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Post by bobbysgirl on May 17, 2011 19:21:45 GMT -5
We don't for sure, but I'd guess they aren't the type to pay for internet service. Probably not. And also the fact that I haven't seen too many threads about dumpster diving on YM. ;D LOL.They have internet.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 19:22:44 GMT -5
Cuz there aren't enough of their radical money saving tips on Smart Spending?
Although I could see Amy and SuziQ getting on quite nicely.
LOL.They have internet.
How do you know that?
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 17, 2011 19:56:01 GMT -5
OK, I have to jump in here because I am seeing repeated references to dumpster diving. For the record: Amy Dacykzcn did not force her children to dumpster dive. She did not promote dumpster diving. She was not a dumpster diver.
This is what she DID. Readers wrote in about various ways to save money. She researched them. All of them. She did detailed cost/benefit analysis to see whether/how much money was saved. When a reader wrote in about dumpster diving, she, gamely, gave it a try. She concluded that, while it was not an activity that she found particularly productive, it might be helpful to other people. That was the one and only time that she engaged in it.
Could we at least try to be factual about people we are disparaging?
I'll post later what she said about couponing. Gotta go make dinner.
PS She is a BIG fan of using the internet to save money.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 17, 2011 19:57:28 GMT -5
LOL.They have internet.
How do you know that?
Oh. Her online newsletter. Duh.
I can only blame the sleep deprivation. It's lucky I didn't have any significant work to do today...
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 17, 2011 20:01:06 GMT -5
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 17, 2011 20:08:44 GMT -5
I already reuse junk mail envelopes. I write my grocery lists and drug chain scenarios on the backside and tuck all the coupons that I plan to use inside.
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 17, 2011 20:13:17 GMT -5
I'll post later what she said about couponing. Gotta go make dinner. gardeninggrandma: ![](http://us.social.s-msn.com/s/images/emoticons/thumbs_up.gif) I would REALLY appreciate it because I am really shocked that she preferred PAYING for expired food rather than attempting to get non-expired food for free.
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Post by mtshastawriter on May 17, 2011 20:22:12 GMT -5
I swapped messages with Jim, Amy's DH, a while ago and they do have internet.
I find it interesting that relatives and others might believe we are abusing our children by having to live on a very low income, in a fairly LCOL area. What are people with ill relatives, children who need 24/7 care, etc... supposed to do?
Sometimes you just plain have to make do with what you have. I hope that's the lesson that my kids grow up having learned. Not all choices in life are those of your own choosing or preference. Sometimes shit happens. Then you deal with it and do the best you can with what you have to work with.
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 17, 2011 21:14:39 GMT -5
I find it interesting that relatives and others might believe we are abusing our children by having to live on a very low income, in a fairly LCOL area. What are people with ill relatives, children who need 24/7 care, etc... supposed to do? They don't have ill relatives, children who need 24/7 care, or etc., though do they? They're choosing this life for their kids so that they could stop working when he was 41 and she was 35. It's a bit different. I'm all for early retirement, but not if it came at the expense of providing for my kids. They obviously feel that their lifestyle isn't being lived at their kids expense. That's fine. It's a personal choice that we each make. And to be fair, they did the newsletter for another five or so years, so didn't truly retire until he was 45ish and she was 40.
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haapai
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Post by haapai on May 17, 2011 23:24:19 GMT -5
I'm sure that the initial plan was to save enough so the kids could go to college. Then the newsletter took off and the book offers came in and he was able to leave the Navy after 20 years without starting another career.
I can't convert a 1997 dollars into 2011 dollars in my head and don't know if it would be worth trying. Some of those 1997 dollars might actually be 1991 or even 1982 dollars. This article was definitely written in an era when being transparent about your finances was still a big no-no, even for tightwads.
I remember an awful lot of what you call impoverishing her kids from my own childhood and I was never poor. My mother had an extremely cavalier attitude toward food expiration dates and didn't believe in shelling out money to keep kids entertained. They were willing to pay half of any book that we wanted in the bookstore but if we wanted to go fishing we'd have to dig our own worms. I'm 42.
