Open carry where you live and how you feel about it

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Jan 3, 2016 14:29:52 GMT -5 mroped said:

Doesn't removing an illegal weapon fall under "law enforcement". Or seizing a weapon from an individual that is clearly inebriated or shows clear signs on mental instability?

At the end I start seeing that we in fact might have the same general understanding of what it is maybe with some discrepancies. However, the way I express it and you the same, may come across in the wrong way?!

originaly I'm from Eastern Europe, Romania to be more exact but my wife on the other hand is born and raised here so all her relatives that might have been in LE, did that in US.
Thats why the question about "other states"
 

Yes, but you can't remove someone's weapon without cause.  Taking the gun away from someone inebriated is one thing.  Coming into a house to remove a gun because the gun owner isn't registered isn't right.  This is what's happening in NY state right now.

When my dad died last year, he was in the process of sending his firearms to both me and my sister.  He had already mailed me one of his guns, and I was supposed to receive others.  My sister was also to receive some of his handguns.  However, he died before this happened.  Now, my sister carries a CWP in MN, I carry one in WA.  Only problem is that my dad was the only CWP holder from NY in the house and when he died, NY has the right to come in and confiscate the guns of the deceased as there is no longer a permit holder in the house.  NY does not recognize a CWP from any other state but NY and the only way you can get a CWP from NY is to be a NY resident, of which neither of us are.

So we were in a conundrum.  We were sitting on about 6 guns that we had to get out of NY ASAP, preferably before my dad's obit hit the paper.  We had 15 days to either turn them over, or get them out of town.  Both my sister and I have dealers we could have sent the guns to in our respective state, but we could not travel in NY state legally with guns, nor could we legally send them out since our CWP wasn't recognized in NY by a FFD.  As it turned out, we flew out of Burlington and were able to get the guns out of the house before the NYS police could come looking.  As my dad had to register his guns, they knew that they were at that address.

So we had illegal guns that NY had a perfect right to remove by NY state law.

Lest you think that this doesn't happen.....
www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/17/deceased-gun-owners-ny-law_n_6173488.html

[mroped]

Don't worry, I have no dreams of that not happening!
And i do understand the problem you were facing. I believe that in this very specific case, the state of NY was overreaching and going to court for it should be out of question. 
Legaly, common sense and whatever you want should be simple: you are an heir, a descendent, it is your right! Period!
Unfortunately, that bothersome document called Constitution, is very clear in stating that the states of the Union are sovereign and the federal government can't interfere unless there is a national security issue or something along those lines.

[gregintenn]

Jan 3, 2016 14:29:52 GMT -5 mroped said:

Doesn't removing an illegal weapon fall under "law enforcement". Or seizing a weapon from an individual that is clearly inebriated or shows clear signs on mental instability?

At the end I start seeing that we in fact might have the same general understanding of what it is maybe with some discrepancies. However, the way I express it and you the same, may come across in the wrong way?!

originaly I'm from Eastern Europe, Romania to be more exact but my wife on the other hand is born and raised here so all her relatives that might have been in LE, did that in US.
Thats why the question about "other states"
 

Absolutely it does.

I'm beginning to think you and I aren't as far apart as it first seemed.

[tskeeter]

Jan 2, 2016 13:42:28 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 2, 2016 12:46:11 GMT -5 tskeeter said:

While I'm pro gun ownership, I have concerns about widespread carrying of fire arms as a dress accessory.  Why?  I think back a year or so to the teacher who dropped her loaded gun, wounding herself while in her classroom.  Unfortunately, I don't trust the judgement of many people when it comes to their gun handling practices.  Knowledgable gun owners don't keep a round chambered unless they are actually in the process of shooting.  Obviously the teacher in my example failed that part of the gun safety class.  Think about your goofiest friend, the one who exhibits the poorest judgement.  Do you trust them to sport a gun strapped to their hip while visiting your home?

Really? Is that protocol for police? Military? This is akin of having a fire extinguisher, but not having it charged until there's a fire.

While I can't address police practices, my understanding is that the military does not keep rounds chambered except when combat is considered eminent.  This reduces the risk of injuries due to accidental discharge of loaded weapons.  The same reason that civilians do not keep rounds chambered.

