sesfw
Junior Associate
Today is the first day of the rest of my life
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 15:45:17 GMT -5
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S T E M
Aug 1, 2016 10:24:25 GMT -5
Post by sesfw on Aug 1, 2016 10:24:25 GMT -5
But "STEM only" for loans is too restrictive, and that's coming from an engineer.
I'm not arguing that point ........ but you have to start somewhere.
It's gotten out of hand because of too many 'exceptions'.
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Deleted
Joined: Sept 28, 2024 22:28:21 GMT -5
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S T E M
Aug 1, 2016 10:37:28 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2016 10:37:28 GMT -5
I think 100K+ for undergrad is crazy no matter what the degree program. I realize that tuition is expensive, but if it's where you're going to have to borrow 100% of the cost then maybe you need to think of alternatives. There's no guarantees you're going to make the kind of money to easily pay that off or that you're even going to graduate! The ones that are really sickening are those that make it 2-3 years and then for whatever reason need to drop out.
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wvugurl26
Distinguished Associate
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Post by wvugurl26 on Aug 1, 2016 10:39:31 GMT -5
I know many places are running around $20-25k a year. If you have to borrow all of it then it's easily $100k.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2016 10:46:49 GMT -5
I get that, but can they come up with NO money over the course of 4 years? No savings before going, no PT job? Nothing? That just wouldn't be an option for me. I would join the service or get a job with tuition reimbursement, or take a year or two to stockpile some cash before I borrowed 100%.
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MJ2.0
Senior Associate
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Post by MJ2.0 on Aug 1, 2016 11:01:51 GMT -5
I get that, but can they come up with NO money over the course of 4 years? No savings before going, no PT job? Nothing? That just wouldn't be an option for me. I would join the service or get a job with tuition reimbursement, or take a year or two to stockpile some cash before I borrowed 100%. I have been considering the SMART program sponsored by the DoD. Basically, for STEM majors you apply for this program. If you get in, they cover all your tuition and give you a stipend of up to around $30k/year depending on your housing situation. You are then guaranteed a job upon graduation. The only drawback for me is that you can't control where they place you. You get to list your desired DoD locations, but if something comes up and they need you elsewhere, you have to go. If I could be guaranteed to get a job in the tri-state area I'd do it in a heartbeat. If I was childless it wouldn't be an issue... Or maybe if I could swing renting a room in NJ and visiting him on weekends...but I don't want to miss out on 5 years being close to DS.
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Deleted
Joined: Sept 28, 2024 22:28:21 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2016 11:07:01 GMT -5
Kids complicate everything.
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MJ2.0
Senior Associate
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Post by MJ2.0 on Aug 1, 2016 11:13:13 GMT -5
Literally EVERYTHING!!!!
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Aug 1, 2016 12:02:19 GMT -5
But "STEM only" for loans is too restrictive, and that's coming from an engineer.I'm not arguing that point ........ but you have to start somewhere. It's gotten out of hand because of too many 'exceptions'. I know it's old: From here www.fastweb.com/financial-aid/articles/who-really-graduates-with-100-000-or-more-in-student-loansFrom here: (Again, old, 2013) So you are talking about trying to fix laws for such a minimal part of the population? Where's the cost benefit in that? This reminds me of my lawmakers. They are willing to spend upwards of a million dollars investigating one case of voter fraud that turns out to be true. They always tell us voter fraud is a real thing. It's super scary because people are trying to game the voting system. My state has like 3 million voters, and they investigate 12 cases of voter fraud, and 5 end up being a problem. I'm not suggesting that voter fraud shouldn't be dealt with. But, our roads, our roads are going to be under funded by 1billion in the next two year budget. From my perspective. I'd rather that 5 million go to roads. I mean, our tax money isn't limitless. And I'd rather have my job, have good roads, and not worry about 5 people in 3 million that were convicted of voter fraud. And it seems that laws that try to protect people from doing stupid things don't work anyway. People still don't wear seatbelts. People still smoke. People don't wear helmets when the ride motor cycles.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Aug 1, 2016 12:32:49 GMT -5
And it's not like it would reduce college costs. Colleges aren't stupid, they'd simply raise the rates for anyone going into the majors were you are certain to get loans. They then will use those costs to subsidize the programs where they aren't getting as much money coming in.
They will also change the programs in order to entice more students into those programs in order to make more money. The dreaded "dumbing down" of STEM programs will happen.
The reason some of these fields command the salaries they do is because there are not enough people to go around to meet demand. Once you have colleges churning out as many graduates as they can like they currently do for science, law and other fields the wages will go down because now employers can wait to take the lowest bidder.
What is the hot field today may not be the hot field once you graduate. .. or even tomorrow. Nursing is a really good example of this, our nursing schools are churning out so many people that they've had to start limiting how many people they accept every year. Hospitals are going to "on call" rolls for most nursing positions because they have more than enough people to fill the gaps. Only a select few command the big dollars and a full time position with benefits.
It's not a BAD career, but I would not consider it to be "hot" anymore. The supposed shortage of nurses is not happening, at least not in areas people want to live in around here.
I've had people insist i need to go into nursing because it's "hot". I would need to get my BSN in order to command a salary that's more than what I make now which will cost me $80k. There are too many new nurses and unemployed experienced nurses for me to command a salary that will get me a decent ROI on $80k.
Yes I could "get an RN" but all the hospitals here if you are a new graduate expect a BSN. All experienced RNs are being expected to obtain their BSN as well. RNs around here make about what I make now only have to work crappier hours and deal with patients. I might as well stay here for the same salary.
