zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,912
|
Post by zibazinski on Jul 20, 2014 14:01:38 GMT -5
My son asked me what a period was. I was fairly sure given his age and iq he wasn't discussing gunctustion. I explained. He needed to know too even though it wasn't going to happen to him. He has a mother, a sister, other females in his life.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,912
|
Post by zibazinski on Jul 20, 2014 14:02:00 GMT -5
Punctuation.
|
|
morrisr2d2
Established Member
Joined: Mar 3, 2011 12:47:41 GMT -5
Posts: 422
|
Post by morrisr2d2 on Jul 20, 2014 14:09:41 GMT -5
I remember as a kid being so confused as to why my mom treated me, a boy, different from my sisters. I had to do all types of chores like mow the yard, take out the trash, help dad with house repairs, and do dishes and laundry. When I asked why my sisters didn't have to do outside chores or help dad with house repairs she said its because they are girls. I asked why do I have to do I inside chores, to which mom said I had to learn to help my future wife out. Or why my mom wouldn't drive me to work or school (I had to walk or bike) but she drove my sisters. Again cause they were girls. As a kid I thought in terms of fairness not gender roles and I resented my parents for that for a while.my parents weren't also as tough on them in terms of school and success, which I later figured out was because they are girls and will get married and have a man be the breadwinner, and that what my parents were prepping me for, to be a breadwinner.
Well to bad for them they got a gay son, but to their credit they've come a long way and are much more forward thinking today.
Eff gender role expectations. I have have no problem with what people do whether it's traditional or not, I just want society to let people figure out what they want without judgment or expectations linked to their genitilia.
|
|
quince
Senior Member
Joined: Sept 23, 2011 17:51:12 GMT -5
Posts: 2,699
|
Post by quince on Jul 20, 2014 14:53:32 GMT -5
Hmm. I will take the lesson and make sure my son gets information about menstruation outside of health class. Excellent point.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,912
|
Post by zibazinski on Jul 20, 2014 15:25:18 GMT -5
You especially don't want to be the one called down to the admin office because your son decides its funny to throw pads down the hall. You want him to be the one who looks down on the immature boys that do.
|
|
achelois
Well-Known Member
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 9:55:44 GMT -5
Posts: 1,479
|
Post by achelois on Jul 20, 2014 17:19:15 GMT -5
Parents, IMHO, don't do their kids any favors by crippling them: in other words not teaching them something because they are of one sex or the other.
|
|
Miss Tequila
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 10:13:45 GMT -5
Posts: 20,602
|
Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 20, 2014 17:24:15 GMT -5
Again, we were asked an opinion and we all gave one. My opinion doesn't mean that I am dismissive of anyone else that is different. It means that I would be attracted to guys that some of you wouldn't be. It means that a guy that would expect me to do what I consider "mans work" wouldn't be attracted to me. Stating that you would be "devastated" if your daughter acted manly took me aback some. Same as Zib saying "ewww" to people's choices. That's a bit beyond giving an opinion, without being dismissive of different choices. Particularly since non traditional gender choices have been helpful at points or currently to both. Just my sense of things. I don't know why that would take you aback...I'm sure I would eventually get over it but if my daughter suddenly chopped off her hair and started wearing mens clothing I would have a really hard time with it. Before you-know-who jumps in and says I would kick her to the curb, I would not. But it would certainly shatter me
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 10, 2024 6:27:51 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2014 17:53:53 GMT -5
I remember the first time I made my daughter help cut the grass. She literally cried and told me through her tears that she shouldn't have to cut grass because she's a girl. Ummm...... what am I? I'm certainly not a male. She was older than her brother and bigger, she got schooled on the lawnmower before he did.
