Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jun 3, 2015 15:29:37 GMT -5
Actually, we're breaking the human race. The Spartans put their feeble out to die. Now we nurture them so they can reproduce. This does not have good implications for the human gene pool. I assume you are serious here. Regardless of anyone's argument, we know opposite sexes are attracted to specific features of the opposite sex. Eyes, lips, hips, butt, scent, And so on...... Science has documented these features. It was necessary to keep the species strong, and be able to repopulate. Call it God's will, or if you are not religious, natures's will. This is where mj's argument comes in about weakening the strength of the human race and it's ability to survive epidemics, and catastrophic calamities. The survival of the fittest was to keep a strong gene pool. Nature always weeded out the weak and infirm. Now we don't. We will reap what we sow.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 3, 2015 15:29:55 GMT -5
Why do we wear clothes? I am sure we would say to protect us from the cold or the sun, but on perfectly nice days people still wear clothes. If we changed the law so you could go anywhere, any time without any clothes on, how would you feel about it? Would you be embarrassed, or threatened? Would you think looking at some people would be unpleasant? Would you fear for your children to just go around with it all hanging out? Would you assume that molestation and rape would increase because creepy guys are now not wearing pants? Would this be a positive or negative thing for our society? Well, I certainly could never go back to Walmart if everyone there was naked.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Jun 3, 2015 15:30:25 GMT -5
no Them's fightin' words here in the South! Only let me be clear that only the TN tomato based sauce is acceptable, none of that South Carolina mustard based baby poop sauce, and none of abomination that Texas does to their meat and then calls BBQ. And don't get me started on that straight-from-hell alien life form that is a McDonald's McRibb - I'm pretty sure that's some soylent green shit dipped in ketchup sweetened with left over candy corn and peeps. Talk all you want about Biblical sin and men laying with men you want - but DO NOT talk shit about BBQ sauce. But, what's your stance on Alabama White Sauce?
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jun 3, 2015 15:31:12 GMT -5
Seriously people, how the hell did we bring bacon into this discussion? Oped made a reference to the Jewish race, and our members took a serious subject and lowered it to the lowest common denominator-jokes.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 15:31:58 GMT -5
The weak and the infirm... Or as I like to call them, zombie fodder...
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 3, 2015 15:36:01 GMT -5
The piece that always makes my brain want to explode is "how do you know you identify as a woman"? How do you know what a woman's brain is like to know that's you? I completely get a man who says "I want to wear a dress, I want to wear lipstick, I want to have (insert whatever female stereotype here)". If you were to ask me whether I'm a man or woman, I'd say man, because I have a penis. I don't feel like there's much else that really defines that. I can be a guy and love sports or wearing pantyhose, or both. Does wanting to mutilate your genitals really define anything? Another thing that's hard for me to reconcile, there are people out there who identify as having 1 missing limb...who don't. We don't cut that limb off for them, we get them mental help. So it can't just be that someone says "ew a penis, get it off of me". It's clearly something where they truly believe they "are" a woman in this case (meaning mentally, not just physically, which is what confuses me because how can I say my mind is male or female...it's just my mind, whatever it is, I can't step inside the mind of others to compare it to). I just don't get how know they're a woman, and not just a man who has traditionally female tendencies in terms of action/thought. Like if they'd never met a woman, would they think "I'm a female of the species", or would they just think "I'm a man but a little different than the majority of men I meet". Like you identify as a woman...but women run the table from super feminine to super masculine. At the end of the day, I don't care what people do. It sometimes makes me sad to think though that perhaps people just feel they'll be more accepted changing genders to what they feel is that traditional gender role than being a very unique member of the gender they were born with. It's probably just because I don't understand how anyone feels their mind is either male or female though. This is close to how I look at it. The gender stuff, anyway. I wonder if transgender would be as prevalent if sex roles were less strongly typed. While society allows variations, it is still more strict with men. Like too many feminine things - better be gay, because then its expected.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 3, 2015 15:40:05 GMT -5
To be fair, the Spartans were a martial society that required strong soldiers to survive against their enemies. They had to discard the old and weak in order for those resources to be used to raise up the next soldiers.
Unless you live in a third world country, you are not living that kind of hand to mouth fight for existence, so we can afford to provide resources for the less fit.
