mmhmm
Administrator
It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
Joined: Dec 25, 2010 18:13:34 GMT -5
Posts: 31,770
Today's Mood: Saddened by Events
Location: Memory Lane
Favorite Drink: Water
|
Post by mmhmm on Jun 18, 2011 16:00:23 GMT -5
Can't endorse any of the statements, so had to choose the final option. I really don't see the anti-intellectualism amongst those I know. Most of us are well educated and appreciate the opportunities that education has afforded us. There may be some out there who resent educated people, or education in general. I don't know any.
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 16:01:16 GMT -5
Gee. I wonder who voted for 'D'. I don't want this to turn into a Dem versus GOP snipe-fest. It just irks me that some of the most intelligent people I know--the ones who know more about AGW than "the experts say", "the experts say"--are decried as "anti-intellectual" for their views. I suppose I should just stop giving a toot... but that would make me "anti-intellectual" too, I suppose.
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 16:03:26 GMT -5
If they told me I was halfway to Pol Pot because I questioned the conclusions of pro-AGW climate scientists, I might have a few words to say. ETA:Facts are not hard. Facts are mutable. Truth is hard, but facts and truth never coincide perfectly. I don't claim that America is a paragon of open-mindedness, but look at the number of facts that are truly under contention. Look at the stakes. Trillions of dollars in terms of climate change. Millions of human lives in the case of embryonic stem-cell research. These are big freaking issues. And then some demagog like Phillips comes along and claims that because Americans contest, scrutinize, oppose, ignore these specific issues, Americans are "anti-intellectual". Others suggest they're a step away from reverting to the Cambodian killing fields. Believe or be silent. I say phooey on that kind of generalization. If you believe it, you're in danger of succumbing to the same closed-mindedness you're lashing out against. Anyway, that's my rant for today.
|
|
NoMoreLunacy
Well-Known Member
Joined: Jun 8, 2011 23:21:57 GMT -5
Posts: 1,293
|
Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 16:03:58 GMT -5
Virgil my friend, please keep at it. The rant in your OP was top rate. I emailed it to a few of my friends and everyone had a very good laugh.
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:08:32 GMT -5
<<< If anti-intellectualism wasn't rampant you would not have so many people ready to take a hatchet to the science curriculum and other boobs ready to let them. >>> ...ooh, ooh... where did that happen?
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:09:44 GMT -5
...and fwiw, I didn't vote in this poll on principle, considering the OP: <<< the lesser-enlightened denizens among us will eagerly make known their sentiments. >>> ;D
|
|
|
Post by marshabar1 on Jun 18, 2011 16:18:37 GMT -5
Does "anti-intellectual" mean refusing to have an adult conversation with Barack Obama where we are suddenly enlightened to understand that he is always right and we are always wrong? i don't agree with any of the statements, Virgil. There are good teachers and lawyers etc. And there are evil scumbags like Ward Ecchhh Churchill. I've known lots of lawyers, and have friends and family who practice law. I like them. But it is a profession which requires a person to act as the agent of whatever person they choose to work for. That can involve some real moral back bends. Also in probate they are subject to INCREDIBLE temptations. Just sayin . . . .
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 16:20:29 GMT -5
Well shucks... I find the concept of you figuring out how to send an e-mail kind of funny too.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Apr 29, 2024 9:11:23 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 16:23:37 GMT -5
<<< If anti-intellectualism wasn't rampant you would not have so many people ready to take a hatchet to the science curriculum and other boobs ready to let them. >>> ...ooh, ooh... where did that happen? Where else? Texas... they had fun with the history curriculum too....
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Apr 29, 2024 9:11:23 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 16:25:16 GMT -5
Actually, Kansas may be worse.... Do you know people actually plan their whole vacation around visiting the Creationism museum there?
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:26:00 GMT -5
<<< If anti-intellectualism wasn't rampant you would not have so many people ready to take a hatchet to the science curriculum and other boobs ready to let them. >>> ...ooh, ooh... where did that happen? Where else? Texas... they had fun with the history curriculum too.... ...so you're a Texan? maybe even feeling sour grapes about the legislation not going your way? and what did they do, anyway?
|
|
NoMoreLunacy
Well-Known Member
Joined: Jun 8, 2011 23:21:57 GMT -5
Posts: 1,293
|
Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 16:26:15 GMT -5
Well shucks... I find the concept of you figuring out how to send an e-mail kind of funny too. It was certainly not easy. First I prayed to the good lord for his guidance on how message others in a properly religious way. Didn't work. Nothing happened. It was as if the lord was out playing golf on a Saturday. Then I called the lord and he told me not to be a moron and make use on 21st Century technology and science instead of sticking to smoke signals and intelligent design from the middle ages.
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:27:57 GMT -5
Actually, Kansas may be worse.... Do you know people actually plan their whole vacation around visiting the Creationism museum there? ...how is this "worse"? ...and in the interests of full disclosure, I've made vacation plans around all kinds of activities, such as visiting museums...
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Apr 29, 2024 9:11:23 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 16:33:59 GMT -5
I'm in PA... I read about Texas... although i think it was more of a social studies re-writing thing... i'll look... www.nytimes.com/2009/01/22/education/22texas.htmland social studies www.nytimes.com/2010/03/13/education/13texas.htmlPersonally... i don't use textbooks all that much, and can choose what i want... but one of the problems with a state like Texas or California making these decisions is that they are state curriculum schools... and textbooks use their standards as baseline, because that is where they are guarenteed to sell the most books (no local districts deciding on their own curriculum... ) ... So yeah... i may not be there, but i do have a problem with Texas conservatives writing science and history for the rest of us...
