|
Post by marjar on Jan 26, 2011 22:26:50 GMT -5
I completely agree. Kids need to learn life skills, in addition to academics. Learning the financial impact, that can result from a moment of passion, might go a long way in fostering responsibility. Kids might think twice about giving into their urges. And would it be so hard to incorporate these into math, econ or social studies classes? I don't know what the best method would be, a separate class or incorporating it into existing subjects, but I think it should be part of the curriculum.
|
|
|
Post by marjar on Jan 26, 2011 22:29:20 GMT -5
I'm sorry, Bill.
|
|
Loopdilou
Well-Known Member
AKA Mrs. Dark Honor
Joined: Feb 27, 2012 19:41:33 GMT -5
Posts: 1,365
|
Post by Loopdilou on Jan 26, 2011 22:32:06 GMT -5
I just think that incorporating it seemlessly into the dialogue would be more effective than shock and awe. Protection needs to be habitual.
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 37,474
|
Post by billisonboard on Jan 26, 2011 22:35:09 GMT -5
Thanks
|
|
vonnie6200
Senior Member
Adopt a Shelter Pet
Joined: Jan 8, 2011 14:07:17 GMT -5
Posts: 2,199
|
Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 26, 2011 22:35:26 GMT -5
I just think that incorporating it seemlessly into the dialogue would be more effective than shock and awe. Protection needs to be habitual. Why?
|
|
|
Post by marjar on Jan 26, 2011 22:35:28 GMT -5
I just think that incorporating it seemlessly into the dialogue would be more effective than shock and awe. Protection needs to be habitual. Maybe both. Classes that focus on life skills and having it reinforced in other subject areas.
|
|
Loopdilou
Well-Known Member
AKA Mrs. Dark Honor
Joined: Feb 27, 2012 19:41:33 GMT -5
Posts: 1,365
|
Post by Loopdilou on Jan 26, 2011 22:55:58 GMT -5
Definitely. Now if we could only get the Christian right to realize that the best way to cut the number of abortions in the US is to properly prepare our youth in the classroom... Hahahahaha! Fat chance we're all doomed!
|
|
rockon
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 8:49:55 GMT -5
Posts: 2,384
|
Post by rockon on Jan 27, 2011 9:20:04 GMT -5
Loopidilou, I'll second the concept of educating youth as the best method for reducing the number of abortions although I would prefer it be done by the parents in the home rather then expecting our teachers to be responsible for moral training. If parents would step up and take their proper responsibility the teachers could do a lot better job of educating our children in the essential curriculum. Even though my wife and I oppose aborting babies and have tried to share that conviction with our children we have always avoided joining pickets, protests or engaging in hateful talk about others who have opposing views. Instead we support a local shelter that helps supply counseling and takes care of the needs of pregnant girls so they can make rational decisions with out the financial pressure.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: May 1, 2024 12:54:56 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2011 9:26:03 GMT -5
"responsible for moral training"
I don't see it as moral training. I would never expect, nor want a school to say 'god doesn't want you to have sex'... Its a health and safety issue.... and abstinence can be a part of health can safety, because it is the only SURE way to avoid std and pregnancy... but comprehensive education requires they also know about other methods to help protect themselves... and teaching about self-respect and the potential dangers and peer pressure are also health/safety issues, not moral ones....
Moral reasons for engaging and not engaging in sex can come from the parents... and if the parents do not give their children one, well the kids still have the safety and health information they need to protect themselves.
|
|
Loopdilou
Well-Known Member
AKA Mrs. Dark Honor
Joined: Feb 27, 2012 19:41:33 GMT -5
Posts: 1,365
|
Post by Loopdilou on Jan 27, 2011 9:45:38 GMT -5
And there is the crux of it. Sex, in this country, is too tied up in morality. But oped just said it much more diplomatically than I am capable of.. exalt!
