whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Dec 11, 2014 17:35:13 GMT -5
I've mentioned this before....
If we didn't have kids - I would be working.
If our kids were in school - I would be working.
Not bc I couldn't find something to do, I very much could (and it would NOT involve cleaning, that's FOR SURE), but bc I would feel incredibly guilty of not bringing in money and making my husband the sole breadwinner while I am doing "hobby stuff".
Some of the moms that I know, not only SAHM, but have "mother's helpers" come in a few days a week. My husband would be OK if I wanted to do that. My mom thinks I HAVE TO do this for myself. But I can't. Again, the guilt of spending money to have someone come and play with my kids (that's all mother's helpers really do) while I don't bring any money just not something I can handle.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 11, 2014 17:39:29 GMT -5
I WAS a SAH person. Perhaps it is because I am not surrounded by a bunch of other SAH persons. Most of my friends are professionals who work a lot of hours. When my kids went to school I felt isolated. I am a people person so I found sitting home everyday to be incredibly boring. My house was spotless, dinner was cooked, I exercised but there wasn't much else to do. What will you do when you retire? I think it's a bit sad that you couldn't come with half a dozen things to do during the few hours your kids were at school. I did but after a week I was bored to tears. I don't know why the fact that I'm not a home body makes you sad. Why should I stay home and be bored when i can make over 6 figures working? Trust me...no need to be sad for me. It wasn't intentional that I stayed home at that point. I made a bad career move and went to a firm that I hated. I had never planned to stay home long term but though I would enjoy a 6 month break. The first four months with the kids were great...the next two were just awful. I spent one full week doing a complete scrub down of everything in the house....then I thought I would die of boredom. I'm not used to just sitting and doing nothing. It isn't in my DNA.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 11, 2014 17:41:30 GMT -5
I hope you'll forgive me for not reading all 5 pages of this thread. I just want to say that I don't like the thread title because I've stopped using the term SAHM, and replaced it with FULL TIME mom / dad. I just feel its time to be honest and admit that there are two kinds of parent- full time, and part time. Some parents choose to work full time and parent part time, and others choose to work part time and/or not work and parent full time. What I find funny is you would be the first one bitching if someone that chose to parent full time (in your words) received government services to do so
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 17:43:35 GMT -5
Moneymom, I'm glad that your friend called you back and that things seem to have settled down.
People's professional lives go in all different directions. I think part of it is knowing when to stop the conversation.
I work FT but over 3 days (I'm an adjunct university professor, I prefer to teach 3 long days and keep 2 days for prep / marking and make my own schedule on those 2 days). One of my best friends used to live two doors away. They moved 2 years ago and they're now 20 min away, so I obviously see her much less often. She used to work PT but now she works FT and travels quite a bit. I recently offered to meet her for lunch at her hospital (which is in the next town from me) and she told me she wouldn't feel comfortable having me come in just to have us both gulp down a sandwich together at her desk.
I got the message.
I think different friends give us different things. Sometimes I find myself typing "my best friend" and then I correct it to "one of my best friends". I have been very, very blessed with friendships. I think I probably have about five "best friends".
Maybe you need to find another person you can be more open with about these issues, and keep this friend for other reasons, but maybe, not that conversation.
