thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Sept 1, 2017 8:36:59 GMT -5
I worked at an evacuation center for about a month after hurricane Katrina (through my employer), and there is just a ton of logistics that has to be managed to support 1000 evacuees. I really can't begrudge the guy if his church isn't set up to handle it. I think it would be a lot easier for a smaller church that could just house a few families, but once you get into large groups, you end up with just massive amounts of food, drink, bathrooms, security issues, medical issues, etc. It can be overwhelming to figure out on the spot.
At our evacuation center we had just a constant traffic of semis coming in and out to bring supplies and equipment. We even ended up with a security perimeter and id badges for everyone because non-evacuees were trying to sneak in to get the FEMA benefits. It was a massive undertaking and I could see how someone would have no idea where to start, especially as the same disaster is hitting them that is hitting everyone else. Maybe you know - is it true that if you have a large building you can call the red cross and they can send a crew to 'administer' a shelter at your facility? You don't actually have to think through the logistics, but they may ask you to find volunteers in your community which they can manage?
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Sept 1, 2017 9:19:20 GMT -5
Since we are on a new page I will reiterate my comments for any that might consider this "friendly" board as a home:
YOU PEOPLE are really something. Mocking God and religion. A group of bitter old women on a rampage over the board. Do you realize that you are probably insulting at least half or more of the members of this board. Most are probably afraid to come on here and post in the middle of your tirade. Who knew 40 was "bitter/old." Even my kids have enough sense to not call me old. And we're pretty Catholic. Even send my kids to Catholic school. It is AMAZING at some of the attitudes that we see from the wealthy Christian parents. Personally, I find it pretty insulting sometimes. Because a lot of times when they want to give...they give for the warm fuzzies. "Oh lookie, we got kids CHRISTMAS presents! Aren't we thoughtful? " Do they care about anything else for those kids? Nope. Do they volunteer their time or do anything "harder" than write a check? Nope. Do they go and develop relationships with poor folks..most of them do not.. Shoot, most of them won't even drive into the unsavory parts of town. (Which by the way, are not terribly unsavory as long as you are aware.) And guess what...that's what they are teaching their kids...too.. I don't begrudge people who have different priorities. We're getting at that point too, where..we are having to say "I can't." to taking on more. But I think we've earned it. We put in our time contributing when our peers didn't. And now, it's interesting..to watch that no one else is stepping up when help is needed in the community. But I tell you, when I was working three jobs, DH was working two jobs and we had our three kids...it was REALLY, REALLY hard sometimes to smile and nod when folks with half our responsibilities were complaining that there was just no way that they could do anything other than maybe write out a check or grab a $20 from the ATM.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 9:34:11 GMT -5
As I said before there is a reason that the membership on this board never goes up. The same reason that the board is populated by the same 20-30 stagnant posters day after day. And one grumpy old man.
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Sept 1, 2017 9:38:11 GMT -5
Aww....another beautiful rant(s) from another one on the other side Pretty tantrum. This 30-60 year old doesn't give a shit to the the lecture wxyz is providing for free. One can have faith, one can have love for God, one can have connection to God in whichever way, but it's extremely DELUSIONAL to think only prayers solve any and everything. Osteen can pray as much as he likes, but as a supposed "man of God" he is pretty petty when it comes to opening his heart and soul to the people In need. So I shall continue to call out the mockery that Osteen has made of religion. And I "talked" to God yesterday too. Told him I continue to poke fun at him. No worries from his side God told me he thinks Joel osteen is an asshole too. Shaming osteen is not picking on religion or god. Osteen is not gods representative. He's one line human who pretends to be godly. Wxyz, you obviously can't read, or are just choosing to be offended. I've seen posters positively note other religious leader are helping
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resolution
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Post by resolution on Sept 1, 2017 9:48:59 GMT -5
I worked at an evacuation center for about a month after hurricane Katrina (through my employer), and there is just a ton of logistics that has to be managed to support 1000 evacuees. I really can't begrudge the guy if his church isn't set up to handle it. I think it would be a lot easier for a smaller church that could just house a few families, but once you get into large groups, you end up with just massive amounts of food, drink, bathrooms, security issues, medical issues, etc. It can be overwhelming to figure out on the spot.
