finnime
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Post by finnime on Jul 29, 2024 2:35:40 GMT -5
Good morning, introspective invisipeeps, considering ways to improve communication and relationships. Welcome to Monday. May your day blossom with peace and hope, and your point of view heard and understood. Right now it's raining. I should say, continuing to rain, since last evening. We'll see if it pauses long enough for a jaunt on the beach. It's also on the cool side, low 60's, as it has been for several mornings now before it goes up to 80+. My right arm is numb. It has been for months now. Dr. Google, DD the nurse and my nephew the medic all say it is likely a cervical nerve compression. It's mainly the upper arm, elbow to shoulder, but in the past two months has spread to the lower arm. It is mildly unpleasant, feeling fat like it was injected with novacaine. I cannot feel much in that arm at all. One more thing of slightly older age. As long as it doesn't interfere with what I want to do, I'm disinclined to look into treatment. Between DH and me, I'm the defensive one, a posture I learned early as the 4th child of 5. It's very hard for me to remain open to hearing, but I work on it most days. I rarely bring up an issue with DH; there are few issues. When I do he acts on it and generally doesn't repeat the problem. It took years to unlearn the problematic ways I avoided interacting with XH, who was at the last a domineering control freak. I learn so much from you all. Yesterday very early was magical. There were patches of thick fog at the beach and over the water. I saw 7 or maybe 8 Great Blue Herons and at least 5 egrets all hunting schoolies from the rocky areas as the fog washed past them. A boat, moored off the cove, came into sight then disappeared in the fog. When the sun rose all I could see was it, red and glowing and covered with fog, then it appeared more fully but still was dimmed by fog.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jul 29, 2024 6:13:55 GMT -5
I fell asleep on the couch watching gymnastics last night, and moved up to bed around midnight. this am, I feel like I've bruised the hip I was laying on while on the couch. nothing visible, but damn it hurts. I'm currently sprawled in bed watching more Olympics coverage. a women's volleyball match just ended, 15-13 in the 5th. that's full distance, a tough loss for the losing team for sure
I decided yesterday afternoon that I just didn't want to Monday today, and took a sick day. as I said to my boss, nothing is on fire that can't wait til tomorrow. so with all the rain, I think the pups and I are going to have a fun day with a pillow fort on the couch and a multi-screen view of Olympics coverage on the big screen.
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daisylu
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Post by daisylu on Jul 29, 2024 6:28:51 GMT -5
My morning is full of meetings, 2 of which were requested Friday when I was off. But I get to logoff at noon to take DH to the foot doctor.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 29, 2024 6:38:42 GMT -5
Like the pink in both pics finnimeEnjoy your recovery day Chiver. I haven't watched any volleyball yet.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 29, 2024 6:42:09 GMT -5
Ack, its mowing time of the slope part by me which is full of weeds. So, I guess no help from outside to cool my place down. Do not need freshly mown grass allergens wafting in my windows.