He ended up in charge of changing lightbulbs because he was taller and didn't need to stand on something like we did. He took care of bugs because he wasn't afraid of them like I was. He learned some handy man skills because he couldn't wait to be old enough to work with his grandfather that works in construction. I taught both of them how to clean the house, do their own laundry, and what little I know about cooking (how to follow a recipe!). I had both of them "help" me do things around the house. They were both expected to do well in school. My son did naturally gravitate toward and take over the more "manly" things around the house, but it wasn't because I forced him to. I sure did appreciate it though, especially since he did a lot of those things without me asking him to.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 10, 2024 6:27:51 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2014 18:21:00 GMT -5
I don't know why that would take you aback...I'm sure I would eventually get over it but if my daughter suddenly chopped off her hair and started wearing mens clothing I would have a really hard time with it. Before you-know-who jumps in and says I would kick her to the curb, I would not. But it would certainly shatter me I guess... suppose a woman actively chooses to be a traditional homemaker their entire adult life, and feels strongly that that is a logical choice for them, their family, and likely for most other women too. Then the same person states that they would be shattered and devastated if their daughters grew up to be girly girls who wanted long hair. It is a surprising statement given their chosen occupational role in reference to tradition. A statement/scenario like this would make me similarly curious. I imagine you might wonder "why does this mom think it's so bad if their daughters want long hair?" as well.
|
|
Miss Tequila
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 10:13:45 GMT -5
Posts: 20,602
|
Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 20, 2014 18:33:13 GMT -5
I don't know why that would take you aback...I'm sure I would eventually get over it but if my daughter suddenly chopped off her hair and started wearing mens clothing I would have a really hard time with it. Before you-know-who jumps in and says I would kick her to the curb, I would not. But it would certainly shatter me I guess... suppose a woman actively chooses to be a traditional homemaker their entire adult life, and feels strongly that that is a logical choice for them, their family, and likely for most other women too. Then the same person states that they would be shattered and devastated if their daughters grew up to be girly girls who wanted long hair. It is a surprising statement given their chosen occupational role in reference to tradition. A statement/scenario like this would make me similarly curious. I imagine you might wonder "why does this mom think it's so bad if their daughters want long hair?" as well. I'm so confused...I have a professional career but have long hair and dress like a woman. I'm not following your correalatjin. Or does every professional woman have to dress butch in your opinion? And that isnt snark, I'm just honestly confused
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 10, 2024 6:27:51 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2014 18:43:04 GMT -5
I'm so confused...I have a professional career but have long hair and dress like a woman. I'm not following your correalatjin. Or does every professional woman have to dress butch in your opinion? And that isnt snark, I'm just honestly confused You emphasized traditional roles, and traditional appearances. Your occupation is extremely non traditional for your gender. So your horror at a daughter acting in a non traditional way surprised me.
|
|
Miss Tequila
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 10:13:45 GMT -5
Posts: 20,602
|
Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 20, 2014 18:53:24 GMT -5
I'm so confused...I have a professional career but have long hair and dress like a woman. I'm not following your correalatjin. Or does every professional woman have to dress butch in your opinion? And that isnt snark, I'm just honestly confused You emphasized traditional roles, and traditional appearances. Your occupation is extremely non traditional for your gender. So your horror at a daughter acting in a non traditional way surprised me. A quick google search will show you that 50% of accountants are female...not sure where you are getting that my occupation is extremely non traditional for my gender....
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 10, 2024 6:27:51 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2014 19:06:12 GMT -5
You emphasized traditional roles, and traditional appearances. Your occupation is extremely non traditional for your gender. So your horror at a daughter acting in a non traditional way surprised me. A quick google search will show you that 50% of accountants are female...not sure where you are getting that my occupation is extremely non traditional for my gender....Accounting was traditionally was done by men. You listed your occupation as financial executive. Executive positions were traditionally done by men. Executive positions are still mostly done by men. Traditionally, your occupation is a men's occupation, and is still mostly male.
