Article about white supremacists arrested on route to Pride

[raeoflyte]

I was going to post this is current events but my commentary isn't so much about the article as what it brings up for me. Thread can of course be moved if needed.


I'm feeling really defeated. My first pride parade was 1998 in NYC. It was before dh transitioned and we had only been out a year. We didn't even really know anyone else who was queer. I had just graduated high-school and we went on a school theater trip to New York. Our last day we were free to go out on our own which just happened to coincide with Pride. Our tour guide pulled us aside and gave us directions to take the subway to the village to watch the parade. We walked out of the subway station, and I swear it was 4 miles of d.y.k.e.s on bikes. It was like being in another world.

We've never been back to NY, but we found our place at home. Joined the lgbtq group at college and made friends. Eventually dh transitioned. We always go to pride here and bring the kids now. It's important to us, its always a great time and it exposes the kids to queer culture outside of us which is a little wonky since societally we are viewed and treated as a straight couple.

We've always had pretty good interactions. My last year of high-school was hard when I realized that many of my friends were actually awful behind my back, and a few random encounters that were nerve wracking. But We've always been out at work, open with the kids and encourage them to tell or not tell as they feel comfortable with their peers and we talk about it/us as it comes up in straight circles.

When we could finally legally be married in 2012 I was happy but cautious. Figured we'd take advantage of it while we could. But since then I got really comfortable. I felt like things had changed. I felt safe. God damnit I really did. I feel stupid for letting myself get so comfortable. I'm pissed off and want to give a big fuck you to the entire world. And I'm just completely utterly exhausted and hopeless. I don't want to fight for my right to just be ignored. That's all I want is to be ignored as a non-issue. Live my life, raise my kids.

I need to find something to do to make me feel like we can make things better, but I have no idea what that is. I'll still go to pride this year and bring my kids, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't nervous, and I've never felt that way in almost 25 years. We're going backwards.


www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61773358

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I hear you.  While I am not queer myself a lot of my HS friends were.  I remember vividly in HS when a friend of mine came out how the senior LBGTQ kids talked to him about the risks involved of being out and how the un-stated rule was you could be gay but not TOO gay.  Something as simple as giving your SO a kiss on the cheek made you fair game.  Meanwhile there were straight couples regularly outright necking in the hallway.

Now Gwen can join an LBGTQ+ club in middle school.  So far I have not heard any whispers of parents trying to get rid of it but I imagine they are coming.  

It scares me that my friends and children Gwen's age are back to having to be afraid for being themselves in the way that my friends back in the late 90s did.  I still remember Matthew Shephard.

I feel powerless as well.  I know that I can vote but a liberal vote in Iowa doesn't mean jack shit anymore.  It is disheartening because Iowa was the 3rd state to ratify gay marriage.  Now we're trying to ban books and want cameras installed in classrooms so you can see if your kid is learning anything "icky" and get the teacher fired.

[billisonboard]

Counterpoint:

Isn't it amazing that in a smaller town in the state of Idaho that the police stepped in and arrested this group prior to them doing anything to disrupt the community celebration. 

[Tennesseer]

Jun 14, 2022 11:05:40 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Counterpoint:

Isn't it amazing that in a smaller town in the state of Idaho that the police stepped in and arrested this group prior to them doing anything to disrupt the community celebration. 

I am also pleased that someone who saw something said something.

[azucena]

Rae - thank you for speaking up.  I learn something from you every time you share your lifestory.  I didn't realize you and your DH got together that young.  I'm sorry that the world hasn't evolved as much as it seems.

[tractor]

I still can't figure out why people care, are they really that afraid someone might "turn" them gay? I have many gay friends, and have yet to decide that women no longer appeal to me.

So, this is not very helpful, but there is a bunch of us out here who still believe people can do what they want with their lives. I think those that oppose it the most are also the most insecure in their own sexual identity.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Jun 14, 2022 11:11:17 GMT -5 tractor said:

I still can't figure out why people care, are they really that afraid someone might "turn" them gay? I have many gay friends, and have yet to decide that women no longer appeal to me.