[gregintenn]

Jan 5, 2016 0:01:07 GMT -5 tskeeter said:

Jan 2, 2016 13:42:28 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Really? Is that protocol for police? Military? This is akin of having a fire extinguisher, but not having it charged until there's a fire.

While I can't address police practices, my understanding is that the military does not keep rounds chambered except when combat is considered eminent.  This reduces the risk of injuries due to accidental discharge of loaded weapons.  The same reason that civilians do not keep rounds chambered.

Civilians actually DO keep a round chambered. If one needs a firearm, they usually need it NOW. An unloaded firearm is little more than a poorly balanced club.

[movingforward]

Open carry makes me nervous in Texas - probably just because it is new.  We have some idiot cowboy wannabes who are a little too gung-ho about the law IMHO.  I don't really want a lot of yahoos carrying around guns with no idea how to really use them.  There has already been an incident where someone had their own gun used against them in a robbery. 

I work for a trade association and we have already had quite a few calls from private business owners wanting to know what the laws are regarding not allowing people with guns into their establishments.  Personally, I wouldn't want them in there either.  I am much more comfortable with concealed weapons (maybe that sounds stupid - I don't know) but I am extremely uncomfortable seeing people walking into movies, restaurants and other public establishments with holstered weapons.  None of the other patrons know what these people's intentions are going to be.  Plus, it seems like the people who actually know how to use guns properly don't plan to open carry.  It seems like the only ones excited about the open carry law are just a bit too excited (if you know what I mean).  And don't even get me started about the laws that have been passed on college campuses... that is a whole other issue... yep, drunk kids in their dorms with guns.  Yeah, that's just what we need .

[gregintenn]

Jan 5, 2016 16:35:29 GMT -5 movingforward said:

Open carry makes me nervous in Texas - probably just because it is new.  We have some idiot cowboy wannabes who are a little too gung-ho about the law IMHO.  I don't really want a lot of yahoos carrying around guns with no idea how to really use them.  There has already been an incident where someone had their own gun used against them in a robbery. 

I work for a trade association and we have already had quite a few calls from private business owners wanting to know what the laws are regarding not allowing people with guns into their establishments.  Personally, I wouldn't want them in their either.  I am much more comfortable with concealed weapons (maybe that sounds stupid - I don't know) but I am extremely uncomfortable seeing people walking into movies, restaurants and other public establishments with holstered weapons.  None of the other patrons know what these people's intentions are going to be.  Plus, it seems like the people who actually know how to use guns properly don't plan to open carry.  It seems like the only ones excited about the open carry law are just a bit too excited (if you know what I mean).  And don't even get me started about the laws that have been passed on college campuses... that is a whole other issue... yep, drunk kids in their dorms with guns.  Yeah, that's just what we need .

Have you considered that virtually 100% of criminals who carry a gun carry concealed? Out of sight out of mind I guess.

Does open carry make you nervous if the person happens to be wearing a badge?

[movingforward]

Jan 5, 2016 18:50:41 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 5, 2016 16:35:29 GMT -5 movingforward said:

Open carry makes me nervous in Texas - probably just because it is new.  We have some idiot cowboy wannabes who are a little too gung-ho about the law IMHO.  I don't really want a lot of yahoos carrying around guns with no idea how to really use them.  There has already been an incident where someone had their own gun used against them in a robbery. 

I work for a trade association and we have already had quite a few calls from private business owners wanting to know what the laws are regarding not allowing people with guns into their establishments.  Personally, I wouldn't want them in their either.  I am much more comfortable with concealed weapons (maybe that sounds stupid - I don't know) but I am extremely uncomfortable seeing people walking into movies, restaurants and other public establishments with holstered weapons.  None of the other patrons know what these people's intentions are going to be.  Plus, it seems like the people who actually know how to use guns properly don't plan to open carry.  It seems like the only ones excited about the open carry law are just a bit too excited (if you know what I mean).  And don't even get me started about the laws that have been passed on college campuses... that is a whole other issue... yep, drunk kids in their dorms with guns.  Yeah, that's just what we need .

Have you considered that virtually 100% of criminals who carry a gun carry concealed? Out of sight out of mind I guess.

Does open carry make you nervous if the person happens to be wearing a badge?

I never said criminals don't carry concealed weapons.  I just don't get how open carry is going to help anything or why some people are so excited about it.

