Are You the Same Person?

[Deleted]

Apr 22, 2022 8:21:56 GMT -5 azucena said:

But here's the thing, getting vaccinated IS a smart decision.  Choosing not to IS stupid.  Plain and simple truths. 

None of that truthiness and fake news crap.

I am just saying . . .

Me being vaccinated does not make me feel superior to the unvaccinated. 

That's how I am different than you guys. 

[raeoflyte]

Everyone makes stupid choices. When those choices negatively impact others you get to live with the judgment and consequences of them.

[pulmonarymd]

Getting vaccinated makes you a smarter person, plain and simple. If everyone was vaccinated about $250k deaths could have been avoided. Name another medical intervention that is that effective.

[pulmonarymd]

Apr 22, 2022 8:41:13 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

Apr 22, 2022 8:21:56 GMT -5 azucena said:

But here's the thing, getting vaccinated IS a smart decision.  Choosing not to IS stupid.  Plain and simple truths. 

None of that truthiness and fake news crap.

I am just saying . . .

Me being vaccinated does not make me feel superior to the unvaccinated. 

That's how I am different than you guys. 

I don’t feel superior. It is a simple medical fact. No different than saying that smoking is bad for you, and if you continue to smoke after having a heart attack or being diagnosed with copd, you have made a stupid decision. If that offends you, too bad

[Deleted]

Apr 22, 2022 9:12:02 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Apr 22, 2022 8:41:13 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

I am just saying . . .

Me being vaccinated does not make me feel superior to the unvaccinated. 

That's how I am different than you guys. 

I don’t feel superior. It is a simple medical fact. No different than saying that smoking is bad for you, and if you continue to smoke after having a heart attack or being diagnosed with copd, you have made a stupid decision. If that offends you, too bad

My uncle died from Covid. He was 89 but that does not matter. He was not vaccinated. He did not want to get vaccinated because it scared him. His choice. He died. It was his choice not to get vaccinated. He was a Korean War Veteran. I am not mad he died. I am not mad he chose not to be vaccinated. I am at peace because he was able to make that choice.

[swasat]

Apr 22, 2022 9:39:05 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

Apr 22, 2022 9:12:02 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

I don’t feel superior. It is a simple medical fact. No different than saying that smoking is bad for you, and if you continue to smoke after having a heart attack or being diagnosed with copd, you have made a stupid decision. If that offends you, too bad

My uncle died from Covid. He was 89 but that does not matter. He was not vaccinated. He did not want to get vaccinated because it scared him. His choice. He died. It was his choice not to get vaccinated. He was a Korean War Veteran. I am not mad he died. I am not mad he chose not to be vaccinated. I am at peace because he was able to make that choice.

And you would be at peace and as non-judgemental if this unvaccinated uncle gave you/your children/your other family members Covid too and they became severely sick or died? I think not.....

Its very easy to stay neutral or at peace when YOU have not been impacted. Ask others who did follow the safety protocols, did get vaccinated, but still got sick or died or lost a loved one because those "others" with supposed "rights' could care less about what their activities do to society in general. 

[pulmonarymd]

Apr 22, 2022 9:39:05 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

Apr 22, 2022 9:12:02 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

I don’t feel superior. It is a simple medical fact. No different than saying that smoking is bad for you, and if you continue to smoke after having a heart attack or being diagnosed with copd, you have made a stupid decision. If that offends you, too bad

My uncle died from Covid. He was 89 but that does not matter. He was not vaccinated. He did not want to get vaccinated because it scared him. His choice. He died. It was his choice not to get vaccinated. He was a Korean War Veteran. I am not mad he died. I am not mad he chose not to be vaccinated. I am at peace because he was able to make that choice.

An infectious disease is different. Your choice AFFECTS me. You can make others sick even if you do not get I’ll. All of my colleagues and I willingly exposed ourselves to infected patients. Early in the pandemic, many of us contracted it, and thousands of us died, including a 26 yo resident. Stop with this nonsense that this is solely an individuals decision.

Not getting vaccinated means you are ok with getting someone else I’ll. At this point in the pandemic, I would like to decrease my risk of getting sick. That requires others to do their part

[Deleted]

Apr 22, 2022 9:46:24 GMT -5 swasat said:

Apr 22, 2022 9:39:05 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

My uncle died from Covid. He was 89 but that does not matter. He was not vaccinated. He did not want to get vaccinated because it scared him. His choice. He died. It was his choice not to get vaccinated. He was a Korean War Veteran. I am not mad he died. I am not mad he chose not to be vaccinated. I am at peace because he was able to make that choice.

And you would be at peace and as non-judgemental if this unvaccinated uncle gave you/your children/your other family members Covid too and they became severely sick or died? I think not.....

