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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2011 19:27:04 GMT -5
We found out our DIL didn't take her husband's name when the first child was born. There was no one in the hospital with her married name. When we asked, she said, "Well, it would have cost $20 to have my driver's license changed." I (and probably everyone else) said, "If you didn't have $20, any number of people would given it to you." Actually, she could have probably gotten close to a $1000 if she had played that scam correctly.
Anyway, we are used to it now, but it was a very passive-aggressive approach.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Feb 14, 2011 19:30:09 GMT -5
I'm curious susanna; what did they name the baby?
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lurkyloo
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Post by lurkyloo on Feb 14, 2011 22:18:05 GMT -5
Changing your name is a very personal decision; it's the basic identifier that everyone uses for you. It's also a complete pain in the tuchus, depending on how old you are. Maybe at eighteen you have one bank account, a driver's license and Social Security to deal with. I got married at 30--I did decide to change my legal name, for various reasons, although I have a number of publications under the original--and had two bank accounts, a retirement account, a taxable investing account, and several other things (in addition to the DL and SS). Some of them were such a pain I just let them slide: I lost several thousand FF miles because I didn't care to fax copies of my DL and SS card to the airline; I left one seldom-used bank account, my HSA, the title to one car, and possibly some other stuff as they were. (Our HR person actually set up the damn HSA as Mary Smith months after I legally became Mary Jones. I'm still annoyed about that.)
I still use my original name for professional purposes and have never had a problem (my DL spells out Mary Smith Jones precisely so I can justifiably claim to be Mary Smith professionally).
WWBG: If your DF doesn't want to change her name, she shouldn't have to. By the same token, if you don't want to change your name, she doesn't get to make that decision for you. You do need to come to some sort of agreement before kids enter the picture.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Feb 15, 2011 9:08:15 GMT -5
We found out our DIL didn't take her husband's name when the first child was born. There was no one in the hospital with her married name. When we asked, she said, "Well, it would have cost $20 to have my driver's license changed." I (and probably everyone else) said, "If you didn't have $20, any number of people would given it to you." Actually, she could have probably gotten close to a $1000 if she had played that scam correctly. Anyway, we are used to it now, but it was a very passive-aggressive approach. I'm not understanding why this is passive aggressive. She didn't want to change her name, and she was probably being flip when she gave you that reason. I didnt' change my name because I think it's a stupid tradition. I tell people it's because my secretary threatened me. People laugh when they hear that explanation, but not so much when I tell them I think it's stupid. I don't really care what anyone else does with their name. I didn't want to change it, so I didn't. You want to do it, have at it.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Feb 15, 2011 9:08:44 GMT -5
...:::"Um, because I didn't become my husband's property when we got married?":::... Exactly. Remember, the only tradition denoting ownership that is permissible is the giving of an engagement ring. Any other tradition to her detriment, or any act implying ownership is absolutely wrong and outdated and must be purged from society. So I like sparkly things. Sue me. And if we had broken up prior to getting married, I would have given it back, because it's the right thing to do. BTW, DH doesn't give a rats patootie about the name I use......
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Feb 15, 2011 9:28:41 GMT -5
I was born with this name and I will die with it. And that is the only explanation I will ever give anyone. If anyone doesn't like it they can kiss my fat ass. My kids have some version of my name as their middle name and their dad's last name as their last name. our daughter has my first name as her middle name and our son has my last name as his middle name. It would have felt weird to me to have two kids and have their names not reflect both sides of the family. They are just as much my children and descendants of my family as they are their Dad's. DH's family have never had a problem with it. And I am sure that after all these years if they had I would have heard about it. I have never had a problem with my kids schools or doctors etc. I just walk in and say I am so and so and I am their mother. The doctor's have the record where I gave birht to them so I think they know I am telling the truth. The school needed their birth certificates from when I enrolled them, so it isn't like they can't check to make sure I really am their mother if they want to verify. Seriously anyone who uses this excuse as a reason to not keep their own name is looking for excuses. IMO they should just do what they want and stop worrying about what other people do.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Feb 15, 2011 9:39:31 GMT -5
Using that logic you should have changed your name at 18 bc you wouldn't want to be your father's property either, correct?
