sheilaincali
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 17:55:24 GMT -5
Posts: 4,131
|
Post by sheilaincali on Jun 30, 2014 16:22:10 GMT -5
Sounds nice, but we'll have to reevaluate in 10-15 years. He might still be living with you and going through the same daily routine. It's possible but he is quite determined to away to college and really would like to go out of country (currently Canada). He has a pretty set plan and wants to fly the nest when he graduates. We plan to move after he graduates and his only concern was "will I have to rent a hotel room when I visit from college?" Anything could happen but I seriously doubt he'll be living on my couch 10 years from now.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 16:26:11 GMT -5
We just started listening to Charles and Emma yesterday and it's amazing how in old, educated, wealthy, aristocratic families, children actually lived at home until they married... No issue. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif)
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,393
|
Post by swamp on Jun 30, 2014 16:46:48 GMT -5
It's a peaceful existence because you have a peaceful kid. One of mine rolls out pretty happily. The other may have an absolute freakin meltdown over the fact I picked out the wrong socks. Or the day may go fine. It's a crapshoot.
|
|
Angel!
Senior Associate
Politics Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 11:44:08 GMT -5
Posts: 10,722
|
Post by Angel! on Jun 30, 2014 16:52:50 GMT -5
Is this an argument for "nature".
IDK.Is he those things because of my influence or because that's who he would have been regardless of who parented him? I'm not one to typically praise myself or my abilities. On some level I do think it's good parenting that has gotten the Boy to where he is so far in life but I honestly don't know. I'd like to think that I am a positive influence on him.
He was born when I was 22. DH and I had only been married a year at that point. Most of our parenting style is either dumb luck or guesswork. We genuinely like our kid so we spend a lot of time with him. We enjoy talking to him and he is a great conversationalist so we talk to him a lot. We are pretty mellow people and he is pretty mellow. We share a lot of common interests too.
My parents don't have a clue "who" I really am. DH's mom checked out when he was 5 and has always put her needs above DH's needs. We had one of those "I don't want to be like my parents" agreements when it came to raising DS.
DS is pretty successful for a 16 year old HS junior. Kids like him, adults find him to be well spoken and polite. He does well in school and is respected by his teachers. Either we are rockstar parents or we totally lucked out in the kid department. I really don't know what the right answer is. I feel like I'm doing a good job as a parent but I'm sure that other people would disagree with me. Maybe you are ABLE to do a good parenting job BECAUSE is innately good natured? ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif) Maybe your answer would be different if you had one of those kids that are hell to parent? Or maybe it has nothing to do with your parenting and you simply got lucky. I am really glad I had DS before DD, otherwise I would probably think I am the world's worst parent. DD is a complete hellion & I would wonder what I am doing wrong except DS was never like that. I think personality has so much to do with it & it is easy to take credit when our kids are easy.
|
|
swamp
Community Leader
Don't be a fool. Call me!
Joined: Dec 19, 2010 16:03:22 GMT -5
Posts: 45,393
|
Post by swamp on Jun 30, 2014 16:54:20 GMT -5
Maybe you are ABLE to do a good parenting job BECAUSE is innately good natured? ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/idunno.gif) Maybe your answer would be different if you had one of those kids that are hell to parent? Or maybe it has nothing to do with your parenting and you simply got lucky. I am really glad I had DS before DD, otherwise I would probably think I am the world's worst parent. DD is a complete hellion & I would wonder what I am doing wrong except DS was never like that. I think personality has so much to do with it & it is easy to take credit when our kids are easy. Amen.
|
|
NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
Posts: 47,476
|
Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jun 30, 2014 16:57:10 GMT -5
My mom said she would have stopped at one if she'd had my brother first. She said she had no way of knowing how completely opposite we'd turn out. It's like Dr. Jeykll and Mr. Hyde.
|
|
Angel!
