pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Mar 25, 2020 12:09:49 GMT -5
That may be true, but one of the biggest risk factor is age. The more old people, the more deaths. Now with a similar age distribution and similar penetration of infection, one would assume a healthier population to do better
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Mar 25, 2020 12:14:12 GMT -5
CBS is reporting that Spain now has more deaths than China. Spain's number of deaths is doubling every three days and so is the US (per the NYT graph) Doesn't Spain and Italy have healthcare for all ? This isn't a slam, but curiosity of its effect on deaths. yes, they do. And Italy's healthcare system is ranked #2 in the world. Italy's problem is that their population is old, and they all smoke. I'm not sure about Spain, but they do tend older and they also smoke. Italy actually has more hospital beds, doctors, nurses, and ventilators per person than the US does. Our numbers are tracking Italy's. We're going to start seeing widespread deaths and insufficient manpower, equipment, and space to care for our sick too.
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kadee79
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Post by kadee79 on Mar 25, 2020 13:33:46 GMT -5
I haven't read all the pages of this thread, but in Washington state, close to Seattle....they have put up field hospitals...and that may be what has to happen in many areas when we run out of beds in our normal hospitals.
Think....like MASH, large tents with cots for the patients. One is on a soccer field up there.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Mar 25, 2020 13:37:30 GMT -5
Doesn't Spain and Italy have healthcare for all ? This isn't a slam, but curiosity of its effect on deaths. yes, they do. And Italy's healthcare system is ranked #2 in the world. Italy's problem is that their population is old, and they all smoke. I'm not sure about Spain, but they do tend older and they also smoke. Italy actually has more hospital beds, doctors, nurses, and ventilators per person than the US does. Our numbers are tracking Italy's. We're going to start seeing widespread deaths and insufficient manpower, equipment, and space to care for our sick too. bingo.
and if we had adequate federal leadership, we could count on them to step into the void, calm the populace, and give us some national unity.
the only logical conclusion one can reach is that this will become worse in the US than Italy.
only a wild optimist like me could postulate otherwise.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Mar 25, 2020 13:38:21 GMT -5
PS- we passed Italy in active cases this morning.
congratulations, Trump, you finally made the US #1 in something.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Mar 25, 2020 13:39:08 GMT -5
That may be true, but one of the biggest risk factor is age. The more old people, the more deaths. Now with a similar age distribution and similar penetration of infection, one would assume a healthier population to do better our population is wildly unhealthy.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Mar 25, 2020 14:49:49 GMT -5
Doesn't Spain and Italy have healthcare for all ? This isn't a slam, but curiosity of its effect on deaths. yes, they do. And Italy's healthcare system is ranked #2 in the world. Italy's problem is that their population is old, and they all smoke. I'm not sure about Spain, but they do tend older and they also smoke. Italy actually has more hospital beds, doctors, nurses, and ventilators per person than the US does. Our numbers are tracking Italy's. We're going to start seeing widespread deaths and insufficient manpower, equipment, and space to care for our sick too. Plus, they have extremely close-knit families. You'll often have grandparents living in the same house as teens and little kids in school.
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Mar 26, 2020 7:49:19 GMT -5
Justt bumping
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laterbloomer
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Post by laterbloomer on Mar 26, 2020 7:52:30 GMT -5
For the record, I don't believe what China is reporting these days. I think they are still way up there. These are the people that tried to hide the fact that there was a deadly virus on the loose in the first place.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Mar 26, 2020 8:38:02 GMT -5
PS- we passed Italy in active cases this morning. congratulations, Trump, you finally made the US #1 in something. dj, Where did you get that? I'm not seeing it on the JohnsHopins site
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2020 8:42:25 GMT -5
Doesn't Spain and Italy have healthcare for all ? This isn't a slam, but curiosity of its effect on deaths. Healthcare for all doesn't help when you don't have enough equipment to cover your needs in a pandemic. Our hospitals are no better equipped to handle a pandemic than theirs are. While healthcare for all is a huge benefit in reducing the need for hospitalization through early intervention, there is no vaccine against this novel virus and no viable treatment to stop it; therefore, early intervention simply isn't possible at this time. Hell, we aren't even able to widely test for it yet. Pandemics are a bit different, don'cha know. You're making my point for me, thanks !