Guess I'll take some Zrytec in a bit.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jul 29, 2024 6:59:45 GMT -5
raeoflyte , One thing that I will say that helped me tremendously was to find people that care about me, and then let them help me. There are very few people in IRL that actually care about me. My inlaws, my husband, my kids, one of my mentors, and a couple of old coworkers, and an old client turned family friend. I think that's why it's still devastating to me that I lost a coworker 5 years ago. Most everyone that I interact with now IRL, outside of my immediate family, they don't care about me. They only want transactional relationships, and they are only interested in what I can do for them. Even at work now, as I'm prepping to leave it's all "We're going to miss you because you made my life easier/more convenient" I'm still sort of aghast that folks at work used my cancer to make them feel some sort of way about themselves. If there ever was a time where it should have been about me, that was it. I was pretty clear about our family's needs/wants. They were fairly disregarded. Don't get me wrong, I did appreciate the gesture. But, their help was not about making our situation easier. It was about them finding a way to make themselves feel better about the situation. Even my mom. *If* I please her, then my birthday gets acknowledged. If I don't fill her needs. Well, then. I'm nothing, at best. At worst, she informs me how I've failed her. That's why I think I love my time away with the old ladies. I get this time where they ask about me. The like me for me. Not for what I do for them. Anyway, after I decided to change up my response to my parents when I was 32, it was amazing to let other people in. I also think, in tern, having that experience made it easier for me to try to accept that my husband really loves me for me, not for the convenience I provide. I'm trying to get back to that again. Now, at almost 50, I know that's part of the solution. I also had to have that experience first. It was quite by luck that I had the first exposure to what works in my 30s. Remembering what works in the day to day, well, at least for me, it gets lost just because what's needed to get through the day is so great. It's easy to see where the defensiveness comes from. When your job is to be a convenience for others, really, to be used and consumed by others. And you do your best. And then you are told it's not good enough, or wrong, or whatever, it's really easy to get to defensive, blameshift, etc. I'm still working on truly accepting that I am enough. Some days are better than others.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 29, 2024 8:21:25 GMT -5
raeoflyte , One thing that I will say that helped me tremendously was to find people that care about me, and then let them help me. There are very few people in IRL that actually care about me. My inlaws, my husband, my kids, one of my mentors, and a couple of old coworkers, and an old client turned family friend. I think that's why it's still devastating to me that I lost a coworker 5 years ago. Most everyone that I interact with now IRL, outside of my immediate family, they don't care about me. They only want transactional relationships, and they are only interested in what I can do for them. Even at work now, as I'm prepping to leave it's all "We're going to miss you because you made my life easier/more convenient" I'm still sort of aghast that folks at work used my cancer to make them feel some sort of way about themselves. If there ever was a time where it should have been about me, that was it. I was pretty clear about our family's needs/wants. They were fairly disregarded. Don't get me wrong, I did appreciate the gesture. But, their help was not about making our situation easier. It was about them finding a way to make themselves feel better about the situation. Even my mom. *If* I please her, then my birthday gets acknowledged. If I don't fill her needs. Well, then. I'm nothing, at best. At worst, she informs me how I've failed her. That's why I think I love my time away with the old ladies. I get this time where they ask about me. The like me for me. Not for what I do for them. Anyway, after I decided to change up my response to my parents when I was 32, it was amazing to let other people in. I also think, in tern, having that experience made it easier for me to try to accept that my husband really loves me for me, not for the convenience I provide. I'm trying to get back to that again. Now, at almost 50, I know that's part of the solution. I also had to have that experience first. It was quite by luck that I had the first exposure to what works in my 30s. Remembering what works in the day to day, well, at least for me, it gets lost just because what's needed to get through the day is so great. It's easy to see where the defensiveness comes from. When your job is to be a convenience for others, really, to be used and consumed by others. And you do your best. And then you are told it's not good enough, or wrong, or whatever, it's really easy to get to defensive, blameshift, etc. I'm still working on truly accepting that I am enough. Some days are better than others. <3 I hope you find that more often Gira. I don't want to get into posting directly about dh or too much about our relationship too - outside of the limited scope I put out originally. I needed outside input to keep moving forward in my processing. It wasn't something easily found independently but I thought the group here would have suggestions and they did.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 29, 2024 8:23:00 GMT -5
I want to thank raeoflyte and all who responded to her post on defensive/reactive behaviors. The discussion has helped me think through some of our issues and the role we each play in them. DH is, to me, the ultimate in defensive behavior, adopting a posture that he is perfect and therefore all problems lie with me. He is 85 and I am sure he will not change, so I've just quiet quit the relationship in a way. I do acknowledge that I am reactive in many ways, blaming him for my own internalized guilt. I honestly work on that but am far from perfect. I wish things were different, but they aren't and that's okay too. As you all have heard me say before, I just never had the guts to walk away from the comforts $$ bring versus a life of poverty. Should have but didn't. Poor choices on my part are not his bad. This is such an honest post and at least for me right now very raw. Thank you for being willing to share.