|
|
chiver78
Administrator
Current Events Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:04:45 GMT -5
Posts: 38,546
|
Post by chiver78 on Jan 27, 2011 9:52:59 GMT -5
I just think that incorporating it seemlessly into the dialogue would be more effective than shock and awe. Protection needs to be habitual. Why? because seamless dialogue teaches the child that this is how things work, in a factual way. they are a lot more likely to absorb the content and what repercussions will come to them in the same situation. IMHO, shock and awe tends to create those "it would never happen to me..." type thoughts, which aren't good.
|
|
Loopdilou
Well-Known Member
AKA Mrs. Dark Honor
Joined: Feb 27, 2012 19:41:33 GMT -5
Posts: 1,365
|
Post by Loopdilou on Jan 27, 2011 10:01:04 GMT -5
Thanks for having my back, chiver Shock and awe functions as a dare to teenagers, not a warning.
|
|
rockon
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 8:49:55 GMT -5
Posts: 2,384
|
Post by rockon on Jan 27, 2011 10:05:11 GMT -5
Maybe you are taking my comments out of context. My comments about moral issues were relevant to abortion not sex. While I think sex is intended for consenting adults I fully understand that it will not necessarily be restrained to that regardless of anyones wishes or how much education is given and that there are health and safety issues related to the unsafe use. Maybe we should require safety stickers applied until a certain level of competency has been achieved
|
|
Loopdilou
Well-Known Member
AKA Mrs. Dark Honor
Joined: Feb 27, 2012 19:41:33 GMT -5
Posts: 1,365
|
Post by Loopdilou on Jan 27, 2011 10:10:52 GMT -5
Ok, but abortion is only a moral issue to some. To the country, from a legal standpoint, it is merely an option. It should only be cautioned against in the sense that it is a potentially dangerous procedure and should only be obtained from respected sources. And it's relatively expensive compared to using other options so you don't have to get one in the first place.
|
|
vonnie6200
Senior Member
Adopt a Shelter Pet
Joined: Jan 8, 2011 14:07:17 GMT -5
Posts: 2,199
|
Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 27, 2011 10:16:20 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by marjar on Jan 27, 2011 10:23:12 GMT -5
Loopidilou, I'll second the concept of educating youth as the best method for reducing the number of abortions although I would prefer it be done by the parents in the home rather then expecting our teachers to be responsible for moral training. If parents would step up and take their proper responsibility the teachers could do a lot better job of educating our children in the essential curriculum. Even though my wife and I oppose aborting babies and have tried to share that conviction with our children we have always avoided joining pickets, protests or engaging in hateful talk about others who have opposing views. Instead we support a local shelter that helps supply counseling and takes care of the needs of pregnant girls so they can make rational decisions with out the financial pressure. I think many parents do try to teach and instill knowledge and values, but kids do have a way of forgetting those ideals in moments of passion. Other parents avoid the topic because they are uncomfortable with it, and some just fail in this area, period.
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 37,474
|
Post by billisonboard on Jan 27, 2011 10:30:43 GMT -5
Removing the financial part of the equation distorts "rational".
|
|
|
Post by marjar on Jan 27, 2011 10:31:10 GMT -5
"responsible for moral training" I don't see it as moral training. I would never expect, nor want a school to say 'god doesn't want you to have sex'... Its a health and safety issue.... and abstinence can be a part of health can safety, because it is the only SURE way to avoid std and pregnancy... but comprehensive education requires they also know about other methods to help protect themselves... and teaching about self-respect and the potential dangers and peer pressure are also health/safety issues, not moral ones.... Moral reasons for engaging and not engaging in sex can come from the parents... and if the parents do not give their children one, well the kids still have the safety and health information they need to protect themselves. YES!
|
|
floridayankee
Junior Associate
If You Don't Stand Behind Our Troops, Feel Free to Stand in Front of Them.
