Helping w/grandkids

[HoneyBBQ]

Jun 18, 2013 16:33:02 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Jun 18, 2013 16:31:44 GMT -5 HoneyBBQ said:

And she said she can't, lol. Why is this so hard to understand? 

Sure she can.  She can move money around so that the oldest doesn't get $5k and the youngest get $893 15 years later.  

I guess I didn't read exactly how old the kids were, but if one is getting close to college, I'd think it's very hard for them to make up that money if they are close to going away to school, or buying a car, etc. And secondly, you don't take back a gift. 

The youngest has 15 years to turn that 893$ into 5k.  

[Deleted]

Thanks for the parenting advice, Doxie.

I'm starting to feel like another poster.  Giving presents seems to piss a lot of other people off.  My kids were brought up to be thankful for whatever.  They had a grandmother who wrote a check for the difference in presents, and it was a family joke.  They also had a cousin who liked to upset the equitable distribution, which required yet another round of checks.  It was honestly too funny!

That cousin has now decided that the next generation of cousins can no longer exchange Christmas presents.  Why?  Because she doesn't think it's fair that she has to buy six presents (one for each of the cousins), and her single child only receive two presents.  Nor can the first cousins (my kids) exchange presents in front of her child from their grandparents (my ex and his wife) because they would have many more than her child.  So after they have Christmas at my MIL's, they must then go across the street (literally) and exchange additional presents at my ex's house.

This isn't how I have ever operated with my kids or ever want to.  My daughter had many pairs of shoes because she was a girl.  She had more clothes.  My son didn't get a check for the difference.  My daughter was a cheerleader, which is expensive, and took piano lessons, etc.  My son, the nerd, didn't get a check for the difference.  

I've never heard my kids complain about a disparity in how they were treated.  Once my daughter asked why I bought her brother something I didn't buy her.  I said, "It is obviously because I love him more."  She said, "No, that's not it.  Why did you buy him that?"  And I explained.

I am sorry for many of you . . . truly.  But you also make me appreciate my kids a lot.

[thyme4change]

1)  You can move money around in 529's, as long as it goes to family members.  
2)  The oldest is 14, so the kid has a few years to figure out how to get college paid for.  I can't imagine that $5k is really going to be the difference between any child going to college or not going to college.  That wouldn't even cover one semester.
3)  She said she was going to try and save up $1k per child before they go off, not that she had enough now to give everyone $1,000 and be done with it.  So far, that baby has $0.00.  $893 might be all that is in there in 2032 when that kid heads off to college.  That won't even cover half the books for one semester.

[Deleted]

Honeybbq, none of the kids are going to college anytime soon.  We are talking about a 9, 7, 6, 4, 2, 1, 0, and 0.

And none of them are getting $893 unless the market tanks.  Maybe the long-term growth in giving the 0s a $1000 now will equal $10,000 in 18 years.  Maybe the yet-to-be conceived will have even better market growth.

When the oldest (now nine and about to enter fourth grade) actually GOES to college, I will reevaluate.

[Deleted]

Jun 18, 2013 16:39:58 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

1)  You can move money around in 529's, as long as it goes to family members.  
2)  The oldest is 14, so the kid has a few years to figure out how to get college paid for.  I can't imagine that $5k is really going to be the difference between any child going to college or not going to college.  That wouldn't even cover one semester.
3)  She said she was going to try and save up $1k per child before they go off, not that she had enough now to give everyone $1,000 and be done with it.  So far, that baby has $0.00.  $893 might be all that is in there in 2032 when that kid heads off to college.  That won't even cover half the books for one semester.

Where did you get your numbers from, Thyme?  Did I post somewhere that the oldest was 14?  He is 9 and is only going into fourth grade.  Even the 1-year-old has his $1000.  I can't contribute to the zeroes yet because you have to have a SSN (and be born first).

[HoneyBBQ]

People's ideas of fairness: 

I mean, I am a firm believer in not INTENTIONALLY being preferential - e.g. you like girls more so you give them 10 presents each and only 1 present to the boys. However, that is not the situation here that is being described. Someone tried to do something NICE for her grandkids, and found, with time, that she was unable to sustain that level of giving so she has to cut back. Maybe she can spend more time with the youngest ones. Seriously, it's not about a tit for a tat. 

My DD will probably not have college funding from her grandmother on her dad's side because when you have kids 20 years apart, nobody planned for it! And it's OK. It's not a reflection of the grandmother being preferential - it's just the circumstances!