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bookkeeper
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Post by bookkeeper on Jul 29, 2024 9:11:22 GMT -5
My right arm is numb. It has been for months now. Dr. Google, DD the nurse and my nephew the medic all say it is likely a cervical nerve compression. It's mainly the upper arm, elbow to shoulder, but in the past two months has spread to the lower arm. It is mildly unpleasant, feeling fat like it was injected with novacaine. I cannot feel much in that arm at all. One more thing of slightly older age. As long as it doesn't interfere with what I want to do, I'm disinclined to look into treatment. I have had some experience with a similar condition. When I was 19 years old, I went through a stop sign and got T-boned in the intersection. I broke my windshield with my head. This has led to some ongoing care with my neck. I use a foam contour pillow under my head. I am a side sleeper, so I also sleep with my arms hugging another fluffy pillow to keep them in correct position to avoid numbness. When the compression was really bad, I used a traction bag. I would warm up my neck with the hot tub or heating pad and then hang in the traction device for 10 minutes to gently stretch and provide relief. I am also a chiropractic patient. I was born with one leg longer than the other in addition to the car accident. I currently have no issues and go for a treatment 2 or 3 times a year to "tune up" and keep things working well. A physical therapist could be able to help if you would not consider a chiropractor. Doorway stretches and corner stretches can help relieve the tightness in your upper back. And remember not to lift or carry very much while you are trying to heal.
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geenamercile
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Post by geenamercile on Jul 29, 2024 9:17:56 GMT -5
I think this is very different in an intimate partner relationship than any other, including parent-child (which is where my experience comes from). The thing I would keep in mind is that this is biology happening. Neural circuits that have been reinforced and strengthened for probably decades. It will take time to reset these, no matter how motivated he is. I have found that reinforce, then walk away and allow time to sink in, then reinforce again is the least frustrating method for me. But I’m not sure how practical that is with a spouse. This is very helpful. Sad but helpful. Can you give me an example of what behavior you're reinforcing in the post above? Boundaries on what won't tolerate? Or something else? But I'm also not looking to help dh work through this anymore. I don't think I could even if I wanted to. I am bolding that because when I hit that point that is when I knew I needed to just end the marriage with my ex, I still and will always care for him and hope the best for him. Giving up on what I wanted, the picture in my head of how we should be was hard. But that is when I came to the conclusion that I could never be a partner to him, or trust him to be a partner to me. This song hit hard during that time
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 29, 2024 9:19:52 GMT -5
The fact that I nearly did cartwheels after seeing that EV is going to be out another two weeks on whatever leave she managed to con out of the company is highly indicative of the emotional and psychological toll this place has taken on me.
I haven't had biweekly meetings yet either she hasn't made the schedule for the new fiscal year.
The fact my error rate has dropped and my productivity has soared in just a month AND I am not "negative" anymore to the point where coworkers have noticed a dramatic shift in my mood should tell them something but it won't.
It's just more evidence to confirm what I already know. I was starting to get cold feet about possibly having to change jobs again because I don't like disrupting my routine. If I feel this good with a temporary reprieve from both of them I need to consider how good I will feel if I can leave entirely because I'll never need to look over my shoulder again.
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geenamercile
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Post by geenamercile on Jul 29, 2024 9:23:57 GMT -5
Sitting at the car service station trying to get a head start on work stuff. This is my last week off, although I am going in tomorrow for a bit. My AC has cold air but it is not really blowing.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 29, 2024 9:25:05 GMT -5
I forgot to share, YM will be so proud of me.
We were talking yesterday with my SIL and her husband about how much DH stands to get from the estate. BIL suggested paying off our mortgage and I said no. He asked why I wouldn't want a paid off house.
I said our interest rate is only 4.2% and our payment $697 a month. The mortgage itself was only for $62k. If I pay off the house then that money is tied up in the house. I want it invested and working for me. I said I have to consider DH is 10 years older than me if something happens to him I may need all the compound interest I can get so I don't end up having to depend on my daughters for support.
Grandma had to have $100k upfront for the nursing home. That is A LOT of cash. I am still 20+ years out from retirement so investing the bulk of this inheritance should set us up pretty nicely for old age when also factoring in our 401ks.