We all get our names from someone - mother, father, husband, whatever. So, once again, I am just not understanding the logic behind it. May be I am just not too bright.
Lena
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Feb 15, 2011 9:43:55 GMT -5
Using that logic you should have changed your name at 18 bc you wouldn't want to be your father's property either, correct? We all get our names from someone - mother, father, husband, whatever. So, once again, I am just not understanding the logic behind it. May be I am just not too bright. Lena So using your logic why don't you just flip a coin and who ever wins gets to keep their own name and the loser has to change it. By your logic if it doesn't matter then it doesn't matter that I change it either. You can't have it both ways. My parents did give my my name. But for better or worse it is who I became. If anyone doesn't like then tough he should have picked someone else. Who picks someone then says all you have to do to be perfect is change?
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Feb 15, 2011 10:02:46 GMT -5
First of all, if you are talking about me specifically, I already said that I really didn't care one way or another.
What I've been asking is for people who feel strongly about it, whether they have logical reasons for it or is it purely emotional. Your reasons are emotional, which is fine. I was just curious if there are any other reasons (besides being published and such, again I already addressed that)
Lena
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Feb 15, 2011 10:11:49 GMT -5
First of all, if you are talking about me specifically, I already said that I really didn't care one way or another. What I've been asking is for people who feel strongly about it, whether they have logical reasons for it or is it purely emotional. Your reasons are emotional, which is fine. I was just curious if there are any other reasons (besides being published and such, again I already addressed that) Lena Truthfull I have never heard of a logical reason for anyone's name in any discussion. In the end it all boils down to what people like or don't like. And that counts for both sides of any name argument. Unless they were a fleeing felon or something and were trying to confuse the cops.
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Feb 15, 2011 10:23:29 GMT -5
IMO they should just do what they want and stop worrying about what other people do.
LOL. I was pretty happy to change names when DH and I got married. I went from a last name no one could spell or pronounce to something that is pretty common. I didn't really have a professional life so changing my name was dead easy (I was in school and checked.) For those who care, I was 34 at the time and it was completely my choice. I told DH that I was taking his name. He didn't really get a choice/say in the matter.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Feb 15, 2011 10:35:23 GMT -5
Oooohhhh, felony conviction is a good one, so is identity theft. That makes sense.
I guess all those "I am not his property", "Let HIM do it", just don't get it
Lena
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Feb 15, 2011 11:04:54 GMT -5
Using that logic you should have changed your name at 18 bc you wouldn't want to be your father's property either, correct? We all get our names from someone - mother, father, husband, whatever. So, once again, I am just not understanding the logic behind it. May be I am just not too bright. Lena You're right, names have to come from some where. However, I was 33 when I got married and I didn't want to change my name. I don't have to have a reason, I think it's a dumb custom. My DH doesn't care what I call myself, why do you?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2011 11:14:34 GMT -5
My DH doesn't care what I call myself, why do you? Bingo... my wife kept her last name, big deal! I am not losing any sleep over it.
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Feb 15, 2011 11:14:34 GMT -5
I am so very sorry that I was curious as to why other people do certain things. How dare of me trying to learn other perspectives. I don't know what I was thinking... Lena
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shanendoah
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Post by shanendoah on Feb 15, 2011 11:22:34 GMT -5
Lena: Other than being published/professional reasons, I don't know if there is any "logical" reason not to change a name, but at the same time, I don't know that there's any "logical" reason to change a name either (other than identity theft and escaped felon). Way back when, it was a property designation, and more recently, it was difficult to deal with schools and doctors, etc, if you had a different last name than your kids. But schools and medical professionals got over that sometime in the 80s/90s. So now, its all emotional reasons, one way or the other. (Tradition is very much an emotional reason and not "logical".)