I have absolutely no problem with law enforcement having guns. They are properly trained. 

[Deleted]

Jan 5, 2016 18:50:41 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 5, 2016 16:35:29 GMT -5 movingforward said:

Open carry makes me nervous in Texas - probably just because it is new.  We have some idiot cowboy wannabes who are a little too gung-ho about the law IMHO.  I don't really want a lot of yahoos carrying around guns with no idea how to really use them.  There has already been an incident where someone had their own gun used against them in a robbery. 

I work for a trade association and we have already had quite a few calls from private business owners wanting to know what the laws are regarding not allowing people with guns into their establishments.  Personally, I wouldn't want them in their either.  I am much more comfortable with concealed weapons (maybe that sounds stupid - I don't know) but I am extremely uncomfortable seeing people walking into movies, restaurants and other public establishments with holstered weapons.  None of the other patrons know what these people's intentions are going to be.  Plus, it seems like the people who actually know how to use guns properly don't plan to open carry.  It seems like the only ones excited about the open carry law are just a bit too excited (if you know what I mean).  And don't even get me started about the laws that have been passed on college campuses... that is a whole other issue... yep, drunk kids in their dorms with guns.  Yeah, that's just what we need .

Have you considered that virtually 100% of criminals who carry a gun carry concealed? Out of sight out of mind I guess.

Does open carry make you nervous if the person happens to be wearing a badge?

Yes, open carry does make me nervous even with a badge.  While I understand and value the roles of LEO's and military in my world, I am very uncomfortable in the presence of weapons. That is exactly why I will choose to absent myself from environments where civilian open carry is accepted.  I also absent myself from establishments frequented by LEO's other than off-duty officers hired for security purposes; I can't enjoy a meal with tables full of heavily armed officers in the restaurant.

[gregintenn]

Jan 5, 2016 21:35:18 GMT -5 @donethat said:

Jan 5, 2016 18:50:41 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Have you considered that virtually 100% of criminals who carry a gun carry concealed? Out of sight out of mind I guess.

Does open carry make you nervous if the person happens to be wearing a badge?

Yes, open carry does make me nervous even with a badge.  While I understand and value the roles of LEO's and military in my world, I am very uncomfortable in the presence of weapons. That is exactly why I will choose to absent myself from environments where civilian open carry is accepted.  I also absent myself from establishments frequented by LEO's other than off-duty officers hired for security purposes; I can't enjoy a meal with tables full of heavily armed officers in the restaurant.

Wow. Do you know the cause of this fear? Was there an incident that triggered it?

Very few times in my life that I've been more than a few feet from a gun. This fear is foreign to me. I have a hard time imagining it.

[zibazinski]

Hysteria and attention seeking

[Deleted]

Jan 5, 2016 21:40:11 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 5, 2016 21:35:18 GMT -5 @donethat said:

Yes, open carry does make me nervous even with a badge.  While I understand and value the roles of LEO's and military in my world, I am very uncomfortable in the presence of weapons. That is exactly why I will choose to absent myself from environments where civilian open carry is accepted.  I also absent myself from establishments frequented by LEO's other than off-duty officers hired for security purposes; I can't enjoy a meal with tables full of heavily armed officers in the restaurant.

Wow. Do you know the cause of this fear? Was there an incident that triggered it?

Very few times in my life that I've been more than a few feet from a gun. This fear is foreign to me. I have a hard time imagining it.

Probably stems from my primary experiences with armed LEO's and military personnel being post-disaster when National Guard etc. patrol the streets while we all live in fear in the dark, as much of them as anyone else.  Also, as a semi-Latina elderly female, I fear local law enforcement because of numerous instances of abuse in our community-my demographic is an easy target.  For me armed officers in a restaurant means (1) many patrons don't enter for fear of abuse or capture on immigration issues and (2) some fool thinking it's a good thing to do a John Wayne/suicide by cop thing.  I understand the need for armed police officers in the parking lot of my church; I don't see the need for the person seated next to me to carry.  I guess this is the good thing about the US-we can all find a way of living that's comfortable for us.  

Gregintenn, what is your life experience that places you so close to weapons for much of your life?  Please share with us.

[gregintenn]

Jan 6, 2016 20:48:07 GMT -5 @donethat said:

Jan 5, 2016 21:40:11 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Wow. Do you know the cause of this fear? Was there an incident that triggered it?

