zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Apr 30, 2015 19:20:36 GMT -5
That bitch mother of theirs is the chief instigator and underminer of everything you try to accomplish. I'd be seeing a lawyer or judge about this. I'm sure a judge would not look kindly on a parent encouraging their children to drop out of school and be unsupervised on the Internet. Or calling the police on their custodial parents.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2015 19:52:29 GMT -5
I think you better get to a lawyer fast. You're the one that is at risk of arrest.
You can talk to the family attorney about getting bio-mom restricted to supervised visitation only since she is inciting issues, but your butt is the one that is going to be in the wringer over the altercation.
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on Apr 30, 2015 19:59:15 GMT -5
I'm back...but typing the next installment.....just wait...it gets better!
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on Apr 30, 2015 20:30:49 GMT -5
(continued) Sitting at the kitchen table, we heard a knock at the door - Rowdy was already there to meet the police and we could hear him saying something along the lines of "abuse", "tired of this shit", and "they're in there". Two officers walked in and one of them took the lead. Stated, I guess you're stepmom and you’re dad? Wanted to know how long we'd been married, how long we'd had custody and what were the facts of the incident. Told them everything they asked (plus the above story). They stopped me when I got to the point of "her slapping me back". "Wait....she slapped you? Are you hurt? Where at? Any other injuries? (no to everything) Here's the thing, the state of Texas has a liberal view of "parental discipline" and what you've described is well within your rights. As long as dad has no issues of you helping discipline (which he doesn't), you are allowed to discipline as long as it doesn't cross the line into child abuse. What you've described is exactly what the kids described and that isn't child abuse. However, the child is not allowed to strike you back - that is assault. Do you want to press charges?” Wait….what ? Charges? Press charges? On a 14 year old? Hmmm…..let me think about this…… No….no I don’t want to press charges. But I do want her to understand exactly what you just told me. I want her brother to understand what you’ve told us. We have been fighting them and their mom for 7 years. They believe that they don’t have to listen to me, or their dad, and it’s been a rough time. (While we were talking, another 2 officers showed up, one of them was the captain) They understood and 3 went out to talk to the kids. One officer stayed with us and gave some examples of child rebellion that parents dealt with that didn’t result in charges of child abuse (one of them was pulling the girl’s hair and dragging her back into the house – OMG!!!). All of a sudden, the 3 of us realized we were hearing a commotion at the front door. We went to look and Rowdy was screaming and cussing at the officers (captain included). I grabbed Hun and pulled him back into the house and said, “Leave him. He’s doing this to himself. If he gets arrested, it will be on him, not us.” So the three of us went back to the kitchen and kept talking while Rowdy kept screaming. (to be continued!)
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Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Apr 30, 2015 20:34:42 GMT -5
OH.MY.FREAKING.DEAR.GAWD. SHIT !!!
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tcu2003
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Post by tcu2003 on Apr 30, 2015 20:38:29 GMT -5
OMG.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2015 20:44:12 GMT -5
Wow, TX is very different than where I am. So sorry you are in this war.
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on Apr 30, 2015 21:03:10 GMT -5
(continued…..)
After a while, Rowdy calmed down and the captain walked back in and asked me again for my story. He again asked me if I wanted to press charges, again I said no. (for the record – if this had been Rowdy, the answer would have been yes – there’s more history there than with Monkey.) He then asked us what we wanted to happen next. I said, “Ummm…I’m not sure….I don’t think anyone has asked me that before. I don’t want to waste any more of your time, but it wouldn’t surprise me if their mom shows up in the next 5 minutes. If there’s any way you can stay and explain this to her, I’d really appreciate it!”
Captain stated no problem. We’re going to talk to the kids again anyway, reiterate everything that was just said and if she happens to show up, we’ll talk to her as well. All officers went outside leaving Hun and me in the kitchen.
I started to clean the kitchen up and then received a text from Buddy that he was almost done (he was at driving class when all of this went down. LaLa was at work, happened to show up after the cops arrived – right into the middle of the commotion). I asked Hun if any of the cop-cars were blocking the driveway and he went to check. I asked the officer at the door if it was okay for me to leave to pick up another child, said, “Sure, no problem.”