At our evacuation center we had just a constant traffic of semis coming in and out to bring supplies and equipment. We even ended up with a security perimeter and id badges for everyone because non-evacuees were trying to sneak in to get the FEMA benefits. It was a massive undertaking and I could see how someone would have no idea where to start, especially as the same disaster is hitting them that is hitting everyone else. Maybe you know - is it true that if you have a large building you can call the red cross and they can send a crew to 'administer' a shelter at your facility? You don't actually have to think through the logistics, but they may ask you to find volunteers in your community which they can manage? Sorry, I don't know if they offer that service or not.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Sept 1, 2017 9:50:19 GMT -5
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Sept 1, 2017 9:53:13 GMT -5
I worked at an evacuation center for about a month after hurricane Katrina (through my employer), and there is just a ton of logistics that has to be managed to support 1000 evacuees. I really can't begrudge the guy if his church isn't set up to handle it. I think it would be a lot easier for a smaller church that could just house a few families, but once you get into large groups, you end up with just massive amounts of food, drink, bathrooms, security issues, medical issues, etc. It can be overwhelming to figure out on the spot.
At our evacuation center we had just a constant traffic of semis coming in and out to bring supplies and equipment. We even ended up with a security perimeter and id badges for everyone because non-evacuees were trying to sneak in to get the FEMA benefits. It was a massive undertaking and I could see how someone would have no idea where to start, especially as the same disaster is hitting them that is hitting everyone else. Maybe you know - is it true that if you have a large building you can call the red cross and they can send a crew to 'administer' a shelter at your facility? You don't actually have to think through the logistics, but they may ask you to find volunteers in your community which they can manage? This is a moot point, because as soon as he made the decision to open Lakewood, his parishioners were jumping in to volunteer. There were piles of supplies available and many of his church members willing to help.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 10:20:41 GMT -5
Reminds me of the same frenzy by the "Ladies" on here that nearly resulted in the board and some of them being sued by Dave Ramsey a while back. What? I think you're grossly exaggerating things here. And pretty much everything I have written on this board (and MSN before it) I would be perfectly comfortable having read in front of anyone. I don't write things, then delete them worried someone will read them years from now. I'm not all that anonymous either. I'm Facebook friends with half the people on here and know several outside of the boards.
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Sept 1, 2017 10:37:38 GMT -5
Aww....another beautiful rant(s) from another one on the other side Pretty tantrum. This 30-60 year old doesn't give a shit to the the lecture wxyz is providing for free. One can have faith, one can have love for God, one can have connection to God in whichever way, but it's extremely DELUSIONAL to think only prayers solve any and everything. Osteen can pray as much as he likes, but as a supposed "man of God" he is pretty petty when it comes to opening his heart and soul to the people In need. So I shall continue to call out the mockery that Osteen has made of religion. And I "talked" to God yesterday too. Told him I continue to poke fun at him. No worries from his side God told me he thinks Joel osteen is an asshole too. God already knows, and there is a nice hot seat waiting for him downstairs.
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MJ2.0
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Post by MJ2.0 on Sept 1, 2017 10:53:59 GMT -5
YOU PEOPLE are really something. Mocking God and religion. A group of bitter old women on a rampage over the board. Do you realize that you are probably insulting at least half or more of the members of this board. Most are probably afraid to come on here and post in the middle of your tirade. As I said before there is a reason that the membership on this board never goes up. The same reason that the board is populated by the same 20-30 stagnant posters day after day. The mean clique of girls in High School, 30-60 years later. Disgusting and embarrassing. But that is simply my last personal opinion....on this thread...... and it will be deleted, but not for a long time so plenty of people can read it before it is deleted. boy, bye.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 11:08:28 GMT -5
This board doesn't get any new people because it's not affiliated with MSN anymore and doesn't get that traffic, we're just refugees hanging out basically. It's not a web page that people are just going to happen upon. If you search for money forums you're more likely to land on Bogleheads or Money Moustache.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 11:29:43 GMT -5
Even my evangelical friends mostly dislike osteen... he doesn't exactly represent them.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 11:31:49 GMT -5
Now John Pavlovitz I like!
