How do you find out what your coworker died of when

[giramomma]

Dec 1, 2021 14:21:28 GMT -5 haapai said:

Dec 1, 2021 14:15:04 GMT -5 andi9899 said:

You're still on this? You need to let it go. The guy got sick and died. You didn't. Move on.

Nuts to you!  In the process, I also got a better bead on how much being vaccinated reduces my chance of dying of Covid and how reliable the gossip netwerk at work is.  I regret nothing!

Do you live in a county that doesn't report any information about Covid?

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 1, 2021 14:21:28 GMT -5 haapai said:

Dec 1, 2021 14:15:04 GMT -5 andi9899 said:

You're still on this? You need to let it go. The guy got sick and died. You didn't. Move on.

Nuts to you!  In the process, I also got a better bead on how much being vaccinated reduces my chance of dying of Covid and how reliable the gossip netwerk at work is.  I regret nothing!

How does that change anything. It was common knowledge that vaccines decrease your risk of hospitalization 5 fold, and your risk of dying 11 fold. Age and underlying health were risks for breakthrough infection. All you have done is fine tuned that knowledge.

If something happening to you is 1%, someone is that person who is that 1%. The above may make you feel better, but it does not change anything at all.

[minnesotapaintlady]

800K dead and somehow this one guy's COD is the answer to all the covid mysteries.

[andi9899]

I didn't realize we hit the 800K mark. That is so sad and truly pathetic when you look at the state of America.

[haapai]

I don't know why it changes things so much but somehow it does.  I can breathe a lot easier now that I believe that there was a less than 5% chance that he was vaccinated.  Maybe it's the similarity to a common confidence interval that rings my bell, but I am suddenly uninterested in any further details about his illness.  I can stop wondering if my distaste for him, his politics, and his antediluvian attitudes regarding women are coloring my analysis of why he died or how much risk I am incurring on the job. 

It's also handy to know that being vaccinated is correlated with even better odds of not dying of Covid than the overall odds that the CDC is pushing out there.  I'll have to calculate the hospitalization odds next.  I'm willing to bet the the ratio is much higher for persons in my age bracket than the six to one ratio that's being swatted around now.  It's good to find out that doing the right thing, getting vaccinated, is actually almost twice as good for you as you have been led to believe. 

It's good to have a reminder that some of my coworkers deserve to be treated with extreme skepticism.  A few of them seem to have utterly defective bullshit detectors so I have every right to do a complete brain-wipe after talking with them or avoid talking to them in the first place. 

Sadly, doing the math also quantifies my suspicions of how badly we are failing people my parents' age. 

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 1, 2021 16:05:15 GMT -5 haapai said:

I don't know why it changes things so much but somehow it does.  I can breathe a lot easier now that I believe that there was a less than 5% chance that he was vaccinated.  Maybe it's the similarity to a common confidence interval that rings my bell, but I am suddenly uninterested in any further details about his illness.  I can stop wondering if my distaste for him, his politics, and his antediluvian attitudes regarding women are coloring my analysis of why he died or how much risk I am incurring on the job. 

It's also handy to know that being vaccinated is correlated with even better odds of not dying of Covid than the overall odds that the CDC is pushing out there.  I'll have to calculate the hospitalization odds next.  I'm willing to bet the the ratio is much higher for persons in my age bracket than the six to one ratio that's being swatted around now.  It's good to find out that doing the right thing, getting vaccinated, is actually almost twice as good for you as you have been led to believe. 

It's good to have a reminder that some of my coworkers deserve to be treated with extreme skepticism.  A few of them seem to have utterly defective bullshit detectors so I have every right to do a complete brain-wipe after talking with them or avoid talking to them in the first place. 

Sadly, doing the math also quantifies my suspicions of how badly we are failing people my parents' age. 

You can get too comfortable with math in medicine. Math is useful, but medicine is not an exact science. In addition, so many variables factor into risk, and we do not understand them well enough, that mathematical models are all approximation. 

[haapai]

Dec 1, 2021 16:12:10 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Dec 1, 2021 16:05:15 GMT -5 haapai said:

I don't know why it changes things so much but somehow it does.  I can breathe a lot easier now that I believe that there was a less than 5% chance that he was vaccinated.  Maybe it's the similarity to a common confidence interval that rings my bell, but I am suddenly uninterested in any further details about his illness.  I can stop wondering if my distaste for him, his politics, and his antediluvian attitudes regarding women are coloring my analysis of why he died or how much risk I am incurring on the job. 

It's also handy to know that being vaccinated is correlated with even better odds of not dying of Covid than the overall odds that the CDC is pushing out there.  I'll have to calculate the hospitalization odds next.  I'm willing to bet the the ratio is much higher for persons in my age bracket than the six to one ratio that's being swatted around now.  It's good to find out that doing the right thing, getting vaccinated, is actually almost twice as good for you as you have been led to believe. 

It's good to have a reminder that some of my coworkers deserve to be treated with extreme skepticism.  A few of them seem to have utterly defective bullshit detectors so I have every right to do a complete brain-wipe after talking with them or avoid talking to them in the first place. 

Sadly, doing the math also quantifies my suspicions of how badly we are failing people my parents' age. 

You can get too comfortable with math in medicine. Math is useful, but medicine is not an exact science. In addition, so many variables factor into risk, and we do not understand them well enough, that mathematical models are all approximation. 

Yes, I know that statistics are only as good as the input.  Data on cause of death is particularly prone to this problem.  In fact, data derived from death certificates is particularly prone to this problem.  What goes onto the death certificate is a reflection of what the person filling out believes and the state of medical knowledge and practice at the time that the death certificate was completed. 

If you want to see an appalling example of this, check out some of the studies that were done using death certificates to determine the life expectancy and cause of death of persons with Downs Syndrome and how that has changed over time.  It's chilling! 

[pulmonarymd]

Dec 1, 2021 16:23:26 GMT -5 haapai said:

Dec 1, 2021 16:12:10 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

You can get too comfortable with math in medicine. Math is useful, but medicine is not an exact science. In addition, so many variables factor into risk, and we do not understand them well enough, that mathematical models are all approximation. 

Yes, I know that statistics are only as good as the input.  Data on cause of death is particularly prone to this problem.  In fact, data derived from death certificates is particularly prone to this problem.  What goes onto the death certificate is a reflection of what the person filling out believes and the state of medical knowledge and practice at the time that the death certificate was completed. 

If you want to see an appalling example of this, check out some of the studies that were done using death certificates to determine the life expectancy and cause of death of persons with Downs Syndrome and how that has changed over time.  It's chilling! 

Yes, I am aware of the accuracy of these types of data. So, if you are aware of it as well, why go through all this work, when the simple calculations that have been done are reassuring? You were attempting to invade someone's privacy for your benefit

[haapai]

I did not know that I could do these calculations and achieve the level of confidence that I have reached.  I (correctly) assumed that attempting to link up with the gossip network would  fill my head with unreliable information.  I was also alarmed by the degree to which coworkers who knew the guy or his daughter complied with not discussing his illness (while circulating a get-well card that I sensed that he would never read) or the circumstances of his death after it had been made quite public. 

I felt pretty gaslighted.  Everyone else seemed to know more than me and I didn't know who to ask or believe.  

FWIW, I never got so far as even looking up how to get a death certificate in my state.  For some reason, I was perfectly willing to lift his dates and places of birth and death and the names of his parents from his death notice, if the application required them, but I had no idea how to come up with his address without further snooping and I was pretty sure that the application would ask for it.  It's an odd line not to want to cross, but it stopped me.  I'm not sure that it would have stopped me if he had lived in my neighborhood or if we still had telephone books that listed street addresses.  

[TheOtherMe]

You would have had to lie to get a death certificate.

I do genealogy and to get my grandparents' death certificates from the counties where they died (because it hasn't been long enough for them to be public), I had to complete a form attesting how I was related to the decedent.  It was accepted and I told the truth.  The two certificates are each stamped "for genealogy purposes only" and I paid for them.

I wouldn't think of doing it for any other relative let alone a co-worker.  

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Dec 1, 2021 19:11:15 GMT -5 haapai said:

I did not know that I could do these calculations and achieve the level of confidence that I have reached.  I (correctly) assumed that attempting to link up with the gossip network would  fill my head with unreliable information.  I was also alarmed by the degree to which coworkers who knew the guy or his daughter complied with not discussing his illness (while circulating a get-well card that I sensed that he would never read) or the circumstances of his death after it had been made quite public. 

I felt pretty gaslighted.  Everyone else seemed to know more than me and I didn't know who to ask or believe.  

FWIW, I never got so far as even looking up how to get a death certificate in my state.  For some reason, I was perfectly willing to lift his dates and places of birth and death and the names of his parents from his death notice, if the application required them, but I had no idea how to come up with his address without further snooping and I was pretty sure that the application would ask for it.  It's an odd line not to want to cross, but it stopped me.  I'm not sure that it would have stopped me if he had lived in my neighborhood or if we still had telephone books that listed street addresses.  

Total wild hair here whatvabout just NOT connecting with a bunch of gossiping idiots who apparently were going so far as to stalk the daughter on Facebook. Maybe THAT is why they didn't tell you anything the bosses know whatvtype of people work for them.

You are vaccinated. You refuse to seek other employment. Make peace with it and move on. This is crazy and obsessive. I think the constant stress and paranoia we've all lived in for the past two years has caught up with you. Plenty of people are seeking help for it you probably should too.

[laterbloomer]

She didn't invade the coworkers privacy and she found data that comforted her. Why are you guys still piling on?

[andi9899]

She did invade his privacy. She couldn't just let it go and went above and beyond to dig into his cause of death. She internet stalked him and his daughter and was trying to figure out how to get a copy of his death certificate. That is not normal behavior.

The incubation period had already passed so she had not been infected by him if she was exposed. So again, why does the COD matter? If she feels that her employer isn't reputable, she can go work elsewhere. She's not willing to do that. So then let it go. Why continue to obsess? It's not normal nor is it healthy.

[Lizard Queen]

I just found out that a coworker's dad died last week. Let's just say this coworker is not my favorite, and from what I've heard about her dad, and his demographics, pretty sure he was antivax. (I heard some very unflattering information about him and his family prior to COVID coming out.) Curious if it was COVID. I'll eventually ask around a little, and no one will know anyway or they won't tell me. Oh well. His obit actually makes him seem like he was kinda nice. I'm sure plenty of people will miss him.

[thyme4change]

Dec 2, 2021 10:49:54 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

I just found out that a coworker's dad died last week. Let's just say this coworker is not my favorite, and from what I've heard about her dad, and his demographics, pretty sure he was antivax. (I heard some very unflattering information about him and his family prior to COVID coming out.) Curious if it was COVID. I'll eventually ask around a little, and no one will know anyway or they won't tell me. Oh well. His obit actually makes him seem like he was kinda nice. I'm sure plenty of people will miss him.

Since we are speaking about gossiping idiots, tell us all that unflattering stuff you heard. 😈

[Lizard Queen]

Dec 4, 2021 9:58:02 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Dec 2, 2021 10:49:54 GMT -5 Lizard Queen said:

I just found out that a coworker's dad died last week. Let's just say this coworker is not my favorite, and from what I've heard about her dad, and his demographics, pretty sure he was antivax. (I heard some very unflattering information about him and his family prior to COVID coming out.) Curious if it was COVID. I'll eventually ask around a little, and no one will know anyway or they won't tell me. Oh well. His obit actually makes him seem like he was kinda nice. I'm sure plenty of people will miss him.

Since we are speaking about gossiping idiots, tell us all that unflattering stuff you heard. 😈

Haha!🤣😁
Her dad was a Baptist preacher, and her siblings are all losers that coworker helps support. Her family is in some redneck area that has a ton of weird people that live there (supposedly, I am completely unfamiliar with the area), and her whole family is very insular and feel superior to everyone else. Coworker is definitely different--and acts like she's better than everyone else. I can't speak to the rest. The obit said her dad was very musical, among other things, and just made him sound pretty nice (not that they're going to say bad things in an obit.) He was only 64, which is fairly young to die. He looked a bit overweight in the pic, but not overly so. It could have been a fairly old pic, meaning simply there was no hint at cause of death from the pic or obituary.