djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 3:46:08 GMT -5
Trump is claiming the public ‘won’t stand for it’ if he gets jail time. Sounds like more instigating. I’m a ‘public’ though, and I can certainly stand for it. I’m wondering how many of his minions would even risk their necks for him, seeing what happened to previous minions. i have lost count of how many times he has said this. it has never happened. my guess is, it won't happen.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 3:47:55 GMT -5
I thought the judicial system and process stood up just fine to Trump’s bluster. And Muhammad Ali "stood up just fine" to Joe Frazier in Manila, right? I mean, he won the fight, right? Almost half the country now doubts that the court system is legitimate, just like our elections. Trump is still bashing the judge, the clerk, Michael Cohen, Stormy Daniels, E. Jean Carroll, and any number of other targets of his rage every day. A major topic of discussion in some quarters is whether we are headed toward a civil war because of this verdict. Jurors and court personnel now have to be concerned that some random nut will do them harm, or kill them. Republicans are now actively trying to use the courts for revenge, along with furthering Trump's attacks on their legitimacy. Aileen Cannon is engaged in her own battle to deny justice with her rulings. And while not strictly a judicial matter, Republican senators' refusal to convict in either of the impeachment trials is in the same sense justice denied. Should I go on? exactly. if you survive, but are mortally wounded, and consigned to a hospital for the remainder of your life until, finally, you pass on, did you win?
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 3:49:13 GMT -5
And sentencing Trump to a prison term (which is extremely rare for anyone convicted for such crimes) will change any of that how? It will show that actions have consequences. He's been repeatedly warned. extremely rare is not a matter of fact or law. if i knew i had a 10% chance of dying on my way into work today, i would stay home.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 4, 2024 3:49:38 GMT -5
I’m not sure rich people do trash picking for community service. They probably do something like give a speech for a charitable event, or something like that. Make him do a speech for free, for a charity fighting global warming by promoting windmills. It would kill him. He goes off script all the time. I doubt it would hurt him much, he would just ramble in the speech about how windmills kill whales and how he can't believe he is the most persecuted former President ever.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 3:50:42 GMT -5
MTG wants Congress to ‘defund’ the whole state of NY for ‘what they did to Trump.’ I can’t even, with her. NYS is a net contributor to federal funds. defund away.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 3:52:42 GMT -5
So even if only 10% of persons convicted of these charges is sentenced to prison,do you really want to argue that any of those are less of a threat than Trump? I wouldn't. bingo. do i think it is LIKELY that Marchant will put Trump behind bars? my gut tells me NO. but he certainly has a terrific case for doing so.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 3:54:21 GMT -5
I’m not sure rich people do trash picking for community service. They probably do something like give a speech for a charitable event, or something like that. Make him do a speech for free, for a charity fighting global warming by promoting windmills. It would kill him. he would spend the entire time talking about how unfair it was. i vote against this idea. trash picking it is. suggest you wear the golfing attire rather than the suit and tie.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 3:56:04 GMT -5
A lot of good those pro-trump witnesses did for him. Got him convicted of felonies 34 times. he only called two witnesses. one confirmed that X# of calls were made to Cohen. the other confirmed that Cohen's lawyer was actually working for Trump.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 4:03:54 GMT -5
It is a good point. But we don't currently jail people preemptively. Should Trump be the reason we end that norm? Why do you claim it would be preemptively? People are imprisoned for these charges, though admittedly not the majority. Trump is likely far worse than the average defendant, both in the nature of his offenses and his actions and behavior throughout the process. A prison sentence is warranted, and he has done not one single thing to obviate that. what is the justice system there for? until sentence is handed down, it is there to protect the criminal from injustice. AFTER, it is there to protect the victim from FURTHER injustice. if Trump is allowed to go on with a wristslap, how does that protect the public? that is the real question. if you say "that can't be done", i disagree. it can. we could incarcerate the man, and put him in solitary confinement. that would certainly protect the general public. a number of lesser sentences might ALSO work. the second role of punishment is reform. this idea has kind of gone by the wayside in the last half century, but it was once a thing, even during some of our lifetimes. so the next question is, again: what is most likely to result in reform of Trump? my gut reaction is NOTHING. ergo, the most suitable punishment for the public good overrides the social interest in reform in this case (and many others). he should remain behind bars for the rest of his life, imo. that is what would be best for America.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 4:06:36 GMT -5
Class E, non-violent, first conviction are other major factors that play against it. Tacitly "suggesting" or encouraging violence does not qualify as non-violent. And "first conviction" does not impress me either, considering his very well-known history. The judge is allowed to take both of those into account. i kind of agree with bills on this one point. he will likely be given strict probation, have his passport revoked, and be watched carefully UNTIL he is convicted again. but as i said earlier, it would be better if he were not.