Senior Associate
Politics Admin
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 11:44:08 GMT -5
Posts: 10,722
|
Post by Angel! on Jun 30, 2014 17:01:45 GMT -5
It's a peaceful existence because you have a peaceful kid. One of mine rolls out pretty happily. The other may have an absolute freakin meltdown over the fact I picked out the wrong socks. Or the day may go fine. It's a crapshoot. Do we have the same child? It is amazing what little thing can cause a complete meltdown that carries over into everything that happens for the next hour (or several hours). And for those that never bend to their kid's will or give in when you have made a decision, I bet you have never a child that actively fights you, undresses herself after you've dressed her (several times), screams at the top of her lungs for 30 minutes straight, and then throws shit when you have had it and have to walk away. Sometimes it is just easier to give in before the tantrum & let her wear the dirty socks she wore yesterday (or whatever minor thing was going to set her off). The coming battle of wills just isn't worth it sometimes. Some kids are just special ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) DS on the other hand is a freaking angel. ETA - hasn't happened recently, but I am remembering the many, many times DD had been brought to school with no shoes on. For some reason that was often a tantrum starter, I finally realized it was just easier to let her not put on the shoes and bring them to school with us. She almost always wanted to put them on the moment we got to school, but inist before we got to school & you had a battle on your hands that would eat up a lot of time & leave us both angry.
|
|
whoisjohngalt
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 14:12:07 GMT -5
Posts: 9,140
|
Post by whoisjohngalt on Jun 30, 2014 17:01:57 GMT -5
Will read the thread in a bit, but today I felt VERY responsible for my kids' rude behaviour towards someone we met for a playdate. Very embarrassed and responsible.
|
|
billisonboard
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 22:45:44 GMT -5
Posts: 37,620
|
Post by billisonboard on Jun 30, 2014 17:12:47 GMT -5
It's a peaceful existence because you have a peaceful kid. One of mine rolls out pretty happily. The other may have an absolute freakin meltdown over the fact I picked out the wrong socks. Or the day may go fine. It's a crapshoot. Do we have the same child? It is amazing what little thing can cause a complete meltdown that carries over into everything that happens for the next hour (or several hours). And for those that never bend to their kid's will or give in when you have made a decision, I bet you have never a child that actively fights you, undresses herself after you've dressed her (several times), screams at the top of her lungs for 30 minutes straight, and then throws shit when you have had it and have to walk away. Sometimes it is just easier to give in before the tantrum & let her wear the dirty socks she wore yesterday (or whatever minor thing was going to set her off). The coming battle of wills just isn't worth it sometimes. Some kids are just special ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) DS on the other hand is a freaking angel. I remember a morning when I was dropping off the stepdaughter at elementary school. She was a little late so I was in the office signing her in. I indicated that it had been "a morning" and the school secretary's response was, "Oh, she is having one of her days". Granted it wasn't a large school but it was interesting that all were well aware of daughter's attitudes.
|
|
swasat
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 13, 2011 9:34:28 GMT -5
Posts: 3,735
|
Post by swasat on Jun 30, 2014 17:18:24 GMT -5
We pick our battles too. AND we pick "when" and "which" household decision the kids can be a "full voting member" on.
DS loves video games. I mean LOVES. Do I let him play as much as he wants? No. I am not against video games but I do think there should be a limit on such things. If he was a full voting member he would play video games for 6 hours straight. Thats against our parenting philosophy. So we hold veto power.
DD wants to stay up till 11pm every night. Do we let him? No. She is not old enough to understand how much sleep needs and how cranky she becomes in the morning with less sleep.
So on and so forth.
But their opinions are definitely considered for things like eating out, vacation spots, what tv to watch, where to go, what to eat etc.
I don't think it has to be "I include my kid 100% in every decision". There is a middle ground. The kids can be included in some common decisions and excluded from some and still be an important member of the family.
|
|
Spellbound454
Senior Member
"In the end, we remember not the words of our enemies but the silence of our friends"
Joined: Sept 9, 2011 17:28:42 GMT -5
Posts: 3,996
|
Post by Spellbound454 on Jun 30, 2014 17:23:03 GMT -5
I think its important to get the structures in place before they hit the teenage years.
Even the nicest kids can go off the rails when they hit the magic 13/14
They do come out of it.....but in the meantime you have to be parent and not best buddy....just to keep them safe.
I've taken many form classes through this period....and its always quiet, respectful and very organised. They cross the line and they know they'll get a sanction and if they are good they get rewards. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/smiley.png)
The School even give me the bad ones because they know I'll get them back on track.
Good behaviour means better results and a brighter future.
|
|
Firebird
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 29, 2010 12:55:06 GMT -5
Posts: 12,448
|
Post by Firebird on Jun 30, 2014 17:30:44 GMT -5
The Jekyll first kid and Hyde second kid is part of why I'm so scared to have another child... but that's a different thread ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/smiley.png)
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 17:33:49 GMT -5
I think there is middle ground. Middle ground is good.