I'm not worried about what would happen in a catastrophic disaster. The old, weak, frail and useless would be eliminated right off the bat, only the young and fit would survive, and their gene pool would continue the species, assuming the catastrophe wasn't so severe all life was wiped out.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 3, 2015 15:43:26 GMT -5
Them's fightin' words here in the South! Only let me be clear that only the TN tomato based sauce is acceptable, none of that South Carolina mustard based baby poop sauce, and none of abomination that Texas does to their meat and then calls BBQ. And don't get me started on that straight-from-hell alien life form that is a McDonald's McRibb - I'm pretty sure that's some soylent green shit dipped in ketchup sweetened with left over candy corn and peeps. Talk all you want about Biblical sin and men laying with men you want - but DO NOT talk shit about BBQ sauce. But, what's your stance on Alabama White Sauce? BBQ sauce made with MAYONAISE ? Literally, I am speechless. Who does that to poor unsuspecting meat?
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Jun 3, 2015 15:46:17 GMT -5
But, what's your stance on Alabama White Sauce? BBQ sauce made with MAYONAISE ? Literally, I am speechless. Who does that to poor unsuspecting meat? Some people in Alabama it would seem. ETA: I find it a decent dipping sauce but never used it in any BBQ application.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jun 3, 2015 15:52:19 GMT -5
Something Jews have to worry about ...I knew I didn't like Jews Did you mean to post a "just kidding!" emoticon with this, or is it for real and for true? Oh my lord...you really have to ask that question??
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jun 3, 2015 15:59:48 GMT -5
Did you mean to post a "just kidding!" emoticon with this, or is it for real and for true? Oh my lord...you really have to ask that question?? Well...yes. Some people don't like Jews. You wouldn't be the first.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 16:06:46 GMT -5
some support for Virgil's side from John Hopkins Two issues presented themselves as targets for study. First, I wanted to test the claim that men who had undergone sex-change surgery found resolution for their many general psychological problems. .......
The first issue was easier and required only that I encourage the ongoing research of a member of the faculty who was an accomplished student of human sexual behavior. The psychiatrist and psychoanalyst Jon Meyer was already developing a means of following up with adults who received sex-change operations at Hopkins in order to see how much the surgery had helped them. He found that most of the patients he tracked down some years after their surgery were contented with what they had done and that only a few regretted it. But in every other respect, they were little changed in their psychological condition. They had much the same problems with relationships, work, and emotions as before. The hope that they would emerge now from their emotional difficulties to flourish psychologically had not been fulfilled.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jun 3, 2015 16:07:29 GMT -5
Did you mean to post a "just kidding!" emoticon with this, or is it for real and for true? Oh my lord...you really have to ask that question?? She does. A Conservative person, not so much. Please see Virgil's post about this board for an understanding of my comment.
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Jun 3, 2015 16:11:14 GMT -5
Incidently, if we go back to the beginning of the bashing of Virgil on this thread, he stated he had a problem with the way Jenner decided to take of the publicity route of his journey. It went down hill after that with personal attacks which the mods let stand.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 16:18:40 GMT -5
Define "loathing". Do I loathe Mr. Jenner? No. Do I loathe the consequences of his actions, and the consequences of his advocacy? Do I loathe the prevailing opinion that none of this matters because it's somehow wrong to reject others' beliefs? I do. Do I loathe the fact that I can't reason with people? That nobody cares why anyone would object to transgenderism? Yes. My view is in direct opposition to virtually everybody else's in this thread. Anyone more conservative has already been run off the board on a rail, so I'm going to seem a bit recalcitrant. I'm trying to be firm and to not compromise my position, while not being glib, petty, or sarcastic. I have no backup on this message board. Please take that into account.Why you poor little special snow flake you.
A couple of things about that statement.
First of all, the only people that were "run off this board" were people who violated the Code of Conduct so egregiously that there was no choice but to ban them. Most here were witness to those sorry derailments. I certainly remember well trying to reason with several of these members to stop spewing their hatred. I would not call them conservative, as that is an insult to my friends who do happen to be conservative.
There are conservatives on this board, plenty of them. I know because I interact with them, usually quite pleasantly. There are shades of conservatism, just as there are shades of liberalism. Some people are liberal, some are left wing, and some are flaming commie nut jobs. As far as anyone being to the right of you, well.
I'm sure "mainstream" conservatives have left this board of their own volition. I'm sure liberals have. It happens. It does not mean that they were "run off on a rail". In fact, others have since joined.
Perhaps you have no back up for some of your positions because you are not in the center of the conservative diaspora, but closer to the far right edge of it. I realize that on other sites these opinions are espoused. There are sites where all sorts of things are discussed, right, left and just plain weird. That does not make them even close to mainstream. We come from more or less free countries, and we are welcome to our viewpoints. However we are not entitled to automatically have others agree with and support these positions.