Very few times in my life that I've been more than a few feet from a gun. This fear is foreign to me. I have a hard time imagining it.

Probably stems from my primary experiences with armed LEO's and military personnel being post-disaster when National Guard etc. patrol the streets while we all live in fear in the dark, as much of them as anyone else.  Also, as a semi-Latina elderly female, I fear local law enforcement because of numerous instances of abuse in our community-my demographic is an easy target.  For me armed officers in a restaurant means (1) many patrons don't enter for fear of abuse or capture on immigration issues and (2) some fool thinking it's a good thing to do a John Wayne/suicide by cop thing.  I understand the need for armed police officers in the parking lot of my church; I don't see the need for the person seated next to me to carry.  I guess this is the good thing about the US-we can all find a way of living that's comfortable for us.  

Gregintenn, what is your life experience that places you so close to weapons for much of your life?  Please share with us.

Thanks for sharing this with me. I often forget just how different our lives can be from one another.

I live in a very rural place. I grew up working on farms. We hunted for a sizable amount of our diet; not out of necessity, but because we enjoy hunting, and eating fresh, wild game meat and fish.

My father taught me to shoot a rifle when I was small enough I had to lean it on the back of a chair. I simply wasn't big enough to hold it up. He also instilled in me a great respect for the power of a firearm, and never wavered in making sure I was always safe with them. Responsibility was learned at a very early age.

When city kids were playing basketball or riding bikes, we were target shooting or hunting. It was just a cultural thing, and it was what we did. I was nearly grown before I learned that not everyone shared our enthusiasm for shooting sports and hunting.

A local gun show was quite the social event. A large crowd gathered to buy, sell, and trade. A lot of stories and lies were swapped as well. It was great fun, and something that was looked forward to.

My father was a tool and die maker, and as a hobby, he built custom rifles. These were beautiful works of art. Even someone who doesn't appreciate guns would surely appreciate the beauty and craftsmanship these exhibit.

He built each of my sons a deer rifle, and they've both taken deer with them. We process our own meat from these. My wife and children also enjoy informal target practice along with a bit of competition mixed in from time to time. I've taught my children the same safety and responsibility as my father taught me.

This is how I grew up. I am a law abiding citizen, and have no interest in harming another human being. I do love guns. I build rifles, customize guns, load my own ammunition, and build holsters and belts for the public.

Taking this away from me will in no way make the public safer.

[gregintenn]

Sorry I've steered this thread off topic. Back to the topic at hand, I personally prefer to carry concealed in public, but see no reason to mandate everyone else to do what I choose to do.

[ArchietheDragon]

Jan 6, 2016 21:50:00 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 6, 2016 20:48:07 GMT -5 @donethat said:

Probably stems from my primary experiences with armed LEO's and military personnel being post-disaster when National Guard etc. patrol the streets while we all live in fear in the dark, as much of them as anyone else.  Also, as a semi-Latina elderly female, I fear local law enforcement because of numerous instances of abuse in our community-my demographic is an easy target.  For me armed officers in a restaurant means (1) many patrons don't enter for fear of abuse or capture on immigration issues and (2) some fool thinking it's a good thing to do a John Wayne/suicide by cop thing.  I understand the need for armed police officers in the parking lot of my church; I don't see the need for the person seated next to me to carry.  I guess this is the good thing about the US-we can all find a way of living that's comfortable for us.  

Gregintenn, what is your life experience that places you so close to weapons for much of your life?  Please share with us.

Thanks for sharing this with me. I often forget just how different our lives can be from one another.

I live in a very rural place. I grew up working on farms. We hunted for a sizable amount of our diet; not out of necessity, but because we enjoy hunting, and eating fresh, wild game meat and fish.

My father taught me to shoot a rifle when I was small enough I had to lean it on the back of a chair. I simply wasn't big enough to hold it up. He also instilled in me a great respect for the power of a firearm, and never wavered in making sure I was always safe with them. Responsibility was learned at a very early age.

When city kids were playing basketball or riding bikes, we were target shooting or hunting. It was just a cultural thing, and it was what we did. I was nearly grown before I learned that not everyone shared our enthusiasm for shooting sports and hunting.