All you're going to do by restricting who is allowed to get loans for school is eventually create the same situation in those chosen fields as is happening in other fields.
Instead of trying to control stupid people we should really be looking at the people who think it's acceptable to give an 18 year old a six figure loan and the people who think it's a great idea to charge that much for an education.
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Ombud
Junior Associate
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Post by Ombud on Aug 1, 2016 14:57:23 GMT -5
With all due respect, you're stating the only degrees that have any validity are stem degrees. And in the same thought, you are overestimating the amount of student loan debt. I understand that the media is fueling this fear, but it isn't real. If most students graduate with 30,000 in student debt then it means their loan repayment will be $294 × 120 payments. Hardly earth shattering. But that doesn't make 'good news,' it's a non starter Go to: studentloans.gov/myDirectLoan/mobile/repayment/repaymentEstimator.action And plug it in yourself if you don't believe me
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MJ2.0
Senior Associate
Joined: Jul 24, 2014 10:27:09 GMT -5
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S T E M
Aug 1, 2016 15:10:23 GMT -5
Post by MJ2.0 on Aug 1, 2016 15:10:23 GMT -5
With all due respect, you're stating the only degrees that have any validity are stem degrees. And in the same thought, you are overestimating the amount of student loan debt. I understand that the media is fueling this fear, but it isn't real. If most students graduate with 30,000 in student debt then it means their loan repayment will be $294 × 120 payments. Hardly earth shattering. But that doesn't make 'good news,' it's a non starter Go to: studentloans.gov/myDirectLoan/mobile/repayment/repaymentEstimator.action And plug it in yourself if you don't believe me these types of media articles are pointless. I'm sure you'll find people who graduated with STEM majors who are in the exact same boat. And you'll find a LOT of non-STEM graduates who paid their loans and who are doing just fine.
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giramomma
Distinguished Associate
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S T E M
Aug 1, 2016 15:46:27 GMT -5
Post by giramomma on Aug 1, 2016 15:46:27 GMT -5
I'm always interested in the costs of college. I'll give you that it's rather hard to find data for utilities. I did learn that my campus needs the same amount of power as 20,000 homes. And that our infrastructure is old.
In state Tuition at my alma matter is 10.5K a year. If someone takes 32 credits, the cost per credit is $328.
This is pretty close to per credit tuition at our tech schools. Our tech school charges 260/credit.
What is an appropriate price point per credit for college then?
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NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Aug 1, 2016 16:25:01 GMT -5
With all due respect, you're stating the only degrees that have any validity are stem degrees. And in the same thought, you are overestimating the amount of student loan debt. I understand that the media is fueling this fear, but it isn't real. If most students graduate with 30,000 in student debt then it means their loan repayment will be $294 × 120 payments. Hardly earth shattering. But that doesn't make 'good news,' it's a non starter Go to: studentloans.gov/myDirectLoan/mobile/repayment/repaymentEstimator.action And plug it in yourself if you don't believe me these types of media articles are pointless. I'm sure you'll find people who graduated with STEM majors who are in the exact same boat. And you'll find a LOT of non-STEM graduates who paid their loans and who are doing just fine. Despite making good money and being smart enough to graduate medical school quite a few doctors are dumb with money. Just because you picked the right major it doesn't mean you won't land yourself in hot water regarding your loans.
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chiver78
Administrator
Current Events Admin
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Post by chiver78 on Aug 2, 2016 8:12:00 GMT -5
With all due respect, you're stating the only degrees that have any validity are stem degrees. And in the same thought, you are overestimating the amount of student loan debt. I understand that the media is fueling this fear, but it isn't real. If most students graduate with 30,000 in student debt then it means their loan repayment will be $294 × 120 payments. Hardly earth shattering. But that doesn't make 'good news,' it's a non starter Go to: studentloans.gov/myDirectLoan/mobile/repayment/repaymentEstimator.action And plug it in yourself if you don't believe me that sounds about right. I had just shy of $28k in loans, and my payments were $253.55.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
Community Leader
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:26:32 GMT -5
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Aug 2, 2016 8:46:29 GMT -5
Plus with student loans for the most part if you are willing to work with them they will bend over backwards to make sure you can make your payment. I had to purchase a manila folder to keep all the paperwork my student loan company kept sending me while I was in school and after I graduated. I think they murdered an entire forest. You are made WELL aware of how much you are taking out, the interest rate and they will even give you estimates on what your payments will be. If you don't then there is the FA office on campus you can talk to. Nobody who graduates with six figures in loans should be shocked at what they owe or the fact they have to pay it back. You can't legislate stupid. Instead of trying to force people to pick a YM approved major in order to fix a rather small percentage of the population how about we just ignore bait click articles designed to get a rise out of us?
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zibazinski
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S T E M
Aug 2, 2016 9:09:41 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by zibazinski on Aug 2, 2016 9:09:41 GMT -5
Some of the doctors go crazy after med school because they've lived so hand to mouth all those years and feel they "deserve" it. A friend of mine lived for five extra years the way she lived through med school. She is now loan free, has the big house, nice car, nanny and maid. Plus, children !!
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Virgil Showlion
Distinguished Associate
Moderator
[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
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S T E M
Aug 2, 2016 10:34:39 GMT -5
Post by Virgil Showlion on Aug 2, 2016 10:34:39 GMT -5
I love how they call it "fixing" the crisis.
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