Do People Just Not Want To Work Anymore?

[NastyWoman]

My oldest went to HS in S'pore. Expat kids were not allowed to have any kind of paying jobs during the school year per the visa rules. In the summer they could with a special waiver. So DS1 had to get a job for at least 3 weeks during the summer and give us his salary (only salary, the tips he made as a porter were his to keep) as his contribution for the very expensive school trips he took for his class without borders. They chose the destination from a list provided and some were quite reasonable in cost others...not so much. He chose Tasmania, Nepal, and Nepal all of which were on the "not so much" list so we told him he needed to contribute. Since he managed to land jobs,at 5-star hotels the tips were nothing to sneeze at  Big win for DS.

DS2 went to HS here in CA. He was offered a systems engineering job at a start-up by someone he worked with on a volunteer job with. DS really, really wanted that job so I told him that he could but even one grade less than a B would be the end of that endeavor. Who would have guessed that would be all it would take for him to be a straight-A student. He made very good money during that time. I don't remember exactly how much but I think he got ~$20/hr in the 1990s so pretty good. The conpany also gave him a laptop when he left for college.

Neither one of them ever flipped burgers aside from family barbeques. They just got lucky and that is not just my opinion: they both have said so several times over the years

[weltschmerz]

I am watching 60 Minutes. They were talking about the results of some tests.

The number one job that American kids aspire to?  Influencer.

The number one job that Chinese kids aspire to?  Astronaut.

Let that sink in.

China is going to blow North America out of the water.

[giramomma]

I think that was a very small part of the reporting.

www.cbsnews.com/news/social-media-political-polarization-60-minutes-2022-11-06/

[billisonboard]

Nov 6, 2022 21:13:05 GMT -5 giramomma said:

I think that was a very small part of the reporting.

www.cbsnews.com/news/social-media-political-polarization-60-minutes-2022-11-06/

Great article.

[TheOtherMe]

The guy who did my tiling said his son is attending college to become a game developer and computer graphics.  The tile guy said he doesn't think that was a wise decision.  

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Forensics was hot when I was graduating because of all the CSI shows.  Simpson saw dollar signs and wanted a program.   It's not a bad field but very niche and very hard to get into.  Parents rightly expressed concern on ROI.

The head of the chemistry department convinced them to make it a Biochemistry degree with emphasis on Forensics. That way you graduated with a general Biochem degree which would give you more options.

I don't see gaming and computer graphics as an automatic bad move if the degree itself can be spun into other computer related professions.  

[jerseygirl]

Can you rent a dumpster and keep in driveway. Just keep throwing junk into it till full. Then call to have it removed
That way don’t need to keep going back and forth with a truck snd to

[billisonboard]

How much of gaming and graphic design is technical competence which can be taught and how much is creative imagination which is more innate? I mean how many people truly have the talent to develop something people want to play? Seems like a field in which a few do great but most are in for drudgery.

[swamp]

From upstate NY: 

www.nny360.com/communitynews/communitynotes/city-of-watertown-unable-to-fill-positions/article_658bf28a-5678-509d-a96b-4a54a77d42a9.html


WATERTOWN — The national labor shortage is having an impact on the city’s efforts to fill 22 positions that were approved in the city budget last spring.



The city still has job openings for many of those positions, including five new police officers at a time when the police department has 12 vacancies.



“I think it is a challenge,” City Manager Kenneth A. Mix said last week, adding it’s difficult to find candidates “in particular departments and for the work that they do.”



The 22 new positions were put into the new budget at a cost of about $1 million and covered by an unexpected increase in sales tax revenues.



Councilman Patrick J. Hickey pointed out that City Council approved the new positions after department heads requested the new positions and Mr. Mix concurred they were needed.



“They were legitimate positions, needed positions,” he said.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Nov 7, 2022 12:13:23 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

How much of gaming and graphic design is technical competence which can be taught and how much is creative imagination which is more innate? I mean how many people truly have the talent to develop something people want to play? Seems like a field in which a few do great but most are in for drudgery.