Also, DD's grandmother is nice enough to take each of her grand kids on a special trip just the two of them. Sadly, I doubt that her grandmother will live long enough for that gift to be realized for DD. But you know what, she is an awesome lady and spends more time with my DD than my own mother. It's not about the money. It's the thought that counts. And if you can't teach your kids that.... 

[HoneyBBQ]

Jun 18, 2013 16:42:59 GMT -5 @southernsusana said:

Honeybbq, none of the kids are going to college anytime soon.  We are talking about a 9, 7, 6, 4, 2, 1, 0, and 0.

And none of them are getting $893 unless the market tanks.  Maybe the long-term growth in giving the 0s a $1000 now will equal $10,000 in 18 years.  Maybe the yet-to-be conceived will have even better market growth.

When the oldest (now nine and about to enter fourth grade) actually GOES to college, I will reevaluate.

Oh, ok. I read something about a 14yr old. It's possible I was confused. You are lucky to have so many grandbabies.

[thyme4change]

Sorry SS - I was working from memory.  I think I have your grandkids' ages and someone else's mixed up.  

[doxieluvr]

Jun 18, 2013 16:33:02 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Jun 18, 2013 16:31:44 GMT -5 HoneyBBQ said:

And she said she can't, lol. Why is this so hard to understand? 

Sure she can.  She can move money around so that the oldest doesn't get $5k and the youngest get $893 15 years later.  

Exactly. Or give each grand $50 and call it done. Whatever it takes to keep it equal, or close. Not one getting $5k and another getting $0.

[thyme4change]

If the 1 year old already has $1000, why are you capping everyone at $1000.  It seems to me like you could continue to put money into everyone's account and reach more than $1000 each.  Even if you move some money out of the 9 year old's account, you could easily get everyone to $2k.

[Blonde Granny]

Lord help me, I agree with Doxie.  To give one grandchild $5K and the other far less just because they were born later is not the proper thing to do.

I would simply open another account for the next child, pool all the money and divide by 4.  Each child then receives the same amount.  That is exactly what my grandparents did years ago.  5 grandchild received the same amount, the 2 great-grands split 50-50 an additional account that had the same amount of money as the grandchildren.  At that time, there was a 2 y/o and a newborn.

You are the grandmother not the mother and it's not your responsibility to cover the cost of raising them. 

[Deleted]

Let me see. 

William will be King of England.  His brother won't.  Elizabeth was queen.  Who cares about Princess Margaret and her kids?  I think her kids have refused royal titles because they are so low in the royal pecking order.

The first kid usually gets a car.  The second kid usually has to share the first kid's car.  The third kid is lucky to ever get to drive. 

The first kid gets a new crib, several baby showers, and a lot of pictures.  The second kid gets the hand-me-downs, fewer notations in the baby book, and very few pictures.   The third kid is asleep when the other two kids are making cute pictures.  (Personal experience.)

The first kid gets the toys.  The second kid gets to use the first kid's toys and a few more.  By the fourth kid, there are so many toys that the parents are begging you not to buy baby toys any more.  (Again, I know this from personal experience.)

I'm not sure the fourth kid EVER gets to ride in the front seat until he/she is old enough to drive.

You are all rather silly in your "fairness" attitude. 

I am capping everyone at $1000, Thyme, because there is an unknown quantity of grandchildren waiting to be born.  My daughter wants five or six.  I am not sure of my daughter-in-law.  I want to be through when I retire.

I MADE A MISTAKE.  I planned for 4 grandkids with the possibility of 6.  When I recognized there would be 8 with the very real possibility of 10 or 12, I gave up.

Please remember, I only have two kids.  It wasn't like I should have expected this many.  It's a very pleasant surpise, but I gave up money-wise.

All of the grandkids BUT one will have $1000. The $5000 already in the older grandchild's account can be redistributed as needed. That's how 529s work.  I am not turning over anything directly to him the day he graduates from high school.

THE END.  Thank you very much. 

[thyme4change]

LOL - I can give money to my oldest but not the youngest, because William will be King of England.  That is pretty funny logic.

I was the youngest and got the best car of all of us.  My sisters each had their own car, too.

[doxieluvr]

Yeah who has silly notions? Nothing like bringing royal titles into what was a normal conversation.

for the record, each of my kids had their own cribs, clothing, toys and both of their baby books are in the same unfinished status. 

[thyme4change]

Baby book?!  Was I suppose to make those?  

[doxieluvr]

Jun 18, 2013 18:11:39 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Baby book?!  Was I suppose to make those?  