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:56:05 GMT -5
Posts: 7,461
|
Post by floridayankee on Jan 27, 2011 10:54:01 GMT -5
I don't see it as moral training. I would never expect, nor want a school to say 'god doesn't want you to have sex'... Nor would I, but the major flaw in this argument is that "god" does not define morals. If "god" defined morals then, by definition, an athiest would be completly amoral.
|
|
chiver78
Administrator
Current Events Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:04:45 GMT -5
Posts: 38,546
|
Post by chiver78 on Jan 27, 2011 11:06:55 GMT -5
Thanks for having my back, chiver Shock and awe functions as a dare to teenagers, not a warning. hah, no worries. we're on exactly the same page with this one.
|
|
|
Post by marjar on Jan 27, 2011 11:09:02 GMT -5
Whatever happened to classes in which kids had to care for an egg or doll like it was a baby? Anyone remember those?
|
|
chiver78
Administrator
Current Events Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:04:45 GMT -5
Posts: 38,546
|
Post by chiver78 on Jan 27, 2011 11:10:31 GMT -5
oh wow, I do! I totally forgot about that until just now, actually. I hope they do still do that, it's enough of a culture shock for a kid while not being all that intrusive.
|
|
Gardening Grandma
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:39:46 GMT -5
Posts: 17,962
|
Post by Gardening Grandma on Jan 27, 2011 11:12:14 GMT -5
Whatever happened to classes in which kids had to care for an egg or doll like it was a baby?
I was substitute teaching when they had those very lifelike dolls. Everyone wanted to hold the "baby". (Including me - they were so cute!).
Unless it pooped really smelly and screamed during the night, I doubt it provided much deterrent.
|
|
rockon
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 22, 2010 8:49:55 GMT -5
Posts: 2,384
|
Post by rockon on Jan 27, 2011 11:12:16 GMT -5
That pretty sums it up for me Yankee. Moral for me can be defined as a personal conscience or a personal feeling of right and wrong this may or may not be related to a believe in God.
|
|
|
Post by marjar on Jan 27, 2011 11:13:45 GMT -5
At one time, those programs/classes were frequently in the media. I haven't heard about them in ages. Are they still around, or were they found to be too costly and/or ineffective? I recall, kids who participated, saying they were shell shocked by the reality.
|
|
|
Post by marjar on Jan 27, 2011 11:14:52 GMT -5
That pretty sums it up for me Yankee. Moral for me can be defined as a personal conscience or a personal feeling of right and wrong this may or may not be related to a believe in God. I agree.
|
|
burnsattornincan
Well-Known Member
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 23:05:21 GMT -5
Posts: 1,398
|
Post by burnsattornincan on Jan 27, 2011 11:35:11 GMT -5
Mr. billisonboard, sorry about your circumstance. You can always count on my support.
Sincerely,
Dalton McGuinty Burns III
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 37,474
|
Post by billisonboard on Jan 27, 2011 11:41:04 GMT -5
Mr. billisonboard, sorry about your circumstance. You can always count on my support. Sincerely, Dalton McGuinty Burns III Years have passed. I am much older though not necessarily wiser. I equate it to having a limb amputated. You just adjust to the loss, move on, but still occasional get that feeling of pain. I just felt the "hen house" conversation that was taking place earlier needed to have a rooster's input. But I thank you for your support.
|
|
chiver78
Administrator
Current Events Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 13:04:45 GMT -5
Posts: 38,546
|
Post by chiver78 on Jan 27, 2011 11:44:10 GMT -5
Mr. billisonboard, sorry about your circumstance. You can always count on my support. Sincerely, Dalton McGuinty Burns III Years have passed. I am much older though not necessarily wiser. I equate it to having a limb amputated. You just adjust to the loss, move on, but still occasional get that feeling of pain. I just felt the "hen house" conversation that was taking place earlier needed to have a rooster's input. But I thank you for your support. I'm sorry for your pain and loss as well. roosters are always welcome, as long as they aren't trying to force their own morality on those that they consider to be immoral.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: May 1, 2024 12:54:56 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2011 11:49:58 GMT -5
I agree with what you are saying on morality versus religion... however, what are the 'moral' reasons for not having sex....etc.? and what morality of sex education would you want taught publically? ... I think personal responsiblity, self respect and respect for others definately have a place in the process, as i said they can be taught from a point of safety and health rather than an outright stance on 'morality'... as some parents do not like the idea of 'teaching morality' in schools... i guess i'm not sure how to separate morality out...
|
|