scgal
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Post by scgal on Nov 22, 2023 13:13:17 GMT -5
Just because a "seasoned" attorney want to press charges does not make a guilty person. I don't know why I think a democrat would think differently. Everything against him other than the documents is political motivated. The documents will be interesting to see how that comes out. I'm willing to say that if he is found guilty on that then there still will be no jail time. Correct, pressing charges doesn't make one guilty. Showing all the evidence to a jury and them convicting him does. That will be happening, whether you believe it or not. But continue living in your delusional world. It hasn't happened yet and most likely won't and if does he still won't go to jail. I don't live in a delusional world anyone on this board is delusional if they think Trump will serve any prision time. |
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Nov 22, 2023 14:12:55 GMT -5
Correct, pressing charges doesn't make one guilty. Showing all the evidence to a jury and them convicting him does. That will be happening, whether you believe it or not. But continue living in your delusional world. It hasn't happened yet and most likely won't and if does he still won't go to jail. I don't live in a delusional world anyone on this board is delusional if they think Trump will serve any prision time. I actually work in the criminal justice world, and based on the evidence that appears to be able to be presented and proved, there is a substantial chance he will serve some jail time. Trump is not helping himself by continuing to yammer in public about all his issues. |
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 22, 2023 19:10:19 GMT -5
do you trust the republicans? if so, why? The democrats have shown they blow everything out of proportion. The 2 impeachments against trump was bogus never should have been brought up. They are so scared (blaming it on damage on what Trump would, can do as president) of Trump they will do anything to stop him. i didn't ask you about democrats. i know what you think of them. do you trust republicans? if so, why? |
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 22, 2023 19:11:20 GMT -5
do you trust the republicans? if so, why? When they get someone like MTG they keep her at bay she barks a lot but they don't give her any meat The democrats are just full blown nuts they will entertain all kinds of crap look at the 2 impeachments on Trump they were bogus yet they did it anyway. How many impeachments inquiries did mtg do against Biden the republicans kept her at bay strike two. i know you can read, scgal. try again. |
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 22, 2023 19:16:55 GMT -5
So you're saying that seasoned district attorneys are just making up the fact that he has been committing crimes his entire adult life? So he didn't try to overthrow the government? He didn't try to overturn a free and fair election? He didn't ask GA to "find" him votes? We all saw it happen. It's all on video. Put the kool-aid down. Just because a "seasoned" attorney want to press charges does not make a guilty person. I don't know why I think a democrat would think differently. Everything against him other than the documents is political motivated. The documents will be interesting to see how that comes out. I'm willing to say that if he is found guilty on that then there still will be no jail time. that is because he committed political crimes. but i would also add that this is kind of like saying that rape is sexually motivated. that is a surprisingly debatable point. rape is mostly about power. so is this. |
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 22, 2023 19:18:44 GMT -5
Again, delusional. You've called for various groups to be shot. Show the post show the post show the goddam post. The only time I said about shooting anyone I was using it as an extreme process of border crossers and even then in one of my post I said I don't support that. I never said anyone should be shot. If you are referring to someone breaking into my property or stealing from me sorry sister that is my right to protect me and anything that belongs to me. Get a grip so, since what is in the capitol is technically my property (and yours), were you OK with capitol police gunning down anyone that entered the capitol? |
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 1:01:25 GMT -5