Can't that be said for pretty much any job?  How many of us are going to achieve greatness in our respective professions? 

Might as well be in for drudgery in something you enjoy.  Which I know tends to go against the YM code.

[billisonboard]

Nov 7, 2022 14:35:46 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Nov 7, 2022 12:13:23 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

How much of gaming and graphic design is technical competence which can be taught and how much is creative imagination which is more innate? I mean how many people truly have the talent to develop something people want to play? Seems like a field in which a few do great but most are in for drudgery.

Can't that be said for pretty much any job?  How many of us are going to achieve greatness in our respective professions? 

Might as well be in for drudgery in something you enjoy.  Which I know tends to go against the YM code.

Just talking this out more

I am thinking about expectations starting out. If you go to school to be a teacher or accountant, you have a good idea where you will end up. Sure you might end up teaching advanced classes to geniuses or keeping the books for some hot entertainer, but that isn't why most major in those fields. How many start law school thinking they will be arguing cases before the Supreme Court? I just don't see many starting out in gaming and graphic design thinking they are going to end up doing video tutorials on how to assemble a baby crib.

And I could be way off base with this.

[teen persuasion]

Nov 7, 2022 15:24:51 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Nov 7, 2022 14:35:46 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Can't that be said for pretty much any job?  How many of us are going to achieve greatness in our respective professions? 

Might as well be in for drudgery in something you enjoy.  Which I know tends to go against the YM code.

Just talking this out more

I am thinking about expectations starting out. If you go to school to be a teacher or accountant, you have a good idea where you will end up. Sure you might end up teaching advanced classes to geniuses or keeping the books for some hot entertainer, but that isn't why most major in those fields. How many start law school thinking they will be arguing cases before the Supreme Court? I just don't see many starting out in gaming and graphic design thinking they are going to end up doing video tutorials on how to assemble a baby crib.

And I could be way off base with this.

How many people even end up in jobs related to their college major anymore?

DD1 - optics engineering degree - Chinese linguist for the Navy
DS2 - American Craftsman degree in furniture design - currently doing coding, after stints in container printing and in pipe organ restoration
me - computer science degree - library staff (initially youth services)
coworker - art education - library staff
coworker - photography - library director

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Nov 7, 2022 19:45:59 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

Nov 7, 2022 15:24:51 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Just talking this out more

I am thinking about expectations starting out. If you go to school to be a teacher or accountant, you have a good idea where you will end up. Sure you might end up teaching advanced classes to geniuses or keeping the books for some hot entertainer, but that isn't why most major in those fields. How many start law school thinking they will be arguing cases before the Supreme Court? I just don't see many starting out in gaming and graphic design thinking they are going to end up doing video tutorials on how to assemble a baby crib.

And I could be way off base with this.

How many people even end up in jobs related to their college major anymore?

DD1 - optics engineering degree - Chinese linguist for the Navy
DS2 - American Craftsman degree in furniture design - currently doing coding, after stints in container printing and in pipe organ restoration
me - computer science degree - library staff (initially youth services)
coworker - art education - library staff
coworker - photography - library director

Both DH  and I did.  

[giramomma]

One of my jobs is in my undergrad major. The dayjob is not.

Many of my friends are not working in the area they got their undergrad in.

Given how often people (except for myself) change careers, I would expect that my kids will go to school for one thing and be employed in something else at some point in their lives.

[Deleted]

Nov 7, 2022 19:45:59 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

How many people even end up in jobs related to their college major anymore?

DD1 - optics engineering degree - Chinese linguist for the Navy
DS2 - American Craftsman degree in furniture design - currently doing coding, after stints in container printing and in pipe organ restoration
me - computer science degree - library staff (initially youth services)
coworker - art education - library staff
coworker - photography - library director

The military, bless them, is always willing to train good people. Not true of most employers. I'm guessing DS2 did some extra studies on his own to learn coding.

