Getting my stuff together

[debthaven]

That is all perfectly reasonable. Sorry Drama if I misunderstood.

[Sam_2.0]

Oh, goodness. It's been a week here

To clarify, I'm not looking for an open marriage necessarily. But I'm also not sold on the idea that one person is all you need for everything forever. I'm not feeling the need to run, but I'm also kind of depressed at the option of staying too. I'm getting out more with friends and doing more things on my own without H, making new friends that don't know him at all. I realized most of my friends were just his that I had adopted when we got together. Its nice to get my own group.

To H's credit, he did go get a full checkup and bloodwork done this week. The Dr said she will help work on some physical issues he's been having which should also help with his mental state.

We actually got a refund this year because he finally had taxes withheld from his checks, so that was awesome. Getting the finances in order slowly but surely. Working on small projects around the house to keep up on things. Trying to keep it all in reasonable shape.

[swamp]

I think the whole notion that one person can give you what you need for life is bullshit.   

[geenamercile]

Sam sounds similar to what I am doing.  The funny thing is DH and I had a more of an open marriage before all of this stuff.  We would play with others together.  But since all this started we have stopped that altogether.  

[Sam_2.0]

Apr 6, 2019 7:38:49 GMT -5 geenamercile said:

Sam sounds similar to what I am doing.  The funny thing is DH and I had a more of an open marriage before all of this stuff.  We would play with others together.  But since all this started we have stopped that altogether.  

I wish we could do things, but separately I am at zero attraction level with H. I go along sometimes when I can to foster relationship and help meet needs he has. But I never wish to start it with him.

It's so hard to tell someone you have an emotional bond with that you have zero sexual desire for them. He is a good person, honestly. He loves his kids. He is a good dad, especially now. You all honestly would enjoy hanging out with him were you to meet him in person. He loves deeply and fier6and he is kind.

And yet my soul just knows. He isnt it for me. He doesnt fit my missing pieces, or at least most of them.

How do you call it when the other one honestly is a good soul? I talk shit about him here when I am mad. And he has deserved a lot of the criticism he brought. But he is also a good soul and I dont share all the good. I stuck too, and I dont share all that. There's balance to be brought especially when only one person tells the story.

[Pants]

Apr 7, 2019 21:29:56 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Apr 6, 2019 7:38:49 GMT -5 geenamercile said:

Sam sounds similar to what I am doing.  The funny thing is DH and I had a more of an open marriage before all of this stuff.  We would play with others together.  But since all this started we have stopped that altogether.  

I wish we could do things, but separately [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/wink.png" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png" alt="" class="smile"] I am at zero attraction level with H. I go along sometimes when I can to foster relationship and help meet needs he has. But I never wish to start it with him.

It's so hard to tell someone you have an emotional bond with that you have zero sexual desire for them. He is a good person, honestly. He loves his kids. He is a good dad, especially now. You all honestly would enjoy hanging out with him were you to meet him in person. He loves deeply and fier6and he is kind.

And yet my soul just knows. He isnt it for me. He doesnt fit my missing pieces, or at least most of them.

How do you call it when the other one honestly is a good soul? I talk shit about him here when I am mad. And he has deserved a lot of the criticism he brought. But he is also a good soul and I dont share all the good. I stuck too, and I dont share all that. There's balance to be brought especially when only one person tells the story.

Have you read this? I think about it a lot. 

therumpus.net/2011/06/dear-sugar-the-rumpus-advice-column-77-the-truth-that-lives-there/

[Sam_2.0]

Oh, goodness. I needed to see that.

But it's not making this easier on me.

[Pants]

Apr 7, 2019 22:12:07 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Oh, goodness. I needed to see that.

But it's not making this easier on me.

I know. Like I said, I think about it a lot.

[Works4me]

Lost 2 Water - were you ever really sexually attracted to him?