Just because a "seasoned" attorney want to press charges does not make a guilty person. I don't know why I think a democrat would think differently. Everything against him other than the documents is political motivated. The documents will be interesting to see how that comes out. I'm willing to say that if he is found guilty on that then there still will be no jail time. that is because he committed political crimes. but i would also add that this is kind of like saying that rape is sexually motivated. that is a surprisingly debatable point. rape is mostly about power. so is this. I will echo that Trump committed many politically motivated crimes to stay in power. Makes Nixon's tape erasing look almost quaint in comparison. Commit political crimes ... it should be QED that yes the enforcement response is going to be from political organizations as well. He is guilty, will be found guilty but I sadly agree with scgal. He is mostly likely to be fined even if he should be jailed. And there might be closed settlements too in the name of national security. I will hate the latter, but I am not well versed in international politics, so it might be the right call. IDK. Germany the country did not go after Hitler. It took the international community to do so. |
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 1:03:39 GMT -5
It hasn't happened yet and most likely won't and if does he still won't go to jail. I don't live in a delusional world anyone on this board is delusional if they think Trump will serve any prision time. I actually work in the criminal justice world, and based on the evidence that appears to be able to be presented and proved, there is a substantial chance he will serve some jail time. Trump is not helping himself by continuing to yammer in public about all his issues. I think he should be jailed immediately for his next contempt of court outburst. Even if it is in a Martha Stewart type jail. Even if it is only a week. It needs to be done, and I'd like to think I would have done it already. |
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 1:09:27 GMT -5
I hate to break it to you. Trump will die in jail. DeSantis would be the absolute worst thing that could happen to America. It doesn't matter though, he's failing hard core in the polls anyway. Plus, you don't like cross dressers and he wears heels and knee high boots wherever he goes. Shouldn't you want him dead like all the other drag queens? And boy will you cry when he don't. I don't want any drag queens dead where did you get that idea? I don't know when Trump will die or how. I think if he dies in the next 4 to 7 years there will be parties in the spirit of Ding Dong the witch is dead in the US and all over the globe. Please clarify, what do you think andi will cry about? |
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 1:13:00 GMT -5
Trust me, I will not be crying. He is in so much trouble that there is no way it will not happen. You're always advocating for people who don't agree with you to be shot. Just go back and read your own posts. That and people who don't look like you. I didn't say 1 post ever about people disagreeing with me to be shot. Good.  We had a former poster who advocated multiple times for liberals to be shot dead. And he did include those of us posting on the board. Yet, because free speech and ID know what, Moon never banned him for it or made sure those posts are removed. I do not miss that attitude and the belief you can kill your way to political purity. That's a Hitler move, and many other dictators throughout history. |
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 23, 2023 1:35:40 GMT -5
that is because he committed political crimes. but i would also add that this is kind of like saying that rape is sexually motivated. that is a surprisingly debatable point. rape is mostly about power. so is this. I will echo that Trump committed many politically motivated crimes to stay in power. Makes Nixon's tape erasing look almost quaint in comparison. Commit political crimes ... it should be QED that yes the enforcement response is going to be from political organizations as well. He is guilty, will be found guilty but I sadly agree with scgal. He is mostly likely to be fined even if he should be jailed. And there might be closed settlements too in the name of national security. I will hate the latter, but I am not well versed in international politics, so it might be the right call. IDK. Germany the country did not go after Hitler. It took the international community to do so. this reminds me of the tolerating intolerance discussion. conservatives think they are being clever with language. but, in fact, any trial involving politics will appear "political" to those that agree with the politics. that is fine. but when the politics run afoul of the law, they should be prosecuted. |
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 23, 2023 1:40:47 GMT -5
i just read a horrendous thing about Florida:
Florida Republican Rep. Ryan Chamberlin has introduced new state legislation that is effectively a “Don’t Say Gay” bill for the workplace. It also contains provisions that could make it impossible for LGBTQ+ nonprofits to operate in the state.
depriving the free speech rights of businesses?
what the actual hell?
if there is a state i am least likely to move to today, it is Florida.