I can always pay off the house later if it is deemed prudent. Worst case the girls have to deal with selling it and paying it off. I am playing a very long term game and having a paid off house ASAP isn't part of it.
ETA: We are paying off smaller debts to free up cash flow. Then part of it will go into our bank savings account, $5k into a money market so it's "growing" but still easy access as an EF and then I need to set up an appointment with Fidelity to get the rest going into a ROTH so we can diversify and have some post tax investments.
And we will use a smidge of it to make our lives better. I want to side the house eventually. I really want to take a cruise with the kids. With the money from DH's third of the house "sale" we stand to get about $107k. That's life changing for us. I don't want ~$50k of it tied up in the house.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jul 29, 2024 9:28:15 GMT -5
Sutures are gone. Surgeon said it looks good and just how it should at this point.
Return in early September.
Countinue washing face with baby shampoo and put vaseline on my nose twice a day. I can handle this.
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bookkeeper
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Post by bookkeeper on Jul 29, 2024 9:29:38 GMT -5
DH and I have had our share of arguments about defensive/reactive behaviors. If I bring up a problem, sometimes the answer I get is "I'll just stop driving" (relating to his car accident where he drove into an oncoming train) or "I can't do anything right". Well big boy, I am not spending the next 15 years driving you around, so you need to do better! Case closed. This whiney behavior often comes with weaponized incompetence on his part. I call this Captain Halfass behavior! Not to his face, but it helps me to laugh at things I can't control.
When these issues arise, I point out that DH is not a victim in any sense of the word. There is a job to be done, and it needs to be done well. That's it. Put your drama back in the box. If I leave and go live at one of the other houses, you get to do everything yourself anyway, so get it together. I have gotten very matter of fact when I talk about what I want from our relationship. Like soupandstew mentioned, I have quiet quit many parts of our relationship because I get nothing in return.
I am sure I would have had as many issues with any roommate for 40 years.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jul 29, 2024 9:31:29 GMT -5
I could have paid my house off when I received the inheritance from my dad. I also chose not to because I would not have had much in the bank.
This summer's cost for the basement waterproofing showed me I was correct. I would have had to borrow to pay for it and I didn't have to borrow.
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minnesotapaintlady
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Post by minnesotapaintlady on Jul 29, 2024 9:37:20 GMT -5
So, I stepped on a scale for the first time in over a year yesterday and now I'm in a panic. I'm trying to decide if I try (again) to deal with this on my own or head to the doctor. At the very least I'd like to get a medically necessary form to use HSA funds for a diet plan or personal trainer, but I seriously need to do something. I walked the lake with Carrot yesterday and my heart rate was 165 and I was dripping sweat when we were done (it's only 3.7 miles!) Paid $30 for another app this morning that will probably end up just being a waste of money.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jul 29, 2024 9:42:43 GMT -5
Eventually your assets will grow, too that it will give you more choices in the future.
I always kept our mortgage low enough so that we could pay it off. Eventually, our Roths grew big enough that we could use that instead of the taxable (like I always had planned). It's nice ot have the choice.
I just about choked. The nice senior facilities you need about 400K to get a seat at the table. The rent for a two bedroom in independent living is low enough that my pension + SS should cover it.
We should still be able to afford living in one of those places, actually, now for as long as we need to.
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Jul 29, 2024 9:54:30 GMT -5
€£¥}[§&$@#&%,}{[_¥£€§§ Whew I feel much better. Thanks for letting me vent and you may have saved a life.