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 16:34:25 GMT -5
I'd bet dollars to dinars you don't have the first clue about modern ID theories. To you, ID is synonymous with young-Earth creationism and you could give a toot whether that preconception is accurate. This thread is about the poll and Ms. times' statement. My limit is one ID debate per quarter.
|
|
NoMoreLunacy
Well-Known Member
Joined: Jun 8, 2011 23:21:57 GMT -5
Posts: 1,293
|
Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 16:36:48 GMT -5
I'd bet dollars to dinars you don't have the first clue about modern ID theories. To you, ID is synonymous with young-Earth creationism and you could give a toot whether that preconception is accurate. This thread is about the poll and Ms. times' statement. My limit is one ID debate per quarter. Dude, please. ID is BS. No credible scientist believes in it. Deal with that.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Apr 29, 2024 9:11:23 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 16:37:40 GMT -5
Kansas worse as far as instructional design as 'science'... Kansas was the first to back design as science education.... but actually i think they are still fighting, as it was overuled a few years later.... not sure about now... Just remember it was big in the ID fight...
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:37:41 GMT -5
<<< This thread is about the poll and Ms. times' statement. >>> ...agreed... I was just curious about this supposed "hatchet job" that I missed on some curriculum somewhere... ...and fwiw, one of my favorite museum-like excursions occurred in PA... ;D
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:38:36 GMT -5
I'd bet dollars to dinars you don't have the first clue about modern ID theories. To you, ID is synonymous with young-Earth creationism and you could give a toot whether that preconception is accurate. This thread is about the poll and Ms. times' statement. My limit is one ID debate per quarter. Dude, please. ID is BS. No credible scientist believes in it. Deal with that. ...dude, please... one opinion per poster, tyvm... ;D
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Apr 29, 2024 9:11:23 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 16:38:51 GMT -5
Yeah.... and evolution says we all came from monkies... The fact remains that ID is NOT science.
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:39:38 GMT -5
Kansas worse as far as instructional design as 'science'... Kansas was the first to back design as science education.... but actually i think they are still fighting, as it was overuled a few years later.... not sure about now... Just remember it was big in the ID fight... ...and this constitutes as a "hatchet job?" interesting...
|
|
NoMoreLunacy
Well-Known Member
Joined: Jun 8, 2011 23:21:57 GMT -5
Posts: 1,293
|
Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 16:39:43 GMT -5
There is just one opinion - ID is BS.
|
|
cme1201
Junior Associate
Tennis Elbow, Jock Itch, and Athletes Foot, every man has a sports life!
Joined: Apr 6, 2011 13:55:07 GMT -5
Posts: 5,503
|
Post by cme1201 on Jun 18, 2011 16:40:45 GMT -5
Actually, Kansas may be worse.... Do you know people actually plan their whole vacation around visiting the Creationism museum there?Is this any worse than people planning their vacation to go see a hole in the ground shoot water (Ole' Faithfull, Yellowstone), See giant trees (Redwood National Forest, Cali) or to see age and weatherworn faces carved in rock (Mt. Rushmore, SD)
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Apr 29, 2024 9:11:23 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 16:41:46 GMT -5
I like museums and visit them... I am just personally dumbfounded by the need of individuals to plan a visit to Creation museum like it was Disneyland... .... Then, i don't get Nascar either... and i'm sure some people would question why i take my kids to see things like Fiddler on the Roof and the Mutter Museum...
|
|
Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 15:19:33 GMT -5
Posts: 27,448
|
Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 16:43:40 GMT -5
I know several scientists of impressive intellectual and academic stature who do. Your statement is false prima facie. Plus, I heard that your astronaut, pro football, world chess champion son who invented the electric toaster also believes in ID. Oh my.
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:44:11 GMT -5
I like museums and visit them... I am just personally dumbfounded by the need of individuals to plan a visit to Creation museum like it was Disneyland... .... Then, i don't get Nascar either... and i'm sure some people would question why i take my kids to see things like Fiddler on the Roof and the Mutter Museum... ...so is it fair to say that you're dumbfounded by your dumbfoundedness in this matter?
|
|
cme1201
Junior Associate
Tennis Elbow, Jock Itch, and Athletes Foot, every man has a sports life!
Joined: Apr 6, 2011 13:55:07 GMT -5
Posts: 5,503
|
Post by cme1201 on Jun 18, 2011 16:44:15 GMT -5
I like museums and visit them... I am just personally dumbfounded by the need of individuals to plan a visit to Creation museum like it was Disneyland... .... Then, i don't get Nascar either... and i'm sure some people would question why i take my kids to see things like Fiddler on the Roof and the Mutter Museum... Faith matters to some, Does it really have to have meaning to you?
|
|
Deleted
Joined: Apr 29, 2024 9:11:23 GMT -5
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 16:44:38 GMT -5
I said two things. Kansas might be worse than Texas as far as promoting ID in their curriculum... and Do you know people plan vacations to the Creation Museum. Sorry if they ran together... I just was dumbfounded the first time i heard someone say they were planning on going there for vacation... Creation Museum is actually in Kentucky i think...
Sometimes my mind wonders....
|
|
NoMoreLunacy
Well-Known Member
Joined: Jun 8, 2011 23:21:57 GMT -5
Posts: 1,293
|
Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 16:44:54 GMT -5
By the way, ID has taken a beating in the courts. Unless separation of church and state is repealed, sneaking in Christianity in public schools won't work.
|
|
|
Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 16:45:32 GMT -5
I know several scientists of impressive intellectual and academic stature who do. Your statement is false prima facie. Plus, I heard that your astronaut, pro football, world chess champion son who invented the electric toaster also believes in ID. Oh my. ...now THAT was a great museum! ;D
|
|