And again, it's going to be easier to give more rights to kids who don't abuse them. Different kids are going to need different things at times.
|
|
swasat
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 13, 2011 9:34:28 GMT -5
Posts: 3,735
|
Post by swasat on Jun 30, 2014 18:08:24 GMT -5
I think there is middle ground. Middle ground is good. And again, it's going to be easier to give more rights to kids who don't abuse them. Different kids are going to need different things at times. Exactly the point we are trying to make ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/smiley.png) That it ultimately depends on the nature of the child. You can do everything right and end up with a child who is crap shoot. Or do everything wrong and end up with a gold plated kid. It definitely depends on parenting, TO SOME EXTENT, but not to the extent some people take credit for as parents.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 18:31:02 GMT -5
I'm a parent first. My kids have tons of friends at school, sports and other various activities. My job is to be their parent. My kids are also important members of our family but as a parent, I make the major decisions. What movie to watch and what to have for dinner are not major life decisions. 9 times out of 10 I ask my kids what they want for dinner and let them choose. Like swasat mentioned, I do, ultimately have veto power! Well, I'm sure I probably give my kids more power on big decisions than you, but that's because of lots of reasons, older kids, pretty level headed kids, etc. But ultimately I do think that I won't prepare them very well if I don't share/ do dictate till they are 18 and then shove them out the door. I'm not saying this is what you are doing! But sometimes you need to make/help make decisions, even, maybe especially ones that fail, when you are in an environment that can still cushion and guide you.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 18:40:39 GMT -5
Maybe. We could just be arguing semantics here.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 18:52:13 GMT -5
My kids are 13 and 15 now. So, this year they are going to research HPV vaccine and decide if they want to get it or not. They help choose vacations. They decide each year if they want to go to school or not, which lessons and certain subjects they want to study ( I don't unschool so they aren't all a choice, although I usually present it as, if you want to keep the option of - open, you need to be doing -). I don't enforce bed times, but we discuss our obligations and how we'll be able to accomplish things if we are too tired, etc. They can usually choose if they want to work or not (outside of certain chores). We've talked as a family about the pros and cons of moving and I won't move someplace they don't want to move. If they don't like dinner, they don't have to eat it.
Is that the type of stuff you want?
|
|
swasat
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 13, 2011 9:34:28 GMT -5
Posts: 3,735
|
Post by swasat on Jun 30, 2014 18:59:07 GMT -5
oped, those are the type of things we take the kids input on as well. Well, except for the bedtime part ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) Because we are both working parents and we use public school. So getting up whenever is not an option. Where I am (and I guess MM is too) confused is what MAJOR decisions do the kids have input on that we are not including our kids in. I guess I am asking the wrong person. It should be directed towards Sheila. I consider a "full voting member" as a person who has input on all the decisions in the family. I sure don't consider kids < 18 to be grown enough to be included in every major family decision.
|
|
whoisjohngalt
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 14:12:07 GMT -5
Posts: 9,140
|
Post by whoisjohngalt on Jun 30, 2014 19:02:05 GMT -5
Will read the thread in a bit, but today I felt VERY responsible for my kids' rude behaviour towards someone we met for a playdate. Very embarrassed and responsible. Sorry.. sounds like you had a bad day. Thanks. What made it even worse that I felt terrible for a little boy that my kids ignored. My husband and I had a "nice" conversation with them about it at dinner.
|
|
whoisjohngalt
Junior Associate
Joined: Dec 18, 2010 14:12:07 GMT -5
Posts: 9,140
|
Post by whoisjohngalt on Jun 30, 2014 19:09:13 GMT -5
OK, so I think I've mentioned this before, but many moms in my homeschooling groups are now all subscribing to this new philosophy of "respect the children", "children are people, treat them as such" and all that other good stuff.
Some of it goes to extreme, in my opinion - I've heard of "I don't make my child brush their teeth, hair, etc bc it's their body" or "I don't make my child share or say "thank you" and please - it should be their decision", "I don't set bed times, meal times, I don't control what they eat"
And of course, the opposite side of it - I am the parent, do as I say.
I fall somewhere in between. While I do respect my children and their thoughts and their opinions and allow them to make certain decisions, I don't equate them to adults. There is a reason that children are not allowed to do various things by law - they are yet not capable of making certain connections and foresee the result of their actions, their brain is simply not developed enough.
