Moving to a plant based diet ... transition phase!

[pulmonarymd]

Aug 18, 2020 19:41:58 GMT -5 Happy prose said:

Aug 18, 2020 19:13:22 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

No, there are injectable medications that are used for weight loss in prediabetics, and some medications used off label to help people lose weight like metformin

I never knew that. Would that work for the very obese, as opposed to having that surgery? 

Not to the same extent. Surgery has been shown to be the best way to have a significant, durable weight loss for the morbidly obese. More patients lost weight, lost more weight, and kept it off than diets or medications. If any other intervention had the success rate that diets have, we would be clamoring for research to find a better treatment

[Cookies Galore]

Aug 18, 2020 18:42:03 GMT -5 Happy prose said:

Aug 18, 2020 14:15:56 GMT -5 Cookies Galore said:

Just needed some emphasis.

Why, did I sound un compassionate? 

You said "put the fork down" and that surgery was a quick fix. That comes across as lacking compassion.
Weight loss surgery is not an easy fix. It's hard work before and after, and demands life-long commitment for it to be a success.

[Happy prose]

Aug 18, 2020 19:58:00 GMT -5 Cookies Galore said:

Aug 18, 2020 18:42:03 GMT -5 Happy prose said:

Why, did I sound un compassionate? 

You said "put the fork down" and that surgery was a quick fix. That comes across as lacking compassion.
Weight loss surgery is not an easy fix. It's hard work before and after, and demands life-long commitment for it to be a success.

Read it however you want!

[countrygirl2]

It's called Ozempic. She is not a large boned person, her weight was awful. And since she has Williams Syndrone you cannot reason with her very well. She gets mad when you try and get her to exercise, she is very sedentary. Before she got on Jardiance she would eat and eat. We had to go to wheat bread and things to keep her from inhaling bread. She still loves bread.

She asked the doc today if she could have whole milk, I got her on 2% months ago and she doesn't care for it. He told her no. Also dad was wanting to get ice cream today, I nixed that.  We have dessert once a week and hubs is always wanting more. I told him, this is not just about weight loss its about her not becoming a full blown diabetic. We don't need that with all her other issues. I just can't deal with that on top of all the rest.

The doc said watch the smoothies too, she needs fruit but I'm going to put less in one.

Her anxiety and other meds, stabilize her pretty good but she still gets really mad at times. 

[countrygirl2]

That's what I wonder and need to ask the doc. How will she keep this off, will it be a temporary fix or something she has to be on forever.  

From what I have read about 130 is her ideal weight, I would be happy with her at 150. Seems that might be more sustainable for her. I talked to them about helping me lose, but I take several meds and with my history of problems with drugs probably not a good idea.  Didn't seem to be much they could do. So I'm on my own.

I was going to treadmill this evening, but the old foot would not let me, the pain was to bad, sigh.

[Deleted]

Aug 18, 2020 19:52:14 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

Surgery has been shown to be the best way to have a significant, durable weight loss for the morbidly obese. More patients lost weight, lost more weight, and kept it off than diets or medications. If any other intervention had the success rate that diets have, we would be clamoring for research to find a better treatment

I used to listen to a podcast called "Sound Medicine", which was discontinued- I really miss it. In one episode they said that weight-loss surgery actually changes your metabolism. I once met a woman who'd had t and felt comfortable enough to ask her if, in retrospect, she could have done it on her own- she was clearly very disciplined about making sure everything she ate was nutrient-rich and not enough to stretch her reduced stomach, and had kept the weight off. She said she'd tried everything and hadn't been able to lose.

Going back to the OT- I've been "almost" vegetarian for years now. I started it to keep my weight down and keep my cholesterol numbers good. I have lean meat or fish once a week and I do eat dairy. I'm very active and have no health problems that I know of. I think that including dairy and making sure that the starches I eat are mostly healthy ones (bulghur, quinoa, barley, beans) helps. I also like protein bars but have to look for the ones that aren't sugar bombs (or loaded with artificial sweeteners instead).

I did go "off the wagon" during the trip to SC to visit family.  Ah, the pork from DBIL's smoker!   Couldn't have missed that.  Back to my routines again.

[Lizard Queen]

It's one thing to try, and turn to surgery when you're unsuccessful after trying for a while, and another to turn straight to the surgery. If I remember correctly,Carl was a fitness buff before life/work got in the way. How about we give him a chance to see how he does with his plan first?

[NoNamePerson]

I have two friends who have had the surgery. One didn't get into much of it with me but one did. She had to have extensive counseling and I gather from a questionnaire that they asked all kinds of questions about past efforts to lose. I know this because she would periodically call me to ask if I remembered what dates we were members of sports club and played racquetball, when we were members of Y, when we used to walk at night after work and so on. She was asking about many years prior to her considering the surgery. So I got the impression it wasn't a just walk in and say "hey doc I want this surgery"

One has kept her weight off and is very conscious of her eating habits. The other has kept most off but has regained some. She says it's her intake of wine but those are her words so I just take it at that.