Its very easy to stay neutral or at peace when YOU have not been impacted. Ask others who did follow the safety protocols, did get vaccinated, but still got sick or died or lost a loved one because those "others" with supposed "rights' could care less about what their activities do to society in general. 

As I stated previously, my vaccinated father was hospitalized for ten days with Covid. He will never be the same. He is receiving home health since being released from the hospital. He followed the safety protocols.

[TheOtherMe]

When choices affect me, it is my business.  

The "choice" people are making not to get vaccinated affects me.  

My uncle who died from Covid was in a nursing home when he got it.  He was there for dementia.  By the time there was no choice but for him to be in a nursing home, vaccines were available.  Had it not been for unvaccinated employees, he most likely would not have caught Covid.  

His daughter would not have had to go through the horror of being with him for 24 hours before he got a room at the hospital and then being told she couldn't see him because visiting hours were over.  She would not have then been told she couldn't see him because HE had exposed her to Covid so she wasn't allowed in the nursing home.  She could have said good bye at the hospital because the day he was released back to the nursing home is the day he died.

I do harbor ill will against the unvaccinated.  They have contributed to countless unnecessary deaths.

[raeoflyte]

Apr 22, 2022 10:13:56 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

Apr 22, 2022 9:46:24 GMT -5 swasat said:

And you would be at peace and as non-judgemental if this unvaccinated uncle gave you/your children/your other family members Covid too and they became severely sick or died? I think not.....

Its very easy to stay neutral or at peace when YOU have not been impacted. Ask others who did follow the safety protocols, did get vaccinated, but still got sick or died or lost a loved one because those "others" with supposed "rights' could care less about what their activities do to society in general. 

As I stated previously, my vaccinated father was hospitalized for ten days with Covid. He will never be the same. He is receiving home health since being released from the hospital. He followed the safety protocols.

How far does that extend? Is the driver who posts videos of driving over 120 mph and gives out prizes to guess his speed free from judgment when his speeding kills people? It's his choice to put his life at risk although he survived and killed 6 people.

I used to think vaccines were a personal choice. I even let some anti-vac friends stay with us when they were in a tough spot. But when I realized that their kids were putting my too young to be vaccinated nephews at risk I had to distance myself from them. Worst part is that they weren't shy about not vaccinating, but they didn't advertise and ran a business that catered to families with young kids. How many kids did they put at risk? But they don't care. Their choice is worth putting others at risk. We ran into them repeatedly for a while right when vaccines were coming out and they wanted to hang out, but no way. With ds and my mom, I couldn't take the risk even if I had wanted to.

[Deleted]

In the New Testament, Jesus speaks of the importance of forgiving or showing mercy toward others.

I am NOT a practicing Christian. Are you? 

[raeoflyte]

Apr 22, 2022 10:57:09 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

In the New Testament, Jesus speaks of the importance of forgiving or showing mercy toward others.

I am NOT a practicing Christian. Are you? 

Nope. Forgiveness is overrated and pushed way too hard by abusers to keep control.

Not that any of that is related to the topic at hand. Actions have consequences. If the worst an anti vaxxer has to bear is being called stupid, they got off lucky. Just look at everyone who died.

[wvugurl26]

You are free to make choices in this country. You are not free of the consequences of your choices and actions. You can't have it both ways.

As to the topic, I'm not sure if anyone is unchanged by the past few years if they are truthful.

[imawino]

Apr 22, 2022 8:41:13 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

Apr 22, 2022 8:21:56 GMT -5 azucena said:

But here's the thing, getting vaccinated IS a smart decision.  Choosing not to IS stupid.  Plain and simple truths. 

None of that truthiness and fake news crap.

I am just saying . . .

Me being vaccinated does not make me feel superior to the unvaccinated. 

That's how I am different than you guys. 

Perhaps it doesn't.  But what you keep making abundantly clear is that you feel superior to people who call anti-vaxxers stupid, so maybe you're not so different as you think?  

The fact is there is a smart choice here and a stupid choice, unless you are truly medically unable to receive the vaccine.  And in this case the stupid choice is ALSO a selfish choice that has the real potential to negatively impact other people.  This is fact, not judgement.  People can and should be judged by the choices they make; and if they make a deliberate, informed choice to endanger other people you can expect that judgement to be unflattering.

[imawino]

Apr 22, 2022 10:57:09 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

In the New Testament, Jesus speaks of the importance of forgiving or showing mercy toward others.

I am NOT a practicing Christian. Are you? 

LMAO.  You may not be a christian but you sure are holier-than-thou!  