A local gun show was quite the social event. A large crowd gathered to buy, sell, and trade. A lot of stories and lies were swapped as well. It was great fun, and something that was looked forward to.

My father was a tool and die maker, and as a hobby, he built custom rifles. These were beautiful works of art. Even someone who doesn't appreciate guns would surely appreciate the beauty and craftsmanship these exhibit.

He built each of my sons a deer rifle, and they've both taken deer with them. We process our own meat from these. My wife and children also enjoy informal target practice along with a bit of competition mixed in from time to time. I've taught my children the same safety and responsibility as my father taught me.

This is how I grew up. I am a law abiding citizen, and have no interest in harming another human being. I do love guns. I build rifles, customize guns, load my own ammunition, and build holsters and belts for the public.

Taking this away from me will in no way make the public safer.

A condemnation of guns is a condemnation of your entire life.  The wonderful memories of growing up.   Happy times with friends and family.  Community.  You are being told that it is not acceptable.   It is no wonder that you are upset about it. 

[gregintenn]

Finally, somebody gets it! Thanks Archie. A sizable number of fellow Americans are telling me that what I do and who I am are no longer acceptable, although I've done nothing to harm any of them.

[movingforward]

Jan 6, 2016 21:50:00 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

Jan 6, 2016 20:48:07 GMT -5 @donethat said:

Probably stems from my primary experiences with armed LEO's and military personnel being post-disaster when National Guard etc. patrol the streets while we all live in fear in the dark, as much of them as anyone else.  Also, as a semi-Latina elderly female, I fear local law enforcement because of numerous instances of abuse in our community-my demographic is an easy target.  For me armed officers in a restaurant means (1) many patrons don't enter for fear of abuse or capture on immigration issues and (2) some fool thinking it's a good thing to do a John Wayne/suicide by cop thing.  I understand the need for armed police officers in the parking lot of my church; I don't see the need for the person seated next to me to carry.  I guess this is the good thing about the US-we can all find a way of living that's comfortable for us.  

Gregintenn, what is your life experience that places you so close to weapons for much of your life?  Please share with us.

Thanks for sharing this with me. I often forget just how different our lives can be from one another.

I live in a very rural place. I grew up working on farms. We hunted for a sizable amount of our diet; not out of necessity, but because we enjoy hunting, and eating fresh, wild game meat and fish.

My father taught me to shoot a rifle when I was small enough I had to lean it on the back of a chair. I simply wasn't big enough to hold it up. He also instilled in me a great respect for the power of a firearm, and never wavered in making sure I was always safe with them. Responsibility was learned at a very early age.

When city kids were playing basketball or riding bikes, we were target shooting or hunting. It was just a cultural thing, and it was what we did. I was nearly grown before I learned that not everyone shared our enthusiasm for shooting sports and hunting.

A local gun show was quite the social event. A large crowd gathered to buy, sell, and trade. A lot of stories and lies were swapped as well. It was great fun, and something that was looked forward to.

My father was a tool and die maker, and as a hobby, he built custom rifles. These were beautiful works of art. Even someone who doesn't appreciate guns would surely appreciate the beauty and craftsmanship these exhibit.

He built each of my sons a deer rifle, and they've both taken deer with them. We process our own meat from these. My wife and children also enjoy informal target practice along with a bit of competition mixed in from time to time. I've taught my children the same safety and responsibility as my father taught me.

This is how I grew up. I am a law abiding citizen, and have no interest in harming another human being. I do love guns. I build rifles, customize guns, load my own ammunition, and build holsters and belts for the public.

Taking this away from me will in no way make the public safer.

You have a greater experience and exposure to guns than most people.  The problem I have with open carry (and guns in general) is that a lot of people who have them don't know diddly squat about how to use them.  There are a great number of individuals, especially in large cities like where I live, that seem to think that open carry is going to somehow deter criminal activity and mass shootings.  They believe that if a regular Joe (for lack of better words) has a pistol strapped to his/her hip that they will be able to "take out" a criminal before they are able to hurt people (or more people than they already have).  In theory, this sounds reasonable... some crazy ass shows up at a public place and starts shooting people, another person has a gun and takes them out.  It makes sense until you get some hero wannabe who isn't trained properly and ends up killing more innocent people, or the criminal(s) easily disarm Barney Five wannabe and have even more ammo to use on Barney Five himself and other patrons.  At any rate, no one knows how it may or may not play out. 