I remember when I was a junior in highschool, watching our local newscast, and the female anchor having to make an announcement about changing her name. She was 8 months pregnant and it was her last show before going on maternity leave. She announced that while she hadn't changed her name when she got married (for professional reasons), she and her husband decided it would be easier if the whole family had the same name, so when she came back to the newscast, her name would be hyphenated with his. I remember thinking how stupid it was that 1) she needed to announce this. Did she think viewers wouldn't be able to figure out that Mary Smith-Jones was the same person as Mary Smith? 2) she thought it would make any difference what her last name was compared to the kids. My mom's last name was different than mine; probably a third of the kids I went to school with had different last names from at least one of their parents, and I even knew a couple kids who didn't go by their legal last name at all.
tbird: See, my signature changed barely at all when I changed my name. I went from a P to a B at the beginning and from a T to a K in the middle, but except for the first letter and the cross over the T on my old signature, its virtually impossible to tell them apart. (I have a nearly illegible signature. My E for my first name looks more like an L.)
I did change my name, but not everywhere. Other than the bank, SS, and DMV, it didn't take more than a phone call for most places. However, our timeshare property requires a notarized copy of our marriage certificate. I've determined that they don't need that, and since we own it together anyway, I'm still listed under my maiden name on that.
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sil
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Post by sil on Feb 15, 2011 11:23:15 GMT -5
I never liked my maiden name. I liked my husband's name better, so I changed it.
If the situation was reversed, I would have kept my maiden name. And if my MIL would have asked me why I kept my maiden name, I probably would have blamed the cost of a new driver's license too
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2011 11:44:11 GMT -5
I am so very sorry that I was curious as to why other people do certain things. How dare of me trying to learn other perspectives. I don't know what I was thinking... Lena For my wife it was because she loved her last name.Her last name is quite famous and fancy : St Laurent Also, her father past away when she was 2 and she wanted to keep it in memory of him (don't ask me th reasoning behind it). I did not mind one bite and we are quite ok with it. She also doesn't mind that people address us as Mr & Mrs AuXXX when we go out , make reservations for dinner/hotels/flights or when we get invited to certain events. Sometimes I have been addressed as Mr. St Laurent by people that knew my wife first and they assumed that was my last name also; did not bother me one bit. When I called her job the other day her co-worker greeded me as Mr. Saint Laurent.
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lurkyloo
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Post by lurkyloo on Feb 15, 2011 11:44:18 GMT -5
I liked my husband's name better too--after 30 years of spelling the original out over the phone and having the person on the other end mishear, I decided I'd seen enough creative misspellings. Of course, some still manage it with a five-letter name (they change a K to a C) but I figure that's their problem.
Also, I like his family. They've welcomed me with open arms, and I'm pleased to be a member (his mother likes to joke that there must have been a mixup at the hospital somewhere; she's pretty sure I've always belonged to them!). I always felt like an alien in my birth family...one that was often treated like she wasn't very bright, at that (despite multiple advanced degrees in hard science).
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2011 11:45:48 GMT -5
My mom's last name was different than mine; probably a third of the kids I went to school with had different last names from at least one of their parents, and I even knew a couple kids who didn't go by their legal last name at all. There are many reasons for changing your name, but "it's better for the kids" doesn't make sense to me. By the time a child is old enough to figure out the last name thing, it doesn't matter. You're Mommy. Do they feel less close to a grandparent or other relative who doesn't share that last name? DH actually went by a last name that wasn't legal till he got into the Navy. He had the last name of his father, who never married his mother, and them Mom married a great man who was a very good influence on DH. (DH is 72 and still quotes some of his wisdom.) Somewhere along the line, he took his stepfather's last name but not legally. He joined the Navy and they insisted that he use his birth name, so he did. I think he was the only guy at his 50th HS reunion who had a different last name than the one in the yearbook!
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whoisjohngalt
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Post by whoisjohngalt on Feb 15, 2011 11:52:14 GMT -5
Cawiau and Lukeyloo, those are very interesting reasons, thanks!!
