Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782 
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Oct 28, 2013 18:44:11 GMT -5
When was being gay illegal? Who said it was? It isn't illegal to write a note and not leave a tip either. |
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 18:45:43 GMT -5
Being Gay isn't against the law Back in the day it was. Mtman said it used to be illegal... When and where was that? |
|
chiver78
Administrator
Current Events Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:04:45 GMT -5
Posts: 39,712
|
Post by chiver78 on Oct 28, 2013 18:49:46 GMT -5
When was being gay illegal? Who said it was? It isn't illegal to write a note and not leave a tip either. am I reading you correctly? please correct me if I'm wrong - you are okay with patrons coming into a restaurant and being served for their meal, and when it is time for them to settle up, they can decline gratuity for <an arbitrary reason, to the server> and leave a note explaining why? I know you're sensitive to anything that looks like bashing of religious folks, but please take a second look at the sanitized version of events. take the religion out of the equation. are you really okay with this couple doing what they did? |
|
kittensaver
Junior Associate
We cannot do great things. We can only do small things with great love. - Mother Teresa
Joined: Nov 22, 2011 16:16:36 GMT -5
Posts: 7,983
|
Post by kittensaver on Oct 28, 2013 18:51:28 GMT -5
Mtman said it used to be illegal... When and where was that? Well the lawyers or folks who have time to scroll through the interwebz could probably answer in more detail than I, but from everything I've seen: many (many) States had (and a few still have) laws on the books criminalizing certain sexual activities (in which, by the way, both gays and straights participate) - but I don't ever recall seeing any law that SPECIFICALLY called out homosexuality as illegal. Just "certain" um, activities  |
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Oct 28, 2013 18:52:47 GMT -5
No, you aren't reading me correctly at all. What does gay being "illegal" have to do with this issue at all? Where did anyone including the patrons say being gay was "illegal"? So, I don't see what point is being made. And, my point is that it isn't illegal to stiff someone the tip or write them a nasty note. I didn't say what they did was right or kind. Oh, never mind. Gawd.
|
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Oct 28, 2013 18:54:16 GMT -5
When was being gay illegal? To my knowledge, it never was, oped. However, homosexual acts were illegal (sodomy laws) so gay people could be arrested on those grounds. |
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Oct 28, 2013 18:54:39 GMT -5
When was being gay illegal? Who said it was? It isn't illegal to write a note and not leave a tip either. Mtman said it was, Shooby. |
|
kittensaver
Junior Associate
We cannot do great things. We can only do small things with great love. - Mother Teresa
Joined: Nov 22, 2011 16:16:36 GMT -5
Posts: 7,983
|
Post by kittensaver on Oct 28, 2013 18:55:31 GMT -5
No, you aren't reading me correctly at all. What does gay being "illegal" have to do with this issue at all? Where did anyone including the patrons say being gay was "illegal"? So, I don't see what point is being made. And, my point is that it isn't illegal to stiff someone the tip or write them a nasty note. I didn't say what they did was right or kind. Oh, never mind. Gawd. Well it may not be illegal, but it certainly IS un-Christian. And no, not all Christians behave this way, but the ones that do certainly do a major disservice to the ones who don't. Just sayin' . . . |
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Oct 28, 2013 18:56:28 GMT -5
Who said it was? It isn't illegal to write a note and not leave a tip either. Mtman said it was, Shooby. He said "back in the day" not now. |
|
mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Oct 28, 2013 18:57:01 GMT -5
When was being gay illegal? Who said it was? It isn't illegal to write a note and not leave a tip either. While mtman did say it was illegal to be gay "back in the day", NOBODY has said it was illegal to fail to leave a tip, or to write a note, Shooby. |
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Oct 28, 2013 18:57:08 GMT -5
No, you aren't reading me correctly at all. What does gay being "illegal" have to do with this issue at all? Where did anyone including the patrons say being gay was "illegal"? So, I don't see what point is being made. And, my point is that it isn't illegal to stiff someone the tip or write them a nasty note. I didn't say what they did was right or kind. Oh, never mind. Gawd. Well it may not be illegal, but it certainly IS un-Christian. And no, not all Christians behave this way, but the ones that do certainly do a major disservice to the ones who don't. Just sayin' . . . And did you bother to read my previous posts regarding exactly that point? |
|
kittensaver
Junior Associate
We cannot do great things. We can only do small things with great love. - Mother Teresa
Joined: Nov 22, 2011 16:16:36 GMT -5
Posts: 7,983
|
Post by kittensaver on Oct 28, 2013 18:57:46 GMT -5
Mtman said it was, Shooby. He said "back in the day" not now. And I'm still trying to figure out how "back in the day" has any relevance to a conversation today . . . . |
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 18:57:52 GMT -5
When was being gay illegal? To my knowledge, it never was, oped. However, homosexual acts were illegal (sodomy laws) so gay people could be arrested on those grounds. As kitty noted, lots of people could be arrested on those grounds... which was the point I was getting to. Nothing ever illegal about 'being gay'. |
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Oct 28, 2013 18:58:40 GMT -5
He said "back in the day" not now. And I'm still trying to figure out how "back in the day" has any relevance to a conversation today . . . . Yeah, me too. I am trying to figure out how being "illegal" has any relevance to the conversation today... |
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 18:58:42 GMT -5
Mtman said it was, Shooby. He said "back in the day" not now. Thus why I asked where and when...  |
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Oct 28, 2013 18:59:42 GMT -5
And, I asked what that had to do with the patrons stiffing the waiter. .. |
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 19:00:05 GMT -5
I think someone was suggesting that Gay actually might be a protected class under the law? As far as being able to discriminate against in terms of hiring, etc.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 19:00:49 GMT -5
And, I asked what that had to do with the patrons stiffing the waiter. .. No, you asked who said it was? |
|
Shooby
Senior Associate
Joined: Jan 17, 2013 0:32:36 GMT -5
Posts: 14,782
Mini-Profile Name Color: 1cf04f
|
Post by Shooby on Oct 28, 2013 19:00:50 GMT -5
I think someone was suggesting that Gay actually might be a protected class under the law? As far as being able to discriminate against in terms of hiring, etc. Which means what in terms of leaving a tip? Sorry, I don't follow your point. |
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 19:02:25 GMT -5
No, there was some discussion about hiring servers who were openly gay... Someone said nowhere in the Midwest would they hire openly gay people... Yikes, do I have to recap the whole thread...