It seems that a lot of other states have open carry and it hasn't really been an issue.  Since the law went into effect I have only seen one person who was not law enforcement with a pistol strapped to his hip.  My guess is it won't be an issue here either but for those of us who have never been around guns (me ) the thought of a bunch of people walking around with weapons makes us a little uneasy. 

ETA:  Please know that I have no problem with someone like you having a firearm.  It wouldn't make me uneasy.  I know people who carry firearms (usually in their briefcase ) and if I know they are properly trained it doesn't bother me much but there is one lady I know who carries and the thought of that scares the crap out of me.  She doesn't know diddly crap about how to use the damn thing. 

[gregintenn]

movingforward,

The same problem, real or perceived, you expressed about open carry still exists with conceal carry, only you just don't see it.

Another thing. ALL cops have guns. Right out there in the open. Most, contrary to popular belief, are not "gun guys". Aside from the mandatory annual qualification, many never fire, clean, or otherwise handle a gun except to buckle on their gun belts. Google accidental police shootings and get to reading. It'll scare the hell out of you. We as a society have been conditioned to give these folks a pass simply because of the magical badge and gun.

There are bad people out there. They are in every walk of life. It's just something we have to live with.

A gun isn't dangerous without someone who's willing to fire it.

If guns are so evil, why does our president surround himself with people carrying guns? A gun can also be used for good. In a magazine I subscribe to, there is an entire page monthly dedicated to news articles where people have saved themselves from harm or death using a firearm.

[movingforward]

Jan 7, 2016 16:33:14 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

movingforward,

The same problem, real or perceived, you expressed about open carry still exists with conceal carry, only you just don't see it.

Another thing. ALL cops have guns. Right out there in the open. Most, contrary to popular belief, are not "gun guys". Aside from the mandatory annual qualification, many never fire, clean, or otherwise handle a gun except to buckle on their gun belts. Google accidental police shootings and get to reading. It'll scare the hell out of you. We as a society have been conditioned to give these folks a pass simply because of the magical badge and gun.

There are bad people out there. They are in every walk of life. It's just something we have to live with.

A gun isn't dangerous without someone who's willing to fire it.

If guns are so evil, why does our president surround himself with people carrying guns? A gun can also be used for good. In a magazine I subscribe to, there is an entire page monthly dedicated to news articles where people have saved themselves from harm or death using a firearm.

Eh, I know the problems are the same.  Like I said before, I just don't see how open carry helps anything other than to make people feel more comfortable because they are totting around a gun that other people can see.  It's the people that NEED open carry to make them comfortable that scare me.  At any rate, arguing over gun laws is just exhausting.  One side is never going to see the other side's point of view. 

[gregintenn]

Jan 7, 2016 16:54:39 GMT -5 movingforward said:

Jan 7, 2016 16:33:14 GMT -5 gregintenn said:

movingforward,

The same problem, real or perceived, you expressed about open carry still exists with conceal carry, only you just don't see it.

Another thing. ALL cops have guns. Right out there in the open. Most, contrary to popular belief, are not "gun guys". Aside from the mandatory annual qualification, many never fire, clean, or otherwise handle a gun except to buckle on their gun belts. Google accidental police shootings and get to reading. It'll scare the hell out of you. We as a society have been conditioned to give these folks a pass simply because of the magical badge and gun.

There are bad people out there. They are in every walk of life. It's just something we have to live with.

A gun isn't dangerous without someone who's willing to fire it.

If guns are so evil, why does our president surround himself with people carrying guns? A gun can also be used for good. In a magazine I subscribe to, there is an entire page monthly dedicated to news articles where people have saved themselves from harm or death using a firearm.

Eh, I know the problems are the same.  Like I said before, I just don't see how open carry helps anything other than to make people feel more comfortable because they are totting around a gun that other people can see.  It's the people that NEED open carry to make them comfortable that scare me.  At any rate, arguing over gun laws is just exhausting.  One side is never going to see the other side's point of view. 

I'm with you in that I too don't see what it helps and don't see a need for it. I don't see a need for skateboards, but am not banging a drum to ban them.