It's a very personal thing and a person should do what is best for them emotionally and health wise is my take on it. Which ever way they go 

[pulmonarymd]

The success of the surgery is very dependent on patient selection. The programs that have better outcomes screen candidates better, and make them do nutrition and psychological counseling, so they can screen out those who are looking for a quick fix, do not understand the lifestyle change this involves, or are otherwise unsuitable. Just like everything else, the more effort an individual puts into something, the more they get out of it.

[weltschmerz]

I don't know anyone who has had weight-loss surgery.

[Deleted]

Aug 19, 2020 13:21:52 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

I don't know anyone who has had weight-loss surgery.

That's interesting because I know at least four.  In addition to my son-in-law, there were two co-workers and a girl I went to college with.  One of the two co-workers had phenomenal results and has kept it off for at least a decade.  The other co-worker lost a fair amount quickly and then stopped.  She hasn't gained any back, but she is overweight still.

I saw the girl I went to college with at a party a few years later so this was easily almost 40 years ago.  She wasn't overweight in college, but that is meaningless.  You never know who is purging, etc. unless  you are there.  She said she got up to 200 pounds before the surgery, which was at the time an unbelievable weight to me.  We considered 125 pounds fat.  Yes, we were naive.  Anyway, she said it had been the most miserable year of her life because of diarrhea, etc.  She would not do it again if she had known how bad it would be.  But she did look good.

I'm sure the surgery has come a long way since in almost 40 years. 

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Aug 19, 2020 13:21:52 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

I don't know anyone who has had weight-loss surgery.

I do.  I know 2.  One had a very successful outcome and is doing very well.  She has complied with everything and it has worked well for her.

The second person I know who had it died last March, after about 5 years of hell.  The surgeon who did the surgery f#$%ed it up, and she had multiple surgeries trying to correct it.  She lost so much of her gut that she could no longer get nutrients that way.  While the surgeon screwed up, the patient was not horribly compliant either and was very likely an extremely poor choice of patient to have this done. 

It all comes down to patient choice and compliance.  There are a lot of psychological issues involved, and you really need to deal with those too. 

[Deleted]

Aug 19, 2020 12:29:57 GMT -5 pulmonarymd said:

The success of the surgery is very dependent on patient selection. The programs that have better outcomes screen candidates better, and make them do nutrition and psychological counseling, so they can screen out those who are looking for a quick fix, do not understand the lifestyle change this involves, or are otherwise unsuitable. Just like everything else, the more effort an individual puts into something, the more they get out of it.

Yeah, I used to watch "My 600-lb. Life" and it was pretty clear that a lot of people had emotional issues with food that had to be addressed so they didn't fall back into the same patterns after surgery.  If you're overeating for comfort, to alleviate boredom, or as some other way to cope, you need to find new ways to cope.

[nidena]

I have a friend who had gastric surgery.  She lost a hundred or so pounds from the 320lbs that she weighed.  She has since gained it all back because she eats her emotions and THAT was not addressed on a continuing basis.  It was discussed when she had it but it didn't continue after the second or third month post-op.

I, myself, had liposuction in 2009 to help meet and maintain standards for the AF.  When I gain weight, it's all (at the time) hips and boobs.  And the AF PT standards measures members at their illiac crest.  So, I had it all sucked off.  Okay, not all of it.  lol.  I was able to maintain that for the seven years that I was still Active Duty after the surgery.

Then I had a hysterectomy and had to sit on my butt for a month in 2016, followed by a three month road trip when I got out of the service.  Let's just say: I'm really glad nobody is measuring the circumference of my hip bones now. 

[TheHaitian]

Aug 18, 2020 9:48:46 GMT -5 @bamafan1954 said:

Aug 17, 2020 21:48:39 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Not elephant in the room, my dr keeps pushing that also : I am not interested.

And yes at my size my insurance would cover it: still not interested.

And no, not a typo.

It just dawned on me that you may not understand the phrase "address the elephant in the room."  It wasn't a comment about you per se.  The phrase refers to a topic that everyone is ignoring.  For example, there is an elephant in a room but everyone chats as if there isn't.

I know English is my third language but come on...

You are posting in a thread I started about my decision to switch up my diet, referred to me by name, even made sure to refer to my weight... yet the elephant in the room that is not being addressed is not about “me” per se?

Are you sure I do not understand the phrase? That you were not trying to refer that I may have a “problem” that may need medical intervention and everyone else is being to nice not mentioning it but you will?

Pardon me if I got it wrong... continue on!