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lurkyloo
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Post by lurkyloo on Jul 29, 2024 9:59:48 GMT -5
I think this is very different in an intimate partner relationship than any other, including parent-child (which is where my experience comes from). The thing I would keep in mind is that this is biology happening. Neural circuits that have been reinforced and strengthened for probably decades. It will take time to reset these, no matter how motivated he is. I have found that reinforce, then walk away and allow time to sink in, then reinforce again is the least frustrating method for me. But I’m not sure how practical that is with a spouse. This is very helpful. Sad but helpful. Can you give me an example of what behavior you're reinforcing in the post above? Boundaries on what won't tolerate? Or something else? But I'm also not looking to help dh work through this anymore. I don't think I could even if I wanted to. Right now I am reinforcing that she needs to let a hired aide into her house several times a week, if she’s going to avoid guardianship and a nursing home. For a few days she was agreeing she needed help with laundry, bc stairs. Last night she was acting receptive and suggesting she could look at a specific place for these resources, and agreeing in principle that she should get to outsource cleaning bc she has better things to do. But, arguing again that she can do laundry because she has a laundry chute Entirely possible I’m not making as much progress as I think I am. It’s important to remember that some of this at this point is delusion and denial, not just intentional gaslighting. I try to convey that I’m respecting her boundaries and preferences where possible, but only where possible. And I pick my battles for sure…it’s not worth getting anyone all worked up just because that’s her default. Previously, when she threw the literal and horrific tantrum about me getting married and kept repeating she just wouldn’t come to the wedding, I eventually took her up on it and said she wasn’t invited unless she apologized for her behavior. After six weeks, I decided I wouldn’t accept an apology anymore and she just wasn’t coming, and let her know that. I think she sent a letter at one point…I had now-DH read it, share a limited distillation and then shred it. I don’t believe there was an apology in it, just “you have to invite me”. I did relent at the last minute, several months later/about 36 hours before the wedding, and gave her another chance to apologize (which was the shortest, nastiest, least apologetic “I’m sorry” ever). There was and continues to be fallout; I still don’t have a relationship with previously-close YB, as he chose to support her at any cost (unnecessary details redacted). I’m not sure any of this is helpful to your situation.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 29, 2024 10:04:33 GMT -5
This is very helpful. Sad but helpful. Can you give me an example of what behavior you're reinforcing in the post above? Boundaries on what won't tolerate? Or something else? But I'm also not looking to help dh work through this anymore. I don't think I could even if I wanted to. I am bolding that because when I hit that point that is when I knew I needed to just end the marriage with my ex, I still and will always care for him and hope the best for him. Giving up on what I wanted, the picture in my head of how we should be was hard. But that is when I came to the conclusion that I could never be a partner to him, or trust him to be a partner to me. This song hit hard during that time I will say I'm not there yet so I think what I'm saying is hitting differently? I can and have done a lot for dh. I will continue to do that. (If I choose to) I will show up on my side and give emotionally and be vulnerable and do my work to not stay stuck in the past so that we actuallu have a chance at making a future together. Which is why time frames matter. But I can't do his work for him. It's bigger than me. I spent 12 years thinking love would fix everything. Then another 15 years trying everything else I could think of. But this is stuff from before I was around and he is the only person that can work on it.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jul 29, 2024 10:12:39 GMT -5
I love modern times, sometimes. It's nice to be able to figure something out in 15 minutes. In the olden days, with paper card catalogs, it would have taken me more than 15 minutes to get to the right building.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 29, 2024 10:15:35 GMT -5
lurkyloo that is helpful to understand. Thank you. And I'm sorry for the whole dynamic. Especially still navigating it while setting up care. I think you've said she's had a falling out with yb but it would be hard for me not to let the 2 of them work it out.
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anciana
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Post by anciana on Jul 29, 2024 10:26:32 GMT -5
I am bolding that because when I hit that point that is when I knew I needed to just end the marriage with my ex, I still and will always care for him and hope the best for him. Giving up on what I wanted, the picture in my head of how we should be was hard. But that is when I came to the conclusion that I could never be a partner to him, or trust him to be a partner to me. This song hit hard during that time I will say I'm not there yet so I think what I'm saying is hitting differently? I can and have done a lot for dh. I will continue to do that. (If I choose to) I will show up on my side and give emotionally and be vulnerable and do my work to not stay stuck in the past so that we actuallu have a chance at making a future together. Which is why time frames matter. But I can't do his work for him. It's bigger than me. I spent 12 years thinking love would fix everything. Then another 15 years trying everything else I could think of. But this is stuff from before I was around and he is the only person that can work on it. Rae, I think if you could clearly let DH know that this is where you are, and continue repeating, that might be all you can do. Does DH realize that he needs to work on this by himself and that you cannot make it happen for him? Did that sink in yet? Does he understand how important it is or he somehow thinks it’ll all blow over and it’ll go away so that you can continue as before? How honest and serious is he when he says he’s willing to work on it? We don’t need those answers, just something for you to think about? Would it be possible to address some of your questions in the next session with the therapist? As in, asking DH what would he like to hear from you or for you to do when he slides back into the undesirable behavior. And then, if he has suggestions, address how much of that you’re able to do. Or ask the therapist for suggestions. I would consider that the next time you find yourself in that situation, the most you’re able to do would be to just point out to him that you’re noticing he’s doing it again and that you will continue the discussion when he sorts that out and can talk without getting defensive as you’re not able to continue until he does. Basically, gently call him out on it, point it out and walk away. I am sorry you keep finding yourself in these situations and they’re not getting better yet. You are tired and worn out, understandably so. Wishing you all the best and sending all the hugs!