So, as with many other things in life, I try to strike a balance. I try to explain the reasons behind me telling them to do something, but there are times when their opinion becomes non-important in a decision making. But guess what? I am not a child and sometimes my opinion doesn't matter either. Such as life.
I hope that my teachings will lead to something good. If not, I'll blame the "nature" and start drinking.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 19:15:01 GMT -5
oped, those are the type of things we take the kids input on as well. Well, except for the bedtime part ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) Because we are both working parents and we use public school. So getting up whenever is not an option. Where I am (and I guess MM is too) confused is what MAJOR decisions do the kids have input on that we are not including our kids in. I guess I am asking the wrong person. It should be directed towards Sheila. I consider a "full voting member" as a person who has input on all the decisions in the family. I sure don't consider kids < 18 to be grown enough to be included in every major family decision. Ok, let's go the opposite way then. What Don't you give your kids a say in? Because I'm trying to think of one I'd exclude my kids from.... This is is hard.
|
|
973beachbum
Senior Associate
Politics Admin
Joined: Dec 17, 2010 16:12:13 GMT -5
Posts: 10,501
|
Post by 973beachbum on Jun 30, 2014 19:16:19 GMT -5
Honestly, barring absolutely horrible parenting, I think we have very little to do with how our kids turn out. This opinion is mostly based on a freakonomics podcast I heard. IIRC, Studies have shown that the biggest impact we have on our kids is actually whether they smoke or drink. How much education & their incomes seem to be much more genetically driven. Although I guess you are still responsible for their genetics unless you adopted ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/tongue2.png) Ho hell yes! ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/yeahthat.gif) I used to think I was the best parent when my DD was little. We set up rules and she was always calmly told what she needed to do and in the very rare event she broke a rule she was given the punishment that was prearranged for it. She would even say she knew her not doing whatever meant she wouldn't get to do such and such because of it. By rights we should have broken our arms patting ourselves on the backs for being such good parents and raising such a well behaved child. ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/grin.png) Then we had our son. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/yikes.png)
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 19:23:57 GMT -5
Gotcha.. okay... yes that gives me a better idea of what you are talking about. Mine are 9 and 11 and I am much more strict than that. I'm not saying either way is right or wrong.. I resented the implication made (not by you) that because I don't consult my kid on every decision that we don't have a loving relationship as pointed out by the minute by minute outline of waking someone up and sending them off to school. Which has nothing to do with wether or not my kids get to pick out a vacation spot or not. We haven't taken an actual vacation in several years so that's kind of a moot point anyways... ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/wink.png) We are none of us ever going to do what everyone else thinks we should do to mark the 'good parents' block. Here we rarely have sit down meals together. We all tend to eat different things, on slightly different schedules and honestly, by the time dinner rolls around, since we see each other all day a lot of the time, we are ready for a break. I like eating dinner with husband while the kids are on their computers. If you just snapshot that scene, I'm sure no one will be handing me any awards. ... Etc.
|
|
swasat
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 13, 2011 9:34:28 GMT -5
Posts: 3,735
|
Post by swasat on Jun 30, 2014 19:25:24 GMT -5
oped, those are the type of things we take the kids input on as well. Well, except for the bedtime part ![](http://images.proboards.com/new/tongue.png) Because we are both working parents and we use public school. So getting up whenever is not an option. Where I am (and I guess MM is too) confused is what MAJOR decisions do the kids have input on that we are not including our kids in. I guess I am asking the wrong person. It should be directed towards Sheila. I consider a "full voting member" as a person who has input on all the decisions in the family. I sure don't consider kids < 18 to be grown enough to be included in every major family decision. Ok, let's go the opposite way then. What Don't you give your kids a say in? Because I'm trying to think of one I'd exclude my kids from.... This is is hard. Financial decisions, like how much to spend on vacations, on the house, how much for savings etc Budgeting Relationships - with family and friends (My 11 and 9 yo kids don't understand, and don't need to understand why some relationships don't work out. Some of the reasons we discuss, others are way beyond their years IMO) Job decisions for both DH and I
|
|
Firebird
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 29, 2010 12:55:06 GMT -5
Posts: 12,448
|
Post by Firebird on Jun 30, 2014 19:26:17 GMT -5
I'll probably get no end of shit for saying this, especially since you all know my hangup about only child stuff- but IN MY OWN PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, the kind of dynamic Sheila describes is very common in only-child households. With only one kid, there's less division between "the parents" and "the kids."
