Big wedding when you're already married

[Firebird]

So is it a real wedding if you say your vows while you're on a roller coaster and the minister is shouting in the car behind you?

[CarolinaKat]

[Angel!]

Apr 25, 2012 13:52:05 GMT -5 hoops902 said:

I think in general at the point which you say to yourself "If I told people the truth, they might not do what I want them to, so I simply won't tell them", you're being deceptive and manipulative.

To be fair it is more like "If I told people the truth, then they would judge me & mock me & my life would be a big fucking joke to them"

It wasn't just to get people to go to the wedding, but so I wouldn't be the subject of gossip & judgement like the couple in the OP or the other thread started last week. I get my feeling hurts easily & have low self-esteem. One of the ways that I protect myself is to not share things that could cause others to hurt my feelings. I really fucked up on the whole DV thing & shouldn't have shared that with people, which I know I have mentioned before.

Even this thread is hurting my feelings, which I don't think is intentional on anyone's part & my story is just an example being used & I tend take things way too personally. But, that is why I didn't tell people because I learned long ago that people WILL judge you for decisions like this & I can't take being judged. On an anonymous message board it is one thing, but when it is your friends & family it really fucking hurts & can destroy relationships.

[hoops902]

"To be fair it is more like "If I told people the truth, then they would judge me & mock me & my life would be a big fucking joke to them"

It wasn't just to get people to go to the wedding, but so I wouldn't be the subject of gossip & judgement like the couple in the OP or the other thread started last week. I get my feeling hurts easily & have low self-esteem. One of the ways that I protect myself is to not share things that could cause others to hurt my feelings. I really fucked up on the whole DV thing & shouldn't have shared that with people, which I know I have mentioned before. "

I guess what I don't get is why you would want those kind of people at your wedding in the first place. Your relationship is specific, you were married legally at a certain point and you wanted to follow it up with a celebration later. I don't get why you'd want people at that celebration who would think the very relationship you're inviting them to celebrate is a "big fucking joke".

Maybe it's cuz I'm a guy, or I just don't care about weddings, or both. I just don't get the idea of wanting people at an event that if they knew the truth about the event, would either not want to be there or legitimately think negatively about the point of the event.

But then that goes back to my point about being deceived. I wouldn't want someone I was close enough to consider a friend to deceive me because they thought so little of me that I couldn't handle knowing the truth of why I was there.

[kindthatjingles]

Apr 25, 2012 14:47:49 GMT -5 Angel! said:

Apr 25, 2012 13:52:05 GMT -5 hoops902 said:

I think in general at the point which you say to yourself "If I told people the truth, they might not do what I want them to, so I simply won't tell them", you're being deceptive and manipulative.

To be fair it is more like "If I told people the truth, then they would judge me & mock me & my life would be a big fucking joke to them"

It wasn't just to get people to go to the wedding, but so I wouldn't be the subject of gossip & judgement like the couple in the OP or the other thread started last week. I get my feeling hurts easily & have low self-esteem. One of the ways that I protect myself is to not share things that could cause others to hurt my feelings. I really fucked up on the whole DV thing & shouldn't have shared that with people, which I know I have mentioned before.

Even this thread is hurting my feelings, which I don't think is intentional on anyone's part & my story is just an example being used & I tend take things way too personally. But, that is why I didn't tell people because I learned long ago that people WILL judge you for decisions like this & I can't take being judged. On an anonymous message board it is one thing, but when it is your friends & family it really fucking hurts & can destroy relationships.

Angel,

Karma for your honesty

[Firebird]

Karma for your honesty

From me too.

[formerroomate99]

Angel, I appreciate your honesty.

But at some point, you're going to have to learn how to be honest with people and handle being judged if you're going to have healthy relationships. No matter what you do, people are going to have their opinions.

[midjd]

Karma from me too, Angel. I do understand how you feel - I tend to be pretty thin-skinned and my feelings are hurt easily. In my mind I can see that it's (usually) not intentional on anyone else's behalf, and that I'm overreacting/projecting/whatever, but that doesn't keep me from being hurt.

Sounds funny but posting on this forum has helped me quite a bit as far as that goes. I have a coworker who has a very brusque manner of speaking/emailing (he may be Hoops in disguise ) and a few of his emails have left me crying in my office, but having disagreements on here (or watching a blowout between two other people), now I can kind of let those roll off my back and just say, "Whatever, he probably doesn't mean it the way I'm taking it, and if he does, what an asshole." It's taken a loooong time, though, and always a work in progress.