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jul 29, 2024 10:30:50 GMT -5
Rae - FWIW, I'm processing similar stuff, so your posts and the responses have been very timely.
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lurkyloo
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Post by lurkyloo on Jul 29, 2024 10:36:38 GMT -5
lurkyloo that is helpful to understand. Thank you. And I'm sorry for the whole dynamic. Especially still navigating it while setting up care. I think you've said she's had a falling out with yb but it would be hard for me not to let the 2 of them work it out. That’s a whole ‘nother trainwreck. She has an ongoing persistent paranoia/delusion that YB is breaking into her house and moving or stealing things. She’s called the police on him multiple times. He is understandably bitter to the point where I’m not at all sure he’s the best choice for guardianship-a few months ago he lied to her that he was dying of pancreatic cancer to get her to back off. Mostly I try to stay out of that and ask her not to complain to me about it, while thinking wtf knock it off these are the people you blatantly chose/favored over me for years. Although there could well be something to SIL being after my parents’ money Just because my mother is paranoid doesn’t mean she’s always wrong and I trust SIL about as far as I can throw her. OB is the most neutral-hasn’t been overtly targeted by her as best I know, but is really good at pissing people off unnecessarily. Not sure how he and YB are currently getting along. OB will try to set up a more universal fPOA (mine is specific to her investment firm which admittedly is the bulk of her liquid assets) and a healthcare POA. I’m the obvious choice for the latter, from a diplomatic and spent-my-career-in-healthcare-adjacent-fields standpoint. Also a lives in the US standpoint. But OB doesn’t deal well with not being the smartest in the room Anyway. #tmi
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lurkyloo
Junior Associate
“Time means nothing now,” said Toad. “It is just the thing that happens between snacks.”
Joined: Jan 8, 2011 11:26:56 GMT -5
Posts: 5,994
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Post by lurkyloo on Jul 29, 2024 10:41:31 GMT -5
Man, this is a depressing thread today. I’m sorry so many of us are struggling. I think we need a cute-pet-picture break And yay TheOtherMe!
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giramomma
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 11:25:27 GMT -5
Posts: 22,040
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Post by giramomma on Jul 29, 2024 10:48:31 GMT -5
Man, this is a depressing thread today. I’m sorry so many of us are struggling. I think we need a cute-pet-picture break And yay TheOtherMe ! It is, and also, it is not.
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raeoflyte
Senior Associate
Joined: Feb 3, 2011 15:43:53 GMT -5
Posts: 14,954
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 29, 2024 10:49:06 GMT -5
Mortification week on askamanager.org this morning is a fabulous break.
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lurkyloo
Junior Associate
“Time means nothing now,” said Toad. “It is just the thing that happens between snacks.”
Joined: Jan 8, 2011 11:26:56 GMT -5
Posts: 5,994
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Post by lurkyloo on Jul 29, 2024 10:51:26 GMT -5
Man, this is a depressing thread today. I’m sorry so many of us are struggling. I think we need a cute-pet-picture break And yay TheOtherMe ! It is, and also, it is not. Heavy then, rather than just depressing. These things need to be discussed, and addressed, but they’re not much fun
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