|
|
Miss Tequila
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 10:13:45 GMT -5
Posts: 20,602
|
Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 20, 2014 19:10:09 GMT -5
A quick google search will show you that 50% of accountants are female...not sure where you are getting that my occupation is extremely non traditional for my gender....Accounting was traditionally was done by men. You listed your occupation as financial executive. Executive positions were traditionally done by men. Executive positions are still mostly done by men. Traditionally, your occupation is a men's occupation, and is still mostly male. Well I AM a financial executive because I rose through the ranks...but I started in public accounting and half of us were female. I'm still not seeing why you think that due to my profession I should want to dress butch or not be devastated if my daughter dressed butch...I have no clue what my profession has to do with whether or not I am feminine...let's just agree to disagree...
|
|
msventoux
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 12, 2011 22:32:37 GMT -5
Posts: 3,037
|
Post by msventoux on Jul 20, 2014 19:12:31 GMT -5
You emphasized traditional roles, and traditional appearances. Your occupation is extremely non traditional for your gender. So your horror at a daughter acting in a non traditional way surprised me. A quick google search will show you that 50% of accountants are female...not sure where you are getting that my occupation is extremely non traditional for my gender.... In my area, at least anecdotally, probably more than half of accountants are female. Plenty of them are staff and seniors, but a small percentage are owners or partner, probably less than 20%.
|
|
Tennesseer
Member Emeritus
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 21:58:42 GMT -5
Posts: 64,529
|
Post by Tennesseer on Jul 20, 2014 19:17:20 GMT -5
My son asked me what a period was. I was fairly sure given his age and iq he wasn't discussing gunctustion. I explained. He needed to know too even though it wasn't going to happen to him. He has a mother, a sister, other females in his life. In my senior year high school mechanical drawing class, and when the term was popular, a goofy kid asked our teacher, a nun, what a douche bag was. The nun laughed and told him to ask his mother.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 10, 2024 6:27:51 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2014 19:20:07 GMT -5
A quick google search will show you that 50% of accountants are female...not sure where you are getting that my occupation is extremely non traditional for my gender.... In my area, at least anecdotally, probably more than half of accountants are female. Plenty of them are staff and seniors, but a small percentage are owners or partner, probably less than 20%. Yep, several professions have become more than half female in the recent times. I appreciate the people who acted in non traditional ways. They opened choices, including the ability to become an executive, a rarer spot, but definitely possible now Miss Tequila, sounds good to me.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 10, 2024 6:27:51 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2014 23:13:19 GMT -5
Final thoughts before settling down and bowing out:
DH and I have run across a rather pervasive an idea that if a man isn't earning money, they're a mooch, even though being a SAH wife in this region with no kids is accepted easily. I think mooching depends on the guy, just like the woman. I felt extremely wonderful and pampered when DH was staying home. He ran errands, cooked, everything, so that I could settled down after work and relax. It was super nice. But man, he got judged hard. I snarled at a lot of people who were telling me to him, since he was a mooch. He was not. He was awesome, and making my life easy and smooth. Now he's making a lot of money designing and overseeing international projects (probably Peru next), and taking international classes like the Antwerp training, and the same people tell me I'm lucky to have him.
I grew up with no brothers, but our parents were very into construction on their home. So there was one guy, dad. 20 acres of woods and meadow, a 1/2 mile steep gravel driveway to rake and maintain, and always stacks of sheet rock and other supplies to put put into place. It felt natural that mom and my sisters and I would help him, he would've been killed from overwork. We wouldn't just sit and stare at dad while he went back and forth carrying 5 kayaks to the water edge, or if the trunk was full of groceries. It's polite and useful to help. Some things, like the oversized sheet rock for the 11 foot ceiling, all four of us took a corner and went up ladders with the sheet and held it in place while dad secured it. No problem. Teams are really handy for carrying heavier stuff, like moving the cast iron bathtub up the stairs.