Lena
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dianartemis
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Post by dianartemis on Feb 15, 2011 12:03:44 GMT -5
I'll probably change my name, mainly because it's long, awkward, and most people can't pronounce it properly. Since I'm not even dating anyone, it's kind of a moot point.
ETA: If I do meet someone and get married and his is worse than mine, I'm keeping mine.
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shanendoah
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Post by shanendoah on Feb 15, 2011 12:16:34 GMT -5
athena: For the two kids I knew, brother and sister, their legal last name was their birth father's. Neither of them liked the man and he was not in their life. They loved their step-father, but their birth father had enough rights to prevent the step from adopting them, or prevent them from legally changing their names while they were under 18. The high school allowed them to hyphenate - birth-step, though no one used the birth part. I believe both legally changed their names once they turned 18.
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shanendoah
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Post by shanendoah on Feb 15, 2011 12:41:36 GMT -5
Given that this thread has devolved into a discussion on last names, I thought this story might interest people www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41577691/ns/world_news-asia-pacific?gt1=43001So while this is not something we have to worry about here in the US, I guess one logical reason for keeping your own last name (as a woman) is to fight for actual equality under the law. (And I will be the first to argue that we do not yet have full equality between genders in the US, we are definitely further along than Japan.)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2011 14:34:18 GMT -5
I didn't change my last name. I couldn't find a logical reason to change it. My mother always had a different last name than me and my sister (married 4 times and changed it with each), so I saw no reason that I had to have the same last name as my child. I really felt like I already had a name and didn't need a new one. Someone had spent time to give me a name that flowed with my last name and it seemed wrong to change it to something that didn't go together well.
It honestly hasn't been inconvenient. In a scary way people just take your word that so and so is your husband.
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on Feb 15, 2011 17:08:38 GMT -5
...:::"where the female children took the mother's name and the male children took the father's name. It sounded fair to me.... ":::...
Funny, I was even willing to compromise to this point, and DF doesn't think that is fair. So clearly I need to redefine my definition of "fair" because the only time I see the word being used, it is by someone who wants a situation re-baselined to benefit him/her.
Good wives take their husbands name without giving him crap. It is the only "fair" way to do it.
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stats45
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Post by stats45 on Feb 15, 2011 17:14:10 GMT -5
What about gay/lesbian partnerships?
The lesbians clearly should have no last name, and the gay men should each take each others...
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on Feb 15, 2011 17:16:02 GMT -5
...:::"where the female children took the mother's name and the male children took the father's name. It sounded fair to me.... ":::... Funny, I was even willing to compromise to this point, and DF doesn't think that is fair. So clearly I need to redefine my definition of "fair" because the only time I see the word being used, it is by someone who wants a situation re-baselined to benefit him/her. Good wives take their husbands name without giving him crap. It is the only "fair" way to do it. Wait, why did she think it's wasn't fair for the girls to get her last name and the boys to get yours? If you have all girls, your name "dies" with you, if you have all boys, her name "dies" with her. It's a crap shoot which gender you have. Or even if you guys CAN have kids.
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on Feb 15, 2011 17:40:17 GMT -5
...:::"Wait, why did she think it's wasn't fair for the girls to get her last name and the boys to get yours?":::...
Correct. And you wonder why these issues make me see red, and why I feel I need to take hard line absolute stances. Because every time I make the mistake of trying to debate these issues on logic or equitable outcomes, it is twisted.
So again, be good wives and take your husbands last names without giving him crap. Men, don't let the LAST thing we have die.
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shanendoah
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Post by shanendoah on Feb 15, 2011 17:46:52 GMT -5
WWBG: Traditional does NOT equal fair. And again I say, I'm sorry about the apparent problems you're having with DF over these issues, but please, stop projecting your issues on to "our" DHs or your DFs issues on to "us" (our/us referring to the women on this thread who happen to not see the name issue the same way you do.) In fact, your ranting has made me wish I hadn't taken DH's name- not that he ever cared one way or another. (If he cared, we would have both changed our names to his mother's maiden name, because there are no men left with that name anymore.)
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