[TheHaitian]

All is good, still in transition. I think I still have some pasta with organic ground beef left but today was the first full day of plant base food besides my protein powder. Baby steps... looking up ideas / recipes so my diet does not become blend and eating the same thing over and over.

Thank god for the internet , YouTube and Instagram... even tik tok. Now just need to set aside the time to actually try them. I feel it would be unfair to ask that of my wife or MIL; and I enjoy cooking. Just too lazy or do not make the time for it.

Since I am overhauling my diet and fitness decided to just go broke. Went back to see the urologist, I am sterile and have low testosterone. Unfortunately it is not a condition that is “fixable”; I will have to keep taking whatever works for the rest of my life. I tried a cream in the past but it did not work and corona happened and stopped. So we decided to start fresh, I am going back for bloodwork this week to get my testosterone level tested and we will try something else and see if it works or help.

Also dusting off my sleep apnea machine because I have to admit “sleep” or good sleep wether I like it or not is an important part of this and my severe sleep apnea may hinder my progress. So will call to schedule an appointment with the new specialists my primary care doctor suggested and go from there. Will start using the machine tomorrow night so they have a couple of nights reading to go off. I hate using it because it is very uncomfortable, I always unconsciously take it off in the middle of the night or at times had made my sleep worse and 6 years later have yet to find one that is convenient and actually helps. But will continue...

Besides that, I started taking fish oil, multivatimin and B12 (last one is because of the plant based diet). Next need to work on a balanced schedule and also how I can take more off my wife plate to help her out (she starts her online PhD classes next week, on top of working from home and overseeing my daughter online classes with the help of her mom). I encouraged my brother to extend his stay in NJ another 2-3 weeks, so he asked his parole officer today and the parole officer have to green light it with the ICE officer overseeing his case. If they do not approve he comes back Saturday and if they do he can stay there till 09/09.

It has been nice having the whole basement to myself again with him here; did not realize how much I like my solitude until I was stuck here With him for 5 months.

[Deleted]

I'm glad you're addressing the sleep issue with a CPAP machine. I had one week earlier this month when poison ivy kept disturbing my sleep. Just plain silly compared to other medical issues, but I cud tell the difference in my workouts due to lack of sleep.

My sister served pasta made with edamame bean flour. I've tried pasta made from black bean and from chickpeas; both were soggier than wheat pasta. The edamame wasn't- it had a nice al dente texture. Better for your blood sugar and a1c, too.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Carl, there's something about too much soy and men's bodies that can go wonky.  I know it's WHY my DH avoids soy but I don't remember any of the details.  Might be something for you to look at? 

[Lizard Queen]

Aug 20, 2020 7:32:03 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

Carl, there's something about too much soy and men's bodies that can go wonky.  I know it's WHY my DH avoids soy but I don't remember any of the details.  Might be something for you to look at? 

Soy is a female hormone, or boosts female hormones, and it seems to be in practically everything these days. (I've got 2 friends with issues with soy.)

[Opti]

Aug 20, 2020 7:32:03 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

Carl, there's something about too much soy and men's bodies that can go wonky.  I know it's WHY my DH avoids soy but I don't remember any of the details.  Might be something for you to look at? 

Soy contains phytoestrogens, can mimic estrogen in the body. 

[Opti]

Aug 20, 2020 7:25:44 GMT -5 @athena53 said:

I'm glad you're addressing the sleep issue with a CPAP machine. I had one week earlier this month when poison ivy kept disturbing my sleep. Just plain silly compared to other medical issues, but I cud tell the difference in my workouts due to lack of sleep.

My sister served pasta made with edamame bean flour. I've tried pasta made from black bean and from chickpeas; both were soggier than wheat pasta. The edamame wasn't- it had a nice al dente texture. Better for your blood sugar and a1c, too.

I think it also depends who makes it. I believe its Explore Cuisine that makes a very good red lentil pasta. I tried Barilla's on sale and hated it. 

[Deleted]

Aug 20, 2020 7:46:04 GMT -5 Opti said:

I think it also depends who makes it. I believe its Explore Cuisine that makes a very good red lentil pasta. I tried Barilla's on sale and hated it. 

That's the brand! I just did a search on "Edamame pasta Costco" since that's where they bought it (but in SC and I'm in MO) and the picture of the box was what I remembered. My Costco run is tomorrow so I hope I can find it.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Aug 20, 2020 7:42:06 GMT -5 Opti said:

Aug 20, 2020 7:32:03 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

Carl, there's something about too much soy and men's bodies that can go wonky.  I know it's WHY my DH avoids soy but I don't remember any of the details.  Might be something for you to look at? 

Soy contains phytoestrogens, can mimic estrogen in the body. 

Huh.  Good to know. 

Thank you all for the info.  Clearly Carl needs to ignore my advice. 