Sure enough – Jetsam was already in the front yard, two officers talking to her, the other two standing by Rowdy. I have no idea where Monkey was – I kept my eyes straight ahead not looking at any of them (didn’t want anything else to be “incited”), got in the vehicle and left. By the time I got back home, the police were gone and Jetsam was gone.
Hun told me that he allowed the kids to go with their mom to McDonald’s (to separate everyone and so everyone could cool off). This was at the recommendation of the police that we allow the kids the space to cool off (whether that mean they go to the park across the street, take a walk or whatever). He said Jetsam actually apologized to him for giving the phone to Monkey and allowing her to ignore our house rules. Rowdy did not go with his mom. He stayed at our house and lifted weights in the shed (that’s fine – it’s at least constructive and not listening to the crap their mom spews).
And that’s it. That’s all that happened. After LaLa and Monkey got back, everyone went to bed (us included) and the “incident” was over.
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Jaguar
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Post by Jaguar on Apr 30, 2015 21:16:13 GMT -5
Geez what a dinner.
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on Apr 30, 2015 21:22:49 GMT -5
As we all know - this isn't the end and this isn't over (someone's probably already said that while I've been typing!). Something else will happen, something else will be kicked up a notch and taken to the next level. No matter how many times the kids are told that Hun and I aren't doing anything wrong, because it isn't what their mom would let them do (which is whatever they want, because she "has to have affirmation that they love her", rather than being their parent), we will always be the bad guys. I have thought about just packing their cloths (Rowdy's and Monkey's), not telling them and just depositing them and everything at their mom's door. Let her deal with it all at this point. I don't want to give her a heads up - I just want to it all in her lap and tell her, you helped create them - they're your problem now. Maybe this won't happen exactly like this, but I expect something similar to happen pretty quick with Rowdy (for sure). Monkey is a little different. She's right on the cusp of being on the right track. She's trying out for band color guard next week for next year's team. She's getting good grades. She's doing what she needs to do to not only have fun, but be responsible as well. I'm afraid if we drop her at her mom's all of the progress we've had in the last 3 years will be lost in less than 3 months. Rowdy had a counseling appointment today. I asked the counselor if I could talk with him for 5 minutes before he talked with Rowdy. I informed him of Rowdy's plan to leave (which he wasn't aware of). I informed him of Rowdy's grades (which he was also not aware of). I then told him that for now, this will be his last counseling appointment that we schedule for him. That if Rowdy does leave, we weren't going to be responsible for appointments that he DOESN'T show up for. He understood and was sympathetic. Anyway....this has been emotionally draining. It always is. I also have a bruise popping up on the back of my hand (not the hand that slapped Monkey with - the other one - probably hit it on the closet door jam when we were struggling). I don't even remember it being hit during the incident. I'm sure Monkey probably has a couple of bruises popping up on her as well. While I wasn't rough with her, I wasn't holding her "easy" either, I had a grip that wasn't letting go. God...I wish I could fast forward about 10 years, know if everything we've gone through is worth it or not. I know I can't possibly know that - but it's the only thing that keeps me going is knowing that I'm doing the best I can and that, hopefully, some day the kids will understand exactly why we do what we do......
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on Apr 30, 2015 21:40:37 GMT -5
Just another day in the Karaboo household. [img]http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/tongue2.png[/img] [img]http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/unwell.png[/img] [img]http://images.proboards.com/new/cry.gif[/img] [img]http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/melancholy.png[/img] [img]http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/crazy.gif[/img]
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on Apr 30, 2015 21:42:21 GMT -5
Dang it. My post is screwed up. Damn slow internet we have. Sorry for the mess!
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taz157
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Post by taz157 on Apr 30, 2015 21:46:50 GMT -5
What a story! For everyone in the Karaboo household - for those that need it and for those that need it.