[swasat]

Apr 22, 2022 10:13:56 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

Apr 22, 2022 9:46:24 GMT -5 swasat said:

And you would be at peace and as non-judgemental if this unvaccinated uncle gave you/your children/your other family members Covid too and they became severely sick or died? I think not.....

Its very easy to stay neutral or at peace when YOU have not been impacted. Ask others who did follow the safety protocols, did get vaccinated, but still got sick or died or lost a loved one because those "others" with supposed "rights' could care less about what their activities do to society in general. 

As I stated previously, my vaccinated father was hospitalized for ten days with Covid. He will never be the same. He is receiving home health since being released from the hospital. He followed the safety protocols.

Lets assume it was your 15 year old son who got infected by your unvaccinated by your unvaccinated uncle. You son was vaccinated, did everything to be safe but still got infected by your uncle. And died as a result.

You'd still feel the same about your uncle? 


A choice made by others that cuts an innocent young life short is NOT forgiveness worthy. It never was, is not, and NEVER WILL BE. Such choices will always be called stupid and unjustified, rightly so.

[swasat]

Apr 22, 2022 10:57:09 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

In the New Testament, Jesus speaks of the importance of forgiving or showing mercy toward others.

I am NOT a practicing Christian. Are you? 

Meh. Double Meh. The same can be said about the person who decided to not get vaccinated. Where was their Christianity when they decided to put their fellow beings at risk? 


Let me guess....NOWHERE!!!! 

[pulmonarymd]

Apr 22, 2022 10:57:09 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

In the New Testament, Jesus speaks of the importance of forgiving or showing mercy toward others.

I am NOT a practicing Christian. Are you? 

I took care of unvaccinated and severely ill patients with Covid. I did so to the best of my ability. As compassionate as I could. That is what they are owed, and what I consider merciful. Any more is not required, and I consider what I do as my duty.

To be forgiven requires repentance. Are these people doing that? Sorry, you get what you gove

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Apr 22, 2022 10:57:09 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

In the New Testament, Jesus speaks of the importance of forgiving or showing mercy toward others.

I am NOT a practicing Christian. Are you? 

Nope never have been and never will be I cannot reconcile the hypocrisy of the church against the actual words in the Bible.

I'm always willing to inform and answer questions. I'd be compassionate if someone I loved was dying.

But eventually you do burn out. The case against COVID vaccinations has become a cult at this point. Eventually you have to draw boundaries for your own sanity and protection.

You change your mind I'm here. You yell in my face I'm part of the problem I lose all sympathy for you. You will eventually face consequences and it's not my job to.save you from them.

As far as severe COVID not once has anyone said this would be a cure and you can still be unfortunate even vaccinated.

But your odds of being unlucky are so much higher unvaccinated. And you are at more risk of taking people down with you.

[pulmonarymd]

For those who believe this is a personal decision:

I, as a physician, choose to be unvaccinated. I still care for people in nursing homes. I get the infected, but before I become symptomatic, infect a patient there, which causes an outbreak. Multiple people need to be hospitalized, a few die. This is ok because it is my choice to be vaccinated., right?

If this isn’t ok, explain why it would be if a lay person caused the outbreak.

[NastyWoman]

Apr 22, 2022 10:57:09 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

In the New Testament, Jesus speaks of the importance of forgiving or showing mercy toward others.

I am NOT a practicing Christian. Are you? 

This is an interesting statement. I watch (way too many) murder shows on ID and occasionally at the end of a show a family member of the victim tells us how they have forgiven the killer of their loved one. It is a reaction I don't necessarily understand but I can respect that on a " do what you need to do to go forward" level. But how many of those people would be willing to forgive the killer if he were still at it, killing others like s/he killed your loved one? Unless they are really deluded my guess is that forgiveness would be totally absent. Yet here you are "preaching" about forgiveness of those who not only endangered others in the past but continue to do so in the name of personal choice. Now THAT is offensive in my opinion!

[Deleted]

I feel some type of way that this thread has devolved into yet another conversation about the vaccines. But I guess maybe that’s easier to talk about than the original subject?

[haapai]

Apr 22, 2022 16:56:46 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

I feel some type of way that this thread has devolved into yet another conversation about the vaccines. But I guess maybe that’s easier to talk about than the original subject?

It has become quite unhelpful for those of us who are trying to figure out what kind of damage we have taken and how to recover.  On the other hand, it has definitely illustrated and demonstrated some of what we've been through and how much we have changed. 

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I do think it's shown how the world has changed.

Antivaxxers have always been there ever since the first smallpox vaccine.

But they were in the minority and didn't have much outreach.

Then social media came along and connect people all over the world.

Then in the last two years a certain someone has brought conspiracy theories into the mainstream and his cronies have made it a condition of belonging.