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scgal
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Post by scgal on Nov 23, 2023 6:38:33 GMT -5
When they get someone like MTG they keep her at bay she barks a lot but they don't give her any meat The democrats are just full blown nuts they will entertain all kinds of crap look at the 2 impeachments on Trump they were bogus yet they did it anyway. How many impeachments inquiries did mtg do against Biden the republicans kept her at bay strike two. i know you can read, scgal . try again. OK befor you give me a strike three. I am referring to they don't act like the democrats and keep their people at bay. NO phony impeachments and such. |
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scgal
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Post by scgal on Nov 23, 2023 6:39:22 GMT -5
And boy will you cry when he don't. I don't want any drag queens dead where did you get that idea? I don't know when Trump will die or how. I think if he dies in the next 4 to 7 years there will be parties in the spirit of Ding Dong the witch is dead in the US and all over the globe. Please clarify, what do you think andi will cry about? When he doesn't die in jail. He won't even go to prision |
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scgal
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Post by scgal on Nov 23, 2023 6:41:03 GMT -5
Show the post show the post show the goddam post. The only time I said about shooting anyone I was using it as an extreme process of border crossers and even then in one of my post I said I don't support that. I never said anyone should be shot. If you are referring to someone breaking into my property or stealing from me sorry sister that is my right to protect me and anything that belongs to me. Get a grip so, since what is in the capitol is technically my property (and yours), were you OK with capitol police gunning down anyone that entered the capitol? Yes I am. Storm the white house and see what happens. You have guards for a reason to guard the place shoot if necessary. |
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scgal
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Post by scgal on Nov 23, 2023 6:42:38 GMT -5
Just because a "seasoned" attorney want to press charges does not make a guilty person. I don't know why I think a democrat would think differently. Everything against him other than the documents is political motivated. The documents will be interesting to see how that comes out. I'm willing to say that if he is found guilty on that then there still will be no jail time. that is because he committed political crimes. but i would also add that this is kind of like saying that rape is sexually motivated. that is a surprisingly debatable point. rape is mostly about power. so is this. This is where you and I disagree I don't think he committed any political crimes. At least none that i'm aware of. Being an arrogant loudmouth is not a crime |
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 7:07:50 GMT -5
that is because he committed political crimes. but i would also add that this is kind of like saying that rape is sexually motivated. that is a surprisingly debatable point. rape is mostly about power. so is this. This is where you and I disagree I don't think he committed any political crimes. At least none that i'm aware of. Being an arrogant loudmouth is not a crime The advantage I have over you is I have studied these political type laws starting back with Cheney and Bush. I know he broke laws. I know he committed political crimes. Hillary got raked over the coals and hung in effigy by much of the Right because she has dared to be herself all these years. They had to retroactively classify, and audit things found on her computer and later her associate's computer to find three classified documents. Three. She was Sec of State. And they were at the lowest classification level that exists. Contrast that with Trump who had Top Secret level docs intentionally hidden in one of his personal bathrooms because he did not want to turn them over. He lied to his lawyers, probably gave them just enough that he felt they'd believe him and he kept the rest to probably be used on foreign leaders. If he hasn't already. And it is unlikely those leaders will talk ever about it unless they want to punish him in the future. You just don't have the historical knowledge to assess this, and I am not a lawyer but Swamp being in NY State definitely has insight especially at the state level. Many politicians have been tried and convicted of crimes in the tri-state area. So Swamp, I and likely PMD as just a few are probably very aware of these. - This is super important, the fact that you think any of these legit laws on the books that he is being charged with has anything to do with him being an arrogant loudmouth implies to me you havent even followed real free speech cases over the years
- Congrats on buying the RW Trump messaging that he is being politicially targeted and free speech is total. In various court cases many limits on what is and isn't free speech have been determined. He regularly uses his loudmouth to target his political enemies by slander. He is aware his supporters will persecute and ruin lives of his targets. Because they have bought the messaging from Trump that he loves them all and he is the target on their behalf. This is a lie but sadly brilliant marketing on his part.
