hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on May 17, 2011 16:19:55 GMT -5
Was it confirmed that she was bringing in money from the property and catering business? If you're not bringing in income of some kind, "if you want to buy X thing that you want and I don't, you should consider bringing in some money of your own instead of me working harder" can be a valid response from your partner. Depending on a lot of things. Catering business makes $13K i believe. Property is break even (though frankly I'm not sure the mere act of "paying bills" for the rentals would really entitle her to claim that as her contribution solely). It's also gone from the catering being "her business" to her being "the driving force"...I'm skeptical that OP is really being objective about each of their contributions given the skew of the first post.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 16:31:03 GMT -5
Just because someone is nice enough to let you get away with not working at one point doesn't mean they forfeit the right to have you pull your share of the weight in the future.
I don't know if "nice enough to let you" is the way I would put that, but I agree with the basic point. A SAHS is fine if both parties are in agreement but everyone needs to accept the idea that someday the financial picture might change and the SAHS might need to go back to work. There should be a plan in place for that eventuality, which should include the SAHS keeping some kind of skill up-to-date in the event that s/he needs to jump back into the workforce at a moment's notice.
It's not wise for SAHSs to become complacent in hir circumstances, IMO. Circumstances have a way of changing.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on May 17, 2011 16:46:27 GMT -5
My mother did all of it, the full time job, 2 kids, all of the house cleaning (and she likes a VERY VERY VERY clean house)/grocery shopping/bill pay (and it wasn't even online), cooking (and no take out or frozen dinners, everything from scratch). She wasn't a single mom, my dad had to travel a lot for work but even when he wasn't traveling, my mom did it all because she preferred doing it herself. Sure it was tiring but nobody said having kids is easy work or working for a living. Not every woman is super woman. Good for those that are, but I'm not and I'm not going to pretend to be. Why does this board think only contributions to a family are monetary? Or that you aren't a contributing member of society unless you have a job?
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 17:01:59 GMT -5
Why does this board think only contributions to a family are monetary? Or that you aren't a contributing member of society unless you have a job?
I had a SAHM and she was awesome. I loved having her home with me; she loved being home with me. But if we had needed money for anything, she would have gone back to work in a heartbeat (and did, several times - not because we needed anything specific but just for the added security).
I don't have any problem with SAHPs, I just don't think it's wise for them to consider SAHParenting their life path. There should always be a backup plan. I find it kind of odd when SAHPs resist re-entering the workforce when it's clearly necessary for their current situation. It's like a lot of them get stuck in a "this IS my life and you can't take it away from me!" kind of groove and I don't get that.
None of this is meant to apply to the OP (or you, or anyone else specific), I don't know enough about the situation. But just in general, I don't think it's a good idea to get too comfortable as a SAHP. Enjoy it while it lasts? Sure. But be ready for the day when it doesn't make sense for your family anymore, because that day will more than likely come sooner or later.
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Post by stl76 on May 17, 2011 19:20:17 GMT -5
"Why does this board think only contributions to a family are monetary? Or that you aren't a contributing member of society unless you have a job? "
Nobody thinks only contributions to a family are monetary but staying at home doesn't pay the bills and it also does not take any stress/pressure away from the one that doesnt stay at home as far as paying bills. Everybody needs money to live on. I just don't think it should be one person's responsibility to make all the money while the other stays at home. I don't think a SAHP is a full time job; plenty of people do both (work and raise kids).
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on May 17, 2011 19:30:55 GMT -5
But just in general, I don't think it's a good idea to get too comfortable as a SAHP. Enjoy it while it lasts? Sure. But be ready for the day when it doesn't make sense for your family anymore, because that day will more than likely come sooner or later.
Here's the thing and I think it will become more and more common. My mom went from having kids at home for 25 years plus working part time for my dad doing books, cleaning, occaisonally drafting and out in the field to having to spend more and more time dealing wth her aging parents, helping out with her grandkids (my sister's oldest 2 had health problems and were born while I was still in high school), etc. She became busier in her 50s than she was in 40s (when she really only had one child at home) and now in her 60s she spends a significant amount of time helping her mother and childless aunt and uncle as they approach 90. Financially, if she needed to find an 8 to 5 job, I'm sure she would have gotten one. However her value in what she was able to save the family in terms of cooking,sewing, cleaning, gardening, all would have been seriously diminished.