I don't remember seeing that obsessive child-enrichment culture (sports, lessons, SAT prep, application stuffing etc.) take off until the mid-nineties. It was taking off in affluent and urban areas sooner, but it took a bit longer to reach the sticks (and the folks who lived in non-stick-built homes).
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Sum Dum Gai
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Post by Sum Dum Gai on May 18, 2011 1:23:18 GMT -5
I'm sure that the initial plan was to save enough so the kids could go to college. Then the newsletter took off and the book offers came in and he was able to leave the Navy after 20 years without starting another career. He retired before the newsletter took off though. He retired in 91. The newsletter took off later. Their initial plan was apparently to just make it work on his $14k pension. I don't care how frugal you are, there's no way in hell you're paying for six college educations on that income.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on May 18, 2011 7:29:16 GMT -5
They're living the Good Life on $17580 a year
Everyone can do their own thing and it doens't bother me. I know there are people this poor and of course you can do it. What I object to is calling it the "good life". A lot of words come to mind to describe it but the good life aren't one of them.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 18, 2011 9:06:19 GMT -5
What I object to is calling it the "good life". A lot of words come to mind to describe it but the good life aren't one of them.
Well, I didn't call it "The Good Life"... That was the title of the magazine article. They probably were referring to a couple that managed (on less than $40K/yr) to pay off a beautiful home, send 6 kids to college for 4 years each, and retire in their 40's with enough money to last them the rest of their lives...
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 18, 2011 9:16:28 GMT -5
What I object to is calling it the "good life". A lot of words come to mind to describe it but the good life aren't one of them. Well, I didn't call it "The Good Life"... That was the title of the magazine article. They probably were referring to a couple that managed (on less than $40K/yr) to pay off a beautiful home, send 6 kids to college for 4 years each, and retire in their 40's with enough money to last them the rest of their lives... Where's the info from her books on her take on using coupons?
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 18, 2011 9:17:10 GMT -5
They're living the Good Life on $17580 a year Everyone can do their own thing and it doens't bother me. I know there are people this poor and of course you can do it. What I object to is calling it the "good life". A lot of words come to mind to describe it but the good life aren't one of them. I was thinking the EXACT same thing. ![:o](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/shocked.png)
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 18, 2011 9:55:37 GMT -5
What I object to is calling it the "good life". A lot of words come to mind to describe it but the good life aren't one of them. Well, I didn't call it "The Good Life"... That was the title of the magazine article. They probably were referring to a couple that managed (on less than $40K/yr) to pay off a beautiful home, send 6 kids to college for 4 years each, and retire in their 40's with enough money to last them the rest of their lives... Where's the info from her books on her take on using coupons? This is from memory-I don't have the book right now. Basically she said that she had no problems with coupons, but that because they were generally for name brands (which she didn't purchase) and for ready to eat/processed foods (which she purchaeqs very little of), she felt she could do better on her own. She was referring to the use of coupons as a way to lower food costs. Because of her large family, the cost of food was one of the largest expenses. She did save a lot growing their own veggies and fruits. I think she added that using coupons might help someone save if they wanted the name brands.
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2011 9:57:06 GMT -5
I'd love to know what their minimum income requirements would be now with the same family - it's almost a decade later and food prices have really gone up. A lot of food banks have gotten reduced shipments from the gov't and other places.
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HoneyBBQ
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Post by HoneyBBQ on May 18, 2011 10:31:13 GMT -5
Regarding her not using coupons, I believe she also said it was difficult to get multiple coupons and the stores in her area didn't double. She had some sort of chart that gave examples of what it would cost to make something like a cake. She showed how much it would cost if she bought a cake mix on sale, with a coupon, vs how much it would cost to bake it from scratch. Her examples always showed it was cheaper to bake from scratch. She also had her staff taste test the store bought mixes vs homemade and of course homemade won. Not surprised. Despite high food prices for many items - basic goods such as flour, sugar, rice, eggs are still very cheap. Especially in bulk. Even butter and milk are reasonable if you buy in large quantities (like Costco). And handmade is ALWAYS better than something that comes in a box. If it's not - you're doing something wrong.
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Post by mtshastawriter on May 18, 2011 10:41:27 GMT -5
The "Tightwad Gazette" was published in the late 1980s early 1990s. (I was a subscriber at the ripe age of about 20) Jim retired and actually then helped Amy with the newsletter. IMHO they did exactly what they set-out to do and managed to find a good way to do it. They earned a boat-load of cash and then "retired" to live their lives together.
I think people have a "right" to retire at whatever age they want to, as long as they can support themselves. This does not make them lazy; it makes them smart. There is so much more to life than working..... However, in our society we don't seem to really value that much anymore. No one has any idea how long they have to live, why spend all of your life working and then drop dead?
When the dust settled, they did send all of their kids to college - paying cash. What else is a mandatory requirement of good parenthood and responsible working adulthood?
I have a son who very badly needs braces. I can't afford them. Is this some form of abuse now if I can't get them for him? When did this shift happen in our country where every kid needs/gets the latest and greatest or parents are not raising their children correctly?
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 18, 2011 10:42:52 GMT -5
Regarding her not using coupons, I believe she also said it was difficult to get multiple coupons and the stores in her area didn't double. She had some sort of chart that gave examples of what it would cost to make something like a cake. She showed how much it would cost if she bought a cake mix on sale, with a coupon, vs how much it would cost to bake it from scratch. Her examples always showed it was cheaper to bake from scratch. She also had her staff taste test the store bought mixes vs homemade and of course homemade won.
Thanks for that add'l info. I do recall that she was pretty much into cooking from scratch.
One thing she did that really impressed me was the very detailed cost/benefit analysis. She factored in everything: time, gas, materials and came up with a labor value. She concluded that, for her, some things saved enough to be worth the effort (cooking from scratch, for example) and some did not. But she never said that everyone should follow her example. She was all about making information available to her readers - who were looking for creative ways to save money.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 18, 2011 10:43:18 GMT -5
Is this some form of abuse now if I can't get them for himThere was a whole thread on this back on the old YM. The general consensus seemed to be yes. ![???](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/huh.png)
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on May 18, 2011 10:48:26 GMT -5
mtshasta- if you refused to work so you could live your dream and couldn't afford those braces, I would say you're an irresponsible parent, bordering on neglect.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on May 18, 2011 10:50:13 GMT -5
I do recall that she had a "buy" price for certain things. I think it was .07/oz for cereal. If she could get it for that (or less) she would (and she'd stock up). I still have my own "buy" price for cereal. (DH has one favorite brand). When I can get an 18 oz box for $2 or less (with or without a coupon) I'll buy it (and, yes, I'll buy quite a bit). Also, soda. I buy it for the grandkids. My "buy" price used to be .18/can, but I've had to raise it to .20/can. The stores will run a "special"... buy 2 get three free, but sometimes they will raise the price so that when you figure out the unit price, it will be .25/can. No, thanks. Usually around the holidays, they will have really good sales on soda and I can get it for .20/can or less.
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 18, 2011 11:19:17 GMT -5
Regarding her not using coupons, I believe she also said it was difficult to get multiple coupons and the stores in her area didn't double. She had some sort of chart that gave examples of what it would cost to make something like a cake. She showed how much it would cost if she bought a cake mix on sale, with a coupon, vs how much it would cost to bake it from scratch. Her examples always showed it was cheaper to bake from scratch. She also had her staff taste test the store bought mixes vs homemade and of course homemade won. I know that she made a lot from scratch which is more healthy, but I can tell from the little that I read that they also ate a lot of outdated PROCESSED foods - the red and green marshmallows come to mind. I don't remember what they paid, but it was more than the $.25/bag clearance price I saw at Target in the week or two following Christmas for a FRESH product. Getting a source(s) for multiple coupons does take a little time, but it is not THAT difficult if you put your mind to it. A lot of the gals on the Grocery Challenge get them from family, friends, or neighbors that do not use coupons and in exchange give them something that they have been able to get for free - and the donor is more than happy with the exchange. Even if all you do is invest in buying a couple of newspapers, you will still come out ahead even WITHOUT double coupons (which I myself do not have). It sounds to me as though regular COUPONING as a way to save money was something that she might not have ACTUALLY tried especially considering the fact that her family did eat processed foods; or maybe she tried it for a very short time - not long enough to really perfect the skill. I have a grocery outlet in my town and they do not take coupons. Some of the foods (especially dairy) are outdated or very soon to be outdated (which is okay cuz you can take it home and freeze it). I see people loading up their carts thinking that everything in the store must be a deal when in fact it is not. A large can of enchilada sauce for $.39 was a good deal. A large jar of bread and butter pickles for $.29 was a good deal. A box of brown sugar for $.99 was not a good deal. If you don't know rock bottom prices (which you would not if those are the only stores that you shop at), you are going to get great deals on a couple of things and pay too much for most everything else. And I have to say that A LOT of the aisles in those stores are JUNK FOOD - off the wall cookies, candy, chips, sugary cereals, and sugary drinks.