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scgal
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Post by scgal on Nov 23, 2023 7:15:26 GMT -5
This is where you and I disagree I don't think he committed any political crimes. At least none that i'm aware of. Being an arrogant loudmouth is not a crime The advantage I have over you is I have studied these political type laws starting back with Cheney and Bush. I know he broke laws. I know he committed political crimes. Hillary got raked over the coals and hung in effigy by much of the Right because she has dared to be herself all these years. They had to retroactively classify, and audit things found on her computer and later her associate's computer to find three classified documents. Three. She was Sec of State. And they were at the lowest classification level that exists. Contrast that with Trump who had Top Secret level docs intentionally hidden in one of his personal bathrooms because he did not want to turn them over. He lied to his lawyers, probably gave them just enough that he felt they'd believe him and he kept the rest to probably be used on foreign leaders. If he hasn't already. And it is unlikely those leaders will talk ever about it unless they want to punish him in the future. You just don't have the historical knowledge to assess this, and I am not a lawyer but Swamp being in NY State definitely has insight especially at the state level. Many politicians have been tried and convicted of crimes in the tri-state area. So Swamp, I and likely PMD as just a few are probably very aware of these. - This is super important, the fact that you think any of these legit laws on the books that he is being charged with has anything to do with him being an arrogant loudmouth implies to me you havent even followed real free speech cases over the years
- Congrats on buying the RW Trump messaging that he is being politicially targeted and free speech is total. In various court cases many limits on what is and isn't free speech have been determined. He regularly uses his loudmouth to target his political enemies by slander. He is aware his supporters will persecute and ruin lives of his targets. Because they have bought the messaging from Trump that he loves them all and he is the target on their behalf. This is a lie but sadly brilliant marketing on his part.
Again I differ with you... You think not know he broke political laws...then again what political laws did he break and some interpetation of what you would believe the offense is. In other words if he didn't come out and say or do it then it did not happen. |
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 7:22:44 GMT -5
Lastly, Scgal and any of our conservative posters and lurkers, I wish for you to educate yourselves instead of getting your opinions predigested by Trump, QAnon, Fox, Hannity, etc.
I would bet, but do not know, that there are probably annual federal laws published. There probably are ones published for our three branches of govt. Swamp might now and might share if I am on the right track or whether it works differently at this level.
NJ the state publishes laws every year. The last time I was shown the books by a lawyer, they were two very substantional softcover books.
Over the years, whether it was trying to fight a parking ticket I believe I shouldn't have received or learning the hard way my town had a limit on how long my dead Honda could remain in my ing spot. I figure apartment mgmt reported it, instead of actually talking to me and at least giving me a heads up.
I will probably have to tow my dead BMW and drop it in my spot next week or sooner, FWIW. In any event, I have had legal encounters at the city and county level of NJ. I have been to court and read up on laws and learned quite a bit just listening to the cases being prosecuated and defended while waiting.
We used to have three lawyers posting regularly and now the burden all falls on to Swamp when we as board members want some legal expertise / legal opinions.
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 7:24:08 GMT -5
The advantage I have over you is I have studied these political type laws starting back with Cheney and Bush. I know he broke laws. I know he committed political crimes. Hillary got raked over the coals and hung in effigy by much of the Right because she has dared to be herself all these years. They had to retroactively classify, and audit things found on her computer and later her associate's computer to find three classified documents. Three. She was Sec of State. And they were at the lowest classification level that exists. Contrast that with Trump who had Top Secret level docs intentionally hidden in one of his personal bathrooms because he did not want to turn them over. He lied to his lawyers, probably gave them just enough that he felt they'd believe him and he kept the rest to probably be used on foreign leaders. If he hasn't already. And it is unlikely those leaders will talk ever about it unless they want to punish him in the future. You just don't have the historical knowledge to assess this, and I am not a lawyer but Swamp being in NY State definitely has insight especially at the state level. Many politicians have been tried and convicted of crimes in the tri-state area. So Swamp, I and likely PMD as just a few are probably very aware of these. - This is super important, the fact that you think any of these legit laws on the books that he is being charged with has anything to do with him being an arrogant loudmouth implies to me you havent even followed real free speech cases over the years
- Congrats on buying the RW Trump messaging that he is being politicially targeted and free speech is total. In various court cases many limits on what is and isn't free speech have been determined. He regularly uses his loudmouth to target his political enemies by slander. He is aware his supporters will persecute and ruin lives of his targets. Because they have bought the messaging from Trump that he loves them all and he is the target on their behalf. This is a lie but sadly brilliant marketing on his part.