I've read articles about how no one sticks to their original career anymore but I'm not sure how they make the transition when companies are so picky about qualifications and they're deluged with resumes so they CAN be picky.

[teen persuasion]

Nov 8, 2022 8:16:11 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

Nov 7, 2022 19:45:59 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

How many people even end up in jobs related to their college major anymore?

DD1 - optics engineering degree - Chinese linguist for the Navy
DS2 - American Craftsman degree in furniture design - currently doing coding, after stints in container printing and in pipe organ restoration
me - computer science degree - library staff (initially youth services)
coworker - art education - library staff
coworker - photography - library director

The military, bless them, is always willing to train good people. Not true of most employers. I'm guessing DS2 did some extra studies on his own to learn coding.

I've read articles about how no one sticks to their original career anymore but I'm not sure how they make the transition when companies are so picky about qualifications and they're deluged with resumes so they CAN be picky.

Yeah, DS2 is intellectually curious and interested in LOTS of things, and gets bored once he's mastered/optimized it (printing place - he'd optimized as much as he could between the shop floor and the design office, he was the main go-between + mock-ups), or hit the top of where he can go with it (pipe organ shop).  For the coding, he found a company that trains you and farms you out to firms needing coders.  Before Covid, they trained on site (so he'd have had to move); with Covid, they pivoted to remote training (you are paid during training).  You are then on contract to them for 2 years, unless your employer buys out your contract (many do).  His placement was in Texas, but he did intake-training remotely, and kept putting off relocating as long as they'd let him work remote.  He never got put on a real project, was "benched", so was definitely not in a hurry to relocate (especially to Texas in the current political climate).  He eventually found a local job and cut ties with the former.

He was also looking into model-making positions, but few of them were full-time.  Those are the kinds of challenges he likes - he does a lot of 3-D printing (testing capabilities) and cosplay model stuff (like a storm trooper helmet he did for DS5), and did replica wheels/framing for a cannon at a historical fort in the area (metal cannon is historical, but wooden parts need replacing over 4 centuries).

[nidena]

My major was Marketing.  With so many jobs are about the "customer experience", it's easy to use what I learned in them.

[Deleted]

Nov 8, 2022 10:17:14 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

Yeah, DS2 is intellectually curious and interested in LOTS of things, and gets bored once he's mastered/optimized it (printing place - he'd optimized as much as he could between the shop floor and the design office, he was the main go-between + mock-ups), or hit the top of where he can go with it (pipe organ shop).

He sounds EXACTLY like the "willing-to-learn" employee that companies need in rapidly-changing environments but are sometimes reluctant to hire because they need to be trained in specific domain knowledge. I'm glad he found a good employer!

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I'm still sorta working in what I got my degree in.  My bachelor's is in biology but I am still employed in science.  I subject hop a lot.  Right now I landed in food science. 

I have considered trying to break out and even discussed it with the career coach but I can't get any bites even with highlighting my "soft" skills such as it were.

I thought about data management but that is getting over saturated and I know here just laid off a butt ton of them so not sure that field is any safer than the one I am currently in.  At least I have 14 years experience to back me up in what I do now. 

[giramomma]

DD1 wants to be a teacher.

I fully expect that she'll pivot out at some point. The teacher burn out rate isn't magically getting better in the next 5-10 years.

To plan for "some point" being during her college career,  I think we'll try to encourage her to go to a good generalist school. DH and I concluded that during her spring break this year, we should start poking around at schools. Likely headed MPL's way. So we can check out a big school and some smaller ones.

[lurkyloo]

I bet the statistics on who is still working in the field you majored in depends heavily on the major.  DH and I are both still in the same fields, as are a lot of the STEM types we went to school with. ( Although I feel like a fair number of us veered over into law.  Does it still count if it’s STEM-centric law? )

If you majored in psychology and are working in marketing, frankly I would consider that the same field 

If you majored in say French medieval literature I’m sure you picked up many skills and are employed or at least employable, but jobs within that specific field seem to me to be somewhat limited.  cough swamp cough

[Deleted]

Nov 8, 2022 12:16:56 GMT -5 giramomma said:

DD1 wants to be a teacher.