Having options has been interesting and good to me, and I want to share my options if I can with guys. Honestly, part of DH's work success is that he's not a super alpha male; he's easy going, likes to joke and is great at multitasking and handling chaos and stress. He already knows how to change diapers and babysit groups of kids because of his parents' multiple divorces and remarriages growing up. He's super versatile, but the drumbeat is that unless he's hauling in money, he's not doing worthwhile things. I aggravates me, even though he's characteristically mellow.
|
|
violagirl
Familiar Member
Joined: Aug 17, 2011 11:04:54 GMT -5
Posts: 703
|
Post by violagirl on Jul 21, 2014 9:29:22 GMT -5
I think this topic is difficult because we all have different views of what it means to "be a man". I grew up in a pretty traditional household. Stay at home mom. Dad was the breadwinner. For the most part, the girls took care of the inside housework and the guys did the outside work. I did used to cut the lawn though because I liked to do it and my brothers were more than happy to let me. I did not help my father with car repairs because I didn't have the patience to hold the light for him and was not interested in cars at all like my brothers were. My brothers did do some housework like vacuuming and cleaning their rooms, but they did not really cook or sew or iron.
It took me awhile to adjust when I got married as I thought my husband, like my Dad and brothers would be a "handy" guy. If stuff needed fixing, I just assumed he would know how to do it. Turns out he knows less about cars than I do and would rather pay someone to do stuff. But I think that is more because he is a perfectionist and will not figure something out as he goes - he would be afraid to do it wrong so he would rather not do it. He is much more mechanically inclined than I am though. He is able to figure out directions better than me so he generally takes care of things like that.
I have discovered there is some danger in being a capable woman. Once I know how to do something, it can end up becoming my job on top of everything else. Like grilling - I learned out how to cook steak better than him. So then I ended up somehow doing all of the BBQing - a traditional male domain in my family.
I dont' think house chores etc need to be 50/50 but if I am going to be expected to do all the cooking and shopping (which I dont' mind), then no way am I going to be doing the lawn mowing. I COULD do the lawn mowing, but I dont' think I should be responsible for every thing.
As for what I think a male should LOOK like. I guess I'm one of the few of my generation who prefer a hairy chest. I also prefer men to be bigger than me. I don't consider myself to be "butch" but I am always disconcerted to shake hands with a man whose hands are smaller than mine or softer. I also prefer men to be bigger than me.
I also prefer my husband to take charge and be the leader. I dont' expect that of other men but I prefer him to be the leader. I know if I was in danger he would jump in between. He always walks on the outside of the sidewalk between me and the street. It isn't even a conscious thing for him.
Anyway, I think there are things regarding gender roles that we can intellectually debate but I think there are some innate differences between the genders that we just do. Is it genetic? Or thousands of years of traditional gender roles? I don't think you can intellectualize that away.
|
|
Opti
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 10:45:38 GMT -5
Posts: 42,245
Location: New Jersey
Mini-Profile Name Color: c28523
Mini-Profile Text Color: 990033
Member is Online
|
Post by Opti on Jul 21, 2014 11:00:59 GMT -5
I think it only becomes your job if you and he let it. I liked to grill, but my XH enjoyed it more, so I chose to let it be primarily his domain.
We both like to drive and be in charge of the car, so we chose to switch roughly equally on long trips. Realized I actually missed that when I had a BF who preferred to let me drive and it was a long and tiring trip.
I also prefer my husband to take charge and be the leader. I don't. I prefer a partnership. I didn't grow up in a traditional household and I'm the eldest of all girls.
I prefer leadership if needed, to be situational.
|
|
skubikky
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 7:37:12 GMT -5
Posts: 3,044
|
Post by skubikky on Jul 21, 2014 11:54:43 GMT -5
I agree and would also go on to say: Also out there are women who are egg donors vs. mothers. Too many baby mamas do the deed and walk away, and not play any role in the lives of their children. But leave them to be raised by the fathers, grandmothers, aunts et al.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,619
|
Post by swamp on Jul 21, 2014 13:34:26 GMT -5
My husband is happy that I'm physically strong and not a girly girl. Im not Butchy either, I'm kind of mid ground. It takes all kinds.
|
|
Green Eyed Lady
Senior Associate
Look inna eye! Always look inna eye!