My DH stays home. There is so much stuff he does that saves us money. He was able to fix our totalled car for $1000. That saved us a ton of money. We could not have gotten a vehicle as reliable for that amount or even the amount of the "total". However a lot of things he does are more a quality of life thing for ALL of us. Will he go back to work eventually? Probably. He keeps his foot in the door with part time consulting. People jump in and out of his industry all the time. He's 46, a 5 or 8 yr break starting at 45 isn't going to be a big deal. I'm perfectly happy having him at home as long as he is.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on May 17, 2011 19:34:28 GMT -5
"Why does this board think only contributions to a family are monetary? Or that you aren't a contributing member of society unless you have a job? " Nobody thinks only contributions to a family are monetary but staying at home doesn't pay the bills and it also does not take any stress/pressure away from the one that doesnt stay at home as far as paying bills. Everybody needs money to live on. I just don't think it should be one person's responsibility to make all the money while the other stays at home. I don't think a SAHP is a full time job; plenty of people do both (work and raise kids). It does in my household. Our household is significantly less stressful when my DH stayed home.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 19:48:07 GMT -5
My DH stays home. There is so much stuff he does that saves us money. He was able to fix our totalled car for $1000. That saved us a ton of money. We could not have gotten a vehicle as reliable for that amount or even the amount of the "total". However a lot of things he does are more a quality of life thing for ALL of us. Will he go back to work eventually? Probably. He keeps his foot in the door with part time consulting. People jump in and out of his industry all the time. He's 46, a 5 or 8 yr break starting at 45 isn't going to be a big deal. I'm perfectly happy having him at home as long as he is.
That's the other reason I would prefer DF to stay home instead of me - well, two reasons. One, he's less likely to be mommy-tracked than I am, and two, he's much better at finding ways to save money than I am. You should see him grocery shop, he'd make SuziQ proud when he's on his game ;D
It does in my household. Our household is significantly less stressful when my DH stayed home.
I had a little taste of what it might be like to have DF stay at home when he moved in and spent a couple of months finding a job. He had the house spotless at all times, made me dinner at least four nights a week, did my laundry, planned low-cost things for us to do together, and just generally made things as easy as possible for me. I loved it. In that particular situation the stress outweighed the benefits since we couldn't live on my salary and he needed to get a job ASAP but if we'd been making enough money for that not to be a concern, it would have been a sweet life - especially if we had children.
So I agree with that statement. Having a spouse stay at home can infinitely reduce the stress on the working partner. Plus, they can focus more on their career. Late nights, no problem. Kid gets sick at school, they don't have to take off. Work from home on the weekend? No worries.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on May 17, 2011 21:29:27 GMT -5
I don't think people consider ONLY monetary contributions...but you don't just get to pick and choose how you contribute to the family. For couples where they like having a SAHP the contributions can be well worth it. For couples where one person wants to stay home and the other person wants them both to work...the message is clearly that the at-home contributions are less important to that spouse than what can be accumulated via a job. (I think for a lot of people that point comes about when kids hit school-age and now all of a sudden the SAHP has an extra 7 hours of time every day they didn't have before. It suddenly becomes an issue of maybe the tradeoff was worth it to have someone with the kids, no daycare costs, and some housework being done...to now the only real advantage being the housework and all of a sudden the advantage of that vs a full time paycheck doesn't seem like such a good deal).
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 22:04:17 GMT -5
So I agree with that statement. Having a spouse stay at home can infinitely reduce the stress on the working partner. Plus, they can focus more on their career. Late nights, no problem. Kid gets sick at school, they don't have to take off. Work from home on the weekend? No worries. Right, but in the back of my mind I know that if I lose my job for any reason we don't have her check to fall back on. It's all on me. If I stop bringing in money we have none coming in at all. Having a household that runs like a well oiled machine without work from me is pretty damn sweet, but there are tradeoffs involved too.
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steff
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Post by steff on May 17, 2011 22:20:37 GMT -5
I'm a SAHM, with 1 kiddo who just turned 17 and will be a senior in HS next year. My hubby works nights, and always has since we got married 18 years ago. I was a bartender when we met. Before that I had office and accounting experience, but hated it...hated hated hated it...was the entire reason why I became a bartender at the time.
It was a joint agreement between hubby & I for me to be a SAHM. We tried me going back into an office and it lasted a few weeks before both of us had had enough. We never saw each other, he never got to see kiddo, and most of what I made went to daycare. It simply wasn't worth it. We made do with his paycheck and in the beginning it was very difficult to make ends meet. I had to get creative with shopping and figuring out how to save money anyway I could. We lived with 1 (very) used car for years and took us forever to slowly save up and go from a bad apt to a better apt, to a duplex, to a rent house, to finally owning our own home.
Hubby will tell everyone that YES, I make his life easier every day that I'm here. The house is clean, his clothes are always washed and ready to go, he has a hot dinner no matter what time he comes home from work...be it 4 am or 10 am or noon. a HOT meal, prepared by me. And in the long run it has been the best thing for our kiddo. I've been deeply involved with him and his schooling since day 1. I've had to help make up for times when hubby didn't see kiddo most of hte week because of working nights. Which btw, pays much better than working during the day in his industry.
I've heard all the "you are lazy, you don't pull your weight" and all the other comments about me being a SAHM over the past 18 years, but in OUR house, it's been the best choice for us and there's no plans for it to change anytime soon. Not even once kiddo starts college. My job is to make hubby's life easier, take care of the home, and save money each week from his paycheck.... and I do my job very well.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on May 17, 2011 22:21:31 GMT -5
Not really. Plenty of people drop their kids off and offload the raising of their children from the hours of 8-6 on another party.
By the time they get their children home and have dinner, they'll see them for a grand total of 2-3 hours a day before putting them to bed and starting the routine all over again the following day.
The poor / lower middle class that struggle to place themselves in middle class [because they want to live a lifestyle they otherwise couldn't afford] largely think this way and rarely realize that the second income is often making them just a few dollars an hour by working.
Most people that are happy with themselves and where they are in their life don't place a value on a person contingent on the money they bring into the home.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on May 17, 2011 22:23:22 GMT -5
Spot on - great post, Steff.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on May 17, 2011 22:25:58 GMT -5
And post on the internet during working hours.
I love the working mom's that are too good to be SAHM's that spend their day posting on internet boards. Apparently, some full time jobs aren't really full time jobs either.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on May 17, 2011 22:28:35 GMT -5
So the amount of money brought in matters more than the hours spent working?
No wonder so many relationship fail when it has to be a competition between spouses on who works how many hours and how much money each contributes to the pot.
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steff
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Post by steff on May 17, 2011 22:41:17 GMT -5
I may not bring cold cash into the house, but I do my part by saving cold cash thru how I shop, keeping to our budget and savings plan (kiddo college fund). I contribute to our house in ways outside of cold hard cash. I save us money thru gardening & canning/preserving our veggies. And as hubby and most who know us would say, our house & lives would fall apart if I wasn't running everything behind the scenes as the SAHM. To be honest, hubby wouldn't know how to order a pizza over hte phone, much less online if he was starving. He paid for the new washer & drier, but he stands and stares at it like it's a monster from Mars going "HUH?".
I remember several years ago, some tv show or magazine doing a piece on how a SAHM would cost more to replace than the income the working dad makes, simply because the SAHM is 100 different jobs that would cost a fortune to hire someone to do.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on May 17, 2011 22:47:09 GMT -5
All I know is if I have to drag my ass out of bed and go to work my spouse has to as well. I'm not putting up with the SAHP lifestyle, period end of story.
"And as hubby and most who know us would say, our house & lives would fall apart if I wasn't running everything behind the scenes as the SAHM."
Kind of sad that your husband is so dependent on you do cook and clean for him and couldn't do these things himself. I do it all, cook, clean, laundry, shop, pay the bills, manage the finances and more. I prefer being a well rounded person and know that I can take care of myself.
"To be honest, hubby wouldn't know how to order a pizza over hte phone, much less online if he was starving. He paid for the new washer & drier, but he stands and stares at it like it's a monster from Mars going "HUH?"."
My point exactly. just sad a grown man can't do his own laundry or feed himself.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 22:48:22 GMT -5
I remember several years ago, some tv show or magazine doing a piece on how a SAHM would cost more to replace than the income the working dad makes, simply because the SAHM is 100 different jobs that would cost a fortune to hire someone to do. I've seen dozens of those and they're always BS. They assume the non working spouse does absolutely every little thing and the working spouse does nothing but work and couldn't figure out how to do a single thing around the house. I have a stay at home spouse so I don't have to cook all that often, that doesn't mean I'd need to hire a chef to make the kids and I three meals a day if Loop left. We might not eat as well as we would with her here, but I'm sure I'd find a way to keep us from starving without having to hire somebody. Same thing for laundry, house cleaning, etc. I'm not saying I wouldn't hire out some of what Loop does, but I definitely wouldn't hire out every single thing she does.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2011 22:50:32 GMT -5
Let's focus on the subject here... it is not about being a Stay at home Parent vs being a working mom.
HER HUSBAND wants her to get a full time job, she wants to remain a stay at home mom. That is the problem, not wether she would be a better mom working or staying home.
Her husband, her partner wants her to contribute more financially to the household expenses. So what? what he wants doesn't matter? It is all about her?
She can do all the math she wants, shows him how it will not be worth it, and how on the long run they will be better off with her staying home, it doesn't matter. He wants her to get a job and brings home more money.
All of you have turned this into stay at home mom vs working mom; who works more or not, what do they contribute. He does not care about that anymore, he wants the extra income.
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steff
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Post by steff on May 17, 2011 22:54:39 GMT -5
All I know is if I have to drag my ass out of bed and go to work my spouse has to as well. I'm not putting up with the SAHP lifestyle, period end of story. "And as hubby and most who know us would say, our house & lives would fall apart if I wasn't running everything behind the scenes as the SAHM." Kind of sad that your husband is so dependent on you do cook and clean for him and couldn't do these things himself. I do it all, cook, clean, laundry, shop, pay the bills, manage the finances and more. I prefer being a well rounded person and know that I can take care of myself. "To be honest, hubby wouldn't know how to order a pizza over hte phone, much less online if he was starving. He paid for the new washer & drier, but he stands and stares at it like it's a monster from Mars going "HUH?"." My point exactly. just sad a grown man can't do his own laundry or feed himself. I haven't been married a week.... we've been married 18 years. When I went out of town for a week and left my guys alone, they managed, but life was not easier for them. And as I stated in my first post here, it works for OUR house best. Hubby works nights, it's a different world on a different time schedule.
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Peace Of Mind
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Post by Peace Of Mind on May 18, 2011 1:06:17 GMT -5
"All of the stay at home moms I know realize how easy it was when they were little because they didn't worry about them having sex, drinking, smoking, doing drugs, getting bored and getting into trouble with the law because of peer pressure or hanging with the wrong group... " This isn't a problem isolated specifically to stay at home moms. Working moms have to deal with the same issues... I agree. But that wasn't my entire post. I was responding to a poster who wondered why a SAHM didn't want to go back to work now that the kids were older. I didn't imply only SAHM had to worry about it, but was explaining the reasoning of the SAHM's I know.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on May 18, 2011 8:29:15 GMT -5
And post on the internet during working hours. I love the working mom's that are too good to be SAHM's that spend their day posting on internet boards. Apparently, some full time jobs aren't really full time jobs either. Don't forget the working dads like yourself
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2011 9:16:03 GMT -5
tbird -
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 18, 2011 9:20:49 GMT -5