Again I differ with you... You think not know he broke political laws...then again what political laws did he break and some interpetation of what you would believe the offense is. In other words if he didn't come out and say or do it then it did not happen. You don't have to beg. You are provably wrong, but you are breaking no laws unless you slandered me. Then, I could use your posts as examples of your lack of understanding of laws including free speech and slander. |
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Post by tallguy on Nov 23, 2023 8:42:46 GMT -5
strike two. i know you can read, scgal . try again. OK befor you give me a strike three. I am referring to they don't act like the democrats and keep their people at bay. NO phony impeachments and such. It should not be humanly possible to be this f***ing ignorant, but yet, here you are. MTG alone has more phony impeachment attempts on her record than every Democrat combined. |
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 9:03:00 GMT -5
OK befor you give me a strike three. I am referring to they don't act like the democrats and keep their people at bay. NO phony impeachments and such. It should not be humanly possible to be this f***ing ignorant, but yet, here you are. MTG alone has more phony impeachment attempts on her record than every Democrat combined. Thanks for quoting this TG. Lord have mercy scgal. I know many conservatives see almost everything in black and white , us them, but damn. The impeachment is real. It is the most documented and legit impeachment since Nixon. (TG or DJ will correct me if I am wrong about whether Nixon was up for impeachment, censure or whatever.) There is also the corruption of blacklisting back in the day which Trump has already done in his first term behind the scenes and in public.  It should tell you something scgal, that Liz Cheney, most of the Dems, most independents like Bernie Sanders are united in trying to keep the danger that is Trump away from our democracy. He has successfully weakened the courts which you may be happy about now, but those chickens are already roosting and you might be less happy if the Dems actually do retaliate Trump style. If the federal support to red states finally were brought into line with blue state tax burdens. The only phony impeachment attempts are on the GOP side. Hunter Biden is guilty of various things that not surprising the Trump clan is also guilty of. Joe BIden has been in politics a long time. He knows where certain lines need to be. Just like some of the Bush family and the unfortunate Billy Beer et al. |
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Post by Opti on Nov 23, 2023 9:06:47 GMT -5
Summary, scgal on a scale of 1 to 10 in understanding impeachments and what is needed to be sucessful. You are off the scale.
You are not alone in this on the Right, but its still very disturbing.
1 lowest understand of impeachments - at least understands how the process starts.
to
10 knows and understands impeachments and has studied at least several Presidential ones at a high amatuer level.
I award you a -10 which I suppose is better than the Q trolls ... or at least their story swallowers.
I like to think I fall at an 8 now with DJ and TG probably at 9.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 23, 2023 10:21:54 GMT -5
i just read a horrendous thing about Florida: Florida Republican Rep. Ryan Chamberlin has introduced new state legislation that is effectively a “Don’t Say Gay” bill for the workplace. It also contains provisions that could make it impossible for LGBTQ+ nonprofits to operate in the state. depriving the free speech rights of businesses? what the actual hell? if there is a state i am least likely to move to today, it is Florida. |
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Nov 23, 2023 10:29:54 GMT -5
that is because he committed political crimes. but i would also add that this is kind of like saying that rape is sexually motivated. that is a surprisingly debatable point. rape is mostly about power. so is this. This is where you and I disagree I don't think he committed any political crimes. At least none that i'm aware of. Being an arrogant loudmouth is not a crime  |
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Nov 23, 2023 12:25:29 GMT -5
It should not be humanly possible to be this f***ing ignorant, but yet, here you are. MTG alone has more phony impeachment attempts on her record than every Democrat combined. Thanks for quoting this TG. Lord have mercy scgal. I know many conservatives see almost everything in black and white , us them, but damn. The impeachment is real. It is the most documented and legit impeachment since Nixon. (TG or DJ will correct me if I am wrong about whether Nixon was up for impeachment, censure or whatever.) There is also the corruption of blacklisting back in the day which Trump has already done in his first term behind the scenes and in public. It should tell you something scgal, that Liz Cheney, most of the Dems, most independents like Bernie Sanders are united in trying to keep the danger that is Trump away from our democracy. He has successfully weakened the courts which you may be happy about now, but those chickens are already roosting and you might be less happy if