It's like a spouse ... no spouse can be everything to their spouse. IMO, it's the same for close / best friends.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 11, 2014 18:03:20 GMT -5
I hope you'll forgive me for not reading all 5 pages of this thread. I just want to say that I don't like the thread title because I've stopped using the term SAHM, and replaced it with FULL TIME mom / dad. I just feel its time to be honest and admit that there are two kinds of parent- full time, and part time. Some parents choose to work full time and parent part time, and others choose to work part time and/or not work and parent full time. What I find funny is you would be the first one bitching if someone that chose to parent full time (in your words) received government services to do so. I wouldn't classify objecting to theft as "bitching", but yeah- I'm opposed to the government taking money at gunpoint from someone who's earned it and giving it to someone who hasn't earned it.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Dec 11, 2014 18:03:58 GMT -5
Moneymom, I'm glad that your friend called you back and that things seem to have settled down. People's professional lives go in all different directions. I think part of it is knowing when to stop the conversation. I work FT but over 3 days (I'm an adjunct university professor, I prefer to teach 3 long days and keep 2 days for prep / marking and make my own schedule on those 2 days). One of my best friends used to live two doors away. They moved 2 years ago and they're now 20 min away, so I obviously see her much less often. She used to work PT but now she works FT and travels quite a bit. I recently offered to meet her for lunch at her hospital (which is in the next town from me) and she told me she wouldn't feel comfortable having me come in just to have us both gulp down a sandwich together at her desk. I got the message. I think different friends give us different things. Sometimes I find myself typing "my best friend" and then I correct it to "one of my best friends". I have been very, very blessed with friendships. I think I probably have about five "best friends". Maybe you need to find another person you can be more open with about these issues, and keep this friend for other reasons, but maybe, not that conversation. It's like a spouse ... no spouse can be everything to their spouse. IMO, it's the same for close / best friends. Knowing when to stop the conversation is 90% of life.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 11, 2014 18:06:23 GMT -5
What I find funny is you would be the first one bitching if someone that chose to parent full time (in your words) received government services to do so. I wouldn't classify objecting to theft as "bitching", but yeah- I'm opposed to the government taking money at gunpoint from someone who's earned it and giving it to someone who hasn't earned it. And yet you insult so those that work.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 18:07:10 GMT -5
Knowing when to stop the conversation is 90% of life.
I'm glad for you you've gotten it down to such a neat formula. I haven't yet managed that LOL.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Dec 11, 2014 18:13:56 GMT -5
I was bored when they were first born. There really arent that many activities for infants - especially when it was hot out.
Volunteering isnt as fun as everyone makes it out to be. I hate being at the school. Kids in large quantities give me anxiety, and I can't really teach anyone anything. I guess I could have made copies, but that sounds boring.
If I was a SAH now that they are in school, I could probably fill my day, but it would likely cost a lot of money. My hobbies arent things like making my own laundry detergent or clipping coupons. It would cost us a fortune for me to have a bunch of free time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 18:15:35 GMT -5
Thyme I remember you went PT, and then ultimately went back to FT. So I always find your posts on this subject interesting.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 18:58:11 GMT -5
By far, my biggest issue staying home was the feeling of dependence and not being able to take financial credit for where we were. That bugged me. I remember my own cousins talking to me one time telling me how "lucky I was to have a husband that could afford to get me this nice house. Man, I flipped. It was like nobody remembered that I bought this land and built the barn long before we were married and put up the entire down payment on the construction loan with the money I got selling my first house. They didn't know that I was the one with the good credit, and the savings and that I worked three jobs for years. All they had to say was how lucky I was to have a guy taking care of me. This was just my own personal issue though. LOL
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Dec 11, 2014 19:07:56 GMT -5
By far, my biggest issue staying home was the feeling of dependence and not being able to take financial credit for where we were. That bugged me. I remember my own cousins talking to me one time telling me how "lucky I was to have a husband that could afford to get me this nice house. Man, I flipped. It was like nobody remembered that I bought this land and built the barn long before we were married and put up the entire down payment on the construction loan with the money I got selling my first house. They didn't know that I was the one with the good credit, and the savings and that I worked three jobs for years. All they had to say was how lucky I was to have a guy taking care of me. This was just my own personal issue though. LOL I gotta comment on this because it reflects what I see as a common perception in society and it makes me nuts.
My mom for the most part never worked outside the home. Yet every day she did the route books and subtotaled the order tickets so my dad could run twice as many stops in the same amount of time as other drivers and pull in more commission. It also gave him less stress on the route because he knew the order and delivery tickets were neat and accurate.
She did this and ran the house and raised the children. She contributed as much to the families' success as did my DAD.
I could not be the wage earner I am if not for DH taking on primary care responsibilities. We are a TEAM, that's what it is all about.