I fully expect that she'll pivot out at some point. The teacher burn out rate isn't magically getting better in the next 5-10 years.

A lot of Math teachers end up in the actuarial field.

On the OT, I wonder what's going on at CVS.  A local FB page had a post from someone who stopped at one in town in the middle of a weekday and they were closed- not enough people.  Today I stopped at one in another town- well-traveled, upper-middle-class area.  Yes, they could refill my prescription buy they were behind 30 days.  Fortunately mine is an "as needed" and I had a small supply, but she didn't even ask any questions to determine whether it was something I needed immediately like painkillers or antibiotics.  (I went to the one in my town and they were able to refill it.)

That has to be a tough job- always people waiting, no WFH and working with a lot of people who are struggling to find the money for their prescriptions.  They're always checking GoodRx.

[nidena]

Nov 8, 2022 14:57:56 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

Nov 8, 2022 12:16:56 GMT -5 giramomma said:

DD1 wants to be a teacher.

I fully expect that she'll pivot out at some point. The teacher burn out rate isn't magically getting better in the next 5-10 years.

A lot of Math teachers end up in the actuarial field.

On the OT, I wonder what's going on at CVS.  A local FB page had a post from someone who stopped at one in town in the middle of a weekday and they were closed- not enough people.  Today I stopped at one in another town- well-traveled, upper-middle-class area.  Yes, they could refill my prescription buy they were behind 30 days.  Fortunately mine is an "as needed" and I had a small supply, but she didn't even ask any questions to determine whether it was something I needed immediately like painkillers or antibiotics.  (I went to the one in my town and they were able to refill it.)

That has to be a tough job- always people waiting, no WFH and working with a lot of people who are struggling to find the money for their prescriptions.  They're always checking GoodRx.

From the outside looking in, it seems like CVS is putting their money into acquiring Urgent Care clinics rather than their front-end store employees. Walgreens is doing the same and has the same problem staffing their stores.  I never know when the one near me will be closed due to staffing issues.

[pulmonarymd]

CVS is having the same issues that everyone else in healthcare has:

Not enough pharmacists
They overexpanded, there is a pharmacy on every corner now
The corporate expectations are unreasonable. The quotas they have can be dangerous.
Burnout from the pandemic.
Unreasonable expectations from patients. CVS doesn't control what your prescription costs. That is determined, for the most part, by your health insurance and the pharmaceutical companies

[Pink Cashmere]

I had a strong dislike for CVS even before the pandemic. That’s where my Mom got her prescriptions filled and they were perpetually short staffed.

The last straw was when they gave my Mom the wrong prescription medication. Thank God my Mom realized it looked different and only took a few of them before realizing it really was the wrong medicine. I posted about it here, and I have since forgotten the details. But what they gave her literally could’ve killed her if she’d taken it like she was supposed to take her real medicine. The label on the bottle was correct, the pills in the bottle were not correct. 

The pharmacist basically said we were lying until I popped up with the medicine and he was like oops and all apologetic and gave me the correct medicine. My Mom already contacted CVS over his head, and once he got the wrong medicine back in his hand, he lied to his superiors and said it never happened. On the advice of Chiver here, I contacted the manufacturer and whoever is in charge of that kind of stuff in Mississippi, where the CVS is. Because I felt like that kind of mistake really could kill someone…. If my Mom was not still in her right mind, she would’ve never noticed that the pills were different and we never would’ve known they actually gave her the wrong medicine. No matter how much info I sent the manufacturer, with pictures and details, it was never enough info and they needed more, so I stopped fooling with it when they started asking me for lot numbers or whatever that the wrong pills came from. HTF am I supposed to know that, when I don’t work at the damn pharmacy? It was pretty much the same thing with the state of Mississippi, asking me questions I had no way of knowing the answers to, because I didn’t work at the damn pharmacy.