Joined: Jan 23, 2012 11:23:55 GMT -5
Posts: 19,629
|
Post by Green Eyed Lady on Jul 21, 2014 13:39:12 GMT -5
Exactly. If we were all attracted to the exact same man/woman, what a fight that would be! To each his/her own.
|
|
hoops902
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 13:21:29 GMT -5
Posts: 11,978
|
Post by hoops902 on Jul 21, 2014 13:55:45 GMT -5
::You listed your occupation as financial executive. Executive positions were traditionally done by men. Executive positions are still mostly done by men.::
Executive positions were traditionally done by people living in Europe. Am I non-traditional in that I live in America? As a straight, white, male I so seldom have a reason to label myself as "non traditional".
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Oct 10, 2024 6:27:51 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2014 14:35:47 GMT -5
Executive positions were traditionally done by people living in Europe. Am I non-traditional in that I live in America? As a straight, white, male I so seldom have a reason to label myself as "non traditional". *sound of getting sucked back in* My understanding is that tradition is defined as "a long-established or inherited way of thinking or acting." dictionary.reference.com/browse/traditionGeographical area often isn't a required factor in continuing a culture's traditional philosophies. Immigrants often continue traditions in the new area. As a straight white male, you have opportunities to act non traditional if you want, and I'd support them. Being a stay at home dad, preferring house work, speaking when something is very much sucking or deeply painful, rather than heavily suppressing it. DH tends to fall silent when upset, and I need to slowly scatter gun until we get on topic and he can start speaking freely. My dad looks very much like "man's man." He was a hands on roofer for decades, and rock climbs as a hobby. He loves being up high and physical. Lots of muscle even at 69 and he's weather beaten. But he's fine with buying pads for us, wasn't afraid of pink if a product was very good, and if mom asked him to hold her purse, he put it on so he wouldn't lose track of it. He was the one to go to for hugs and cuddles, mom was about tough love and getting back in the saddle so we didn't get afraid. Whatever works and is sensible for people, I support.
|
|
NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
Posts: 48,091
|
Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 21, 2014 14:38:09 GMT -5
But he's fine with buying pads for usMy dad's made runs for sick neighbors. DH isn't embarrassed to buy them for me but gets easily irritated in the feminine product aisle. I'm extremely picky so it's easier if I just run to get them myself. I can't really blame him because the last time I went I nearly had a tantrum too. It's getting ridiculous trying to decode all the packages to find what it is you want.
|
|
greeniis10
Well-Known Member
Joined: May 9, 2012 12:27:09 GMT -5
Posts: 1,834
|
Post by greeniis10 on Jul 21, 2014 15:03:58 GMT -5
But he's fine with buying pads for usMy dad's made runs for sick neighbors. DH isn't embarrassed to buy them for me but gets easily irritated in the feminine product aisle. I'm extremely picky so it's easier if I just run to get them myself. I can't really blame him because the last time I went I nearly had a tantrum too. It's getting ridiculous trying to decode all the packages to find what it is you want. Oh, this reminds me of the one time I actually smiled while shopping at Wal-Mart. A little boy was in the big part of the buggy (he was probably 5 yrs. old maybe??) shopping with his mom. She stops in front of the vast wall of pads in their brightly colored packages. Here's how their conversation went: (He was wearing regular clothes but also had on a cape; super-hero-boy of some sort, so I knew he had a personality.) Little boy: Mom, are you buying diapers? Mom: No LB: Well, what are they? Mom: silence LB: Do you NEED diapers? Mom: No (quietly scanning the shelves) LB: Get Trumps. Mom: No LB: Get the blue ones. Mom: No LB: Get the green ones. Mom: No LB: (gesturing dramatically at the shelf) Just pick something!!! I'm sure you had to be there, but it was quite funny and I give the mom credit for just being cool about it.