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Mar 26, 2020 8:51:24 GMT -5
I would point out that countries that do have COVID19 under control DO have universal healthcare. S Korea, Taiwan, Japan, Singapore.
Of course, they also have testing, competent leadership at the top, and widespread use of masks in the population.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2020 8:51:52 GMT -5
Lots of premise there. You need to answer them. I have have a fatalistic attitude, don't care, and are wrong. I need an emoji that shows a fish swimming past a baited hook. Look up P/A posting, lol. So, we have no control over anything? I’ll remember that when conservatives complain about an issue. You guys talk about planning for emergencies from a monetary standpoint. Why does that not carry over to other areas? The things I outlined were not outrageous, nor are they unreasonable. The government had a practice scenario outlining these events just a few months ago. Why were we not at least trying to prepare for this based on those lessons? I’m sure that telling states to figure it out themselves was not the lesson. But with all your pronouncements, you are surprisingly silent with your opinions on this. Strange, but continue to belittle my comments "So we have no control over anything" Where was an issue of control in my post you're quoting here, lol. Could you be confusing it with your premise in your previous post ? You spent the whole rest of your post answering that, lol. Starting to feel a little left out over here, as you talk to yourself. Kind of funny; Usage of the terms 'so we have' and 'so you believe' along with 'got it'. Dislikes Trump with a vengence. Concerned about the U.S. making their own product. Seemed to home in on OC and jma23 in that first hundred posts. Claims an actual working knowledge of physics, but answers with standard alarmist narrative in regards to AGW. Is it time for me to use the 'enter code' button yet ?
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Mar 26, 2020 8:52:52 GMT -5
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 26, 2020 8:56:08 GMT -5
Those countries are also more society oriented than most Western Cultures are. It's much easier to get people to comply when they accept that the lives of the many outweigh the lives of the few.
We definitely do not have that mindset in America as the mass hoarding of toilet paper proves.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Mar 26, 2020 9:00:07 GMT -5
So, we have no control over anything? I’ll remember that when conservatives complain about an issue. You guys talk about planning for emergencies from a monetary standpoint. Why does that not carry over to other areas? The things I outlined were not outrageous, nor are they unreasonable. The government had a practice scenario outlining these events just a few months ago. Why were we not at least trying to prepare for this based on those lessons? I’m sure that telling states to figure it out themselves was not the lesson. But with all your pronouncements, you are surprisingly silent with your opinions on this. Strange, but continue to belittle my comments "So we have no control over anything" Where was an issue of control in my post you're quoting here, lol. Could you be confusing it with your premise in your previous post ? You spent the whole rest of your post answering that, lol. Starting to feel a little left out over here, as you talk to yourself. So, should we attempt to intervene or not. You have stated nothing we could have done would make any difference, so how far do you draw that line?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2020 9:19:05 GMT -5
"So we have no control over anything" Where was an issue of control in my post you're quoting here, lol. Could you be confusing it with your premise in your previous post ? You spent the whole rest of your post answering that, lol. Starting to feel a little left out over here, as you talk to yourself. So, should we attempt to intervene or not. You have stated nothing we could have done would make any difference, so how far do you draw that line? This would be your passive post. I've added to my post #252. People cannot change their syntax without considerable effort.