[lurkyloo]

I’m sorry, Sam.  I think you just make the best decisions you can, and treat everyone with respect, including yourself and H.  Keep in mind that in the long term, it’s probably not great for his self-esteem to be married to someone who isn’t attracted to him-not your fault whatsoever, but sometimes you gotta accept your truth. I think the bandaid‘s gonna come off one way or the other.  It’s up to you whether you want to rip it off all at once or go for a more gradual approach.

Whatever you decide, we always have your back 

[gs11rmb]

Apr 7, 2019 21:53:39 GMT -5 Pants said:

Apr 7, 2019 21:29:56 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Have you read this? I think about it a lot. 

therumpus.net/2011/06/dear-sugar-the-rumpus-advice-column-77-the-truth-that-lives-there/

That was an interesting article.  I did notice that none of the women had children, which just complicates matters so much more.

As an outsider looking in via a message board I think that Sam knows she needs to 'go'.  Figuring out how to do it with the least amount of damage to the people she loves the most is the hardest part.

[lurkyloo]

Mar 31, 2019 23:33:14 GMT -5 giramomma said:

We've come to the conclusion that likely the easiest thing would be to remain married but have DH rent a small apartment for DH and just have him go there at night once the younger two are asleep, and then just come over the next day if he's not working, or straight to work on the days he works.

We don't have enough bedrooms/finished basement to do an in-house separation, and moving to a bigger house for 7/8 years doesn't seem prudent.  I don't even know if divorcing would really even make sense. I'd still need to carry everyone on my health insurance. I'd still be supporting DH. We'd still need to tag team parent. I'd still need to work two jobs.

We've both independently come to the conclusion that I cannot live with a dry drunk for the rest of my life. My husband is almost 44. Yet, I'm having similarly themed discussions with my 15year old DS as I am with my husband. It's the selfishness and lack of empathy that gets me, along with the minimal effort. I can't imagine being 60 with the spouse that has the maturity, still of a 15 year old.  And until DH really gets after some of these things...he'll start using again. It's just a matter of time. White knuckling doesn't last forever.

So, now I watch and wait while he does more work. Fortunately I have plenty of other things to keep me busy until it all gets sorted out.

Gira, I’m sorry you’re dealing with this.  I know you’ll get through it, I know you’re strong enough to deal with it.  Adulting sucks sometimes.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Apr 7, 2019 21:53:39 GMT -5 Pants said:

Apr 7, 2019 21:29:56 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

I wish we could do things, but separately [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/wink.png" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png" alt="" class="smile"] I am at zero attraction level with H. I go along sometimes when I can to foster relationship and help meet needs he has. But I never wish to start it with him.

It's so hard to tell someone you have an emotional bond with that you have zero sexual desire for them. He is a good person, honestly. He loves his kids. He is a good dad, especially now. You all honestly would enjoy hanging out with him were you to meet him in person. He loves deeply and fier6and he is kind.

And yet my soul just knows. He isnt it for me. He doesnt fit my missing pieces, or at least most of them.

How do you call it when the other one honestly is a good soul? I talk shit about him here when I am mad. And he has deserved a lot of the criticism he brought. But he is also a good soul and I dont share all the good. I stuck too, and I dont share all that. There's balance to be brought especially when only one person tells the story.

Have you read this? I think about it a lot. 

therumpus.net/2011/06/dear-sugar-the-rumpus-advice-column-77-the-truth-that-lives-there/

Wow.  Thanks, I think. 

[WholeLottaNothin]

Apr 7, 2019 21:53:39 GMT -5 Pants said:

Apr 7, 2019 21:29:56 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

I wish we could do things, but separately [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/wink.png" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png" alt="" class="smile"] I am at zero attraction level with H. I go along sometimes when I can to foster relationship and help meet needs he has. But I never wish to start it with him.

It's so hard to tell someone you have an emotional bond with that you have zero sexual desire for them. He is a good person, honestly. He loves his kids. He is a good dad, especially now. You all honestly would enjoy hanging out with him were you to meet him in person. He loves deeply and fier6and he is kind.