Bitch slap your cousins for me and never think the contributions of the SAHS is not of equal value to the spouse with an outside job
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 11, 2014 19:10:45 GMT -5
By far, my biggest issue staying home was the feeling of dependence and not being able to take financial credit for where we were. That bugged me. I remember my own cousins talking to me one time telling me how "lucky I was to have a husband that could afford to get me this nice house. Man, I flipped. It was like nobody remembered that I bought this land and built the barn long before we were married and put up the entire down payment on the construction loan with the money I got selling my first house. They didn't know that I was the one with the good credit, and the savings and that I worked three jobs for years. All they had to say was how lucky I was to have a guy taking care of me. This was just my own personal issue though. LOL I get so annoyed her anyone says a guy should take care of a woman. Just because we have vajayjays doesn't mean we need someone to take care of us!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 19:25:52 GMT -5
By far, my biggest issue staying home was the feeling of dependence and not being able to take financial credit for where we were. That bugged me. I remember my own cousins talking to me one time telling me how "lucky I was to have a husband that could afford to get me this nice house. Man, I flipped. It was like nobody remembered that I bought this land and built the barn long before we were married and put up the entire down payment on the construction loan with the money I got selling my first house. They didn't know that I was the one with the good credit, and the savings and that I worked three jobs for years. All they had to say was how lucky I was to have a guy taking care of me. This was just my own personal issue though. LOL I gotta comment on this because it reflects what I see as a common perception in society and it makes me nuts.
My mom for the most part never worked outside the home. Yet every day she did the route books and subtotaled the order tickets so my dad could run twice as many stops in the same amount of time as other drivers and pull in more commission. It also gave him less stress on the route because he knew the order and delivery tickets were neat and accurate.
She did this and ran the house and raised the children. She contributed as much to the families' success as did my DAD.
I could not be the wage earner I am if not for DH taking on primary care responsibilities. We are a TEAM, that's what it is all about.
Bitch slap your cousins for me and never think the contributions of the SAHS is not of equal value to the spouse with an outside job
I got my husband his job. and I did EVERYTHING besides go off to work in the morning. All the house work all the yard work, all the financials and childcare. He could go on business trips all over the world on a moments notice and not worry about a thing on the home front. As it turns out he wasn't worrying much about the marriage either when he was on these trips, but that's a different subject.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 11, 2014 19:30:34 GMT -5
I gotta comment on this because it reflects what I see as a common perception in society and it makes me nuts.
My mom for the most part never worked outside the home. Yet every day she did the route books and subtotaled the order tickets so my dad could run twice as many stops in the same amount of time as other drivers and pull in more commission. It also gave him less stress on the route because he knew the order and delivery tickets were neat and accurate.
She did this and ran the house and raised the children. She contributed as much to the families' success as did my DAD.
I could not be the wage earner I am if not for DH taking on primary care responsibilities. We are a TEAM, that's what it is all about.
Bitch slap your cousins for me and never think the contributions of the SAHS is not of equal value to the spouse with an outside job
I got my husband his job. and I did EVERYTHING besides go off to work in the morning. All the house work all the yard work, all the financials and childcare. He could go on business trips all over the world on a moments notice and not worry about a thing on the home front. As it turns out he wasn't worrying much about the marriage either when he was on these trips, but that's a different subject. Lol..that's because men suck and a major reason why I don't think any woman should be dependent on one.
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milee
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Post by milee on Dec 11, 2014 19:49:35 GMT -5
I get so annoyed her anyone says a guy should take care of a woman. Just because we have vajayjays doesn't mean we need someone to take care of us! This morning a couple of my girlfriends and I had a boat on the hoist and were doing some difficult work to it. It was all going well - we know what we're doing, have the tools, etc. Until the last part where we realized not one of us was tall enough to reach the last critical set of bolts. We're all about 5'3" and no matter what we did, we needed about 6" more arm to get the dang bolts. So we realized we had to find a 6' tall person to help. None of our buddies were around, so we were going to have to look for a stranger for help. So one friend suggested that we'd be able to get guy help more quickly if we could all look confused and helpless, so we tried it. ... And burst into hysterical laughter 10 seconds later because we just don't know how to do "confused and helpless."
I guess when you're competent for a while, you lose the skill of looking like you need help.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 20:01:35 GMT -5
LOL Milee ... you need to buy one of those plastic Ikea "steps" LOL.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Dec 11, 2014 20:16:23 GMT -5
I get so annoyed her anyone says a guy should take care of a woman. Just because we have vajayjays doesn't mean we need someone to take care of us! This morning a couple of my girlfriends and I had a boat on the hoist and were doing some difficult work to it. It was all going well - we know what we're doing, have the tools, etc. Until the last part where we realized not one of us was tall enough to reach the last critical set of bolts. We're all about 5'3" and no matter what we did, we needed about 6" more arm to get the dang bolts. So we realized we had to find a 6' tall person to help. None of our buddies were around, so we were going to have to look for a stranger for help. So one friend suggested that we'd be able to get guy help more quickly if we could all look confused and helpless, so we tried it. ... And burst into hysterical laughter 10 seconds later because we just don't know how to do "confused and helpless."