Remember when TD was a moderator and he had that "Debate the post, not the poster" rule. It was an easy rule to understand and he implemented it fairly and across the board. He probably deleted more of my posts then any other moderator and gave me more 3 day bans then any other moderator, but I always thought he was fair. Maybe I would get mad sometimes or think he was wrong, but I always thought he had a rule and was honestly applying it. I often don't like the rules that some moderators want to have, but I liked his rule. I think it was because he was so fair in applying it. Maybe that was just my perspective though.
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NancysSummerSip
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Post by NancysSummerSip on Jun 3, 2015 16:22:44 GMT -5
Did you mean to post a "just kidding!" emoticon with this, or is it for real and for true? Oh my lord...you really have to ask that question?? Hey now. I'm Jewish, and Miss T. likes me. I think. Now the fact that I'm a Democrat...that's another matter.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 16:27:37 GMT -5
some support for Virgil's side from John Hopkins Two issues presented themselves as targets for study. First, I wanted to test the claim that men who had undergone sex-change surgery found resolution for their many general psychological problems. .......
The first issue was easier and required only that I encourage the ongoing research of a member of the faculty who was an accomplished student of human sexual behavior. The psychiatrist and psychoanalyst Jon Meyer was already developing a means of following up with adults who received sex-change operations at Hopkins in order to see how much the surgery had helped them. He found that most of the patients he tracked down some years after their surgery were contented with what they had done and that only a few regretted it. But in every other respect, they were little changed in their psychological condition. They had much the same problems with relationships, work, and emotions as before. The hope that they would emerge now from their emotional difficulties to flourish psychologically had not been fulfilled.
Hickle, you don't see a problem with 40 year old research on this issue? The fact is, as long as the environment is unaccepting and hostile towards these people, we can't really isolate variables to sufficiently answer the questions posed.
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quince
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Post by quince on Jun 3, 2015 16:31:29 GMT -5
Gender can be a delicious, complicated mix of biology and social construct. Yay complicated awesomeness. That said, I wish I had a level amount of hormones in my body in a 30 day period. And less risk of UTI (Lucky men with external genitalia and long urethrae!) And developed and retained muscle mass better. There are a lot of other "woman" things that I could say I wanted to avoid, but they are all societal, so I can easily avoid them (Hair removal, make-up, jewelry.) I would be just as freaked out if I saw labia in a women's restroom as a penis...probably more, because penises just dangle...displaying labia takes more work. Also, nudity doesn't bother me, as long as people put something down before they sit on a chair. There is a wide, wide, wide difference between just being naked, and assaulting people/playing with yourself/being sexual. I admit I am not very educated on trans people...I don't have close personal relationships with anyone who has transitioned. I do get a little ... uneasy?...something...when MTF as represented in the media are over-the-top feminine, lots of make-up, put together hair, stylishly dressed...because I do not see these things as necessary to being a woman. I understand that for people who were not born with the traits to match their identity, extra effort is needed to "pass", or to just feel comfortable. I also imagine I'd be more put-out if all the publicized expression of female gender was shrieking at vermin, expecting others to pay, and not understanding math. I'm vaguely aware that there are people who reject the idea of permanently locked into either gender as their identity.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 3, 2015 16:47:55 GMT -5
Incidently, if we go back to the beginning of the bashing of Virgil on this thread, he stated he had a problem with the way Jenner decided to take of the publicity route of his journey. It went down hill after that with personal attacks which the mods let stand. In fairness, one of the posts was deleted and another one discussed. It's reasonably well known that I prefer people to express their thoughts candidly, and that I don't mind personal criticism. The one post was deleted because leaving it would set a bad precedent. I'm alone among the mods, but to me there's no meaningful difference between "You're a moron.", "I hate morons like you.", "Yet another moronic argument from Bob.", which are prohibited, and "I can't believe how moronic some people are.", "I hate it when people make moronic arguments.", "Only a moron would believe that was true.", which aren't prohibited. It's irrelevant semantics. Tweaking subject and tense a bit to trivially circumvent established prohibitions. If it were up to me, they'd all be allowed. At this point we're basically just banning sentence structure. "I've known dozens of people exactly like Virgil in my life, and every single one of them has a mama who wears army boots." "There are some opinions being expressed in this thread that remind me of just how many losers there are out there whose mamas wear army boots." "Isn't it funny how the people who hate Jenner so much are the same people who cry murder when we find out that their mamas wear army boots?" Just tell me my mama wears army boots. For Pete's sake.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 16:52:32 GMT -5