[Lizard Queen]

Aug 20, 2020 8:15:29 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

Aug 20, 2020 7:42:06 GMT -5 Opti said:

Soy contains phytoestrogens, can mimic estrogen in the body. 

Huh.  Good to know. 

Thank you all for the info.  Clearly Carl needs to ignore my advice. 

I think it was a good idea bringing it up. My DH says a lot of the protein supplements contain soy, so it's a good thing to keep in mind if a man has low testosterone.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Yeah, I know soy is in a lot of things and DH has his preferred brands that don't contain it.  He'll eat stuff with soy, he just tries to avoid it.  My WAG would be that he avoids it  in 90-95% of the time.  It's eating out and frozen foods that probably are the worst offenders for him for soy.  But I digress. 

[wvugurl26]

Soy is everywhere especially convenience stuff. I can't have it. I'll be sick. My dad's theory is that it's a cheap filler. My DH has slowly learned that this is why I make most things from scratch. He used to complain but know he's experienced seeing it in every dang thing.

The latest was the chicken fajitas at Aldi. I thought they'd be an easy quick lunch and we have a bunch of tortillas to use up. Had soy protein in them.

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Aug 18, 2020 9:48:46 GMT -5 @bamafan1954 said:

Aug 17, 2020 21:48:39 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Not elephant in the room, my dr keeps pushing that also : I am not interested.

And yes at my size my insurance would cover it: still not interested.

And no, not a typo.

It just dawned on me that you may not understand the phrase "address the elephant in the room."  It wasn't a comment about you per se.  The phrase refers to a topic that everyone is ignoring.  For example, there is an elephant in a room but everyone chats as if there isn't.

12 to 13 years ago, my husband used this phrase in an email conversation with his siblings and some of his adult nieces and nephews. One of his nieces and her mother/his sister have not forgiven him because they decided he was calling the niece an elephant. 

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Aug 18, 2020 21:02:22 GMT -5 Happy prose said:

Aug 18, 2020 19:58:00 GMT -5 Cookies Galore said:

You said "put the fork down" and that surgery was a quick fix. That comes across as lacking compassion.
Weight loss surgery is not an easy fix. It's hard work before and after, and demands life-long commitment for it to be a success.

Read it however you want!

That's how interpretation works. It doesn't matter how you intended it as the speaker/author. It matters how it was received. 
It is a rude, judgmental, shallow-assumptioned phrase to use. I saw that as a naturally thin person with an eating disorder who cannot always just "put down the fork". 

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Aug 19, 2020 13:21:52 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

I don't know anyone who has had weight-loss surgery.

Maybe it's not done as much in Canada? 
I personally know three off the top of my head, and I haven't finished my coffee yet

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Aug 20, 2020 2:24:34 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

All is good, still in transition. I think I still have some pasta with organic ground beef left but today was the first full day of plant base food besides my protein powder. Baby steps... looking up ideas / recipes so my diet does not become blend and eating the same thing over and over.

Thank god for the internet , YouTube and Instagram... even tik tok. Now just need to set aside the time to actually try them. I feel it would be unfair to ask that of my wife or MIL; and I enjoy cooking. Just too lazy or do not make the time for it.

Since I am overhauling my diet and fitness decided to just go broke. Went back to see the urologist, I am sterile and have low testosterone. Unfortunately it is not a condition that is “fixable”; I will have to keep taking whatever works for the rest of my life. I tried a cream in the past but it did not work and corona happened and stopped. So we decided to start fresh, I am going back for bloodwork this week to get my testosterone level tested and we will try something else and see if it works or help.

Also dusting off my sleep apnea machine because I have to admit “sleep” or good sleep wether I like it or not is an important part of this and my severe sleep apnea may hinder my progress. So will call to schedule an appointment with the new specialists my primary care doctor suggested and go from there. Will start using the machine tomorrow night so they have a couple of nights reading to go off. I hate using it because it is very uncomfortable, I always unconsciously take it off in the middle of the night or at times had made my sleep worse and 6 years later have yet to find one that is convenient and actually helps. But will continue...

Besides that, I started taking fish oil, multivatimin and B12 (last one is because of the plant based diet). Next need to work on a balanced schedule and also how I can take more off my wife plate to help her out (she starts her online PhD classes next week, on top of working from home and overseeing my daughter online classes with the help of her mom). I encouraged my brother to extend his stay in NJ another 2-3 weeks, so he asked his parole officer today and the parole officer have to green light it with the ICE officer overseeing his case. If they do not approve he comes back Saturday and if they do he can stay there till 09/09.

It has been nice having the whole basement to myself again with him here; did not realize how much I like my solitude until I was stuck here With him for 5 months.

How's the fish oil going? My husband had to try a few different ones before he found one that didn't constantly make everything taste fishy. 
He uses this one: