. it's tiring, and it's never going to change as it's like trying to talk to a brick wall. 🤦‍♀️

Actually, it is even worse. She has no care about what the consequences are for the person who is forced to give birth because their reason for an abortion doesn't meet her definition. The pregnancy will result in a child with a horrible genetic disease who will be chronically ill and suffer, leading to an early death. Sucks to be you. Should have planned better before you opened your legs. If it bankrupts you or your family falls apart, oh well. Not my problem. You mean I have to pay more in taxes so those poor people who I would not let get an abortion can get SNAP assistance. Hell no! Let them suffer. She is either the most callous individual or incredibly stupid, because she is unwilling or unable to recognize what she wants to condemn people to have to deal with. But we are the ones without morals.

oh, I'm aware. but that would have added way more lines to a post that wasted enough of my time and brainpower. 

[djAdvocate]

Nov 11, 2023 12:50:29 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

Nov 11, 2023 12:43:53 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i disagree.  it means a great deal if you care about developmental biology.

there is certainly no consciousness at fertilization.  even the most zealous Christian doesn't believe that.  otherwise, all of the miscarriages, etc would get funerals and court hearings.  literally nobody wants that for women that have that misfortune.

so, yeah.  it matters.  just not to you.  and that is ok with me.  but you need to at least recognize that it is a consideration for OTHERS if you care about this debate.

and here is your logic flaw - she doesnt care about the debate.

it is not a logical flaw.  it is a conditional statement.

it is also a fact.  are you denying it?  if someone, ANYONE, you- me, cares about debate, it REQUIRES them to consider that others have their own set of facts on their side, which they are arguing against yours.

then the argument devolves to facts, and the best facts win.

if it helps, imagine this question in the abstract.  

[djAdvocate]

Nov 11, 2023 12:57:53 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Nov 11, 2023 10:36:33 GMT -5 scgal said:

I eat meat, shot and killed animals for food, killed insects....on and on and on it doesn't mean anything to the subject actually this subject should be carried back to the abortion thread.

Insects, deer, cows, humans etc. are all animals. My guess is your randomly kill insects with no consideration for why they exist on earth. They do have a purpose.

You are no better than the women you scorn for receiving abortions.

i am not sure that is true.  i would just say that it is logically inconsistent to think killing for meat (or even better, "population control") is OK and that abortion for non-viable fetuses is not.

are you familiar with A Modest Proposal, Tenn?  even though it is satire, it is a good illustration of logical extension on this debate for the third trimester problem.

[djAdvocate]

Nov 11, 2023 13:14:04 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

It isn't Democrats who are lying about abortion but the author of this article (and others like her here and elsewhere) sure are lying.

Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

Democrats are lying to Americans about abortion. They are both dishonest about where Republicans stand on the issue and misrepresenting their own position. Since they intend to make abortion a key issue in the 2024 election, it is important to set the record straight.

Simply put, most Republicans are moving toward where the majority of Americans are, wanting abortion to be legal but limited to the first 15 weeks of pregnancy. 

Rest of article here: Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

really?  i don't think i have seen that anywhere.  can someone show me that this is true?
not joking around here, i really WOULD like to see it.

[djAdvocate]

Nov 11, 2023 14:02:15 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Nov 11, 2023 13:53:14 GMT -5 scgal said:

I don't devulge into the medically necessary because I'm not a qualified physician. Like the ACA you can be against something without having a solution for something better. ACA was and is a failure, but I come to accept it is what it is. 

ACA is a failure in what way? Millions more people have health insurance. More hospitals have closed in states that did not expand medicare. it is only a failure if you think these things are worthless.

And yes, being against something without a plan on how to fix the problem is ridiculous. But you do not believe that millions o funinsured people is a problem, so I can see why you are against the ACA-because you think it caused your premiums to go up or you have to pay taxes. It is all about you.

it is a failure because it didn't offer a public option.
i blame a few "moderate" Democrats for that.
without them, we could have it.
and it would be universally accepted now, if we did, i believe.

what we have instead is expanded medicare.
which is, indeed, and improvement over before.
but it does not nearly get us to the endpoint.

[djAdvocate]

Nov 11, 2023 13:49:52 GMT -5 scgal said:

Nov 11, 2023 12:57:53 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Insects, deer, cows, humans etc. are all animals. My guess is your randomly kill insects with no consideration for why they exist on earth. They do have a purpose.

You are no better than the women you scorn for receiving abortions.

All are part of our eco system. Deer hunting is managed to keep the population under control.

abortion is managed to keep the population under control.

ergo......

[djAdvocate]

Nov 11, 2023 14:28:13 GMT -5 Opti said:

Nov 11, 2023 13:14:04 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

It isn't Democrats who are lying about abortion but the author of this article (and others like her here and elsewhere) sure are lying.

Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

Democrats are lying to Americans about abortion. They are both dishonest about where Republicans stand on the issue and misrepresenting their own position. Since they intend to make abortion a key issue in the 2024 election, it is important to set the record straight.

Simply put, most Republicans are moving toward where the majority of Americans are, wanting abortion to be legal but limited to the first 15 weeks of pregnancy. For proof, look no further than the stance of former president Donald Trump, who is leading the GOP primary race by a wide margin; he has called Florida’s six-week abortion ban “terrible” and is pushing back against a nationwide law outlawing the procedure.

Democrats, though they deny it, seek to make abortion access available through the entire nine months of pregnancy That is abhorrent.

Vice President Harris’s husband, Doug Emhoff, told a group of supporters that the 2024 presidential race will be about “Dobbs and democracy”; the White House certainly hopes that will be the case, given their abysmal approval ratings on the economy, immigration, crime and every other matter critical to voters.

Given the outcome of the most recent elections, it makes sense for Democrats to pursue their one winning issue. Axios reports: “After Ohio’s vote Tuesday to protect abortion rights, Democrats are rushing to get similar measures on the ballot next year in key states such as Arizona, Nevada and Florida — partly to boost President Biden and down-ballot Democrats.”

Getting abortion resolutions on ballots in critical swing states would help Democrats turn out young voters who otherwise might not show up and who are now defecting from Joe Biden in droves. The recent New York Times/Siena poll that showed Biden losing to former president Trump in five key swing states also showed Uncle Joe barely ahead with young voters — a group favored him by 26 points in 2020.

Rest of article here: Be wary of Democrats’ lies about abortion

They love peddling the lie that abortion is OK even at birth. They are sick liars who care nothing about truth and constantly bear false witness. I think its been more than a decade at least that Dems conceded abortions in the third trimester for only medically necessary reasons. And I think its on the order of only 3.6% of all abortions anyway.

Fifteen weeks is too early especially since its been shown over and over again some HS girls don't even realize they are pregnant for certain until they give birth. Safe harbor laws hopefully address saving these surprise infants. 

i agree with this.  some medical issues are quite complicated.  this becomes a discussion about making abortion illegal for those that discover problems late, or not.  the number of complications past midterm should be part of the discussion, but i have never seen it in print, or as part of ANY discussion.

[chiver78]

Nov 11, 2023 16:01:27 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Nov 11, 2023 12:50:29 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

and here is your logic flaw - she doesnt care about the debate.

it is not a logical flaw.  it is a conditional statement.

it is also a fact.  are you denying it?  if someone, ANYONE, you- me, cares about debate, it REQUIRES them to consider that others have their own set of facts on their side, which they are arguing against yours.

then the argument devolves to facts, and the best facts win.

if it helps, imagine this question in the abstract.  

see my followup to pmd.    I'm perfectly willing to participate in a discussion on the topic, with people that actually participate. same as with any discussion on complicated topics. 

[pulmonarymd]

Nov 11, 2023 16:09:40 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Nov 11, 2023 14:02:15 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

ACA is a failure in what way? Millions more people have health insurance. More hospitals have closed in states that did not expand medicare. it is only a failure if you think these things are worthless.

And yes, being against something without a plan on how to fix the problem is ridiculous. But you do not believe that millions o funinsured people is a problem, so I can see why you are against the ACA-because you think it caused your premiums to go up or you have to pay taxes. It is all about you.

it is a failure because it didn't offer a public option.
i blame a few "moderate" Democrats for that.
without them, we could have it.
and it would be universally accepted now, if we did, i believe.

what we have instead is expanded medicare.
which is, indeed, and improvement over before.
but it does not nearly get us to the endpoint.

I understand that. Unfortunately, that isn’t what she means. It was an incremental improvement. Better than it was. Still have a ways to go

[djAdvocate]

Nov 11, 2023 16:15:25 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

Nov 11, 2023 16:01:27 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

it is not a logical flaw.  it is a conditional statement.

it is also a fact.  are you denying it?  if someone, ANYONE, you- me, cares about debate, it REQUIRES them to consider that others have their own set of facts on their side, which they are arguing against yours.

then the argument devolves to facts, and the best facts win.

if it helps, imagine this question in the abstract.  

see my followup to pmd.    I'm perfectly willing to participate in a discussion on the topic, with people that actually participate. same as with any discussion on complicated topics. 

well, my point was a bit more direct (though obliquely stated):

you are not really having a discussion with someone who is not entertaining your facts.
you are simply stating your facts for OTHERS that are participating in a discussion.

agree or disagree?

[chiver78]

Nov 11, 2023 16:17:43 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Nov 11, 2023 16:15:25 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

see my followup to pmd.    I'm perfectly willing to participate in a discussion on the topic, with people that actually participate. same as with any discussion on complicated topics. 

well, my point was a bit more direct (though obliquely stated):

you are not really having a discussion with someone who is not entertaining your facts.
you are simply stating your facts for OTHERS that are participating in a discussion.

agree or disagree?

yes, I will agree with that. but this is why I enjoy participating in discussions and debates with you, vs the other poster. you debate for the sake of debating, and I don't do that all that often anymore. I actually unpacked a box today that wasn't at all what I expected, and found a couple college essays that showed I was pretty smahhhhhht* at one point in my life. the other is more like screaming into a vacuum like most internet interactions. anyway, I'm annoyed at myself for having wasted the amount of time on them that I already have today. so with that, I'm out of this thread arc for the night. 