[Firebird]

But at some point, you're going to have to learn how to be honest with people and handle being judged if you're going to have healthy relationships. No matter what you do, people are going to have their opinions.

I agree with that, but let's not forget that everyone isn't starting from the same place emotionally and mentally when it comes to dealing with judgment.

There's something to be said for protecting yourself during times when you know you need that, too. You have to learn to be your own protector.

[imawino]

Angel, I’m sorry that you had your feelings hurt. This thread is actually a perfect example of why people keep things secret because they are afraid of having their feelings hurt. My biggest problem with this thread (after the assumption that the guests have a right to know things because gosh darn it the wedding is more about them than the bride and groom!) is the willingness so many people had to just assume negative motive from the couple. I’m not going back through 20 pages of stuff here, but I don’t recall that he stated he wasn’t telling because he wanted his sucker parents to shell out a boatload of dough for his blowout bash, and they wanted to collect all the goodies and roll around in them in a writhing mass of deceitful sin. It sounded like a couple loved each other and wanted to get married. For whatever reasons his parents wanted him to wait, and they want to pay for a big (is it big?) wedding when their son is back on the country. (am I misremembering that the groom is not currently residing in this country?) On the other hand, the bride didn’t want to wait. We don’t really know why. I don’t know where they live and what the culture is, maybe they were looked down on for living together in sin? Maybe her parents were pressuring her? Maybe she just really wanted to be his wife? Or maybe she’s a terrible person and had weird motives, we just don’t know. It sounds like the groom is trying to make his wife happy by doing what she wants and trying to make his family happy by letting them throw the wedding they want. He may not be going about it in the way that some or all of us would, but that doesn’t mean his intentions are bad. MOST people are truly not out to fuck over their friends and family all the time. Most of us are muddling through day to day as best we can with pressures to please everyone around us all the damn time. Maybe if we started off from a position of assuming his heart was in the right place people wouldn’t be so quick to be so negatively judgmental of their choices about how to handle their marriage and wedding.

[imawino]

Apr 25, 2012 15:20:59 GMT -5 formerroomate99 said:

Angel, I appreciate your honesty.

But at some point, you're going to have to learn how to be honest with people and handle being judged if you're going to have healthy relationships. No matter what you do, people are going to have their opinions.

While growing a thicker skin can be an asset in life there is an alternative to this statement. It could be that if people can't learn to mind their own business they could at least learn to keep their opinions to themselves. Not everything you think need be shared. This idea that people need to spew their thoughts in an effort to be honest all the time is way overrated.

[quotequeen]

Apr 25, 2012 12:33:15 GMT -5 shanendoah said:

Quotequeen: So just out of curiosity, in a case like my BFF, where they got married because he was about to be deployed for 6 months, and then had their religious wedding ceremony 9 months later- would you have refused to attend?

I'm answering this in isolation, I haven't had a chance to read the portion of the thread posted after my last post. I would decide whether to attend any particular event based on my relationship with the individuals involved and my understanding of the particular circumstances. I wouldn't automatically refuse to attend just because the couple was already married. However, in a case such as that described in the OP, where I was not particularly close and I knew the couple was deceiving their friends and relatives, I would almost certainly not attend the event.

[Sum Dum Gai]

I get my feeling hurts easily & have low self-esteem.

You need to work on that. Seriously, it will do wonders for your life.

The world according to Dark, in a nutshell so this post doesn't get redonkulous long; there are roughly 7 billion people on the planet and all but a handful don't give a shit about you. The number of people that would shoot you just to watch you bleed outnumbers the people that even know your name. The number of people that really care about you is measured in the double digits, if you're lucky. For some of us it's a single digit number. There's only one single person that you can count on to always side with you no matter what, and that's you. If you don't even like yourself, you take away that person. That's a pretty shitty way to go through life.

So, become your single biggest fan. Sure you'll make mistakes along the way, but who cares? Nobody likes a hero that doesn't have a few flaws anyway. Keep the small handful of people that care about you close, and cherish the hell out of them. Tell the rest of the teeming biomass to go fuck themselves. They don't give a shit about you anyway, so why worry about pleasing those assholes? Give em the finger and laugh while you do it.

That is all.

Oh, and I personally think you're awesome! Haters gonna hate, but don't let them get to you. I know, kind of, how hard it was to get through the situation you found yourself in, and I think you're braver, tougher, and way more awesome than you give yourself credit for. Keep on rockin, and if anybody doesn't like it you tell them you're going to sick this internet weirdo on em.