And yet my soul just knows. He isnt it for me. He doesnt fit my missing pieces, or at least most of them.

How do you call it when the other one honestly is a good soul? I talk shit about him here when I am mad. And he has deserved a lot of the criticism he brought. But he is also a good soul and I dont share all the good. I stuck too, and I dont share all that. There's balance to be brought especially when only one person tells the story.

Have you read this? I think about it a lot. 

therumpus.net/2011/06/dear-sugar-the-rumpus-advice-column-77-the-truth-that-lives-there/

Wow, that was a very interesting read.

[Sam_2.0]

Ughghg, I just re-read all of that today. I just wish there was a way to turn back on the attraction. It was there at one point. But its been so damaged and hurt, that I don't know if it can ever come back or start new. I hear that for some it happens. And for others, it never does.

[shanendoah]

My mother divorced my father because she didn't love him enough to be married to him anymore. That was it. That was the only reason. And for a few years after the divorce, they really couldn't even speak to one another. But both of my parents ended up in better lives apart than they would have been in had they stayed together. It wasn't always easy for them. It wasn't always easy for my brother and I. But I honestly, seriously believe that we are all better off.
And now, my parents are friends. When my mom feels like she hasn't heard from me in a while, she'll first check in with my dad to see if he's talked to me. And if he hasn't, she'll send an email that CCs him, demanding I let them both know I'm fine.

I am not saying you should divorce him. I am not saying you shouldn't. I am saying that if you do, you will not be the first woman (or the first woman with kids) to leave a spouse who is a good person because they are not the right person for you. And that's okay.

[swamp]

Apr 7, 2019 21:53:39 GMT -5 Pants said:

Apr 7, 2019 21:29:56 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

I wish we could do things, but separately [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/wink.png" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png" alt="" class="smile"] I am at zero attraction level with H. I go along sometimes when I can to foster relationship and help meet needs he has. But I never wish to start it with him.

It's so hard to tell someone you have an emotional bond with that you have zero sexual desire for them. He is a good person, honestly. He loves his kids. He is a good dad, especially now. You all honestly would enjoy hanging out with him were you to meet him in person. He loves deeply and fier6and he is kind.

And yet my soul just knows. He isnt it for me. He doesnt fit my missing pieces, or at least most of them.

How do you call it when the other one honestly is a good soul? I talk shit about him here when I am mad. And he has deserved a lot of the criticism he brought. But he is also a good soul and I dont share all the good. I stuck too, and I dont share all that. There's balance to be brought especially when only one person tells the story.

Have you read this? I think about it a lot. 

therumpus.net/2011/06/dear-sugar-the-rumpus-advice-column-77-the-truth-that-lives-there/

well that hits close to home...............

[Pants]

Apr 8, 2019 10:23:48 GMT -5 swamp said:

Apr 7, 2019 21:53:39 GMT -5 Pants said:

Have you read this? I think about it a lot. 

therumpus.net/2011/06/dear-sugar-the-rumpus-advice-column-77-the-truth-that-lives-there/

well that hits close to home...............

Yup.

[giramomma]

Not advocating for you to stay at. all.

For me attracted-ness or not, is really dependent upon whether or not I'm feeling safe enough to be vulnerable.  No emotional safety=no sex because no attraction. Feeling safe=attracted=reliving my twenties, in terms of frequency of sex..

The idea that you have missing pieces also interests/intrigues me.

Actually, I don't think any of us having missing pieces, unless we are largely unhealthy ourselves (codependent, abusive, mentally ill, etc).  But, then it's also up to us to find those missing pieces ourselves.

I mean, sure DH and I compliment each other in ways that are inconsequential...like in terms of cleaning...Clutter bugs the shit out of DH and dirt bugs the shit out of me. But, in the grand scheme, these are just so not important (but, to contextualize, our house doesn't look like an episode of hoarders, either. If we did, well, then yes..this would be super important and not inconsequential).