I've never understood this either.  It makes no sense.  What are people so damn afraid of?

My oldest son is gay and I struggle with it a lot. Not because I care about his sexuality at all (I was never really thrilled with the idea of daughter in-laws anyhow), but because I worry about how some people will treat him because of it. Its hard knowing your kid is going to go through life as a target for psycho hate groups.

[Deleted]

…I felt like things had changed. I felt safe. God damnit I really did. I feel stupid for letting myself get so comfortable. I'm pissed off and want to give a big fuck you to the entire world. And I'm just completely utterly exhausted and hopeless. I don't want to fight for my right to just be ignored. That's all I want is to be ignored as a non-issue. Live my life, raise my kids.

I completely understand.

You and you DH are not alone. There are millions of us straight people that also want you to be safe, comfortable and able to live your lives in peace. That won’t stop the nuts from being nuts, but there is strength in numbers and together we can hopefully make it clear to the nuts that we will not tolerate discrimination and harming people because of their sexuality. I genuinely don’t understand why so many people care so much about other people’s personal business anyway.
I’m really sorry you are feeling the way you do.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Jun 14, 2022 11:11:17 GMT -5 tractor said:

I still can't figure out why people care, are they really that afraid someone might "turn" them gay? I have many gay friends, and have yet to decide that women no longer appeal to me.

So, this is not very helpful, but there is a bunch of us out here who still believe people can do what they want with their lives. I think those that oppose it the most are also the most insecure in their own sexual identity.

Sometimes I wonder if it is because they themselves are and have been school their whole life that it is wrong.  If someone is openly out and proud it forces them to question everything they know.

And like it or not with everything else there is privilege attached to being straight.  That's the drum the Republican platform is beating right now.  You can't tell yourself  your gay coworker was only promoted to fill a quota if the playing field is level.  You can't count on him possibly getting fired because he's gay and you slide right in.

You might actually be judged on your merits, which we claim in this country is what we want.  Which may mean your merits aren't as hot as you like to think. You're going to have to face the fact you are a medicore POS who has been coasting comfortable on society's biases this entire time*   

*I don't think everyone believe this I am specifically talking about those subset of people who cry about quotas and "wokeness" whenever it is isn't a person in their approved categories getting whatever it is they are bitching about.   I've been following it right now in regards to the new Star Wars Kenobi series. 

JFC people. Their heads may explode when they realize James Earl Jones, the voice of Vader is black. 

And now there is also uproar over the Buzz Lightyear movie because there is an LBGTQ character in it.  Yet none of them noticed Rupaul was a snail in Bubble Guppies. 

[bean29]

Jun 14, 2022 11:36:55 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jun 14, 2022 11:11:17 GMT -5 tractor said:

I still can't figure out why people care, are they really that afraid someone might "turn" them gay? I have many gay friends, and have yet to decide that women no longer appeal to me.

I've never understood this either.  It makes no sense.  What are people so damn afraid of?

My oldest son is gay and I struggle with it a lot. Not because I care about his sexuality at all (I was never really thrilled with the idea of daughter in-laws anyhow), but because I worry about how some people will treat him because of it. Its hard knowing your kid is going to go through life as a target for psycho hate groups.

I did not realize your oldest was Gay. I am still somewhat unsure if that many people really object or if those that object have intimidated everyone else into silence because they threaten violence if you do not comply.

I always understood that Minneapolis had a thriving Gay community. Hopefully your son will be safe there. I have a cousin who is a lesbian and she and her partner have lived there for nearly 30 years without issue.

I wish this pushback was not an issue. I have a nephew that came out about 5 years ago. When DD asked me if her Dad’s family would accept him, I said yes, my DH had told me he had 3 cousins that were gay. One of them, was asked by her Grandpa (maybe in the 90’s) when she was going to have children, she said “Grandpa, I’m never going to have Children, I am Gay”. My BIL had not heard that story. My nephew came to a family party on his way to a pride event dressed in a tutu. We will not suddenly become anti/gay because some religious nuts threaten us with violence, and unlike me, several family members will be willing to engage in violence if threatened.