[hoops902]

"My biggest problem with this thread (after the assumption that the guests have a right to know things because gosh darn it the wedding is more about them than the bride and groom!) is the willingness so many people had to just assume negative motive from the couple."

I don't think anyone is assuming a negative motive, we're assuming that no matter what the motive we don't want our friends lying to us. If I think it's none of your business that I got married 2 months ago in a courthouse, and I don't want to tell you, then that's my right. And if you ask, and I want to tell you to mind your own business, that's my right as well. At the point that I tell you I'm getting married and I want you to be there, I've lost my right to consider "I'm already married actually" to be none of your business.

And yes, I believe guests have the right to know what they're being invited to.

"While growing a thicker skin can be an asset in life there is an alternative to this statement. It could be that if people can't learn to mind their own business they could at least learn to keep their opinions to themselves. Not everything you think need be shared. This idea that people need to spew their thoughts in an effort to be honest all the time is way overrated. "

I agree, not everyone needs to know everything. But going from a situation where nothing is said or asked, and reaching out to them to make a deceitful statement that was never needed in the first place isn't ok. You don't have to tell me you're trying to have a child, but when you invite me to a baby shower you'd better be pregnant. I didn't ask, you offered it up. There's a far different standard between someone nosing into your business, and you volunteering information to them that isn't true that they never even asked for.

You don't have to tell people everything, but when you tell them something, it has to be the truth (or should be).

[Firebird]

Unless you need to know about something so you can decide if someone is allowed a wedding...

Yup, except for then

[Firebird]

Maybe if we started off from a position of assuming his heart was in the right place people wouldn’t be so quick to be so negatively judgmental of their choices about how to handle their marriage and wedding.

But then what fun would life be? ;D

[Firebird]

This idea that people need to spew their thoughts in an effort to be honest all the time is way overrated.

I think I've said enough on this subject, but in case this wasn't still clear to everyone, the above is why I wouldn't say anything to this couple or any other couple who was doing this (unless I was VERY close to them and maybe not even then).

They don't need to know my opinion. They want me at what they think of as their wedding; I'll just take that as a nice gesture, go with a smile and dance the night away. I don't have a huge issue about this just because it's the topic of the hour.

I'm only "spewing my thoughts" on YM where it doesn't matter anyway. This situation had to do with money, it rubbed me the wrong way, and I was curious about what other people thought, so I posted about it. Turns out a bunch of other people have strong feelings on the topic as well.

It doesn't have to be more complicated than that.

[Firebird]

Oh, and I personally think you're awesome! Haters gonna hate, but don't let them get to you. I know, kind of, how hard it was to get through the situation you found yourself in, and I think you're braver, tougher, and way more awesome than you give yourself credit for. Keep on rockin, and if anybody doesn't like it you tell them you're going to sick this internet weirdo on em.

DARK!!!! Someone stole your YM identity and said something nice on it! Call the constable!

[Angel!]

Apr 25, 2012 16:39:42 GMT -5 Sum Dum Gai said:

Oh, and I personally think you're awesome! Haters gonna hate, but don't let them get to you. I know, kind of, how hard it was to get through the situation you found yourself in, and I think you're braver, tougher, and way more awesome than you give yourself credit for. Keep on rockin, and if anybody doesn't like it you tell them you're going to sick this internet weirdo on em.

Damnit Dark! I was trying to walk away from this thread so I don't continue to argue in circles with Hoops & get all pissy again. But then you have to go and be all nice & I feel like a jackass if I don't at least acknowedge it.

And yes, I do need to work on the self esteem & all that - after 2 failed marriage I do realize I have major issues.

Thank you everyone that said nice things. Not sure why I am getting so defensive & upset regarding a decision I made almost a decade ago, but it is what it is.

I am not going to continue to argue or defend my choices on this thread. But if others want to continue to , then feel free

[Sum Dum Gai]

DARK!!!! Someone stole your YM identity and said something nice on it! Call the constable!

What? I'm a total sweetheart. I'm nice to like everybody.

[Firebird]

What? I'm a total sweetheart. I'm nice to like everybody.

Yesterday you were an asshole and we should be calling you on it... make up your mind, man! Do you have multiple personalities?

[Sum Dum Gai]

But then you have to go and be all nice & I feel like a jackass if I don't at least acknowedge it.

Did you learn nothing from my post?? I'm just some dude online. I'm part of the teeming biomass that you should be giving the finger too! We'll have to go for the remedial life lesson from Dark.