I guess when you're competent for a while, you lose the skill of looking like you need help.
Lol! Don't get me wrong, I pull out my female card when i have to
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 21:47:04 GMT -5
What will you do when you retire? I think it's a bit sad that you couldn't come with half a dozen things to do during the few hours your kids were at school. I did but after a week I was bored to tears. I don't know why the fact that I'm not a home body makes you sad. Why should I stay home and be bored when i can make over 6 figures working? I think you should make whatever choice you want to make. But this isn't being sad that you aren't a homebody. It's being concerned that the ONLY options you saw were stay home and be bored or work full time. It's quite possible to not work flull time for pay and also not just stay home and clean, etc... It's possible you might not be able to work your whole life. What will you do?
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gooddecisions
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Post by gooddecisions on Dec 11, 2014 22:22:32 GMT -5
I hope you'll forgive me for not reading all 5 pages of this thread. I just want to say that I don't like the thread title because I've stopped using the term SAHM, and replaced it with FULL TIME mom / dad. I just feel its time to be honest and admit that there are two kinds of parent- full time, and part time. Some parents choose to work full time and parent part time, and others choose to work part time and/or not work and parent full time. So, if your kids are in school until 3:30 and then practice or clubs until 4:30 or 5, does that stay at home parent get credit for being a "full-time parent" even though they aren't necessarily with the kid anymore time than the "part-time" parent. Help me understand because plenty of working parents are still active with the school activities, appointments, taking sick days when the kids are sick, doing laundry, cooking, homework, attending recitals/games, cleaning up and everything else that goes into parenting. My co-worker (full-time) won a volunteer award from our company for serving her community. Her 1000+ volunteer hours were for being a room mom in her kid's classroom. But, she is a full-time employee, so I guess she is somehow still only a part-time parent.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Dec 11, 2014 22:31:03 GMT -5
I did but after a week I was bored to tears. I don't know why the fact that I'm not a home body makes you sad. Why should I stay home and be bored when i can make over 6 figures working? I think you should make whatever choice you want to make. But this isn't being sad that you aren't a homebody. It's being concerned that the ONLY options you saw we're stay home and be bored or work full time. It's quite possible to not work flull time for pay and also not just stay home and clean, etc... It's possible you might not be able to work your whole life. What will you do? We were buying my husband some shirts and the elderly gentleman at the shop was chatting with us. He asked what my husband's job was, and so went the conversation and found out that this guy had been a fairly prominent lawyer here. Given the nature of the work he did, I'm sure he earned plenty of money, and now he was retired. He said that he was so happy working, he decided to continue to work - but now selling shirts. Apparently, just about everyone that worked at that shop had been a professional, and couldn't find joy in hobbies or retirement. The store was generous with scheduling, so they could all travel or arrange around other activities. I thought the whole thing was lovely. I have said for a long time that work is my hobby. I enjoy it, and I don't really care for the hobbies everyone else seems to like - so I will go with it for now. When retirement comes, maybe I will go sell shirts, or drop dead from boredom. I don't consider it a personality flaw that we aren't all totally self-sufficient like you. It takes all kinds. What is up with you lately, Oped - you seem a little "judgier" than usual.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 22:31:17 GMT -5
If you parent full time and work part time, are you 1 1/2 people?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 22:41:26 GMT -5
I didn't mean that to be judge-y. I'm sorry that you read it that way. I thought Tech was misunderstanding the concern. Her assumption seemed to be that if you SAH, you stay at home, and since that bored her, she can't do it. I don't think that's the only option if someone isn't working full time for money.
I said pretty clearly that she should do what she likes, but I guess I do wonder how people can find nothing to do outside of sit home bored or work full time. It's foreign to me. I do wonder what a person with that choice would do when they can't work.
I'm not sure how that is judgy? .... Or at least I'm guessing it's not any more judgy than wondering how people can stay home without kids, which Tech asked about as well.
Honestly, do you have other examples? Because I'm not seeing my infraction here...