The only place I can see a real benefit of open carry being legal is to prevent a concealed carrying person from being charged with a crime if they bent over or reached up for something on a shelf and accidentally made their arm visible.

  It is not my intention to argue with you, or to try and convince you to change your mind. I would like to present a different point of view to people who might not know much about firearms beyond the garbage they've seen on the news or in Hollywood movies.

[Deleted]

DH and I have owned guns all our lives.  We did a certain amount of target shooting when we were younger; DH hunted so he had rifles and shotguns (my eyesight and accuracy is not good enough for a kill shot so I never hunted); DH also liked sporting clays.  We both had concealed carry permits for many years because of our late night commutes.  DH renewed his concealed permit last year but doesn't carry.  We do have loaded handguns in our home.  

I think my main concern with open carry is that the individuals I personally know who embrace the idea are not experienced with guns but follow an extremist ideology that includes open carry as a component of their thought process.  I just don't want to sit next to a person at the movie who has a gun in one hand and popcorn in the other.  Yes, I get it that everyone at the movie might be the victim of an active shooter incident, but I don't feel one bit safer with the civilian next to me carrying.  It's easy to talk but how many have ever trained for this?  A static target on a range is not the same as a dark venue with muzzle flashes and nano-seconds to decide who's who-good/bad, shooter/victim.

We have a certain amount of controversy in the area right now involving a restaurant that offered a 25% discount to customers who open carry.  Some fools then made death threats against the restaurant owner which is just flat stupid and wrong.  It really doesn't make any difference to me because (1) it's BBQ which we rarely eat (2) it's 15 miles away and I'm not driving that far for anything.  

Hopefully none of us will ever actually experience a situation where the question is tested.

[ktunes]

one thing to consider is that in some states even with a concealed carry permit, open carry is not allowed...so if I were carrying a handgun in a holster and under a sweatshirt, that would be legal...if i raised my hands above my head and my sweatshirt pulled up exposing the holstered gun, i just broke the law...

in georgia you have to have a permit to open carry a handgun...the law becomes a little muddled about open carry with long guns...

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Jan 9, 2016 1:52:46 GMT -5 ktunes said:

one thing to consider is that in some states even with a concealed carry permit, open carry is not allowed...so if I were carrying a handgun in a holster and under a sweatshirt, that would be legal...if i raised my hands above my head and my sweatshirt pulled up exposing the holstered gun, i just broke the law...

in georgia you have to have a permit to open carry a handgun...the law becomes a little muddled about open carry with long guns...

This depends upon state.  In some states, accidentally flashing you gun if you are concealed carrying is a misdemeanor.  Other states, nada.

[Deleted]

Who said guns were evil?    I don't think automobiles are evil... But I do want to regulate liscensing and registration. 

[billisonboard]

Before one open carries, here is something to consider:
COVEN CAST provides our most powerful method of spell casting as the entire coven participates to create the :Pmost intense and effective spell casting we can offer.

EDIT: Perhaps I should add an adult content warning for the link

[daisy]

We live in rural WI and both open carry and concealed carry.  DH has been more 'open' about open carrying than I and he's had some great conversations about it...mostly in the grocery store.  Lots of people ask what kind of gun he has, what it cost, how he likes it etc.  No one has been negative or weirded out.  Again, rural WI so I wouldn't expect it - but we are not too far from the capital either.  He, too, thinks that people who walk around with an AR strapped to their back are attention-seeking jerks who are doing more to damage the legal gun-owning/carrying populace than those of us who unobtrusively have a pistol in a holster.

In a bit of an OT, when someone who lives in a large city with a huge police department tells me I don't need to own a gun of any sort because 'the police have guns' - I want to punch them.  We live in the middle of BF nowhere, in a town with ~500 people, surrounded by 100's of acres of farmland, with a total of THREE COUNTY sheriffs on duty at any given time in a county with an area of over 800 miles....you do the math.  I had to call 911 a couple of years ago when DH suffered an injury here in the house.  The ambulance came, checked him over, put him in the back and started an IV BEFORE the county sheriff got to the house....tell me again how an LEO with a gun will come to my rescue when someone breaks into my house?