I told DD the worst thing is not my child being Gay, the worst is they feel unloved/unaccepted and commit suicide. I don’t care how others love, I just worry about me and my own relationship.

[stillmovingforward]

Jun 14, 2022 11:36:55 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jun 14, 2022 11:11:17 GMT -5 tractor said:

I still can't figure out why people care, are they really that afraid someone might "turn" them gay? I have many gay friends, and have yet to decide that women no longer appeal to me.

I've never understood this either.  It makes no sense.  What are people so damn afraid of?

My oldest son is gay and I struggle with it a lot. Not because I care about his sexuality at all (I was never really thrilled with the idea of daughter in-laws anyhow), but because I worry about how some people will treat him because of it. Its hard knowing your kid is going to go through life as a target for psycho hate groups.

Feel free to PM me. My DS1 is also gay and in a tech field and only a bit older than your DS. So, we've been in your shoes.

[raeoflyte]

Jun 14, 2022 11:36:55 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jun 14, 2022 11:11:17 GMT -5 tractor said:

I still can't figure out why people care, are they really that afraid someone might "turn" them gay? I have many gay friends, and have yet to decide that women no longer appeal to me.

I've never understood this either.  It makes no sense.  What are people so damn afraid of?

My oldest son is gay and I struggle with it a lot. Not because I care about his sexuality at all (I was never really thrilled with the idea of daughter in-laws anyhow), but because I worry about how some people will treat him because of it. Its hard knowing your kid is going to go through life as a target for psycho hate groups.

I totally get it. Every story dd writes has lesbian characters. It stops my heart, of course not because I am upset by it. I just wanted her life to be easier.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Jun 14, 2022 11:36:55 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jun 14, 2022 11:11:17 GMT -5 tractor said:

I still can't figure out why people care, are they really that afraid someone might "turn" them gay? I have many gay friends, and have yet to decide that women no longer appeal to me.

My oldest son is gay and I struggle with it a lot. Not because I care about his sexuality at all (I was never really thrilled with the idea of daughter in-laws anyhow), but because I worry about how some people will treat him because of it. Its hard knowing your kid is going to go through life as a target for psycho hate groups.

Gwen has talked with me about her sexuality and stuff.   I would kill anyone who tried to harm her with my bare hands but I had to stop myself from giving the same speech that my friend got back in HS from our peers.  It really upset me that the world is such that I feel the need for that lecture still exists. 

[TheOtherMe]

I have many gay and lesbian friends.   I don't care who a person loves.  I do care if they are taunted, hated, etc. for who they love.

I have heard my generation of cousins talk about my 2nd cousin and his partner.  It isn't pretty.  

I also saw a friend of mine, the little boy who grew up next door to me, write really hateful stuff on FB.  I am still in shock over that.

Each person needs to let people love who they want and be who they are.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Jun 14, 2022 12:27:36 GMT -5 TheOtherMe said:

I have many gay and lesbian friends.   I don't care who a person loves.  I do care if they are taunted, hated, etc. for who they love.

I have heard my generation of cousins talk about my 2nd cousin and his partner.  It isn't pretty.  

I also saw a friend of mine, the little boy who grew up next door to me, write really hateful stuff on FB.  I am still in shock over that.

Each person needs to let people love who they want and be who they are.

I was surprised at how a portion of DH's family reacted when their son came out as gay.  I've only met the kid twice since we got together.  It was so obvious I had no idea he was still in the closet.

Now I know why.  Upon thinking about it though sadly the reaction did make sense, his family is pretty damn conservative.  They are just the smart ones who don't say openly hateful stuff to your face.  They say the type of stuff that flies under the radar and has you asking yourself if you misunderstood.

I've been really sad about how my mom keeps consuming a diet of Fox News and is becoming quite intolerant, especially since my parents if need be were willing to be safe haven for my friends in HS.  I don't understand how you do the mental gymnastics needed to do a total 180 like that.