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msventoux
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Post by msventoux on Apr 30, 2015 21:57:56 GMT -5
If your family pulls out this type of crazy for a regular dinner, what do you do for the holidays? Seriously though, best wishes to you. I don't know how you do it!
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on Apr 30, 2015 22:00:50 GMT -5
Holidays are actually pretty tame! Lol! Only ones we have to worry about is the alcoholic, redneck cousins.
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stillmovingforward
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Post by stillmovingforward on Apr 30, 2015 23:42:58 GMT -5
KaraBoo: While I can feel your pain (we could be twins but without the bio-mom), I have been told a few interesting things: - Children explode like this on people they feel safe around/with
- Children will act out their anger on those they feel safe around/with rather than the person they are angry with
- And it is often a case of 'how far can I trust you?' 'How much do you love me?'
None of this makes what they do hurt any less nor does it make you feel any better. On your side, you have a long history of trying to help your kids. If things escalate, the police will look at the counseling the kids have received, school visits, etc. Trust me, the police know how difficult teens from rocky beginnings can be. They know how to look for caring, back-against-the-wall parents. You will occasionally run into a crappy officer but, for the most part, the police will do their best to be helpful and will recognize that you are good parents.
Get yourself to counseling. You will need help remembering you are on the right path, that you are doing the right things, and basically be a cheerleader for you (that's all my counselor tells me he is, that I know what to do, I just need to be reminded that I'm doing everything right and these days will pass).
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on May 1, 2015 5:54:33 GMT -5
Hi stillworking:
Logically, I agree 100% with you and know that the kids act like this because of exactly the points you have listed. I know they are screaming at me the things they long to scream at their mom, but can't.
Emotionally, right now, I'm drained. I've been doing this song and dance for 13 years (started before we were married).
I'm not going to give up on any of the kids. I'm not going to follow through with dropping them off at bio moms. I can't. I love them too much to hurt them like that. (Hurt in the way that "she said she'd never give up on me, but that's exactly what she just did by dropping me off here". )
I'm NOT going to do that to them....it's just soothing for my logical side to know that the kids aren't mine, I don't have to put up with the crap, and that they have 2 parents who are ultimately responsible for them. I CHOOSE to stay in their lives because I love them. I choose to deal with the crap because deep down I know they are frightened kids who lash out because I have been their rock. I choose this life because, despite what bio mom and kids think, these are my kids and I am there for them no matter what.
Anyway...time to start the day. I'll be back later.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 1, 2015 7:21:22 GMT -5
Who called bio mom? That's the first thing I'd find out. That needs to stop, period. Secondly, id lawyer up and get before a judge. Get copies of those police reports.
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on May 1, 2015 7:53:32 GMT -5
Just a few minutes before starting work....
Rowdy called mom - that's a no brainer. He called her just after hanging up with police.
I'm actually glad he did. That allowed her to talk to the police and for THEM to tell her that neither Hun or I are in the wrong. It won't change anything, but it will be included in the police report.
I'm not going to stop either of them from calling her. The older the kids get, the maturer they are becoming and realizing that I'm not the "evil" person she's made me out to be (Lala already knows this). I don't treat any of them any different than I would my own son (with the exception of id be more affectionate with them if they'd let me - they haven't let me be since their mom threw fits when they were younger and it just stressed them out more when I tried).
I have no reason to have a lawyer at the moment. Just because the police are being called? What about CPS being called? Not worried about either - I'm not breaking any laws or harming the kids. I've told Jetsam multiple times - "take us to court if you don't like what's happening with your kids. That's what we did and the courts decided. We cannot stop you from filing, it is your right to do so, and we'll be there to answer any accusations."
She hasn't filed and won't. She'll blame it on not having any money, and that might be true, but the rest of the truth is that she hasn't fulfilled the original court order and she knows it.