Case in point. MY Girlfriend had 3 kids under the age of 5 and had her sister, who is a few points shy of being labeled "special needs" watch them for her for $125 per week. There's no way I would have EVER let that barely functional person watch 3 of the most precious things she had but she did it so she and her husband could have a big house in the great school district and every child could have their own room, yada yada yada. I worked the family business when the kids were small then went back to teaching when the kids got school age so was home by 4 most days and she actually left me a message one time asking me what I was doing, "out spending my husband's money?" I NEVER forgot it and how it offended me big time. I never asked her why she had 3 kids and left them for 14 hours a day with an idiot but because I wasn't making the big bucks, I was LAZY and living off my husband. So as I can get even more slammed, I also had a housekeeper but I did all the rest, laundry, hauling kids, grocery shopping, cooking and cleaning up afterwards, homework, you get the picture. Now I take care of DF and this never ending new house stuff that needs to get done but I may just go back to work this fall and let the chips fall with this house and all the rest. Working outside the home is 10x easier than inside the home. I have had enough of this.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on May 18, 2011 10:32:28 GMT -5
All I know is if I have to drag my ass out of bed and go to work my spouse has to as well. I'm not putting up with the SAHP lifestyle, period end of story. "And as hubby and most who know us would say, our house & lives would fall apart if I wasn't running everything behind the scenes as the SAHM." Kind of sad that your husband is so dependent on you do cook and clean for him and couldn't do these things himself. I do it all, cook, clean, laundry, shop, pay the bills, manage the finances and more. I prefer being a well rounded person and know that I can take care of myself. "To be honest, hubby wouldn't know how to order a pizza over hte phone, much less online if he was starving. He paid for the new washer & drier, but he stands and stares at it like it's a monster from Mars going "HUH?"." My point exactly. just sad a grown man can't do his own laundry or feed himself. It is called division of labor. My husband can pay bills, it just works better if I do it. I can clean, it just works better if my DH does it. I can do yard work, it just works better if DH does it. DH can cook, it just works better if I do it. I can take care of car maintenance (aka find a place to take care of it), it just works a lot better if DH does it (aka does it himself) and saves us money. I can do laundry, DH just happens to do it.
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2011 10:38:23 GMT -5
All I know is if I have to drag my ass out of bed and go to work my spouse has to as well. I'm not putting up with the SAHP lifestyle, period end of story. "And as hubby and most who know us would say, our house & lives would fall apart if I wasn't running everything behind the scenes as the SAHM." Kind of sad that your husband is so dependent on you do cook and clean for him and couldn't do these things himself. I do it all, cook, clean, laundry, shop, pay the bills, manage the finances and more. I prefer being a well rounded person and know that I can take care of myself. "To be honest, hubby wouldn't know how to order a pizza over hte phone, much less online if he was starving. He paid for the new washer & drier, but he stands and stares at it like it's a monster from Mars going "HUH?"." My point exactly. just sad a grown man can't do his own laundry or feed himself. It is called division of labor. My husband can pay bills, it just works better if I do it. I can clean, it just works better if my DH does it. I can do yard work, it just works better if DH does it. DH can cook, it just works better if I do it. I can take care of car maintenance (aka find a place to take care of it), it just works a lot better if DH does it (aka does it himself) and saves us money. I can do laundry, DH just happens to do it. Tada! I : wash the dishes make the bed Wash the clothes half the times Iron the clothes Usually cook 2-3 times a week Take care of the cars when I can do it on my own Do the groceries handle the finances My wife: cook most of the time wash the clothes the other half clean the house since she is somewhat OCD Wash the clothes the other half Do the groceries the other half when I don't get the chance Paid some bills etc. One of the benefits of being married vs being single is you get a partner with whom you can share duties or pick up the slack where you drop the ball
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 18, 2011 10:48:54 GMT -5
BTW, do you honestly think your wife is going to go back to work after having a baby?
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 18, 2011 10:49:49 GMT -5
Or that she is just telling you what she knows you want to hear?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2011 10:54:45 GMT -5
BTW, do you honestly think your wife is going to go back to work after having a baby? We will find out in 3 years won't we I love how you all decide that the husband/father has no say in it. Just bend down and agree to just take it. LOL ;D ;D My wife spend 6 years in undergrad/grad school and now studying/preparing to start a PhD program next year. Also let's not forget that she has a massive amount of student loans. Let's just say being a stay at home mom is not even up for negotiations.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 18, 2011 11:03:28 GMT -5
By YOU it isn't but from what you say about her, your odds seem to not be good.
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