Or, DH and I definitely have different parenting styles. He's more all about the feels, and I am not. But, I think the absence of either one of us wouldn't really drastically change a whole lot in our family systems.

One of the things that kills me the most with DH's choices, is that he's willing to throw an amazing wife and amazing kids away for the high. That hurts way more this time, than before.  Please don't get me wrong, I'm no Victoria Secret's model MILF, but..I'm still quite enough. It's not my job to make others see that in me, and the important part is that I see it in myself.

[justme]

I forget which of my favorite advice columnists - Carolyn Hax or Dan Savage - it came from. Or maybe both more-or-less say the same thing when in comes to whether it's enough:

Would you want to be married to someone who feels like you do about them? Especially unwittingly? 


I remember one somewhat recently that I'm trying to find and it was where a women in her late 30s got married to a guy that was good enough because she wanted to have kids. But so far they aren't having any luck in the department and now that kids are looking like it's not going to happen she's thinking more and more about exes and more like she's stuck with her husband.

Ooh! I found it. It was actually the husband that wrote in about his wife telling him that. It doesn't entirely fit this instance, but I do like this part:

This matters because what you provide is what somebody wants, needs, finds exciting. Someone else. Maybe you haven’t met her yet, and I won’t give you empty assurances that you will, but it’s a no-brainer that there are women “more in love” with an introverted, respectful, fun, he’d-make-a-good-father style.



Which is why this wretched thing might be good for you. When your wife married you for the wrong reasons — I take her word for all this, I should emphasize, and draw no conclusions of my own — she stopped your search for that woman.

www.goerie.com/entertainmentlife/20190118/wife-second-guesses-marriage-after-trouble-conceiving-children-carolyn-hax

(Pay no attention to the married for the wrong reason part. I'm not personally making that determination for any of you on here!)

[giramomma]

Apr 8, 2019 10:19:48 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Ughghg, I just re-read all of that today. I just wish there was a way to turn back on the attraction. It was there at one point. But its been so damaged and hurt, that I don't know if it can ever come back or start new. I hear that for some it happens. And for others, it never does.

Have you read the Seven Levels of Intimacy by Matthew Kelly?

Are you willing to risk being vulnerable again? And it's totally OK if you aren't.

After two years, I'm not...I think I'll get there eventually. And I guess thankfully DH is willing to wait.

I think emotional intimacy/vulnerability is the "hard" work of marriage or relationships, whether it's with our spouse, someone else or our kids, actually.

I also think, in general, this is the piece that most people don't "get" until they've been married for like 40 years. 

[Deleted]

I divorced a "nice guy."  He is somewhat controlling and very pessimistic, but he is nice.  Nor did he have the addictions that you guys are having to deal with.

It is hard to divorce someone that the world views as nice.  But he's actually so much better off without me.  His second wife is the church secretary.  She plays the piano on Sundays and her cake decorating skills are pretty professional.  She's all the things I never wanted to be.  

He'll survive, and you will thrive.  Both of you, Sam_2.0 and giramomma, with whatever you choose.  You are strong women. 

[giramomma]

One more thing, lost-

If you DO choose to want to work past the hurt..you have to remember your husband's behavior is NOT about you.

It sucks. Because it affects you. But, it really has nothing to do with you. He's the broken one. And that's the trick to navigating all of this successfully. But, only if you want to.

[Wisconsin Beth]

Part of my issue is that I don't feel attractive anymore.  I just feel fat.  And tired.  And that we have no money to spend on me or maybe that I don't deserve to spend the money we have on me.  And instead of talking about this with DH or my therapist, I hold it in. 

[WholeLottaNothin]

Apr 8, 2019 10:53:08 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

Part of my issue is that I don't feel attractive anymore.  I just feel fat.  And tired.  And that we have no money to spend on me or maybe that I don't deserve to spend the money we have on me.  And instead of talking about this with DH or my therapist, I hold it in. 