We're in a really dangerous time right now. More people than ever are traumatized and vulnerable which means more targets for these groups.

I will continue to speak out. At first I used to think live and let live. Then measles started popping up. Whooping cough is really high in my county.

Now this. So that's a way I changed. I owe it to my profession, my country and the human race to not shut up and "respect others". The consequences are too high.

[haapai]

That certain someone has been turning reasonably functioning humans into anger-spewing persons-to-be-worked-around for longer than that.  Things have not been sane in my workplace for about six years. 

[TheOtherMe]

Or in my family.

One of them posted a statement today that made POTUS 44 look stupid.  That was her intent because he's Black and Black people can't be President.   It took me about 30 seconds to find that the so called quote from him never happened.  She said I don't have a sense of humor.  

[chiver78]

Apr 22, 2022 17:21:07 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I do think it's shown how the world has changed.

Antivaxxers have always been there ever since the first smallpox vaccine.

But they were in the minority and didn't have much outreach.

Then social media came along and connect people all over the world.

Then in the last two years a certain someone has brought conspiracy theories into the mainstream and his cronies have made it a condition of belonging.

We're in a really dangerous time right now. More people than ever are traumatized and vulnerable which means more targets for these groups.

I will continue to speak out. At first I used to think live and let live. Then measles started popping up. Whooping cough is really high in my county.

Now this. So that's a way I changed. I owe it to my profession, my country and the human race to not shut up and "respect others". The consequences are too high.

I read an opinion piece this morning, that was a fascinating and enlightening read. I'll edit this post in the am (I saved the link on my laptop). it talked about how the past 10-12y have been exceptionally stupid for the general public. it went on to talk in more detail about the control of social media and the like.

I'm bookmarking this post to update with the article link. I have some work to crank out in the am, so I'll see it. 🙃

[Deleted]

Apr 22, 2022 11:55:03 GMT -5 imawino said:

Apr 22, 2022 10:57:09 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

In the New Testament, Jesus speaks of the importance of forgiving or showing mercy toward others.

I am NOT a practicing Christian. Are you? 

LMAO.  You may not be a christian but you sure are holier-than-thou!  

I threw in the Christianity thing because I have read people comment on these boards about the Republicans claiming to be Christians. That made me think the Democrats making those comments know true Christianity. Sorry if I misinterpreted the comments.

I always claim not to know enough about politics to argue Republican vs. Democrat. I quietly vote for whoever I consider the best candidate is. Independently. I have been an independent voter since I was 18 years old. 

What's the general consensus? Do independent voters wear masks and get vaccinated?

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Apr 22, 2022 9:39:05 GMT -5 @beckaroo said:

Apr 22, 2022 9:12:02 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

I don’t feel superior. It is a simple medical fact. No different than saying that smoking is bad for you, and if you continue to smoke after having a heart attack or being diagnosed with copd, you have made a stupid decision. If that offends you, too bad

My uncle died from Covid. He was 89 but that does not matter. He was not vaccinated. He did not want to get vaccinated because it scared him. His choice. He died. It was his choice not to get vaccinated. He was a Korean War Veteran. I am not mad he died. I am not mad he chose not to be vaccinated. I am at peace because he was able to make that choice.

So your uncle used his fears to put the healthcare professionals at further risk of their lives.  I think that was pretty selfish of him.  His fears took up resources that were always desperately needed during this pandemic, whether it was a hospital bed, supplies, drugs or employee time.

It was one thing if you couldn’t be vaccinated, or if you got Covid despite being vaccinated.  But to deliberately risk a bunch of people is selfish……and I’m utterly sick of selfish people.  

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Apr 22, 2022 20:47:59 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

Apr 22, 2022 17:21:07 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I do think it's shown how the world has changed.

Antivaxxers have always been there ever since the first smallpox vaccine.

But they were in the minority and didn't have much outreach.

Then social media came along and connect people all over the world.

Then in the last two years a certain someone has brought conspiracy theories into the mainstream and his cronies have made it a condition of belonging.

We're in a really dangerous time right now. More people than ever are traumatized and vulnerable which means more targets for these groups.

I will continue to speak out. At first I used to think live and let live. Then measles started popping up. Whooping cough is really high in my county.

Now this. So that's a way I changed. I owe it to my profession, my country and the human race to not shut up and "respect others". The consequences are too high.

I read an opinion piece this morning, that was a fascinating and enlightening read. I'll edit this post in the am (I saved the link on my laptop). it talked about how the past 10-12y have been exceptionally stupid for the general public. it went on to talk in more detail about the control of social media and the like.

I'm bookmarking this post to update with the article link. I have some work to crank out in the am, so I'll see it. 🙃

I’d be interested in this link when you put it up.