Repeat after me (exactly!):
I don't give a crap what any of you think. I know I'm awesome, and you guys don't know jack about me, so go stick your opinion where the sun don't shine!! *make rude gesture*

ETA - I know Doxie catches a lot of flak on this board, but this is one area she has down cold. Her financial choices make me cringe, but her ability to just let everything roll right off her back is legend. She's so good at it that it's almost like she can warp reality to her whim. Or at least her perception of reality. In the end our perceptions are our reality, so it's almost like a super power.

[Sum Dum Gai]

Yesterday you were an asshole and we should be calling you on it... make up your mind, man!

On the rare occasion that I'm not a total sweetheart, you guys should call me on it.

Do you have multiple personalities?

I don't think so, but I guess if I did I wouldn't really know.

[Angel!]

Here you go:

I don't give a crap what any of you think. I know I'm awesome, and you guys don't know jack about me, so go stick your opinion where the sun don't shine!! *make rude gesture*

Or should I have said "I don't give a crap about what you want me to say - kiss my ass"? Is my willingness to just repeat phrases fed to me by some random dude on the internet part of my problem?

I think Dark does the occasional nice thing to keep us on our toes. Just when we think he is going to zig, he zags & confuses everyone.

[Firebird]

ETA - I know Doxie catches a lot of flak on this board, but this is one area she has down cold. Her financial choices make me cringe, but her ability to just let everything roll right off her back is legend. She's so good at it that it's almost like she can warp reality to her whim.

Yeah but I'm of the opinion that "so immune to what other people think that I'm totally delusional about my life choices" is a prime example of too much of a good thing.

[Sum Dum Gai]

Or should I have said "I don't give a crap about what you want me to say - kiss my ass"?

Very good young padawan! You'll have this stuff figured out in no time.

Is my willingness to just repeat phrases fed to me by some random dude on the internet part of my problem?

Confucius say, "A life spent worrying about pleasing others should only be attempted by prostitutes." He was kind of a weird dude.

[Firebird]

Or should I have said "I don't give a crap about what you want me to say - kiss my ass"? Is my willingness to just repeat phrases fed to me by some random dude on the internet part of my problem?

There is a HILARIOUS joke in here somewhere about parrots and chat rooms, but I can't seem to get at it right now. Boo on that

[formerroomate99]

I agree with the others that you do have to protect yourself emotionally and people don't need to blurt out every single opinion they have.

But if AngelD is constantly lying to her family and friends and/or her family members feel they can't say anything without hurting her feelings, then I fail to see how it would be possible to have a close relationship with these people. A certain amount of trust and honesty is necessary if you want to foster close relationships.

When I'm at work, I keep my opinion to myself about most things and don't share much. As a result, my coworkers are not and will never be close friends, even though I like and admire most of them and spend around half my waking hours with these people. Our relationship is and will always be cordial and shallow. If I kept my family and friends at such a distance, I'd be desparately lonely.

[imawino]

Apr 25, 2012 16:54:56 GMT -5 Firebird said:

This idea that people need to spew their thoughts in an effort to be honest all the time is way overrated.

I think I've said enough on this subject, but in case this wasn't still clear to everyone, the above is why I wouldn't say anything to this couple or any other couple who was doing this (unless I was VERY close to them and maybe not even then).

They don't need to know my opinion. They want me at what they think of as their wedding; I'll just take that as a nice gesture, go with a smile and dance the night away. I don't have a huge issue about this just because it's the topic of the hour.

I'm only "spewing my thoughts" on YM where it doesn't matter anyway. This situation had to do with money, it rubbed me the wrong way, and I was curious about what other people thought, so I posted about it. Turns out a bunch of other people have strong feelings on the topic as well.

It doesn't have to be more complicated than that.

To be clear, my comment wasn't intended to be in any way related to this scenario or even this message board. It was just a response to the advice to get a thicker skin. I don't think that "bad" advice, but I wish people were as quick to advise people to keep their opinions to themselves as they were to advise other people to grow a thicker skin and deal.

To paraphrase an old joke, opinions should be treated more like penises. It's okay to have one and it's even okay to be proud of it. But it's not always okay to take it out in public or try to shove it down my throat.

Of course, that's just my opinion. Ha!

Obviously, this rule goes out the window when you're talking about a message board. One of the main purposes here is to solicit and offer opinions. Smiling and nodding doesn't work so well.

[Firebird]

To paraphrase an old joke, opinions should be treated more like penises. It's okay to have one and it's even okay to be proud of it. But it's not always okay to take it out in public or try to shove it down my throat.

5 minutes and you get karma for this. My new favorite catchphrase.