the Dems actually do retaliate Trump style. If the federal support to red states finally were brought into line with blue state tax burdens. The only phony impeachment attempts are on the GOP side. Hunter Biden is guilty of various things that not surprising the Trump clan is also guilty of. Joe BIden has been in politics a long time. He knows where certain lines need to be. Just like some of the Bush family and the unfortunate Billy Beer et al. To be precise, Nixon was never impeached. There were Articles of Impeachment presented with some ultimately adopted, and there were a number of Congressmen and Senators who said publicly that they would vote for impeachment or conviction, but the matter was never voted on by the full House of Representatives. Nixon resigned before that took place. The inquiry itself does not constitute impeachment. The vote of the full House is what actually constitutes impeachment, and a two-thirds vote of the Senate is how a president is convicted and removed from office. |
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 23, 2023 12:27:37 GMT -5
strike two. i know you can read, scgal . try again. OK befor you give me a strike three. I am referring to they don't act like the democrats and keep their people at bay. NO phony impeachments and such. ok, fine. but i was looking for something POSITIVE. you know, like a reason to vote FOR them. voting AGAINST democrats doesn't really count for me. but i didn't ask the question that way, and you answered it, so.....thanks. you trust Republicans to not impeach Biden. got it. now, i need to go take my anti-gaslighting medication. |
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 23, 2023 12:29:47 GMT -5
that is because he committed political crimes. but i would also add that this is kind of like saying that rape is sexually motivated. that is a surprisingly debatable point. rape is mostly about power. so is this. This is where you and I disagree I don't think he committed any political crimes. At least none that i'm aware of. Being an arrogant loudmouth is not a crime we have agreed to let the courts decide this. however, what i was SAYING is that he is being TRIED for committing political crimes. whether he is guilty or not is up to the court. what i mean by political crimes is that he is being tried for interfering with the political process. i mean, we can both agree on that, right? |
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 23, 2023 12:35:41 GMT -5
Thanks for quoting this TG. Lord have mercy scgal. I know many conservatives see almost everything in black and white , us them, but damn. The impeachment is real. It is the most documented and legit impeachment since Nixon. (TG or DJ will correct me if I am wrong about whether Nixon was up for impeachment, censure or whatever.) There is also the corruption of blacklisting back in the day which Trump has already done in his first term behind the scenes and in public. It should tell you something scgal, that Liz Cheney, most of the Dems, most independents like Bernie Sanders are united in trying to keep the danger that is Trump away from our democracy. He has successfully weakened the courts which you may be happy about now, but those chickens are already roosting and you might be less happy if the Dems actually do retaliate Trump style. If the federal support to red states finally were brought into line with blue state tax burdens. The only phony impeachment attempts are on the GOP side. Hunter Biden is guilty of various things that not surprising the Trump clan is also guilty of. Joe BIden has been in politics a long time. He knows where certain lines need to be. Just like some of the Bush family and the unfortunate Billy Beer et al. To be precise, Nixon was never impeached. There were Articles of Impeachment presented with some ultimately adopted, and there were a number of Congressmen and Senators who said publicly that they would vote for impeachment or conviction, but the matter was never voted on by the full House of Representatives. Nixon resigned before that took place. The inquiry itself does not constitute impeachment. The vote of the full House is what actually constitutes impeachment, and a two-thirds vote of the Senate is how a president is convicted and removed from office. if he had been impeached, he would have been removed. there were at least 2 years under Nixon where Democrats had a SuperMajority. it would have only taken a few moderate Republicans to convict and remove him. faced with that prospect, he resigned. let me know if i got that wrong in any way, tg. incidentally, this was the GOP that a vaguely remembered growing up. it was the GOP that had some core principles and integrity. what do they stand for NOW? name me one thing. i am not joking about that. |
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Nov 23, 2023 12:39:43 GMT -5
so, since what is in the capitol is technically my property (and yours), were you OK with capitol police gunning down anyone that entered the capitol? Yes I am. Storm the white house and see what happens. You have guards for a reason to guard the place shoot if necessary. i think that rip said the same thing. so you two are logically consistent on this. |
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