Eh....it is what it is. My life is chaos, but I wouldn't trade it at the moment. :-)
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 1, 2015 8:25:58 GMT -5
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NancysSummerSip
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Post by NancysSummerSip on May 1, 2015 9:08:18 GMT -5
Kara, I had to reread your posts about the incident a couple of times to grasp the full extent of what happened. I can follow the incident itself, but what it all means is another story entirely. I know you love the kids and choose to be in their lives, but how much do you love yourself? You really need to find some balance for YOU in all of this. I worry about you getting physically hurt at this point, by either Monkey or Rowdy. Both kids are certainly capable of it, given their ages, their anger issues and a little psychological push from Flotsam/Jetsam. Granted, they may simply be testing your limits. But this just went a little too far. I'd hate to see you give up on either of them, especially since Monkey seems to be making progress. Pressing charges on a 14-year-old does sound extreme, but it might have been the best thing. It would have driven home just how serious this is for Monkey to defy parental authority, and to let Hun know that you are not the kids' punching bag; that he has to step up more and more often than just this incident. At their ages, and given the history, the horse has left the barn as far as much discipline goes; it is really pretty late to instill good behavior habits at this point. But it's not impossible. You just may have to use some extreme measures that put them in a world of hurt for a time. Easy for someone without kids to say, I know. But I've worked in the criminal justice system, and I've seen how young they start. The jail I worked in had a whole floor just for kids whose crimes were sufficient to charge them as adults. And that floor was always full. Full of kids whose parents cared a lot less than you, if those parents were even still around. Most weren't - they were dead, in jail or on drugs somewhere on the streets. It's OK to scare Monkey and Rowdy straight. If it takes being charged, I'd be in favor of it. If it takes living on the margin of society with their marginal mama, I'd be in favor of it. Sometimes, you cannot love and care kids into being good and right. If they had been yours early on, then maybe so. But they came with so much damage and baggage, I think it may take a cleansing with the force of Niagara Falls to change them.
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stillmovingforward
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Post by stillmovingforward on May 1, 2015 11:47:02 GMT -5
That is why I strongly recommend that KaraBoo seeks counseling for herself asap. Trust me, if 'scared straight' really worked, those kids in jail wouldn't be in juvenile detention, again. And taking an 'at risk' kid and sending them to a bad situation is the worst thing that can happen. They will not suddenly appreciate you. That comes years later. With much more adult thinking than the average teen has.
What can happen is to recognize YOUR OWN triggers. And how to disengage prior to a situation escalating. I had children that would rage, throw things, yell abusively, etc. But if I walked out of the house, it all stopped. They needed the audience. Without the audience, they had no reason to continue. Engaging just led to more fights and arguing. This was VERY difficult for me to learn! What scares me is Karboo's response to Monkey. While this is totally understandable and logical from a typical child background, it has a good chance of only going to cause more grief in the long run. I am biased though, this is how my SDH started off after many good years and he slide down a potentially abusive slope from there. Its going to be a long road to recovery for him.
And I'll admit, I've not always done the right thing myself. I have buttons that these kids can push. I just have to learn how to control it and have another trick to use. Find a counselor that works with a lot of foster and adoptive kids. One that will work with you, not the kids.
And, last but not least, keep moving forward. Someday, the kids will come around. Many of the kids I raised are delightful now. The ones I had for a long time anyway.
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on May 1, 2015 13:41:49 GMT -5
I appreciate the kind words and suggestions. I really do.
However, being in the actual situation and observing the day to day interactions, things are not as dire as they seem from my posts.
Rowdy and Hun got into a screaming match a few weeks ago, went belly to belly with physical threats flying back and forth, but neither threw a punch. Rowdy even said, "hit me so I can hit you back! I know if I hit you first then I'll get charged with assault. Or let's go into the street - I won't be charged there, I'll be defending myself!" What this latest incident with Monkey showed both of them (kids) - even that's not entirely true where we live according to the police.
Based on history with MY kids (I have no experience with any other troubled teens), I doubt anything else will come of this incident. I slapped Monkey one time before, almost 3 years ago. She learned very quickly that I wouldn't tolerate certain things. She tested me a few weeks later after that first incident, saw the warning look on my face and quickly backed down. Granted, she's now 14, but this time there was police reinforcement that I wasn't in the wrong, her and her mom were.