I have this issue as well. I have been trying to exercise more and be more mindful of my eating, but the progress is slow and frustrating. I know a lot of the issues are internal, like I don't feel worthy of spending money or time on myself. But the other side is I have let myself go for so long and made other people the priority, that this is why I feel so fat and unattractive. I don't say anything either. With my sister dying, other than in the beginning, I have held my feelings in. I have always been an emotional eater, so that is not good either. The only time I feel like I can cry is when I am alone in the shower. Because my feelings are secondary.

[giramomma]

Apr 8, 2019 10:53:08 GMT -5 Wisconsin Beth said:

Part of my issue is that I don't feel attractive anymore.  I just feel fat.  And tired.  And that we have no money to spend on me or maybe that I don't deserve to spend the money we have on me.  And instead of talking about this with DH or my therapist, I hold it in. 

[zibazinski]

Divorce weight loss goes back on after awhile. 😢.

[Pants]

Apr 8, 2019 10:19:48 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Ughghg, I just re-read all of that today. I just wish there was a way to turn back on the attraction. It was there at one point. But its been so damaged and hurt, that I don't know if it can ever come back or start new. I hear that for some it happens. And for others, it never does.

Can I ask - are you sure that your attraction isn't there because of all the things that happened between you and DH? Because despite what we commonly hear, lots of women struggle with monogamy because we get bored sexually with only one partner. There's a lot of studies that back that up. So maybe it's not about intimacy or vulnerability or hurt? Maybe you're just bored with the same ol' same ol'. 

I don't know whether that helps or hurts, but thought I'd throw the possibility out there. 

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Apr 7, 2019 21:53:39 GMT -5 Pants said:

Apr 7, 2019 21:29:56 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

I wish we could do things, but separately [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/wink.png" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png" alt="" class="smile"] I am at zero attraction level with H. I go along sometimes when I can to foster relationship and help meet needs he has. But I never wish to start it with him.

It's so hard to tell someone you have an emotional bond with that you have zero sexual desire for them. He is a good person, honestly. He loves his kids. He is a good dad, especially now. You all honestly would enjoy hanging out with him were you to meet him in person. He loves deeply and fier6and he is kind.

And yet my soul just knows. He isnt it for me. He doesnt fit my missing pieces, or at least most of them.

How do you call it when the other one honestly is a good soul? I talk shit about him here when I am mad. And he has deserved a lot of the criticism he brought. But he is also a good soul and I dont share all the good. I stuck too, and I dont share all that. There's balance to be brought especially when only one person tells the story.

Have you read this? I think about it a lot. 

therumpus.net/2011/06/dear-sugar-the-rumpus-advice-column-77-the-truth-that-lives-there/

Huh.

That actually made me feel better.  I don't want to go.  I've been thinking I SHOULD go because other people would go but I don't want to.   It rips me in half when I think about it, I get no sense of relief.

Will that change someday?  IDK.   But for the time being my answer is the same as it was when I walked down the aisle.    I have no idea if that makes me stupid or not but according to the article I have the answer I need at least.

[oped]

So. I do see some dichotomy in suggesting that leaving is likely the best option for many women, and also suggesting that the idea that one person needs to be everything for you is a ridiculous sham. If it is true that one person doesn't need to be everything for you, then why must there be that 'one perfect person who will fill all your holes' so to speak.... ? 

I'm jaded. I'm sure. By my upbringing. But my father has been in search of the perfect person for his entire life. He changes a little bit each time he meets a new one. He is sure she is the one. But ultimately no one fills that role, because no one is perfect and no one can fill his gaps. He is still he after all. Every time. 

I don't know what this means really. Its just. Realistically, did all of those women in that link leave their men, just like the adviser... and also then find exactly the perfect man that made everything better... just like the adviser?  

Not sure if i even have a point....