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Sept 1, 2017 11:43:28 GMT -5
It's probably the Lutheran in me but Mega churches have never sat well with me. I don't think your church needs to be a tiny hovel but the giant arenas and immense wealth of the pastors makes me think of the 95 theses against the Catholic church.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Sept 1, 2017 11:46:06 GMT -5
OK, I don't know how true this is, but I would not want to shelter people with water on the first floor of the building. That seems like a disaster waiting to happen. (Note, I think it is cool that the Quad City River Bandits can still play their games with their flood system in place, so maybe that makes me a hypocrite, but as I plan for having my cities flood system fully functioning in the next 2 decades, I don't like the idea of people behind the flood wall when it is flooding, we'll continue to encourage flood insurance, etc). Eta: I do not like megachurches. I don't understand them at all. I don't know how you end up with a church "family" with 16,000 other people and I don't understand people who get rich off of it. But I do understand flood and flood safety and having people sheltering in a building that has a flooded first floor or basement is not a good idea. From what I can tell, the church had no flooding in the basement, the parking garage, the first floor or the parking lot. The picture of the flooded parking lot was from a few years ago and Joel said on CNN that the water got so high, it was nearly a foot from the top of the flood gate, which would indicate the water never breeched. He said they had flooding in the past, and it has been confirmed that they built the flood gate after that flood happened. I could be wrong, as my sources are not solid. But he stated pretty clearly that he was afraid there was going to be flooding. No one has claimed to be the original source for the pictures of the flooded area. They are not verified by Lakewood. OK, so a man made system was protecting the building from flooding is what was confirmed on CNN? And the floodwaters were within a top of wall? In cases of permanent flood protection, we design systems with at least 3 foot of freboard. 1 foot is the absolute bare minimum. At 1 foot, you evacuate people out of the area. I would not be comfortable from a public safety perspective of having evacuees in a building protected by a man made system with floodwaters one foot from the top.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Sept 1, 2017 12:03:12 GMT -5
Aww....another beautiful rant(s) from another one on the other side Pretty tantrum. This 30-60 year old doesn't give a shit to the the lecture wxyz is providing for free. One can have faith, one can have love for God, one can have connection to God in whichever way, but it's extremely DELUSIONAL to think only prayers solve any and everything. Osteen can pray as much as he likes, but as a supposed "man of God" he is pretty petty when it comes to opening his heart and soul to the people In need. So I shall continue to call out the mockery that Osteen has made of religion. And I "talked" to God yesterday too. Told him I continue to poke fun at him. No worries from his side God told me he thinks Joel osteen is an asshole too. Shaming osteen is not picking on religion or god. Osteen is not gods representative. He's one line human who pretends to be godly. Wxyz, you obviously can't read, or are just choosing to be offended. I've seen posters positively note other religious leader are helping Just for clarity, there have been posts about "Christians" and "American Christians" on the thread as well. It's not just talk about Osteen, it very quickly went onto Megachurches in general, then Christians in general (not everyone obviously, but definitely some posts went much broader than Osteen).
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Sept 1, 2017 12:06:15 GMT -5
I'd just like to say that if I ever insult half the members of this board, I'd like to sincerely apologize that I wasn't able to offend more of you. I've always been an A-student, so I always shoot for at least 90%.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 12:11:20 GMT -5
It's probably the Lutheran in me but Mega churches have never sat well with me. I don't think your church needs to be a tiny hovel but the giant arenas and immense wealth of the pastors makes me think of the 95 theses against the Catholic church. Mega churches freak me out. I keep getting the creepy feeling they're going to start handing out Kool Aid or something. I went to a Little House on the Prairie style church that held maybe 50 or 60 people, everyone knew everyone in there very well. About 10 years ago I was confirmed in the Catholic Church, but have since quit going, for several reasons, but one was it just felt too large and ostentatious.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Sept 1, 2017 12:20:16 GMT -5
"God, please tell me what I can do to help the people in Houston."
God's response: "Just keep talking to me. Me, me, me, me, me. I can do anything you ask, but I won't. But keep talking to me."
My husband says "God seems to be a real asshole."
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Sept 1, 2017 12:21:38 GMT -5
I was thinking this too...I don't really know of another group of really critical thinkers. And I really value that here.
I'd expect that to extend to everything, including religion.
We teach our kids to think critically about our faith. Shoot, even one of the nuns at our church encouraged us to be critical about our faith during an intro to Bible study class that I took once. I wonder what that makes the nun?
Maybe it doesn't go here...but here are my feelings about this post and the other one going on "Your Money"
Real life is not talking about the weather and the local sports teams. We won't get anywhere as a society if we only talk about the weather and the local sports teams, because these are nice, polite, safe topics. And frankly, I don't want to go back to a time where you didn't say LGBT or addiction, you shuttled away unwed pregnant young women, you simply accept sexual harassment in the workplace as a part of life, and too bad if someone is beating you, you just keep your mouth shut and cover up the bruises, and questioning things was frowned upon.
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Lizard Queen
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103/2024
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Post by Lizard Queen on Sept 1, 2017 12:28:45 GMT -5
My in-laws used to go to sort of a mega church. It was large-ish, and non-denominational. We went to one service there, and it was a production. It seemed to be church as entertainment. The kids' classes were decked out, too, with a slide that they'd ride down to the lower level where they were located. Plus, there was a Starbucks style coffee bar in the lobby. Still, I heard they did outreach--doing food drives and such, so I don't think it was all bad.