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Dec 11, 2014 22:42:35 GMT -5
It's hard to give a good answer because I don't really know the dynamics of the relationship. If it were me, I'd probably just proceed without bringing it up again or apologizing, unless my friend was giving me the cold shoulder.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Dec 11, 2014 22:44:52 GMT -5
I didn't mean that to be judge-y. I'm sorry that you read it that way. I thought Tech was misunderstanding the concern. Her assumption seemed to be that if you SAH, you stay at home, and since that bored her, she can't do it. I don't think that's the only option if someone isn't working full time for money.I said pretty clearly that she should do what she likes, but I guess I do wonder how people can find nothing to do outside of sit home bored or work full time. It's foreign to me. I do wonder what a person with that choice would do when they can't work. I'm not sure how that is judgy? .... Or at least I'm guessing it's not any more judgy than wondering how people can stay home without kids, which Tech asked about as well. Honestly, do you have other examples? Because I'm not seeing my infraction here... As I said - I can think of a million things to do - and all of them cost money. I could bankrupt us in 2 years if I followed through on all my interests. Not all of us find joy in volunteering or whatever is free.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Dec 11, 2014 22:51:39 GMT -5
I'm sorry, but unless she's the Secretary of State or something, then I do think you know that being a working mother is a stressful and sensitive subject with her.
She actually handled it correctly. She told you that she couldn't talk about this subject with you.
No one in this day and age is oblivious to the conflict between working mothers and stay-at-home mothers. If you are that oblivious, you need to get out more.
And to tell her that you think that staying at home is more stressful You are lucky she is still speaking to you. Most working mothers do most of what you do plus some.
I was practically a stay-at-home mother, by the way. I worked PT. I'm not speaking from self-interest.
Not true. I left my job to take care of my dying father. I spent almost 24/7 caring for him. You cannot compare that to anything. Now I'm assisting my disabled uncle and my SIL who is going blind. I did all this while being a foster parent and taking care of infants/toddlers. Being a SAHM is not always puppies and rainbows. As a general rule, it's not a good idea to have conversations with ANYONE about "who has it easier." That's not a constructive topic, and everyone will end up with hurt feelings.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 22:53:28 GMT -5
I didn't mean that to be judge-y. I'm sorry that you read it that way. I thought Tech was misunderstanding the concern. Her assumption seemed to be that if you SAH, you stay at home, and since that bored her, she can't do it. I don't think that's the only option if someone isn't working full time for money.I said pretty clearly that she should do what she likes, but I guess I do wonder how people can find nothing to do outside of sit home bored or work full time. It's foreign to me. I do wonder what a person with that choice would do when they can't work. I'm not sure how that is judgy? .... Or at least I'm guessing it's not any more judgy than wondering how people can stay home without kids, which Tech asked about as well. Honestly, do you have other examples? Because I'm not seeing my infraction here... As I said - I can think of a million things to do - and all of them cost money. I could bankrupt us in 2 years if I followed through on all my interests. Not all of us find joy in volunteering or whatever is free. So the only option for a person not working full time for money is to stay home all day alone... Is that what you are saying?
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Dec 11, 2014 22:56:18 GMT -5
No - clearly there are many things to do. I just haven't found any that I enjoy that are cheap enough that if I stopped working I could still afford them.
Why not give us a list of these magical things that are so awesome for every single personality type that don't cost any money?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2014 23:05:46 GMT -5
I doubt there is one list for everyone. I'm guessing it would need to be molded to ones interests. You want to list yours and we can find you some options?
The point is though that Tech said multiple times:
"There is only so much cleaning, exercising, and cooking one can do." "without the kids home there was nothing to do" "I honestly don't know what people do all day long" "I'd go insane if I was just home by myself all day long every day" " I'm not used to just sitting and doing nothing. It isn't in my DNA." "being home alone would drive me nuts" Etc etc...
She obviously sees only ONE definition for SAH, and ONE alternative... Work full time.
But it's judgy to suggest that there might be alternatives? ....
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Dec 12, 2014 0:06:17 GMT -5
My mom can't retire. She thinks she will bankrupt them with all the hobbies and activities she would be doing.
My dad LOVES being retired. I have no clue what he does all day, but he seem to be always busy, but he doesn't seem to be spending a lot of money.
I can see myself being like my mom and my husband would be a combo of both of my parents.
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