[daisy]

Jan 11, 2016 13:07:50 GMT -5 alwaysbeoptimizing said:

Jan 11, 2016 12:03:05 GMT -5 daisy said:

We live in rural WI and both open carry and concealed carry.  DH has been more 'open' about open carrying than I and he's had some great conversations about it...mostly in the grocery store.  Lots of people ask what kind of gun he has, what it cost, how he likes it etc.  No one has been negative or weirded out.  Again, rural WI so I wouldn't expect it - but we are not too far from the capital either.  He, too, thinks that people who walk around with an AR strapped to their back are attention-seeking jerks who are doing more to damage the legal gun-owning/carrying populace than those of us who unobtrusively have a pistol in a holster.

In a bit of an OT, when someone who lives in a large city with a huge police department tells me I don't need to own a gun of any sort because 'the police have guns' - I want to punch them.  We live in the middle of BF nowhere, in a town with ~500 people, surrounded by 100's of acres of farmland, with a total of THREE COUNTY sheriffs on duty at any given time in a county with an area of over 800 miles....you do the math.  I had to call 911 a couple of years ago when DH suffered an injury here in the house.  The ambulance came, checked him over, put him in the back and started an IV BEFORE the county sheriff got to the house....tell me again how an LEO with a gun will come to my rescue when someone breaks into my house?

when you need help in seconds, the police or only minutes away.

The police officers I know well are generally supportive of people having guns, not being dumb*sses, but planning to protect themselves.

They will admit that they can't usually get there before the situation will be resolved one way or the other.

That's very true - when you grow up with guns, practice with them all of the time (we have an area at the back of the property where we shoot) and KNOW the dangers involved with handling a loaded weapon...then you can at least raise a defense while calling 911.  The gun owners we know have no desire to usurp LEOs, but if someone comes knocking at my door at any time during the day - they WILL be met with a gun (out of sight) and a 100# GSD.  And if we are out on the property working, we are open carrying.  It's a fact of life.  All of our children are capable of using a gun as well and have the proper respect for it.

Youngest is in the National Guard and just texted me that she got to take apart an M16 yesterday - when I asked if she managed to put it back together she said, "MOOOOOOOOOOOM"....we call her Machinegun(name). 

[milee]

Jan 11, 2016 13:04:00 GMT -5 alwaysbeoptimizing said:

2. Concealed carry requires a permit (background check/etc).  Having a gun in your glovebox counts as concealed!!  This is why DW has a permit, so if I ever, for whatever reason, had a concealed pistol in the car and got out and she ran to the store and happened to get pulle dover and searched, she would not be in violation of the law.

That's the same reason I have a CCW permit, too. DH is into guns, is a Range Safety Officer at the local range, participates in Three Gun and Action Pistol competitions, etc.  I'm competent at using them mainly because I've gone with DH and the boys as a family thing, but if/when I ever live alone, I won't own a gun.  We keep all guns and ammunition in a safe at home and guns aren't really my thing.  All that being said, several times when DH and I would switch cars in the past, I'd open the trunk, glove box, back seat etc and discover that since I had his car that "I" was carrying a concealed weapon.    It just seemed like a good way to avoid unnecessary hassle to get my permit even though I have no plans to ever carry a gun.

[billisonboard]

Jan 11, 2016 12:03:05 GMT -5 daisy said:

... I had to call 911 a couple of years ago when DH suffered an injury here in the house.  The ambulance came, checked him over, put him in the back and started an IV BEFORE the county sheriff got to the house.... ...

So when you reported an injury through 911, medical personnel got there quicker than law enforcement personnel. Why did the country sheriff show up at all?

[daisy]

Jan 11, 2016 14:20:02 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Jan 11, 2016 12:03:05 GMT -5 daisy said:

... I had to call 911 a couple of years ago when DH suffered an injury here in the house.  The ambulance came, checked him over, put him in the back and started an IV BEFORE the county sheriff got to the house.... ...

So when you reported an injury through 911, medical personnel got there quicker than law enforcement personnel. Why did the country sheriff show up at all?

Because they always do?  I don't know the criteria for a law enforcement response....maybe they thought that because of the type of accident that he had tried to kill himself? He sliced part of his finger off using an ancient saw and I don't remember what I said to the dispatcher.  I think around here if anything that happens that requires a 911 call the sheriff's deputy shows up.  That's an error I typed in that post (making soap and taking a quick break) - it's the sheriff's deputies that patrol - all 3 of them.