thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 20, 2020 21:32:21 GMT -5
Mine have made it to 5 and 10 so I must not totally suck as a parent. I freely admit that by the standards of this board I had no business becoming a parent. Not only did I hand off my children to daycare at an early age so I could work but I am not nearly educated enough to be able to coach both of them to the required educational standards the state requires for each subject. I can certainly do some of them and even get them to an advanced level in certain subjects but I also happen to recognize my limits. There are some things they are better off having a teacher trained in the subject teaching them. Teachers have always had my respect but now more so than ever. I can't count how many times I've had to explain to Abby we did not have computers when I was her age so mommy is just as new to this shit as she is. Many of us are highly educated, but the school's curriculum has changed over the years. When they introduced core math, it was completely different than how I learned math. They discontinued cursive here, so I've had to teach my children how to write cursive, which is fine, so they can sign legal documents. I excelled in most math subjects (I'm an accountant now), but the core dynamics I learned long ago I haven't had to use in years- hello trigonometry. Teachers are involved in this day to day. Not so much us parents. And it can be frustrating for both the parents and kids as we are trying to learn some concepts together. Even helping my daughter and her roommate with their accounting class. I learned balance sheet debits and credits first, but the materials they had were quite the opposite. I have always had the utmost respect for teachers as my parents spent their careers in education. I have many friends who are teachers, principals, superintendents and they are doing thire best. They also understand how this online learning for K-12 is difficult for kids/parents. I'm just bad at teaching people anything. Becoming a parent hasn't changed my ability to present a subject in a way that someone can absorb it.
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oped
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Post by oped on May 20, 2020 23:01:29 GMT -5
Well this was a fun conversation to miss !
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 21, 2020 15:44:57 GMT -5
Well this was a fun conversation to miss ! Wish I had.
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gs11rmb
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Post by gs11rmb on May 21, 2020 16:03:37 GMT -5
Well this was a fun conversation to miss ! Wish I had. Yeah... I try not to be critical of other people's family choices (even if I privately roll my eyes) but I'm still taken aback by the knowledge that some people on this board obviously think I have made bad choices for my children. For the record: - I make 6 figures
- I do not want to be a SAHM
- My DH does not want to be a SAHD
- I sent my children to a formal Child Development Center with very low turnover and staffed by nurturing and college educated people
- At home daycares make ME uncomfortable
- I have no desire to homeschool
- I am sick and tired of the sanctimonious attitude of people who think that because they stayed at home they have some how 'sacrificed' for their children and therefore love them more than working parents.
- It's only a sacrifice if you do something you really really really don't want to do but choose to because it is for the betterment of others. Staying at home is simply a choice with financial ramifications - that does not equate to a sacrifice.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on May 21, 2020 16:34:26 GMT -5
Yeah... I try not to be critical of other people's family choices (even if I privately roll my eyes) but I'm still taken aback by the knowledge that some people on this board obviously think I have made bad choices for my children. For the record: - I make 6 figures
- I do not want to be a SAHM
- My DH does not want to be a SAHD
- I sent my children to a formal Child Development Center with very low turnover and staffed by nurturing and college educated people
- At home daycares make ME uncomfortable
- I have no desire to homeschool
- I am sick and tired of the sanctimonious attitude of people who think that because they stayed at home they have some how 'sacrificed' for their children and therefore love them more than working parents.
- It's only a sacrifice if you do something you really really really don't want to do but choose to because it is for the betterment of others. Staying at home is simply a choice with financial ramifications - that does not equate to a sacrifice.
Join the “I suck as a mom” club!lol I’m on the other end. My mom put her entire financial security in my dad. I suffered the ramifications of that when my parents divorced. I went from Middle class to government housing and food stamps overnight. I love my kids too much to ever put their security at risk. And I love myself too much to ever rely on a man. I would love to not work. Until my passive income can replace my very healthy active income (with zero support from a man), I will work.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on May 21, 2020 16:49:12 GMT -5
... And I love myself too much to ever rely on a man. ... (with zero support from a man), ... With tongue half in cheek, have you considered a same sex marriage? That way you won't have to rely on one of us yucky men?