Incidently, if we go back to the beginning of the bashing of Virgil on this thread, he stated he had a problem with the way Jenner decided to take of the publicity route of his journey. It went down hill after that with personal attacks which the mods let stand. In fairness, one of the posts was deleted and another one discussed. It's reasonably well known that I prefer people to express their thoughts candidly, and that I don't mind personal criticism. The one post was deleted because leaving it would set a bad precedent. I'm alone among the mods, but to me there's no meaningful difference between "You're a moron.", "I hate morons like you.", "Yet another moronic argument from Bob.", which are prohibited, and "I can't believe how moronic some people are.", "I hate it when people make moronic arguments.", "Only a moron would believe that was true.", which aren't prohibited. It's irrelevant semantics. Tweaking subject and tense a bit to trivially circumvent established prohibitions. If it were up to me, they'd all be allowed. At this point we're basically just banning sentence structure. "I've known dozens of people exactly like Virgil in my life, and every single one of them has a mama who wears army boots." "There are some opinions being expressed in this thread that remind me of just how many losers there are out there whose mamas wear army boots." "Isn't it funny how the people who hate Jenner so much are the same people who cry murder when we find out that their mamas wear army boots?" Just tell me my mama wears army boots. For Pete's sake. I would ban them all. Debate the post, not the poster. Any time Paul starts a thread, over half the posts are just people mocking Paul. It doesn't matter how interesting the subject might be to others. Bring back the 3 day ban so if people feel compelled to call **** an asshole, they can choose to do so and get it out of their system.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 3, 2015 17:07:41 GMT -5
In fairness, one of the posts was deleted and another one discussed. It's reasonably well known that I prefer people to express their thoughts candidly, and that I don't mind personal criticism. The one post was deleted because leaving it would set a bad precedent. I'm alone among the mods, but to me there's no meaningful difference between "You're a moron.", "I hate morons like you.", "Yet another moronic argument from Bob.", which are prohibited, and "I can't believe how moronic some people are.", "I hate it when people make moronic arguments.", "Only a moron would believe that was true.", which aren't prohibited. It's irrelevant semantics. Tweaking subject and tense a bit to trivially circumvent established prohibitions. If it were up to me, they'd all be allowed. At this point we're basically just banning sentence structure. "I've known dozens of people exactly like Virgil in my life, and every single one of them has a mama who wears army boots." "There are some opinions being expressed in this thread that remind me of just how many losers there are out there whose mamas wear army boots." "Isn't it funny how the people who hate Jenner so much are the same people who cry murder when we find out that their mamas wear army boots?" Just tell me my mama wears army boots. For Pete's sake. I would ban them all. Debate the post, not the poster. Any time Paul starts a thread, over half the posts are just people mocking Paul. It doesn't matter how interesting the subject might be to others. Bring back the 3 day ban so if people feel compelled to call **** an asshole, they can choose to do so and get it out of their system. The problem is that it's so absurdly easy to flout the rules without crossing the line. "Another crap article by Paul." Let's say this crosses the line and we ban it. Then how about? "Another worthless article by Paul." Do we ban that? Say we do. Then: "Another worthless article and trumped-up summary." Let's ban that too. "This article is worthless, and the summary is totally inaccurate." Still too harsh. Let's ban that. "I fail to see the value of this article, and I question the accuracy of the summary." OK. That sounds nice and academic. We'll let that stay. We're saying the exact same thing as we were before, but we're being 'nice' about it. Alas, the thread is still packed to the gunnels with comments paraphrasing "Another crap article by Paul.", but at least it's 'nice' detritus rather than the plain vanilla kind. Anyway... we're off topic.
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on Jun 3, 2015 17:22:40 GMT -5
no Them's fightin' words here in the South! Only let me be clear that only the TN tomato based sauce is acceptable, none of that South Carolina mustard based baby poop sauce, and none of abomination that Texas does to their meat and then calls BBQ. And don't get me started on that straight-from-hell alien life form that is a McDonald's McRibb - I'm pretty sure that's some soylent green shit dipped in ketchup sweetened with left over candy corn and peeps. Talk all you want about Biblical sin and men laying with men you want - but DO NOT talk shit about BBQ sauce. I'll clarify, if we're talking actual homemade BBQ sauce going on legit smoked meat like pulled pork or ribs, yes I'm in What I'm opposed to is a big squirt of Kraft BBQ sauce on a hamburger or whatever people put that stuff on.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 3, 2015 17:29:05 GMT -5
To be fair, Virgil, there are other examples.
Every rational, intellectually honest person knows that unfettered free market capitalism is the best way to reduce poverty.