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scgal
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Post by scgal on Jun 4, 2024 4:15:09 GMT -5
Just the fact that he was POTUS he will not see jail time. Nothing less than murder will not see jail time. Even then I highly doubt there would be any
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 4:33:45 GMT -5
Just the fact that he was POTUS he will not see jail time. Nothing less than murder will not see jail time. Even then I highly doubt there would be any you insisted(?) he would not be convicted. now you are insisting(?) he won't see jail time. it might be best to just wait for the ruling, scgal. as i already said: my gut tells me he won't do it. but he certainly has a great case for it.
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Post by Opti on Jun 4, 2024 5:40:57 GMT -5
Just the fact that he was POTUS he will not see jail time. Nothing less than murder will not see jail time. Even then I highly doubt there would be any There is always a first one, first time. I don't think this case will be it, but former governors go to jail. Highly criminal former Presidents should get similar treatment.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 7:14:15 GMT -5
Just the fact that he was POTUS he will not see jail time. Nothing less than murder will not see jail time. Even then I highly doubt there would be any There is always a first one, first time. I don't think this case will be it, but former governors go to jail. Highly criminal former Presidents should get similar treatment. i think it would be a tremendous boost to our legal system and our international standing to do this. i know that MAGA thinks just the opposite, but they are not seeing this situation for what it actually is.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jun 4, 2024 8:36:59 GMT -5
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teen persuasion
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Post by teen persuasion on Jun 4, 2024 9:14:32 GMT -5
Why do you claim it would be preemptively? People are imprisoned for these charges, though admittedly not the majority. Trump is likely far worse than the average defendant, both in the nature of his offenses and his actions and behavior throughout the process. A prison sentence is warranted, and he has done not one single thing to obviate that. what is the justice system there for? until sentence is handed down, it is there to protect the criminal from injustice. AFTER, it is there to protect the victim from FURTHER injustice. if Trump is allowed to go on with a wristslap, how does that protect the public? that is the real question. if you say "that can't be done", i disagree. it can. we could incarcerate the man, and put him in solitary confinement. that would certainly protect the general public. a number of lesser sentences might ALSO work. the second role of punishment is reform. this idea has kind of gone by the wayside in the last half century, but it was once a thing, even during some of our lifetimes. so the next question is, again: what is most likely to result in reform of Trump? my gut reaction is NOTHING. ergo, the most suitable punishment for the public good overrides the social interest in reform in this case (and many others). he should remain behind bars for the rest of his life, imo. that is what would be best for America. As you say, nothing is going to reform Trump. He never pays his bills, so fines are also a moot point. Incarceration is unlikely due to logistics w/ SS protection of a former president. I think he needs to be muted, for the protection of the public. No more public speech, period. No interviews, no news reports, NOTHING. That would probably be the most frustrating punishment as far as Trump is concerned.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 4, 2024 9:24:25 GMT -5
what is the justice system there for? until sentence is handed down, it is there to protect the criminal from injustice. AFTER, it is there to protect the victim from FURTHER injustice. if Trump is allowed to go on with a wristslap, how does that protect the public? that is the real question. if you say "that can't be done", i disagree. it can. we could incarcerate the man, and put him in solitary confinement. that would certainly protect the general public. a number of lesser sentences might ALSO work. the second role of punishment is reform. this idea has kind of gone by the wayside in the last half century, but it was once a thing, even during some of our lifetimes. so the next question is, again: what is most likely to result in reform of Trump? my gut reaction is NOTHING. ergo, the most suitable punishment for the public good overrides the social interest in reform in this case (and many others). he should remain behind bars for the rest of his life, imo. that is what would be best for America. As you say, nothing is going to reform Trump. He never pays his bills, so fines are also a moot point. Incarceration is unlikely due to logistics w/ SS protection of a former president. I think he needs to be muted, for the protection of the public. No more public speech, period. No interviews, no news reports, NOTHING. That would probably be the most frustrating punishment as far as Trump is concerned. Suspension of Trump's First Amendment rights would be a validation of what he claims is happening to him. I don't think we should hand him that victory.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 9:36:18 GMT -5
yeah. he is a big 'ol ho.