*I am from Boston, after all. 

[djAdvocate]

Nov 11, 2023 16:38:13 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

Nov 11, 2023 16:17:43 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

well, my point was a bit more direct (though obliquely stated):

you are not really having a discussion with someone who is not entertaining your facts.
you are simply stating your facts for OTHERS that are participating in a discussion.

agree or disagree?

yes, I will agree with that. but this is why I enjoy participating in discussions and debates with you, vs the other poster. you debate for the sake of debating, and I don't do that all that often anymore. I actually unpacked a box today that wasn't at all what I expected, and found a couple college essays that showed I was pretty smahhhhhht* at one point in my life. the other is more like screaming into a vacuum like most internet interactions. anyway, I'm annoyed at myself for having wasted the amount of time on them that I already have today. so with that, I'm out of this thread arc for the night. 

*I am from Boston, after all. 

not to encourage you, but keep in mind that you are not wasting time on them.
you are EITHER stating your opinion which will hopefully influence those actually discussing, OR
you are venting (which has it's own cathartic qualities).  in any case, we all eat chocolate, now
and again.  unless we are severely diabetic, it won't kill us, even if it does not particularly help us.

[Opti]

Dark chocolate saves lives! 

[tallguy]

Nov 11, 2023 16:46:41 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Nov 11, 2023 16:38:13 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

yes, I will agree with that. but this is why I enjoy participating in discussions and debates with you, vs the other poster. you debate for the sake of debating, and I don't do that all that often anymore. I actually unpacked a box today that wasn't at all what I expected, and found a couple college essays that showed I was pretty smahhhhhht* at one point in my life. the other is more like screaming into a vacuum like most internet interactions. anyway, I'm annoyed at myself for having wasted the amount of time on them that I already have today. so with that, I'm out of this thread arc for the night. 

*I am from Boston, after all. 

not to encourage you, but keep in mind that you are not wasting time on them.
you are EITHER stating your opinion which will hopefully influence those actually discussing, OR
you are venting (which has it's own cathartic qualities).  in any case, we all eat chocolate, now
and again.  unless we are severely diabetic, it won't kill us, even if it does not particularly help us.

I never have any illusion that I am doing anything to convince stupid people of their error.  Most of those are beyond hope.  I do have a belief (and have had it confirmed on occasion) that I am influencing or convincing the open-minded yet undecided.  Good enough.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Not to change the subject from imprisoning like 20% of the population, but is anyone concerned that the new speaker of the house that is presenting a proposal to keep our government funded is apparently broke himself?  Seriously, this is concerning to me.  Either he is the absolute worst person to make financial decisions for the country or he's got some shady shit going on hiding assets.

[scgal]

Nov 11, 2023 16:11:18 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Nov 11, 2023 13:49:52 GMT -5 scgal said:

All are part of our eco system. Deer hunting is managed to keep the population under control.

abortion is managed to keep the population under control.

ergo......

human beings ergo....

[chiver78]

Nov 11, 2023 17:15:01 GMT -5 scgal said:

Nov 11, 2023 16:11:18 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

abortion is managed to keep the population under control.

ergo......

human beings ergo....

what does that even fucking mean? can you actually intelligently convey a point that doesn't include parrot points?

[chiver78]

Nov 11, 2023 16:46:41 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Nov 11, 2023 16:38:13 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

yes, I will agree with that. but this is why I enjoy participating in discussions and debates with you, vs the other poster. you debate for the sake of debating, and I don't do that all that often anymore. I actually unpacked a box today that wasn't at all what I expected, and found a couple college essays that showed I was pretty smahhhhhht* at one point in my life. the other is more like screaming into a vacuum like most internet interactions. anyway, I'm annoyed at myself for having wasted the amount of time on them that I already have today. so with that, I'm out of this thread arc for the night. 

*I am from Boston, after all. 

not to encourage you, but keep in mind that you are not wasting time on them.
you are EITHER stating your opinion which will hopefully influence those actually discussing, OR
you are venting (which has it's own cathartic qualities).  in any case, we all eat chocolate, now
and again.  unless we are severely diabetic, it won't kill us, even if it does not particularly help us.

I know, discussion still influences those reading and not yet participating. I'm just tired of the airtime we all still give this closed and locked mind. (and I know, I just responded again. I need to be better about that 🙄)

but, you can have my portion of the chocolates. I don't actually like it. I'll raise my glass of wine to toast. 🙃

[Opti]

Nov 11, 2023 17:13:29 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Not to change the subject from imprisoning like 20% of the population, but is anyone concerned that the new speaker of the house that is presenting a proposal to keep our government funded is apparently broke himself?  Seriously, this is concerning to me.  Either he is the absolute worst person to make financial decisions for the country or he's got some shady shit going on hiding assets.

Maybe both? What little I have read is he has omitted information on required financial statements. 

[tallguy]

Nov 11, 2023 17:31:39 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

Nov 11, 2023 17:15:01 GMT -5 scgal said:

human beings ergo....

what does that even fucking mean? can you actually intelligently convey a point that doesn't include parrot points?

I think that has already been determined, don't you?