I know that you, as a liberal, cannot stand the thought that other people don't naturally make the same choices that you do.
don't understand what laterbloomer hopes to accomplish with this thread, but c'est la vie.
I do think it is nicer to dislike the OP, arguments, etc. instead of the person.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Jun 3, 2015 17:44:31 GMT -5
But, what's your stance on Alabama White Sauce? BBQ sauce made with MAYONAISE?
Literally, I am speechless. Who does that to poor unsuspecting meat? Is that what it is oh my lord i am living in the wrong state. If I could put mayo on everything and in everything, i would!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 17:59:40 GMT -5
I would ban them all. Debate the post, not the poster. Any time Paul starts a thread, over half the posts are just people mocking Paul. It doesn't matter how interesting the subject might be to others. Bring back the 3 day ban so if people feel compelled to call **** an asshole, they can choose to do so and get it out of their system. The problem is that it's so absurdly easy to flout the rules without crossing the line. "Another crap article by Paul." Let's say this crosses the line and we ban it. Then how about? "Another worthless article by Paul." Do we ban that? Say we do. Then: "Another worthless article and trumped-up summary." Let's ban that too. "This article is worthless, and the summary is totally inaccurate." Still too harsh. Let's ban that. "I fail to see the value of this article, and I question the accuracy of the summary." OK. That sounds nice and academic. We'll let that stay. We're saying the exact same thing as we were before, but we're being 'nice' about it. Alas, the thread is still packed to the gunnels with comments paraphrasing "Another crap article by Paul.", but at least it's 'nice' detritus rather than the plain vanilla kind. Anyway... we're off topic. Delete the ones that are about Paul. It doesnt have to be perfect. If people say that wasnt about Paul then give them the benefit of the doubt and let them repost. I think Paul has some interesting ideas and I would like to read more debate on them. Just my opinion for what its worth. I absolutely hated getting mocked and my worries getting ridiculed. I was having a hard time and people could mock but I couldnt respond with f.u. which was the correct reply, by the way.
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Jun 3, 2015 18:03:08 GMT -5
Them's fightin' words here in the South! Only let me be clear that only the TN tomato based sauce is acceptable, none of that South Carolina mustard based baby poop sauce, and none of abomination that Texas does to their meat and then calls BBQ. And don't get me started on that straight-from-hell alien life form that is a McDonald's McRibb - I'm pretty sure that's some soylent green shit dipped in ketchup sweetened with left over candy corn and peeps. Talk all you want about Biblical sin and men laying with men you want - but DO NOT talk shit about BBQ sauce. I'll clarify, if we're talking actual homemade BBQ sauce going on legit smoked meat like pulled pork or ribs, yes I'm in What I'm opposed to is a big squirt of Kraft BBQ sauce on a hamburger or whatever people put that stuff on. Open Pit is my favorite mass made sauce - more vinegary than sugary.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 18:07:55 GMT -5
Organicville Tangy is the favorite around here.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 3, 2015 18:27:49 GMT -5
To be fair, Virgil, there are other examples.
Every rational, intellectually honest person knows that unfettered free market capitalism is the best way to reduce poverty.
I know that you, as a liberal, cannot stand the thought that other people don't naturally make the same choices that you do.
don't understand what laterbloomer hopes to accomplish with this thread, but c'est la vie.
I do think it is nicer to dislike the OP, arguments, etc. instead of the person.
I think it's nicer too. I just don't see 'nicer' as a solid basis for what stays and what goes. The examples you give (which should be in quotes) sound like Paul. He's been able to stick around because he knows how the game is played, and he's willing to play it. I don't know too many conservatives who'd bother.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 3, 2015 18:43:47 GMT -5
The last one was you. I remember when it was mostly conservatives, and I remember a time when there was more balance and people.
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DagnyT
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Post by DagnyT on Jun 3, 2015 21:36:36 GMT -5
Sorry you had that experience. I was thinking that the times I learned the most were the times I was most challenged. If he's scared to challenge anyone, I'm afraid his students are not learning much that they didn't already know. I probably learned the most important lesson of all. People don't listen, people don't care about your opinion. If you are depending on someone for something, tell them what they want to hear so you can get what you need. If you don't want to do that, go get what you want elsewhere. Everyone thinks they are right, and no one really has an open mind. Liberals are just as closed minded as right wing christian conservatives. If you disagree with them, they belittle you, they tell you that you are the cause of all the world's problems, they blame every social injustice ever on you. "Everyone is right, as long as they see it the same way I do." - said everyone, everywhere, always. This has got to be one of the most truthful statements I have ever read.
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