|
|
Sum Dum Gai
Senior Associate
Joined: Aug 15, 2011 15:39:24 GMT -5
Posts: 19,892
|
Post by Sum Dum Gai on Oct 28, 2013 19:07:54 GMT -5
Can we please not throw phrases like stiffing the waiter into a thread about a gay waiter. It sounds hella dirty.
|
|
kittensaver
Junior Associate
We cannot do great things. We can only do small things with great love. - Mother Teresa
Joined: Nov 22, 2011 16:16:36 GMT -5
Posts: 7,983
|
Post by kittensaver on Oct 28, 2013 19:10:23 GMT -5
I think someone was suggesting that Gay actually might be a protected class under the law? As far as being able to discriminate against in terms of hiring, etc. Which means what in terms of leaving a tip? Sorry, I don't follow your point. There's nothing illegal about failing to leave a tip, but there IS something VERY wrong with folks who "use" their religious beliefs to judge and look down on others who do not believe and act as they do. Fine, leave no tip if you want to, just don't be an a**hole and lecture someone with a judgmental note about what you perceive their personal or religious failings to be. THAT is being judgmental, period. It is NOT religious, it is NOT 'righteous' - it is judgmental. Period. (Which I believe was the original point of the thread). Flame away. |
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 19:14:11 GMT -5
Exactly, these people aren't really being called out for not leaving a tip... Although that is rude when service is excellent... They are being called out for leaving an asshat note they had no business leaving.
|
|
zibazinski
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 24, 2010 16:12:50 GMT -5
Posts: 47,914
|
Post by zibazinski on Oct 28, 2013 19:16:08 GMT -5
It was me that said some areas wouldn't hire someone who was obviously gay just like they might not hire someone with tats or freaky hair. Some areas that's a plus.
|
|
kittensaver
Junior Associate
We cannot do great things. We can only do small things with great love. - Mother Teresa
Joined: Nov 22, 2011 16:16:36 GMT -5
Posts: 7,983
|
Post by kittensaver on Oct 28, 2013 19:17:39 GMT -5
Exactly, these people aren't really being called out for not leaving a tip... Although that is rude when service is excellent... They are being called out for leaving an asshat note they had no business leaving. Exactly. |
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 19:18:33 GMT -5
In my understanding most of the servers in US don't even make a minimum wages. What I mean is owner of the establishment they seldom pays required minimum wages. Really? What is the point of having a legal minimum wage if that is not enforced. Its bad enough that we have to subsidize the wages of servers but to not give them at least minimum wage is a crime. |
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 19:22:11 GMT -5
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Nov 24, 2024 13:55:26 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2013 19:24:53 GMT -5
In my understanding most of the servers in US don't even make a minimum wages. What I mean is owner of the establishment they seldom pays required minimum wages. Really? What is the point of having a legal minimum wage if that is not enforced. Its bad enough that we have to subsidize the wages of servers but to not give them at least minimum wage is a crime. You make a very good assumption. |
|
kittensaver
Junior Associate
We cannot do great things. We can only do small things with great love. - Mother Teresa
Joined: Nov 22, 2011 16:16:36 GMT -5
Posts: 7,983
|
Post by kittensaver on Oct 28, 2013 19:25:32 GMT -5
In my understanding most of the servers in US don't even make a minimum wages. What I mean is owner of the establishment they seldom pays required minimum wages. Really? What is the point of having a legal minimum wage if that is not enforced. Its bad enough that we have to subsidize the wages of servers but to not give them at least minimum wage is a crime. Well like it or not, in a number of States there are Wage and Hour laws that allow employers to "apply" tips against the minimum wage. Under those rules, an employer only has to pay the difference between what the employee actually earns in tips and minimum wage. You can thus understand why many/most servers are reluctant to 'fess up to what their tips actually are - both for tax and wage reasons. So most places settle on some kind of "formula" for tips - where I worked many (many) moons ago the formula was "declare 8% of your total receipts for the night as tips." It gave some leeway for both generous tippers and stiffers. And it passed muster with the restaurant's CPA. Folks on the high end (swanky restaurants where wait staff can earn hundreds per night in tips) do not want the employer OR the IRS dipping into their stash, as it were. But yeah, being able to apply tips against minimum wage can hurt/suck for folks who don't work in swanky places. ETA: Oped beat me to it. |
|
steff
Senior Associate
I'll sleep when I'm dead
Joined: Dec 30, 2010 17:34:24 GMT -5
Posts: 10,780
|
Post by steff on Oct 28, 2013 19:26:25 GMT -5
It should also be noted that in many chain sit down restaurants, tips are pooled at the end of the night & divided between all the servers. Waiters & waitresses also tip out the bartenders & busboys from their tips.
|
|