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Virgil Showlion
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[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Sept 1, 2017 12:35:59 GMT -5
@wxyz: Rather than posting duplicates of your aggregate Reply #148, in future please refer to it by reply number or link. Three copies of the material is enough. - Virgil (Mod)
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Sept 1, 2017 12:40:36 GMT -5
who complained to the mods now? And was Virgil assigned to the task to tell him?
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Sept 1, 2017 12:46:47 GMT -5
Even if we accept that Osteen could not possibly open his church up as a shelter, he's got a "flock" of 17,00. You're telling me that a man with that much charisma couldn't have assisted with mobilizing his flock to do something in the community? Like IDK help at a soup kitchen, collect donations that don't go to his book sales? How about organizing his flock to donate blood? 17,00 people is A LOT of blood.
All he could manage to do was pray for people in Huston? Even if he didn't want to shelter homeless people the church should have been open for anyone who needed comfort/guidence at this time. Church is supposed to be a sancutary for all who seek it, not just those who buy his books.
I agree with the minister that married us that churches are becoming too much of a "member's only club". It does warm my heart to see how many other churches, synagoges and mosques have opened their doors to their communities and been a sanctuary to those in need, regardless of membership.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Sept 1, 2017 13:08:27 GMT -5
Has it been 1-5 days yet?
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Sept 1, 2017 14:28:43 GMT -5
Even if we accept that Osteen could not possibly open his church up as a shelter, he's got a "flock" of 17,00. You're telling me that a man with that much charisma couldn't have assisted with mobilizing his flock to do something in the community? Like IDK help at a soup kitchen, collect donations that don't go to his book sales? How about organizing his flock to donate blood? 17,00 people is A LOT of blood. All he could manage to do was pray for people in Huston? Even if he didn't want to shelter homeless people the church should have been open for anyone who needed comfort/guidence at this time. Church is supposed to be a sancutary for all who seek it, not just those who buy his books. I agree with the minister that married us that churches are becoming too much of a "member's only club". It does warm my heart to see how many other churches, synagoges and mosques have opened their doors to their communities and been a sanctuary to those in need, regardless of membership. But who is to say his flock isn't doing that without him saying anything? Last fall, my church made sack lunches for those filling sandbags. The pastor had nothing to do with that effort. But it was still an organized unofficial Church event. They used the church to make the lunches and then split up to deliver them. I don't believe in the mega Church concept and I don't think Joel Osteen is a good person, but there where is the proof his church members aren't doing anything? Eta: I guess my point is that last fall people could have said well LHWC isn't doing anything besides pray and that wasn't true. We had teens/young adults filling sandbags, we had those fixing sandwiches, I got to pull an all nighter making sure the temporary measures held, etc.
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ken a.k.a OMK
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They killed Kenny, the bastards.
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Post by ken a.k.a OMK on Sept 1, 2017 14:59:44 GMT -5
YOU PEOPLE are really something. Mocking God and religion. A group of bitter old women on a rampage over the board. Do you realize that you are probably insulting at least half or more of the members of this board. Most are probably afraid to come on here and post in the middle of your tirade. As I said before there is a reason that the membership on this board never goes up. The same reason that the board is populated by the same 20-30 stagnant posters day after day. The mean clique of girls in High School, 30-60 years later. Disgusting and embarrassing. But that is simply my last personal opinion....on this thread...... and it will be deleted, but not for a long time so plenty of people can read it before it is deleted. boy, bye. @wxyz then maybe you need to leave and find a board better suited to your opinions.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Sept 1, 2017 15:12:00 GMT -5
Oh I wasn't bashing the people in his congregation.
My point was people having been saying osteen could not do anything cause of this that or other reason in reference to the church building itself.
My point was someone who can attract a 17,000 following and all the others who've helped him make his fortune could do A LOT more that pray safely and dry.
it doesn't sit well with me seeing a pastor getting rich while appearing to not practicing what he preaches.
Like I said mega churches and their leaders make me think of the 95 theses.
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Sept 1, 2017 15:35:04 GMT -5
God told me he thinks Joel osteen is an asshole too. Shaming osteen is not picking on religion or god. Osteen is not gods representative. He's one line human who pretends to be godly. Wxyz, you obviously can't read, or are just choosing to be offended. I've seen posters positively note other religious leader are helping Just for clarity, there have been posts about "Christians" and "American Christians" on the thread as well. It's not just talk about Osteen, it very quickly went onto Megachurches in general, then Christians in general (not everyone obviously, but definitely some posts went much broader than Osteen). You're right. And my intent was just to shame Osteen. Many religious groups are doing what they can.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 16:01:31 GMT -5
Seven pages of religion bashing? What thread are your reading?
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