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on May 21, 2020 17:31:07 GMT -5
I'm glad to hear that my children, who will soon be serial killers because I work, will have company.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on May 21, 2020 18:06:31 GMT -5
... And I love myself too much to ever rely on a man. ... (with zero support from a man), ... With tongue half in cheek, have you considered a same sex marriage? That way you won't have to rely on one of us yucky men? Lol! I love men. I’ve just learned to count on no one but myself. If I were a lesbian I would have said “with no support from a woman”. Being self-sufficient is extremely important to me. Allowing my financial security to depend on the whim of another person seems so foreign to me.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on May 21, 2020 18:09:37 GMT -5
I'm glad to hear that my children, who will soon be serial killers because I work, will have company. They can have their own club in prison?!?! But I’m sad...I would prefer my child do time for something like white collar crime...sigh
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busymom
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Post by busymom on May 21, 2020 22:31:27 GMT -5
I'm glad to hear that my children, who will soon be serial killers because I work, will have company. They can have their own club in prison?!?! But I’m sad...I would prefer my child do time for something like white collar crime...sigh I hear Trump may have some openings...
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on May 22, 2020 16:09:18 GMT -5
Ok, I concede - most people are stupid, most parents are stupid, everyone would be better outsourcing child-raising to childcare "professionals". Happy? Yeah, DH and I can't possibly be qualified to raise 5 kids on our own - DH only has degrees in English, Psychology, and Education, while I only have a degree in Computer Science, experience in tutoring college level mathematics, and work in Youth Library Services. No PhDs in early childhood development. Never said that. But being smart is necessary but not sufficient to be a teacher. You need to have the right temperament. Be able to encourage and be tough at the same time. Having patience to do the teaching especially when they do not get something that is obvious to you. Then, as they get older, they can actually know more about subjects than you. For example, I know I could teach biology if I had to. But, the details of certain concepts are not something I remember, given how long ago I was in school. So I would have to review the subject, and that is for a subject I know well. It is not an easy job. I know I could not do it, so I respect those who can. If you can do it, more power to you Absolutely . I was singularly unsuited to homeschool my sons. In fact I have often stated that the only reason they made it to adulthood is that they went to schools for their education needs. I don't know what I would do if I had to make that choice now. The only time I ever came close was before/during/after the first war with Iraq (was that desert storm?) when very credible terrorist threats were made against western targets (we lived in SE Asia). After a month of missed school I was ready to have the kids finish their school year in Europe. I would have moved hslfway across the world just for that. But today there is no place to run to, no place that gets you out of harms way. I know everyone is doing the best they can and I admire how parents today are handling this previously unknown challenge.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on May 22, 2020 16:18:10 GMT -5
Just got word that NYSSMA (state level music association) All-State concerts scheduled for NOVEMBER are cancelled.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2020 14:14:59 GMT -5
Alabama's state superintendent of education announced that virtual school would be available for any student whose parents feel uncomfortable about sending them back in the fall. That's not a big deal at the high school where I used to teach. They could already take core courses virtually, only coming in for tests. I'm guessing that is the only thing that would change. And Alabama has an online education system, ACCESS, that high schoolers could tap into. Normally, they would go to a computer lab at school, but that could be adapted to allow them to do it from home. They can already access it there. Or their teachers could just post online assignments that duplicate the inclass assignments. It is very doable.
Elementary students, particularly the lower grades, are what would worry me. It wouldn't be supervision that is the problem; the parents will have chosen to keep them home next year. But I just don't think of third graders, for example, as particularly independent learners. Alabamians already suffer from an inferior educational system. I don't see this helping the situation.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on May 23, 2020 14:54:28 GMT -5
I think they should expand the school year into much of the summer if they continue online learning like they've been doing. My kids have very little school work, and I'm fine with that for now, but I think they need to make up for that with more weeks of school. I'm saying this about elementary school here. I don't know the best strategy for older grades.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on May 23, 2020 16:03:11 GMT -5
I think they should expand the school year into much of the summer if they continue online learning like they've been doing. My kids have very little school work, and I'm fine with that for now, but I think they need to make up for that with more weeks of school. I'm saying this about elementary school here. I don't know the best strategy for older grades. I think that all depends. My 2nd grader was doing 20-25 hours of academic work a week, which is actually 5-10 hours more than what she got in face-to-face school. We didn't even touch the specials.
Even after face-to-face school, the kids are usually gassed for the first month of summer. One month of recoup time is just not enough.
I would also expect Fall to be more rigorous because there's enough time for teachers to be educated on best practices for online teaching. What we saw in the public schools was online teaching. Online teaching requires a ton more prep than face to face. Time was a luxury we didn't have in March, but we do for the upcoming school year.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on May 23, 2020 16:17:17 GMT -5
I think they should expand the school year into much of the summer if they continue online learning like they've been doing. My kids have very little school work, and I'm fine with that for now, but I think they need to make up for that with more weeks of school. I'm saying this about elementary school here. I don't know the best strategy for older grades. I think that all depends. My 2nd grader was doing 20-25 hours of academic work a week, which is actually 5-10 hours more than what she got in face-to-face school. We didn't even touch the specials.
Even after face-to-face school, the kids are usually gassed for the first month of summer. One month of recoup time is just not enough.
I would also expect Fall to be more rigorous because there's enough time for teachers to be educated on best practices for online teaching. What we saw in the public schools was online teaching. Online teaching requires a ton more prep than face to face. Time was a luxury we didn't have in March, but we do for the upcoming school year.
My 1st grader has 3 Zoom meetings per week, ranging from 30 minutes to an hour. He's got an hour worth of other work to do altogether, plus an extra 10 minutes per day of reading. It's fine for now, but it's not much. My 4th grader has one 45 minute zoom meeting per week, plus his work that took him about an hour or 2 on Monday morning, then he's done for the week, other than 10 extra minutes of reading per day. During normal school, they are still supposed to do 20 minutes of reading per day. So this is not much at all in addition to that. I'm fine with this amount, I guess, if we have more weeks of it, especially if that means we maintain retention over the summer better. Neither kid is getting even so much as 10 hours of academic work per week. Working from home during this, there's no way I could make my 7 year old do 20 hours per week. It would make us both tear our hair out.
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lurkyloo
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Post by lurkyloo on May 25, 2020 18:07:10 GMT -5
DS’ school goal is 11-13 hours a week, which I think is roughly accurate. They have one 30 min zoom meeting every weekday, with pre-meeting video and worksheet for math (3x) and post-meeting exit work for both math and literacy. Maybe 5 hours of math and 2-3 hours of literacy work, plus 20 min a day of reading. They have a weekly optional science assignment and biweekly specials-media, art, music and phys ed. Those are mostly 30 min to an hour each...and that’s with strategically ignoring the full extent of the phys ed, which could easily be 2-3 hours. Luckily around a third of her links don’t work . And I’m not doing 3 7 min videos a day for 5 days...kid is plenty active already. I’d like to see more writing assigned, since that’s a particular weak point, but other than that it’s not too bad. However, right now there is no real expectation that I’ll be able to work a full 8 hours a day even teleworking. If reduced school schedules continue into fall I might have to work a reduced schedule.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on May 26, 2020 12:32:42 GMT -5
1 in 5 teachers unlikely to returnA poll found 1 in 5 teachers unlikely to return if schools open in the fall. And 6 in 10 parents will pursue at home alternatives for their children.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on May 26, 2020 12:52:49 GMT -5
1 in 5 teachers unlikely to returnA poll found 1 in 5 teachers unlikely to return if schools open in the fall. And 6 in 10 parents will pursue at home alternatives for their children. The teacher that lives on the street was hoping to be able to go a few more years before retirement, but she threw in the towel. The last several years, the lack of support from the administration was overwhelming, but this last event just tipped her over the line. I think she is younger than 60.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on May 26, 2020 13:28:57 GMT -5
1 in 5 teachers unlikely to returnA poll found 1 in 5 teachers unlikely to return if schools open in the fall. And 6 in 10 parents will pursue at home alternatives for their children. Eh. My 2nd grader was team taught this year. One of her teachers is pushing 70, very likely. I was amazed at how quickly she picked up using technology...from using the Zooms/Web Ex to Using See Saw to view and comment on my kid's work. I also don't believe the number of parents that are willing to pursue at home alternatives. That number is far two high for a society that mostly relies on two income families and that equates school to cheap child care. I would assume that a good amount of 2nd shift jobs simply won't be available in the numbers that they used to be: bartending, serving, that sort of thing. While I can do my job anywhere I have internet access, I still have a decent amount of meetings a week that need to be conducted during normal business hours.
I also don't see, how if parents were already so burned out with having their kids at home 24/7 for the past few months...how they are going to do it happily for the next calendar year on top of it.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 26, 2020 13:33:36 GMT -5
I wonder how many of those parents are assuming their employers will work with them if school doesn't reopen. I am sure some will but I am hard pressed to believe that that many parents will be allowed to continue to work from home indefinitely. They may be in for a shock and have to make some tough decisions come August.
It is what it is going to be we will figure out and adapt. I don't have the emotional or mental bandwith to deal with it. I've already had it made clear I'm a horrible parent per YM due to my lack of pandemic level financial planning foresight and my complete disregard to properly educate myself in a manner to be able to home school my kids till college so why stress when I've already failed?
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oped
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Post by oped on May 26, 2020 13:45:29 GMT -5
About 40% of families do not have 2 incomes. Not everyone has the same situation. And this event has changed a lot of circumstances as well. There may be some who look to do things differently going forward.
I was still initially surprised by those numbers though.
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on May 26, 2020 14:01:27 GMT -5
I thought this was an interesting tidbit (I clicked thru to the USAToday article):
Not quite sure what to make of those data points.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on May 26, 2020 14:34:53 GMT -5
It means they think their wife should stay home and home school their kids, so they do not have to worry about them getting sick. You don't think they would be the ones staying home, do you?
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on May 26, 2020 14:35:13 GMT -5
DGS1 started back in school on Monday (they live in Munich so no Memorial day). He attends a preK/K school and started with the oldest children first. He attends K so that means he is in this group. They have a number of precautions in place but I don't know what they all are. For instance face masks are mandatory for anyone 6 and over but whether that includes during class? Who knows. They have separate entrances for now for each class and there is no mixing with other classes even on the playground. But will any equipment be off limits? Who knows.
DS and DDIL decided that based on the information they have U. Is going back. But I know them well enough that I trust they pull him out of school again as soon as they don't like it. This is the same son who decided two weeks before things were closed down there that public transportation was not a good idea where they live and he started to work from home. He is not going into the office yet for that same reason. No cramming on subways/trains for him until he considers it safe enough.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on May 26, 2020 14:40:22 GMT -5
I think I have to see how things shake bout in the summer to see how I feel about homeschooling in the fall. There was a time in my life that I would have jumped at the chance, but I'm a much different person now. A much less patient person.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on May 26, 2020 15:04:02 GMT -5
It means they think their wife should stay home and home school their kids, so they do not have to worry about them getting sick. You don't think they would be the ones staying home, do you? Unless it makes more sense for men to stay at home vs the women. That's precisely why my husband husband works part time..I can outearn him, and therefore it's more efficient for me to focus on earning while he focuses on the family. That, and he has a better tolerance for tedium and monotony than I do.
Google told me that the PEW folks found that 40% of the women in families were the breadwinners in 2013. I'm sure that's changed now, with the economic down turn.
ETA: I also live in a very liberal area. When my husband returned to work after being a SAHP, no one looked at him sideways or called him lazy. He was told that he had a great opportunity, blah blah. Nothing but favorable stuff. He didn't have to worry about the gap in employment in the same way women do.
I know very few people that are still hell bent on traditional gender norms. And they are also older (think 70s). So, doesn't matter.
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oped
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Post by oped on May 26, 2020 15:22:03 GMT -5
It means they think their wife should stay home and home school their kids, so they do not have to worry about them getting sick. You don't think they would be the ones staying home, do you? Some might. I used to help run a large homeschooling organization, about 100 families a year average. And there were at least, let me count... 2 families over the decade where dad was the primary caregiver/schooler That said, it might be more than that today or in different geographical areas, things do change, but yeah, probably a lot that.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on May 26, 2020 15:22:47 GMT -5
I think the decision regarding these things should be made at an individual level based on talent, temperament, and earning potential. I live in a blue part of the country, and it is still a situation where a male who is a SAHP is look on in skeptical fashion, and their worth as a man/partner is suspect. Shouldn't be, but the idea that an able body man is being "supported" by their wives make the less than. And even in liberal areas, many women will not marry "down" and feel that they need to protect their money. Not that it isn't wrong, but we are not as enlightened as we think. ANd a a man. I do not believe the majority of the men in that survey will volunteer to be the one staying home. I may be wrong.
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oped
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Post by oped on May 26, 2020 15:24:47 GMT -5
I'll say again... I guess I said it on a different thread... if your school is doing remote to start in the fall, let me know if you'd rather actually homeschool (even short term till things are back to more 'normal') and I'll help you come up with what might be a less stressful program than regular school at home (depending on your school's supports and program).
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