My side gig has to do with health insurance, and a few years ago, they sent someone from the big company to help me with a big event. She knows someone that is a pharmacist for CVS and she talked about how that person was so unhappy with their job because CVS never staffs their pharmacies appropriately. This conversation was before the thing happened with my Mom, and before the pandemic.

CVS is the preferred provider for prescription medicines with my health insurance because they bought Aetna, and Aetna partnered with my health insurance company (through my union) a few years prior. I still don’t use CVS. F*** CVS.

[wvugurl26]

I think they definitely got too aggressive in their expansion at CVS. Buying all the Target ones probably didn't help. And corporate ridiculously pushes auto refills which doesn't help the workload.

My grandma's reminders are set up to go to my phone and I'm forever saying no not needed yet. I laugh when I get messages that say her doctor opted out of contact for refills.

If I got a minute to breathe at work, I'd be looking into that auto refill thing. I doubt they are being appropriately backed out when the scripts aren't picked up.

I maintain that the pharmacy benefit managers are what is driving up the price. Get rid of them. Bunch of middlemen ripping us all off to the tune of record profits.

[nidena]

The overexpansion statement got me curious which lead me to googling.

I did NOT know there are nearly 30,000 physical pharmacy locations and that's just across 8 chains.  Walgreens and CVS each have more than 9,000 locations with CVS having closer to 10,000.  Pre-pandemic, they also each had more than 200,000 employees with CVS having closer to 300,000.  CVS appears to show they had no negative change in employees from 2020 to 2021.  Walgreens shows a loss of nearly 20,000.  How can they be struggling so much if they "lost no employees"?

[wvugurl26]

If CVS lost pharmacy employees and replaced them with store employees the numbers would still be 300,000 but inadequate staffing for the pharmacy side of the store.

My niece worked there for several months as a pharmacy tech. They were very short staffed and not nice to employees.

Also locally in the last 18 months we had an older CVS be replaced by a new one with the Minute Clinic inside. This new format and expanded size requires way more employees than the old one needed.

[Deleted]

Nov 8, 2022 15:08:47 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

CVS is having the same issues that everyone else in healthcare has:

Not enough pharmacists
They overexpanded, there is a pharmacy on every corner now
The corporate expectations are unreasonable. The quotas they have can be dangerous.
Burnout from the pandemic.
Unreasonable expectations from patients. CVS doesn't control what your prescription costs. That is determined, for the most part, by your health insurance and the pharmaceutical companies

I agree- I've never seen customers taking it out on the pharma techs but if you have any empathy it must be draining- working with customers who are sick and/or in pain and have a prescription in hand but not enough $$ for the co-pay, so you go through GoodRx, etc. and look for discounts. It must be awful to have to send people away without a prescription when it's still under patent and there are no discounts to be had.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Nov 8, 2022 16:20:58 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

Nov 8, 2022 15:08:47 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

CVS is having the same issues that everyone else in healthcare has:

Not enough pharmacists
They overexpanded, there is a pharmacy on every corner now
The corporate expectations are unreasonable. The quotas they have can be dangerous.
Burnout from the pandemic.
Unreasonable expectations from patients. CVS doesn't control what your prescription costs. That is determined, for the most part, by your health insurance and the pharmaceutical companies

I agree- I've never seen customers taking it out on the pharma techs but if you have any empathy it must be draining- working with customers who are sick and/or in pain and have a prescription in hand but not enough $$ for the co-pay, so you go through GoodRx, etc. and look for discounts. It must be awful to have to send people away without a prescription when it's still under patent and there are no discounts to be had.

I have at Walgreens a few times now.  They were so overwhelmed and only had two techs and the pharmacist working.

The old bat almost made the pharmacist cry.  DH not so quietly asked why the rush was did she plan on dying soon?  He also very loudly when we got up to the counter told the pharmacist she was doing a great job handling everything and don't let mean people make her cry.