The only child tends to be treated like a little adult from a very young age and as s/he gets older, that can translate into what kind of looks like a relationship between three equals. Obviously that doesn't mean the kid runs the whole show. It just means they're treated more like an adult than the average kid is by their parents.
For example, at age nine I didn't get a vote when my family moved states (as it should be in my opinion) but I got a lot of say in decisions around the move, like the timing of it and the furniture we bought and so forth. My parents consulted me on that stuff. They used to tell me "you don't always get a vote, but you get a voice."
So I don't think Sheila is saying her kid gets total control or anything. It sounds like they just have more equality in their relationship with their teenage son than a lot of parents have with their kids. In MY experience, that is super common with only children and their parents.
|
|
giramomma
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 11:25:27 GMT -5
Posts: 21,549
|
Post by giramomma on Jun 30, 2014 19:29:26 GMT -5
I didn't read page 3... The kids have no say in the size of our family. If I let my 3 kids have input about how many more kids we would have, they would want another one or two. Actually my oldest (10) told me he'd still like a baby brother a few weeks ago. How many hours my DH works. OR I work. In my kid's utopia, neither one of us would work and we would both be SAHPs. The kids also do not have a say, right now, whether or not their homework gets done or when it gets done. The rule is home (after playing on the playground for a 30-60 minutes), snack, homework. The kids also do not have a say in whether or not they contribute to household chores..They may have some choices as to what chores they get to do, but not contributing is an option. Granted with homework and chores, they do have the option to not do them. I make consequences bad enough that they prefer to comply. Overall, though, they comply without complaint.
|
|
Firebird
Senior Associate
Joined: Dec 29, 2010 12:55:06 GMT -5
Posts: 12,448
|
Post by Firebird on Jun 30, 2014 19:34:25 GMT -5
I think there is middle ground. Middle ground is good. And again, it's going to be easier to give more rights to kids who don't abuse them. Different kids are going to need different things at times. Totally agree with this.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 19:35:35 GMT -5
Well, we do try to make some budget decisions together, as I think its important they understand, we can do this, or this, or this, but not all of it. They both had to plan their own day or overnight family trip this year. Research, budget, etc. We took them both.
My dad just came in tonight and announced birthdays are up to 200 now and handed my daughter 200$. Sigh. I generally let them spend gifts, but I'm going to talk to them about setting half of that back/investing it. Ultimately I'll let them decide though. I DO make son Long term save 10% of his 'real' pay checks. But in a world of fewer 'rules' if that is one he learns. Yay. It was a suggestion that lump sums like tax returns be opposite, spend 10 save 90, but I think since it was only 68$, he went 50/50.
A lot of this stuff though, and relationship stuff like you mentioned has grown as they have grown. Obviously.
|
|
giramomma
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 11:25:27 GMT -5
Posts: 21,549
|
Post by giramomma on Jun 30, 2014 19:47:59 GMT -5
I tend to parent a little more heavy handed than DH. My DH is the talker/explainer/ touchy feely one.
While my older two still have their moments with me, sometimes my DH is a little surprised at how they respond to requests I make vs requests he makes. (That said, I also time things better than DH.)
But, the kids have a lot of latitude, much more than I had at their age. I figure I'll keep giving them rope until they hang themselves. I'd rather them make mistakes while at home...
Except for some safety issues. DS already knows that drinking and drive is unacceptable. I've told him several times I will make sure his life is over if he chooses to drink and drive. We haven't talked about having pictures of nekkid girls (classmates) on his phone, but that will also fall under the "I will make sure his life is over" category.
While my kids are living under my roof, I do consider it my job to ensure to the best of my abilities that they don't end up on the sex offender list or in jail because they killed someone.
That said, my kids have input in how they will spend their summer, what we do on vacation, where we go out to eat, how they dress/look, what activities they pursue, etc.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Jun 17, 2024 8:24:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 19:55:03 GMT -5
I agree on those topics. I've been lucky in that mine are not 'out of sight' as much, and that son has shown no real interest in 'dating' yet. We've discussed things, but not maybe as in depth as necessary. But over the next year I need to bring up more of that stuff. I bought daughter a t shirt the other day because I liked the saying, not thinking it was V cut. OMG. She usually wears boxy, boy cut shirts. I noticed when I picked them up from Art that her table had a lot more boys sitting around than normal. ![](http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/sick.png)
|
|