|
|
michelyn8
Familiar Member
Joined: Jul 25, 2012 6:48:24 GMT -5
Posts: 926
|
Post by michelyn8 on Jul 21, 2014 15:13:26 GMT -5
A quick google search will show you that 50% of accountants are female...not sure where you are getting that my occupation is extremely non traditional for my gender....Accounting was traditionally was done by men. You listed your occupation as financial executive. Executive positions were traditionally done by men. Executive positions are still mostly done by men. Traditionally, your occupation is a men's occupation, and is still mostly male. I may be the only one who gets Miss T's point of view but to be honest I can't explain it any better than she has either. I'm not attracted to men who don't fit the traditional mold. I do what needs to be done regardless of the associated gender stereotype and always will but in my relationships, I also expect certain tasks to be done by men and others to be done by me unless we agree to a different division of labor. I've always said if I remarry it will be to someone who makes enough money that I can quit work, be a SAHS (taking care of anything that needs doing at home as well as the traditional female housekeeping role), and spend my spare time on things that truly interest me. If I have to keep working to keep a roof over my head and take care of most things at home, then I may as well stay single. And the men I meet seem to expect that I will work to support the home plus take care of said home too while they spend their off hours pursuing their interests. No thanks. I also get her feelings about her daughter and her husband's feelings about a son that would want to sing showtunes. I doubt they'd kick them to the curb if they were to exhibit non-traditional behavior for their sex. It would just be an adjustment no different than when I had to come to terms with my son confirming he is gay. Plus - I'll concede that in larger cities and companies it has traditionally been men who held jobs such as hers but I also think we need to look back past the Mad Men era and the women's liberation movement. There have always been women working outside the home, women in business, women running things, etc. Those roles just were not always prominent because it was a woman doing what needed to be done and not necessarily looking for validation that they were just as good at it as their male counterparts. BTW Miss Tequila - Hugh Jackman is a rather manly man and he sings showtunes. What say you about that?
|
|
giramomma
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 11:25:27 GMT -5
Posts: 22,143
|
Post by giramomma on Jul 21, 2014 16:48:53 GMT -5
But he's fine with buying pads for usMy dad's made runs for sick neighbors. DH isn't embarrassed to buy them for me but gets easily irritated in the feminine product aisle. I'm extremely picky so it's easier if I just run to get them myself. I can't really blame him because the last time I went I nearly had a tantrum too. It's getting ridiculous trying to decode all the packages to find what it is you want. Oh, this reminds me of the one time I actually smiled while shopping at Wal-Mart. A little boy was in the big part of the buggy (he was probably 5 yrs. old maybe??) shopping with his mom. She stops in front of the vast wall of pads in their brightly colored packages. Here's how their conversation went: (He was wearing regular clothes but also had on a cape; super-hero-boy of some sort, so I knew he had a personality.) Little boy: Mom, are you buying diapers? Mom: No LB: Well, what are they? Mom: silence LB: Do you NEED diapers? Mom: No (quietly scanning the shelves) LB: Get Trumps. Mom: No LB: Get the blue ones. Mom: No LB: Get the green ones. Mom: No LB: (gesturing dramatically at the shelf) Just pick something!!! I'm sure you had to be there, but it was quite funny and I give the mom credit for just being cool about it. Apparently, the last time DH and the kids went shopping at Costco, and they were in the feminine hygiene aisle, DS said "Look I already found the box of stuff that Mom uses, " and proceeded to take a box off the shelf and put it in the cart. DS has not really bothered yet, to ask, what my stuff is for. DS is also incredibly sensitive..much more sensitive than my girls, actually. Sure, because of that we have to parent him differently, but I really never thought of it as some sort of "adjustment." I actually marvel at how far he ahead he is emotionally than DD1. I find it to be an incredible gift. And I chose to nourish the gift as much as I can, rather than trying to "toughen him up."
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,912
|
Post by zibazinski on Jul 21, 2014 17:00:17 GMT -5
When DS asked me what was in my cart I answered feminine hygiene products. He asked, I answered. When he wanted to know more, years later, and I explained, he had an AH HAH moment. I didn't lie but told enough to answer his question for his range of knowledge.
|
|