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Mar 26, 2020 9:37:37 GMT -5
So, should we attempt to intervene or not. You have stated nothing we could have done would make any difference, so how far do you draw that line? This would be your passive post. I've added to my post #252. People cannot change their syntax without considerable effort. Either be serious or not, but I am not going tpo be back and forth with this nonsense. Clearly you have no interest in dialoguwe
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 26, 2020 11:54:05 GMT -5
Get trump off the air across the country or just stand silently in the background. Seattle NPR Station Says It Will No Longer Carry Donald Trump’s Coronavirus Briefings Live Because Of MisinformationAn NPR station in Seattle said that it no longer will carry live coverage of President Donald Trump’s coronavirus briefings because of concerns that they feature unchecked misleading or false information. “KUOW is monitoring White House briefings for the latest news on the coronavirus — and we will continue to share all news relevant to Washington State with our listeners,” the station tweeted. “However, we will not be airing the briefings live due to a pattern of false or misleading information provided that cannot be fact checked in real time.” Most recently, Trump has called for lifting of social distancing guidelines in the near future, perhaps by Easter, even though public health professionals are still grappling with the spread of the virus. He also has made false claims about the availability of tests, the timeline for finding a vaccine and the potential benefits of a treatment that includes the ingredient chloroquine. While there is some promising study of its potential use, it has not it has not been approved for treatment. NBC News reported on one Arizona man who died after ingesting chloroquine phosphate, and his wife said that they learned about its use after watching a briefing. Seattle NPR Station Says It Will No Longer Carry Donald Trump’s Coronavirus Briefings Live Because Of Misinformation
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Mar 26, 2020 13:04:30 GMT -5
That may be true, but one of the biggest risk factor is age. The more old people, the more deaths. Now with a similar age distribution and similar penetration of infection, one would assume a healthier population to do better and Spain is the "Florida of Northern Europe" for many people as it has very pleasant weather and a LCOL. So that contributes to the age distribution in that country
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Mar 26, 2020 13:15:04 GMT -5
Get trump off the air across the country or just stand silently in the background. Trump's approval rating has hit an all time high. A record number of people are happy with the way he is handling the situation. Either people are comforted by hearing what they want to hear. Or we are all being too hard on the guy.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Mar 26, 2020 13:15:28 GMT -5
Those countries are also more society oriented than most Western Cultures are. It's much easier to get people to comply when they accept that the lives of the many outweigh the lives of the few. We definitely do not have that mindset in America as the mass hoarding of toilet paper proves. Well, I can tell you that in Singapore they don't only test a lot more than they do here, they are also very pro-active in testing (you come from abroad and you will be tested and told to self quarantine until the results are in) and quite aggressive in enforcing the self quarantine requirement. If you break it and you are a foreigner living there you will be deported on the first occasion out forever persona non grata. If you are Singaporean you go to jail for it. They have closed their borders to all tourists and any essentially to almost all business visits by enforcing a 2 week quarantine for all business visitors.
Hoarding was a one day thing twice: once after the early cases were discovered and the other last week when the borders were mostly closed. Both times their prime minister stepped in and calmed down the masses by addressing the people directly. Next day it all went back to the new normal. Not as busy outside as before and people are keeping their distance from each other, but that's it.
As reported by my inside source in Singapore (aka DS1)
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mollyc
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Post by mollyc on Mar 26, 2020 14:07:00 GMT -5
As of yesterday afternoon, of our 9 cases, 1 was in ICU and 5 were recovered and off isolation.
Waiting to see what happens today.
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deminmaine
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Post by deminmaine on Mar 26, 2020 14:15:23 GMT -5
Gad this is like arguing climate change all over again, but with an active body count. Yippee!
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Mar 26, 2020 14:30:49 GMT -5
Get trump off the air across the country or just stand silently in the background. Trump's approval rating has hit an all time high. A record number of people are happy with the way he is handling the situation. Either people are comforted by hearing what they want to hear. Or we are all being too hard on the guy. Cue the music:
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Mar 26, 2020 14:32:58 GMT -5
Great song!
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Mar 26, 2020 14:34:03 GMT -5
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 26, 2020 16:17:32 GMT -5
Get trump off the air across the country or just stand silently in the background. Trump's approval rating has hit an all time high. A record number of people are happy with the way he is handling the situation. Either people are comforted by hearing what they want to hear. Or we are all being too hard on the guy. Your first possible assumption.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2020 8:54:43 GMT -5
This would be your passive post. I've added to my post #252. People cannot change their syntax without considerable effort. Either be serious or not, but I am not going tpo be back and forth with this nonsense. Clearly you have no interest in dialoguwe "Clearly", lol. Like I said, very difficult. C'est la vie
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2020 9:14:12 GMT -5
Get trump off the air across the country or just stand silently in the background. Trump's approval rating has hit an all time high. A record number of people are happy with the way he is handling the situation. Either people are comforted by hearing what they want to hear. Or we are all being too hard on the guy. I was surprised. Was it Gallup ? Caught the tail end on the NBC news. Doing less equals higher approval ratings ? Maybe he's learned a little after all the complaints about executive over reach.
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