It worries me that maybe the people I thought would be supportive of my kids won't be as supportive as I originally thought.

[minnesotapaintlady]

Jun 14, 2022 12:16:52 GMT -5 bean29 said:

Jun 14, 2022 11:36:55 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

I've never understood this either.  It makes no sense.  What are people so damn afraid of?

My oldest son is gay and I struggle with it a lot. Not because I care about his sexuality at all (I was never really thrilled with the idea of daughter in-laws anyhow), but because I worry about how some people will treat him because of it. Its hard knowing your kid is going to go through life as a target for psycho hate groups.

I did not realize your oldest was Gay. I am still somewhat unsure if that many people really object or if those that object have intimidated everyone else into silence because they threaten violence if you do not comply.

I always understood that Minneapolis had a thriving Gay community. Hopefully your son will be safe there. I have a cousin who is a lesbian and she and her partner have lived there for nearly 30 years without issue.

I wish this pushback was not an issue. I have a nephew that came out about 5 years ago. When DD asked me if her Dad’s family would accept him, I said yes, my DH had told me he had 3 cousins that were gay. One of them, was asked by her Grandpa (maybe in the 90’s) when she was going to have children, she said “Grandpa, I’m never going to have Children, I am Gay”. My BIL had not heard that story. My nephew came to a family party on his way to a pride event dressed in a tutu. We will not suddenly become anti/gay because some religious nuts threaten us with violence, and unlike me, several family members will be willing to engage in violence if threatened.

I told DD the worst thing is not my child being Gay, the worst is they feel unloved/unaccepted and commit suicide. I don’t care how others love, I just worry about me and my own relationship.

Well, he just told me freshman year of college when home for Christmas break, so I'm still processing...it's taking me awhile.  It was kind of a What?  Really?  Are you sure?  And I think I'm still mostly at that stage. Plus, I mostly just post about stuff he does that drives me nuts.

But, it does shine some light on why he chose Minneapolis over Ames despite being uncomfortable about moving to a big city. He loves it there now though, and I think for the most part his generation is quite accepting of everyone.

I still worry.  Like, how will his brother accept it when he finally comes out to him?  Ex 2.0 is homophobic with a capital H.  I'm sure he is filling Carrot up with his opinions on the subject when he's with him.

[giramomma]

Jun 14, 2022 11:57:03 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

You and you DH are not alone. There are millions of us straight people that also want you to be safe, comfortable and able to live your lives in peace. That won’t stop the nuts from being nuts, but there is strength in numbers and together we can hopefully make it clear to the nuts that we will not tolerate discrimination and harming people because of their sexuality. I genuinely don’t understand why so many people care so much about other people’s personal business anyway.

Because it is truly easier to judge other people than it is to just take care of your own shit.

Focusing on ourselves, making sure we're the best possible version of ourselves, and doing meaningful things with our time...It's hard. It's so hard.

Much easier to be passive consumers of whatever thoughts have been to fed to us.

The flip side is if a person doesn't have a meaningful life, there isn't much for the person to talk about. So, then what does the person talk/think about? Whatever is being fed to him or her...

ETA: I also wonder how much the judgement is about really getting pissed off at others, for living their best, authentic lives?

[tallguy]

I like the story about the Utah mom whose son was arrested.  She offered him a choice to drop out of Patriot Front or be kicked out of the house.  He said he couldn't drop Patriot Front  She told him, "Well, I guess you made your choice."  She kicked him out, and is going to continue speaking out so that the group (who prefers privacy) might finally drop her son because his mom has a big mouth.  

[bean29]

Jun 14, 2022 13:05:42 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jun 14, 2022 12:16:52 GMT -5 bean29 said:

I did not realize your oldest was Gay. I am still somewhat unsure if that many people really object or if those that object have intimidated everyone else into silence because they threaten violence if you do not comply.

I always understood that Minneapolis had a thriving Gay community. Hopefully your son will be safe there. I have a cousin who is a lesbian and she and her partner have lived there for nearly 30 years without issue.

I wish this pushback was not an issue. I have a nephew that came out about 5 years ago. When DD asked me if her Dad’s family would accept him, I said yes, my DH had told me he had 3 cousins that were gay. One of them, was asked by her Grandpa (maybe in the 90’s) when she was going to have children, she said “Grandpa, I’m never going to have Children, I am Gay”. My BIL had not heard that story. My nephew came to a family party on his way to a pride event dressed in a tutu. We will not suddenly become anti/gay because some religious nuts threaten us with violence, and unlike me, several family members will be willing to engage in violence if threatened.

I told DD the worst thing is not my child being Gay, the worst is they feel unloved/unaccepted and commit suicide. I don’t care how others love, I just worry about me and my own relationship.

Well, he just told me freshman year of college when home for Christmas break, so I'm still processing...it's taking me awhile.  It was kind of a What?  Really?  Are you sure?  And I think I'm still mostly at that stage. Plus, I mostly just post about stuff he does that drives me nuts.

But, it does shine some light on why he chose Minneapolis over Ames despite being uncomfortable about moving to a big city. He loves it there now though, and I think for the most part his generation is quite accepting of everyone.

I still worry.  Like, how will his brother accept it when he finally comes out to him?  Ex 2.0 is homophobic with a capital H.  I'm sure he is filling Carrot up with his opinions on the subject when he's with him.

My DD is 25. She and her friends are very accepting. My SIL seems to have been pulled in by trump, but her boys were raised with my DN, and one of her best friends from HS was gay too. I just keep telling myself she is not suddenly going to become anti-gay.

I also saw an article this am saying that the republicans have pulled in so many non-traditional R supporters that they are going to have to become more mainstream if they want to keep them. Hopefully they will pull away from the extremists.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Jun 14, 2022 13:05:42 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jun 14, 2022 12:16:52 GMT -5 bean29 said:

I did not realize your oldest was Gay. I am still somewhat unsure if that many people really object or if those that object have intimidated everyone else into silence because they threaten violence if you do not comply.

I always understood that Minneapolis had a thriving Gay community. Hopefully your son will be safe there. I have a cousin who is a lesbian and she and her partner have lived there for nearly 30 years without issue.

I wish this pushback was not an issue. I have a nephew that came out about 5 years ago. When DD asked me if her Dad’s family would accept him, I said yes, my DH had told me he had 3 cousins that were gay. One of them, was asked by her Grandpa (maybe in the 90’s) when she was going to have children, she said “Grandpa, I’m never going to have Children, I am Gay”. My BIL had not heard that story. My nephew came to a family party on his way to a pride event dressed in a tutu. We will not suddenly become anti/gay because some religious nuts threaten us with violence, and unlike me, several family members will be willing to engage in violence if threatened.

I told DD the worst thing is not my child being Gay, the worst is they feel unloved/unaccepted and commit suicide. I don’t care how others love, I just worry about me and my own relationship.

Well, he just told me freshman year of college when home for Christmas break, so I'm still processing...it's taking me awhile.  It was kind of a What?  Really?  Are you sure?  And I think I'm still mostly at that stage. Plus, I mostly just post about stuff he does that drives me nuts.

But, it does shine some light on why he chose Minneapolis over Ames despite being uncomfortable about moving to a big city. He loves it there now though, and I think for the most part his generation is quite accepting of everyone.

I still worry.  Like, how will his brother accept it when he finally comes out to him?  Ex 2.0 is homophobic with a capital H.  I'm sure he is filling Carrot up with his opinions on the subject when he's with him.

Since he grew up with his big brother he may be more accepting than he thought. It's a lot harder to generate and keep boogeymen alive when you have someone right in front of you that challenges it.

Hence why the OP wants things like Drag Queen story time banned.

I would be prepared for a shit load of questions from Carrot though and think through how you and his brother (if willing) are going to address them.  Cause from what you have talked about in regards to Ex 2.0 I imagine there are going to be some doozies.   

[djAdvocate]

Jun 14, 2022 10:49:12 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

I was going to post this is current events but my commentary isn't so much about the article as what it brings up for me. Thread can of course be moved if needed.


I'm feeling really defeated. My first pride parade was 1998 in NYC. It was before dh transitioned and we had only been out a year. We didn't even really know anyone else who was queer. I had just graduated high-school and we went on a school theater trip to New York. Our last day we were free to go out on our own which just happened to coincide with Pride. Our tour guide pulled us aside and gave us directions to take the subway to the village to watch the parade. We walked out of the subway station, and I swear it was 4 miles of d.y.k.e.s on bikes. It was like being in another world.

We've never been back to NY, but we found our place at home. Joined the lgbtq group at college and made friends. Eventually dh transitioned. We always go to pride here and bring the kids now. It's important to us, its always a great time and it exposes the kids to queer culture outside of us which is a little wonky since societally we are viewed and treated as a straight couple.

We've always had pretty good interactions. My last year of high-school was hard when I realized that many of my friends were actually awful behind my back, and a few random encounters that were nerve wracking. But We've always been out at work, open with the kids and encourage them to tell or not tell as they feel comfortable with their peers and we talk about it/us as it comes up in straight circles.

When we could finally legally be married in 2012 I was happy but cautious. Figured we'd take advantage of it while we could. But since then I got really comfortable. I felt like things had changed. I felt safe. God damnit I really did. I feel stupid for letting myself get so comfortable. I'm pissed off and want to give a big fuck you to the entire world. And I'm just completely utterly exhausted and hopeless. I don't want to fight for my right to just be ignored. That's all I want is to be ignored as a non-issue. Live my life, raise my kids.

I need to find something to do to make me feel like we can make things better, but I have no idea what that is. I'll still go to pride this year and bring my kids, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't nervous, and I've never felt that way in almost 25 years. We're going backwards.


www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61773358

i don't have words of comfort to offer right now.  the next three years will tell you a lot about how things are likely to go.  but if liberals can prevail, this will just be another one of those moments that we would rather forget, but always remember.

[swamp]

Jun 14, 2022 11:57:48 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Jun 14, 2022 11:11:17 GMT -5 tractor said:

I still can't figure out why people care, are they really that afraid someone might "turn" them gay? I have many gay friends, and have yet to decide that women no longer appeal to me.

So, this is not very helpful, but there is a bunch of us out here who still believe people can do what they want with their lives. I think those that oppose it the most are also the most insecure in their own sexual identity.

Sometimes I wonder if it is because they themselves are and have been school their whole life that it is wrong.  If someone is openly out and proud it forces them to question everything they know.

And like it or not with everything else there is privilege attached to being straight.  That's the drum the Republican platform is beating right now.  You can't tell yourself  your gay coworker was only promoted to fill a quota if the playing field is level.  You can't count on him possibly getting fired because he's gay and you slide right in.

You might actually be judged on your merits, which we claim in this country is what we want.  Which may mean your merits aren't as hot as you like to think. You're going to have to face the fact you are a medicore POS who has been coasting comfortable on society's biases this entire time*   

*I don't think everyone believe this I am specifically talking about those subset of people who cry about quotas and "wokeness" whenever it is isn't a person in their approved categories getting whatever it is they are bitching about.   I've been following it right now in regards to the new Star Wars Kenobi series. 

JFC people. Their heads may explode when they realize James Earl Jones, the voice of Vader is black. 

And now there is also uproar over the Buzz Lightyear movie because there is an LBGTQ character in it.  Yet none of them noticed Rupaul was a snail in Bubble Guppies. 

I think there would be a similar explosion if they stopped and thought really really really hard about Lando Calrissian.  

[swamp]

Rae, I'm so sorry this is happening. 

I do, however, have hope for the younger generation.  My kids are teens, and as far as I can tell, most of them don't give a rat's patootie about sexual orientation.  

[billisonboard]

Jun 14, 2022 14:01:20 GMT -5 swamp said:

Rae, I'm so sorry this is happening. 

I do, however, have hope for the younger generation.  My kids are teens, and as far as I can tell, most of them don't give a rat's patootie about sexual orientation.  

Unfortunately

Members of Patriot Front are "comparatively young," Strzok said. link

[djAdvocate]

Jun 14, 2022 14:01:20 GMT -5 swamp said:

Rae, I'm so sorry this is happening. 

I do, however, have hope for the younger generation.  My kids are teens, and as far as I can tell, most of them don't give a rat's patootie about sexual orientation.  

gender fluidity is fully embraced by my son and his peers.
i am pretty confident that what we are seeing is LARGELY the dying breath of old farts.
but lord knows how clingy such folks (and their ideas) can be.

[Deleted]

Jun 14, 2022 13:05:42 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Jun 14, 2022 12:16:52 GMT -5 bean29 said:

I did not realize your oldest was Gay. I am still somewhat unsure if that many people really object or if those that object have intimidated everyone else into silence because they threaten violence if you do not comply.

I always understood that Minneapolis had a thriving Gay community. Hopefully your son will be safe there. I have a cousin who is a lesbian and she and her partner have lived there for nearly 30 years without issue.

I wish this pushback was not an issue. I have a nephew that came out about 5 years ago. When DD asked me if her Dad’s family would accept him, I said yes, my DH had told me he had 3 cousins that were gay. One of them, was asked by her Grandpa (maybe in the 90’s) when she was going to have children, she said “Grandpa, I’m never going to have Children, I am Gay”. My BIL had not heard that story. My nephew came to a family party on his way to a pride event dressed in a tutu. We will not suddenly become anti/gay because some religious nuts threaten us with violence, and unlike me, several family members will be willing to engage in violence if threatened.

I told DD the worst thing is not my child being Gay, the worst is they feel unloved/unaccepted and commit suicide. I don’t care how others love, I just worry about me and my own relationship.

Well, he just told me freshman year of college when home for Christmas break, so I'm still processing...it's taking me awhile.  It was kind of a What?  Really?  Are you sure?  And I think I'm still mostly at that stage. Plus, I mostly just post about stuff he does that drives me nuts.

But, it does shine some light on why he chose Minneapolis over Ames despite being uncomfortable about moving to a big city. He loves it there now though, and I think for the most part his generation is quite accepting of everyone.

I still worry.  Like, how will his brother accept it when he finally comes out to him?  Ex 2.0 is homophobic with a capital H.  I'm sure he is filling Carrot up with his opinions on the subject when he's with him.

As far as I recall, I’ve only said it here once, that my son is gay.

DD had been telling me he was, and I finally took him outside on the patio (for privacy) and asked him point blank. He mentioned that day a couple years ago and told me how he was so afraid of how I might react and how after we finished talking I hugged him and asked him “now what you want for dinner” and how much he loved me for that. 

Like you, I was and still am afraid of how other people would treat him and that somebody might try to harm him just because he’s gay.

Most of my family feels some type of way about gay people though. They understand not to say anything crazy around me. My kids’ paternal grandparents cut DS off because he’s gay, they didn’t even go to his high school graduation, they just stopped fooling with him period. Which pissed me off SO bad and I stopped fooling with THEM, even though DS tried to convince me he didn’t care. 

DD use to feel some type of way about gay people in general, and her brother being gay in particular. But she became more accepting as she matured and she got over herself years ago. Oddly enough when she watched an interview with Caitlyn Jenner a few years ago, it bothered her. She said she can’t imagine living your whole life afraid to be who you really are, and that it’s sad so many people feel like they have to do that. I didn’t remind her that the way she use to think was why it’s hard for people to just be themselves, I was just glad that she truly was no longer “that” person.

[raeoflyte]

Usually when we see or feel like the younger generation is more accepting its because we're seeing it through the eyes of a young person in or peripherally in that circle. We gravitate toward like minded people.

But white supremacists are actively recruiting young white boys and it's working in large part because I feel because our DEI initiatives are not including white men. I don't know what the answer is. But reading through ds texts it's clear that gay is still an insult at least in some circles. He knows I read his texts but I'll only get involved if it's something concerning. I was happy to read a text my son sent that he doesn't care if someone's gay with painfully colorful metaphors, even if it was a little shocking even for me. But it's an insight to the things he's hearing.

I wonder how much progress we've made. It seemed like we were so close to turning the corner in the 90's. And we have representation now, and I never have to give the Trans 101 talk anymore because people know so much more than they did 20 years ago. And my life is so easy. But being gay/queer/trans is still treated as very other even in mostly supportive circles. Not the norm. Not something to discuss until the kids are old enough.

Books being banned that might hint at anything not cis/straight and beyond some facebook posts is there any push back? Entire communities or at least the vocal sub community is working to turn around the progress we thought we made.

[chiver78]

Jun 14, 2022 11:57:03 GMT -5 @pinkcshmere said:

…I felt like things had changed. I felt safe. God damnit I really did. I feel stupid for letting myself get so comfortable. I'm pissed off and want to give a big fuck you to the entire world. And I'm just completely utterly exhausted and hopeless. I don't want to fight for my right to just be ignored. That's all I want is to be ignored as a non-issue. Live my life, raise my kids.

I completely understand.

You and you DH are not alone. There are millions of us straight people that also want you to be safe, comfortable and able to live your lives in peace. That won’t stop the nuts from being nuts, but there is strength in numbers and together we can hopefully make it clear to the nuts that we will not tolerate discrimination and harming people because of their sexuality. I genuinely don’t understand why so many people care so much about other people’s personal business anyway.
I’m really sorry you are feeling the way you do.

 all of this. 

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Interesting you mention that I just read an opinion article on talking to boys about being boys.  I thought it was interesting because a big driver of joining hate groups is fear of change and being left behind in the new world order.  We need to do more to show young men that everyone having a seat at the table doesn't mean they have LESS.

I was always pissed at Phil for his rants about women taking jobs away from men.  O-kay well if women are outnumbering men in X then that means women are leaving Y.  Instead of fostering a system where men feel they are owed these jobs and that women are "stealing" them which prompts groups to insinuate that they can stop them, why aren't we encouraging men to adapt and fill in the employment gaps in sector Y?  We've done a lot to tell girls that they can do anything a man can do but we aren't telling men they can do anything a woman can do.

And we need to teach men it isn't weakness to question their sexuality and that sex with a woman isn't the pinnacle of manhood.  It's okay to be open, vulnerable and perhaps even experiment a little if you are comfortable doing so.  It's not a sign that you are less of a man for it.  You can't be afraid the queers are going to corrupt your kid if you've accepted that sexuality is not something to be afraid of.

www.cnn.com/2022/06/10/health/masculinity-conversation-boys-wellness/index.html

By fine-tuning the conversation in this direction, boys can see their rejection of "toxic" masculinity in a more positive light.

Demonstrations of empathy or vulnerability might be a radical, brave act rather than a cause of embarrassment. Being an ally to girls and others who are mistreated because of their gender identities might be seen as a sign of strength rather than a confession of bad behavior.

"If you come at anyone with a list of everything they do wrong, they are going to get defensive and angry," Mangino said. If you come at them with a list of the ways they can change themselves and the world for the better, on the other hand, they might open up. True gender equality won't take place until everyone is part of the conversation, she said.

ETA: I do believe a lot of us are going to have to die before real change happens.  While I may be open minded another person my age may not be and they are going to raise their children that way who raise their children that way.  People do not become more conservative as they age, it's we are now outdated because each generation after is ever so slightly more progressive.  Eventually it will run itself out but it's going to be a very long time before that happens.

[raeoflyte]

My cousins that "stand with Kirk Cameron" are having significantly more kids than my progressive cousins. Anecdote isn't data, and I really want to be wrong. But it's been a rough few days I guess.