I have been going to counseling off and on for various issues for myself. The ones I have seen have given me good suggestions and think I'm handling the situation just fine. My biggest complaint is Hun not backing me up more before now. It took me telling him I was going to leave him (because I WILL NOT make him choose me or his kids - that's not fair, and I won't ask anyone to do that, but I will remove myself from the situation if someone who says they love me allows me to be trampled on) before he realized how far out of control his kids had gotten. It probably is too little too late for the kids, but he is trying and that makes a world of difference for me.
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CarolinaKat
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Post by CarolinaKat on May 1, 2015 13:49:15 GMT -5
I appreciate the kind words and suggestions. I really do. However, being in the actual situation and observing the day to day interactions, things are not as dire as they seem from my posts. Rowdy and Hun got into a screaming match a few weeks ago, went belly to belly with physical threats flying back and forth, but neither threw a punch. Rowdy even said, "hit me so I can hit you back! I know if I hit you first then I'll get charged with assault. Or let's go into the street - I won't be charged there, I'll be defending myself!" What this latest incident with Monkey showed both of them (kids) - even that's not entirely true where we live according to the police. Based on history with MY kids (I have no experience with any other troubled teens), I doubt anything else will come of this incident. I slapped Monkey one time before, almost 3 years ago. She learned very quickly that I wouldn't tolerate certain things. She tested me a few weeks later after that first incident, saw the warning look on my face and quickly backed down. Granted, she's now 14, but this time there was police reinforcement that I wasn't in the wrong, her and her mom were. I have been going to counseling off and on for various issues for myself. The ones I have seen have given me good suggestions and think I'm handling the situation just fine. My biggest complaint is Hun not backing me up more before now. It took me telling him I was going to leave him (because I WILL NOT make him choose me or his kids - that's not fair, and I won't ask anyone to do that, but I will remove myself from the situation if someone who says they love me allows me to be trampled on) before he realized how far out of control his kids had gotten. It probably is too little too late for the kids, but he is trying and that makes a world of difference for me. Hey, You got through to LaLa and she's the oldest. Monkey's only 14 and that's not fun for anyone.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 1, 2015 16:12:03 GMT -5
Trust me, DD started at 9 and even now at 26, she can still act like a brat. It's a lot better than it was. She's still selfish and self centered and it's all about her-just like her father-but she's going to PA school the end of this month and she'll be alright. But it was a long hard journey. I've never forgotten what she put me through and there were times I wanted to ship her to boarding school or her father. But I hung in there. If I'd have had her father undermining me, well, let's just say the outcome would have been very different.
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on May 3, 2015 13:30:20 GMT -5
Great! Now MY ex is here. <sigh>
Wonder what scam he's up to today?
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mollyanna58
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Post by mollyanna58 on May 3, 2015 14:10:25 GMT -5
Great! Now MY ex is here. <sigh> Wonder what scam he's up to today? And you thought Sunday was a day of rest. Good luck!
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KaraBoo
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Post by KaraBoo on May 3, 2015 14:39:12 GMT -5
Thankfully, he didn't want to talk with me, but it's always disconcerting when he just shows up out of the blue.
He talked with Buddy for about 20 minutes, checked out his car and then left. He gave him some money to give to me (I'm thankful for anything, but I'm not impressed.). I guess for CS, but if it doesn't go through the state, then it isn't recorded. I'm not going to report it. I'm done with attempting to keep track of CS.
he mentioned to Buddy that he's now getting disability. I hope he's not getting disability. He's not disabled, unless you count his conscience being nonexistent. The guy has done everything he can for the past 18 years that I've known him to get out of working. When he does work, he complains about being smarter than the managers and the work being beneath him.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 3, 2015 17:37:51 GMT -5
Ugh
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Works4me
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Someone responded to your personal ad - a German Shepherd named Tara wants to have you for dinner...
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Post by Works4me on May 4, 2015 6:08:15 GMT -5
Karaboo - except if he us getting disability, doesn't that mean that child support and also back child support can be deducted automatically and sent to you?
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