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scgal
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Post by scgal on Jun 4, 2024 9:48:58 GMT -5
Just the fact that he was POTUS he will not see jail time. Nothing less than murder will not see jail time. Even then I highly doubt there would be any you insisted(?) he would not be convicted. now you are insisting(?) he won't see jail time. it might be best to just wait for the ruling, scgal . as i already said: my gut tells me he won't do it. but he certainly has a great case for it. Correct I did say that. I was thinking of conviction with jail time. In any case I do believe jail time would be out of the question.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jun 4, 2024 10:13:57 GMT -5
Ah - clarification of where the goal posts were the whole time. Even if the explanation makes little sense. If I were on that jury, I would take a leave of absence, moth ball my house and spend the next 8 months in Europe or Australia, or wherever else I could hide. If they get doxxed their lives will be miserable. www.cnn.com/2024/05/31/tech/threats-doxxing-trump-jurors/index.html
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 4, 2024 10:24:08 GMT -5
i am not sure i would have said he would be jailed, if it were suggested earlier.
again, i think he SHOULD be jailed. i just don't FEEL that he will.
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jun 4, 2024 12:14:24 GMT -5
I will stick with what I said early on in this process. After all of his trials are completed, I will be in agreement with the MAGAts that Donald Trump should not be in prison. Anything short of his execution will be insufficient.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jun 4, 2024 14:35:47 GMT -5
I think he's going to get the max fine on each conviction and 7 days in jail.
In NY, you get 1/3 of your sentence off a local jail sentence for good behavior, so that makes it 5 days. Just enough time to be put in isolation for infectious disease screening, and then a day in the general population.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jun 4, 2024 15:27:10 GMT -5
I think he's going to get the max fine on each conviction and 7 days in jail. In NY, you get 1/3 of your sentence off a local jail sentence for good behavior, so that makes it 5 days. Just enough time to be put in isolation for infectious disease screening, and then a day in the general population. He wouldn’t ever go to Gen pop. But maybe they can do a cavity search.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jun 4, 2024 20:25:30 GMT -5
Seems the U.S. congressman's son knows his dad and other trump supporters are bats hit crazy.
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Pink Cashmere
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Post by Pink Cashmere on Jun 4, 2024 20:37:53 GMT -5
Seems the U.S. congressman's son knows his dad and other trump supporters are bats hit crazy. I’m sure that little boy is in a world of trouble with his parents now. My emojis aren’t acting right, so just imagine a sad face here.
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Post by empress of self-improvement on Jun 4, 2024 20:47:09 GMT -5
Seems the U.S. congressman's son knows his dad and other trump supporters are bats hit crazy. I’m sure that little boy is in a world of trouble with his parents now. My emojis aren’t acting right, so just imagine a sad face here. Don't be sad Pink. The kid's dad thought it was funny too. I read about it earlier.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jun 4, 2024 22:15:30 GMT -5
I think he's going to get the max fine on each conviction and 7 days in jail. In NY, you get 1/3 of your sentence off a local jail sentence for good behavior, so that makes it 5 days. Just enough time to be put in isolation for infectious disease screening, and then a day in the general population. He wouldn’t ever go to Gen pop. But maybe they can do a cavity search. Cavity search is standard procedure when admitted to jail. I would not want to be that corrections officer……
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jun 4, 2024 22:18:26 GMT -5
He wouldn’t ever go to Gen pop. But maybe they can do a cavity search. Cavity search is standard procedure when admitted to jail. I would not want to be that corrections officer…… Hazmat suit.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jun 5, 2024 0:42:26 GMT -5
He wouldn’t ever go to Gen pop. But maybe they can do a cavity search. Cavity search is standard procedure when admitted to jail. I would not want to be that corrections officer…… I’m thinking the opposite - people might pay good money to harshly prod that guy’s asshole. All the while saying that he was asking for it, and prisoners just let guards grab em by the prostrate, so he should be enjoying this.
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