So the books said. 

I do take pictures of them...sometimes...on my phone. Maybe I should back them up. 

[kittensaver]

Jun 18, 2013 18:29:12 GMT -5 doxieluvr said:

Jun 18, 2013 18:11:39 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Baby book?!  Was I suppose to make those?  

So the books said. 

I do take pictures of them...sometimes...on my phone. Maybe I should back them up. 

Ya think My DH is a computer guy, and one of his clients lost ALL of the family pictures because they weren't backed up.

Or at least that's what they thought until DH managed to find them a hard drive restoration/rescue company. The client was hopping mad that he lost all his photos, but also refused to pay $1,200 to get them (the hard drive) restored.

Just a word to the wise - back up!!!!!!!!!

[Miss Tequila]

When my MIL passed away she left each of her four grandchildren a CD, to which she contributes to annually. As my kids are 12 and 14 years younger than my niece and nephew, they received much less. I was sad but not because of the disparity. I was sad because my Mil could have used that money to make her life better but instead chose to give it to her grandchildren. The fact that my kids got less meant nothing to me.

[Deleted]

William will be King of England. His brother won't.

Princess Di left the younger one more money to make up for it.

It's impossible to be completely fair or even when it comes to kids.  SS oldest grandkid may not even go to college and then the 529 can be shifted to his younger siblings.  Or he may get a full ride, or one of the younger ones may.  It's just too far out to guess.  The parents will also have more time to save for the younger ones, or the younger ones may get more aid with older siblings in college than the oldest one gets since he will be the only one in college.

I think SS should move from shoe buying and college funds to having lunch and a movie/activity with each kid.  With that many in the family I'm sure each one loves personal time with grandma.

My mom gifts DS more than she can afford.  It's painful for me.  I'd rather have her pick out a gift, pay for it myself, and then have her give it.  Being financially secure as you enter retirement is one of the best gifts you can give your kids and grandkids.

[Gardening Grandma]

Jun 18, 2013 21:53:05 GMT -5 @anne81 said:

  Being financially secure as you enter retirement is one of the best gifts you can give your kids and grandkids.

This. Absolutely. Is. A. Better. Gift. Than. a. College Education.

[Deleted]

Jun 18, 2013 10:33:53 GMT -5 sheilaincali said:

Of the 4 kids in my family I am the most independent and as a result I kind of get screwed.  In 2012 my parents gave my DS $75 for his birthday and one board game for Christmas.  For the birthdays 5 of the 8 grandkids got checks for $75, BUT my brother's two kids got actual presents.  This told the other grandkids that they weren't special enough for Nana and Papa to make the effort of going to the store, buying a present, and wrapping it up.
For Christmas the 3 oldest boys (one of which is my DS) each got one present but the little kids (age 3 to 8) had dozens to open.  And even dollar wise the older kids gifts weren't expensive.  It was disheartening for my DS to have to say "I don't have any more to open" every single time it came back around to be his turn to open presents since they do it from youngest to oldest. 
You probably think I'm whining or whatever but it's hard to see your son be disappointed.  He is 15 so it's not like he didn't understand. 

So help with the grandkid-
I get none.

My younger brother- my parents buy all of his kids birthday and Christmas presents (that they are told are from their dad), buy all of their school clothes and school supplies.  In addition to that my mom balances his checkbook and pays all of his bills for him.  They also feed him and his kids dinner and baby sit his kids several times a week.  My parents take his children on vacation every year.

My older brother- my parents give my brother a monthly stipend of $600 and pay for his three kids to participate in summer camps, orchestra and take them on vacation every year.

My sister- my parents buy her kids some school clothes and take them on vacation. 

Girl...there are days I SWEAR we are related!

[happyscooter]

My parents were SSSOOOOO very fair when the grandkids were little.  At Christmas, if they spent $27.00 on 4 of the grandkids and didn't have another gift to even it out for the other 2 grands, they put $2.00 in an envelope for the 2 and said 'have your mom take you to McDonalds for lunch.' DH and I are like that now.  My kids laugh about it but they have never been treated unfairly so they don't know the hurt.

We always knew that my in-laws gave more to BIL's family, really didn't know to what extent.  But cleaning out their house, we found thank you notes for money sent while niece and nephew were in college.  And other times.  My kids went to college, it would have been nice for them to have gotten even $5.00 to go to a fast food place.  And I can almost bet that the niece and nephew were sent a LOT more money than $5.00.  Goody boxes with popcorn, snacks, etc...  Yes, I know for a fact, I was at the house as it was being packed up. 

Nephew told me when he got married how much money he was given by the grandparents.  I know they would have given his sister the same, they would have never treated them differently.  So when my son told me how much my FIL gave him (he has no idea of the difference $$), I couldn't believe it.  But MIL was deceased by then, so it fell to FIL.  My other son got the same amount as his brother.  And I always thought it was my FIL who made the decisions about big things.  DH said 'no, mom ruled the roost and made the money decisions.' 

And money is not the only way that my family was treated unfairly.  But I won't go into that.  It's even worse when you are cleaning out and see so many reminders that your family was second class.  One more stab at my DH's heart.

[Miss Tequila]

Jun 19, 2013 6:14:08 GMT -5 happyscooter said:

My parents were SSSOOOOO very fair when the grandkids were little.  At Christmas, if they spent $27.00 on 4 of the grandkids and didn't have another gift to even it out for the other 2 grands, they put $2.00 in an envelope for the 2 and said 'have your mom take you to McDonalds for lunch.' DH and I are like that now.  My kids laugh about it but they have never been treated unfairly so they don't know the hurt.

We always knew that my in-laws gave more to BIL's family, really didn't know to what extent.  But cleaning out their house, we found thank you notes for money sent while niece and nephew were in college.  And other times.  My kids went to college, it would have been nice for them to have gotten even $5.00 to go to a fast food place.  And I can almost bet that the niece and nephew were sent a LOT more money than $5.00.  Goody boxes with popcorn, snacks, etc...  Yes, I know for a fact, I was at the house as it was being packed up. 

Nephew told me when he got married how much money he was given by the grandparents.  I know they would have given his sister the same, they would have never treated them differently.  So when my son told me how much my FIL gave him (he has no idea of the difference $$), I couldn't believe it.  But MIL was deceased by then, so it fell to FIL.  My other son got the same amount as his brother.  And I always thought it was my FIL who made the decisions about big things.  DH said 'no, mom ruled the roost and made the money decisions.' 

And money is not the only way that my family was treated unfairly.  But I won't go into that.  It's even worse when you are cleaning out and see so many reminders that your family was second class.  One more stab at my DH's heart.

Why does money make your dh feel like that? My husband's mother basically supported his sister her entire adult life. From letting her live in a house rent free (MIL and her siblings inheried her mother's house and she bought out her siblings).  MIL paid the taxes, insurance, etc on teh house.  MIL also "lent" SIL tens of thousand of dollars over the years (never paid back, of course). It sickedn me that SIL would let MIL support her like that (MIL was not a wealthy woman, she worked in a grocery store!) but beyond that, it was MIL"s money to do with as she wanted. She obviously thought my SIL was pathetic and never capable of supporting herself. 

I should mention that at the time of MIL's death, SIL was $100K in debt and in a debt consolidation program...and she and BIL gross about $85K a year!  We live in a LCOLA area and she had no mortgage, no real estate taxes, no homeowners insurance, etc. 

I would have felt uncomfortable taking money like that from anyone but I asked my husband if it bothered him, did he feel like he got the short end of the stick.  He said no, and he thanks his mom for not fucking him up by learning that a child needs to learn to live on their own two feet.  There are 15 years betweetn SIL and DH so by the time DH was a young boy MIL realized she created a mess wtih my SIL.  She didn't repeat it with my husband.

[happyscooter]

DH told me he was cheated a few times growing up, I just thought he was playing 'pitiful me' when we were dating so I would feel sorry for him.  We were never able to use the vacation home (even though it was bought as a FAMILY vacation home), couldn't borrow a vehicle when ours was in the shop, and was never loaned or given money for any reason. 

Child having surgery?  Well, that's what insurance is for and you have a good job. 

Vacation?  If you pay for it yourself, you will appreciate it more.

Babysit for dinner out for your anniversary?  Pay a sitter and you will realize how good you have it.

Anyway, as we have always said, it was their money/time/car/ etc... to do with it what they pleased.

[happyscooter]

Last word from me , BIL was listed as a beneficiary on an account of in-laws.  His kids were listed as a %, my kids a smaller % than their cousins.  DH got $0.00 from this account.  $$$$$$$$, literally thousands.  Fair, no, hurtful, yes. 

[Wisconsin Beth]

Jun 18, 2013 16:38:34 GMT -5 @southernsusana said:

Thanks for the parenting advice, Doxie.

I'm starting to feel like another poster.  Giving presents seems to piss a lot of other people off.  My kids were brought up to be thankful for whatever.  They had a grandmother who wrote a check for the difference in presents, and it was a family joke.  They also had a cousin who liked to upset the equitable distribution, which required yet another round of checks.  It was honestly too funny!

That cousin has now decided that the next generation of cousins can no longer exchange Christmas presents.  Why?  Because she doesn't think it's fair that she has to buy six presents (one for each of the cousins), and her single child only receive two presents.  Nor can the first cousins (my kids) exchange presents in front of her child from their grandparents (my ex and his wife) because they would have many more than her child.  So after they have Christmas at my MIL's, they must then go across the street (literally) and exchange additional presents at my ex's house.

This isn't how I have ever operated with my kids or ever want to.  My daughter had many pairs of shoes because she was a girl.  She had more clothes.  My son didn't get a check for the difference.  My daughter was a cheerleader, which is expensive, and took piano lessons, etc.  My son, the nerd, didn't get a check for the difference.  

I've never heard my kids complain about a disparity in how they were treated.  Once my daughter asked why I bought her brother something I didn't buy her.  I said, "It is obviously because I love him more."  She said, "No, that's not it.  Why did you buy him that?"  And I explained.

I am sorry for many of you . . . truly.  But you also make me appreciate my kids a lot.

My sister's kids are 18 and 20 now.  Both girls.  When I was pregnant with DS, we talked about fair and equal are not the same.  And that stuff gets done based on interests.  For example, her older DD did horseback riding camp.  The younger one did Lego camp.  But both girls were happy that they got to do something that interested them.  Yeah, one cost a lot more (it was several nights camping vs. being taken to the local HS that hosted the Lego camp) but they didn't care.  To be honest, I'm more concerned about being each kid getting equal/adequate amounts of one on one time than I am cost of activities. 

[zibazinski]

Sorry, but im with the fair and equal camp on this one. I get the idea that two camps may costs differently and all that but when it comes to GIFTS, things should be equal. To not do otherwise is wrong, hurtful, and can cause issues between family.

[Deleted]

Jun 19, 2013 8:09:13 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Sorry, but im with the fair and equal camp on this one. I get the idea that two camps may costs differently and all that but when it comes to GIFTS, things should be equal. To not do otherwise is wrong, hurtful, and can cause issues between family.

We got into this a family "gift exchange" for Christmas with my ex-bf's family.  Everyone was supposed to bring a $10 gift.  Some obviously had done better shopping than others.  Nobody wanted the dvds that someone had picked up.

The next year everyone exchanged $10 Walmart giftcards.  I kid you not.

The next year there was no gift exchange.

[Wisconsin Beth]

The kids (age range 3.5-22, 10 total) do a gift swap at Christmas.  Limit is around $20-$25ish.  We draw names in fall and my SIL keeps the list.  My kids are the youngest by like 8+ years and the older ones like to shop for them, gives them a reason to hang out in the toy aisles.    I asked my sister about it for the older ones and she said the kids like it, even though they're older.  We don't do adult gifts at Christmas, just to the godparents/godchildren and the grandparents.  It works for us.  When it doesn't work for us (as a whole) we'll shift to something else.  The important thing is the gathering, not the gifts.    But as I said earlier, we don't do drama very well and we're mostly sane. 

[sheilaincali]

What annoys me most about my parents different treatment of their grandchildren is that they saw what treating grandkids differently did to us growing up.  It was obvious to us from a young age that our paternal grandparents were very indifferent towards us.  We would stop by their house at Christmas (both grandparents and several aunts/uncles on both sides lived in the same town).  We'd stop by for dinner and have to watch the favored grandkids open presents when there were none for us.  We'd be regaled with stories of them flying halfway across the country to watch my younger cousin's dance recitals but they never once drove 2 blocks down the street to watch my brother play college football at the university that they donated generously to. 

There is a significant age difference between my dad and his youngest brother.  My uncle was 4 when my brother was born.  My mom called on Mother's Day to tell them that she and my dad were having a baby and my grandma's response was "How could you do this to me!  I'm too young to be a grandma!".  Never mind that my parents were in their 20's, married and my dad was shipping off with the Navy soon. 

The last time I saw my dad's mom was 3 years ago.  My dad convinced her to come down for Christmas and she spent the entire weekend on the phone trying to convince one of her other son's to come and pick her up since she wasn't having any fun. 

My mom's parents treated all the kids fairly and as a result still has a close relationship with all of her grandkids and great grandkids.  Her I saw on Sunday when I sprung her from her nursing home for the day.