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Post by bobbysgirl on May 18, 2011 11:23:57 GMT -5
Cuz there aren't enough of their radical money saving tips on Smart Spending? Although I could see Amy and SuziQ getting on quite nicely. LOL.They have internet. How do you know that? Amy told me she goes on it every day. She has her fav frugal sites too.
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cael
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Post by cael on May 18, 2011 11:27:06 GMT -5
I haven't read this entire thread, but. My mother had a real lady boner for this woman and read the Tightwad Gazette religiously when I was a kid. I think this is a little extreme... I dunno. I agree with thinking calling this "the good life" isn't quite right.
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 18, 2011 11:30:52 GMT -5
I do recall that she had a "buy" price for certain things. I think it was .07/oz for cereal. If she could get it for that (or less) she would (and she'd stock up). I still have my own "buy" price for cereal. (DH has one favorite brand). When I can get an 18 oz box for $2 or less (with or without a coupon) I'll buy it (and, yes, I'll buy quite a bit). Also, soda. I buy it for the grandkids. My "buy" price used to be .18/can, but I've had to raise it to .20/can. The stores will run a "special"... buy 2 get three free, but sometimes they will raise the price so that when you figure out the unit price, it will be .25/can. No, thanks. Usually around the holidays, they will have really good sales on soda and I can get it for .20/can or less. In the last two years, yes, they will have soda at a very good price for Memorial Day, July 4th, and Labor Day; but the absolute cheapest price (so far) has been in anticipation of the Super Bowl at CVS. Get (6) 12-packs for $20 and get a $10EB back = $.14/can. And the limit on the deal was (2) per card so you could get (12) 12-packs. I was thrilled that they were out of the Pepsi Cherry so I got a rain check and waited to buy it until a coupon came out that made the deal even sweeter and picked them up for even less. Just another little couponing trick of the trade. ;D
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 18, 2011 11:34:14 GMT -5
Where's the info from her books on her take on using coupons? This is from memory-I don't have the book right now. Basically she said that she had no problems with coupons, but that because they were generally for name brands (which she didn't purchase) and for ready to eat/processed foods (which she purchaeqs very little of), she felt she could do better on her own. She was referring to the use of coupons as a way to lower food costs. Because of her large family, the cost of food was one of the largest expenses. She did save a lot growing their own veggies and fruits. I think she added that using coupons might help someone save if they wanted the name brands. Waiting for a rock bottom sale and combining with a coupon on a name brand product is ALWAYS cheaper than buying a generic.
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on May 18, 2011 11:37:46 GMT -5
Cuz there aren't enough of their radical money saving tips on Smart Spending? Although I could see Amy and SuziQ getting on quite nicely. I don't know about that. SuziQ is A LOT more like me than she is like Amy. I'm sure she would applaud Amy for SOME of the things that she is willing to do to save money, but I don't think that she would do most of them herself. Again, I could be wrong.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 18, 2011 11:38:38 GMT -5
The thing that still bothers me is that they retired on $14k a year. Again, it's nice for them that it worked out to get the windfalls that made it possible to pay their kids' college and raise their standard of living to $17k a year (if that's what happened) but it didn't have to happen that way. In fact, it very easily could have gone the opposite way, with something REALLY BAD happening to their family that forced one or both parents to go back to work - only without any current job skills. And had that happened, they couldn't have paid for anyone's college education. They'd have been lucky to afford their mortgage.
So call it whatever you like, but they took an enormous risk with six children and as far as I'm concerned, they're not all that smart just really damn lucky.
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