Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2014 19:26:50 GMT -5
I too have no advice to give you, but wish you the best of luck.
If you're going to get sick, might it be better to get sick on Wed so you have some time to regroup / think / prepare for your job interviews?
Fingers and toes crossed for you!
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Aug 4, 2014 19:31:37 GMT -5
Thanks.
Oh man, sometimes I think this situation will drive me to drink. I just try to take it one step at a time, and worry about what might happen later later. For now, I need to focus on preparing for the interviews and doing well, and let the chips fall where they may.
Yes, my boss previous to my current one thought I did a great job, gave me good reviews and everything.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 4, 2014 19:37:46 GMT -5
Phoenix-that your termination was overturned should have been expunged from any of your records. Whether it was is another story.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2014 19:39:02 GMT -5
I am not trying to be negative, but they ARE going to fire you.
I don't think you should have consented to this "background" stuff until you talked to a lawyer if you are actually going to fight for your job.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Aug 4, 2014 19:42:49 GMT -5
Phoenix-that your termination was overturned should have been expunged from any of your records. Whether it was is another story. I asked how they found out about it, but she didn't know. My guess is they called an old boss or co worker and they told them. If my record really wasn't changed, then that's a big issue because it was ordered by the court that it was to be changed like it never happened.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 4, 2014 19:48:03 GMT -5
Phoenix-that your termination was overturned should have been expunged from any of your records. Whether it was is another story. I asked how they found out about it, but she didn't know. My guess is they called an old boss or co worker and they told them. If my record really wasn't changed, then that's a big issue because it was ordered by the court that it was to be changed like it never happened. Something to look ìnto in the near future (are your records clear).. Did the investigator think you had been fired? Or was he aware of your court ordered reinstatement prior to your interview.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2014 19:48:32 GMT -5
Phoenix-that your termination was overturned should have been expunged from any of your records. Whether it was is another story. I asked how they found out about it, but she didn't know. My guess is they called an old boss or co worker and they told them. If my record really wasn't changed, then that's a big issue because it was ordered by the court that it was to be changed like it never happened. But people will not un-learn about it. Anyone who knows will still know. I guess that's why I don't understand fighting that hard for a job. If they don't want you there, they will find a reason to get rid of you.
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wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on Aug 4, 2014 19:51:22 GMT -5
Part of me thinks you should have disclosed it. I'm guessing either an old boss or maybe the back pay or something?
Interviewing your boss and one co-worker was standard procedure when I had my interview for the same clearance. I'm not saying it's wrong but the group who did my investigation got in serious trouble for digging into stuff that was off limits. For example things when you are under 18 are off limits yet mine asked why my parents got divorced. I tried to stifle my initial response which was how the F would I know, I was 5!!!
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Aug 4, 2014 19:52:45 GMT -5
I would imagine the court document ordering the reinstatement of your employment would be part of your permanent file/record. So if the investigator went through your file, he/she would have come across it.
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wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on Aug 4, 2014 19:54:07 GMT -5
As for the interview timing, did you have on old clearance that would be expiring now? I'm actually kind of surprised someone in your position didn't have to get clearance as a condition of the job.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2014 19:58:00 GMT -5
Part of me thinks you should have disclosed it. I'm guessing either an old boss or maybe the back pay or something? Interviewing your boss and one co-worker was standard procedure when I had my interview for the same clearance. I'm not saying it's wrong but the group who did my investigation got in serious trouble for digging into stuff that was off limits. For example things when you are under 18 are off limits yet mine asked why my parents got divorced. I tried to stifle my initial response which was how the F would I know, I was 5!!! if the firing was expunged from his record, there's no way he should bring it up. just like any arrests that aren't part of your record. frankly once they brought that up I would have ended the interview and contacted a lawyer.
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Ava
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Post by Ava on Aug 4, 2014 20:05:51 GMT -5
Phoenix; you should concentrate on getting a new job. I know it's difficult but try not to waste too much energy on your current position; it really doesn't look salvageable.
I also agree with shasta that you should find a lawyer.
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Abby Normal
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Post by Abby Normal on Aug 4, 2014 20:25:05 GMT -5
Is it normal to do a background check like this? Shouldn't they have done one before you were hired? Unless your clearance was up it seems strange to me. Sounds more "investigate for cause" rather than routine.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Aug 4, 2014 20:37:43 GMT -5
I asked how they found out about it, but she didn't know. My guess is they called an old boss or co worker and they told them. If my record really wasn't changed, then that's a big issue because it was ordered by the court that it was to be changed like it never happened. Something to look ìnto in the near future (are your records clear).. Did the investigator think you had been fired? Or was he aware of your court ordered reinstatement prior to your interview. They were aware I was reinstated, but didn't know the specifics.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Aug 4, 2014 20:39:06 GMT -5
I asked how they found out about it, but she didn't know. My guess is they called an old boss or co worker and they told them. If my record really wasn't changed, then that's a big issue because it was ordered by the court that it was to be changed like it never happened. But people will not un-learn about it. Anyone who knows will still know. I guess that's why I don't understand fighting that hard for a job. If they don't want you there, they will find a reason to get rid of you. I'm not fighting to keep my current job, I'm keeping the wolves at bay (so to speak) until I can find another job. I'm fighting to keep the paychecks coming until I can get the hell out of dodge. The only alternative is unemployment, and who wants that?
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Aug 4, 2014 20:41:10 GMT -5
As for the interview timing, did you have on old clearance that would be expiring now? I'm actually kind of surprised someone in your position didn't have to get clearance as a condition of the job. When I started with the Navy in 2007, I got a secret clearance, which is good for 10 years. I guess my current job just accepted the clearance and didn't do a public trust background check. Either it's ordered by my supervisor, or someone decided that was an oversight and wanted to correct it. Either way, my security clearance stuff should be good until late 2017, at least if they wanted to accept my secret clearance. I'm not sure if you leave the DOD if they are supposed to do one or not, but my understanding was they didn't when I was hired here.
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Apple
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Post by Apple on Aug 4, 2014 20:43:02 GMT -5
The government works in really weird ways, and when your working for it, you have to play the game or you get crushed. Right now, Phoenix is pretty stuck, but seems to be handling it.
I think you did the right thing with the investigator. My foreman once got investigated because his adult stepson got mad at him and called up district and told them that the foreman had all kinds of government tools at his house. So, they investigated, found out what was going on, realized the guy hadn't stolen a bunch of tools, he just had a tool for a stepson, and closed the investigation. It sounds like the new boss is mad and is going to throw whatever she can at Phoenix, and has decided SHE thinks he should be investigated.
I'll keep my fingers crossed that one of these jobs works out for you! I'd be careful about taking sick leave though if she can use that against you and just take two days of annual instead.
Edited because phoenix posted while I was typing...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2014 20:46:08 GMT -5
Sounds like you still haven't hired a lawyer?! I think you need to bite that bullet Phoenix.
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Phoenix84
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Post by Phoenix84 on Aug 4, 2014 20:49:38 GMT -5
Ah, Apple, I wish I had your life. You sound like you have an interesting job.
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Knee Deep in Water Chloe
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Post by Knee Deep in Water Chloe on Aug 4, 2014 21:11:03 GMT -5
Oh, Phoenix, I'm so sorry this is not getting better. Definitely follow your sick leave policies. I hope the interviews go well for you. Do you want us to ask you questions so you can practice answers?
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drivingaround
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Post by drivingaround on Aug 4, 2014 21:43:34 GMT -5
Are you practicing your response to the question "Why are you leaving your current employer?"? Perhaps saying it in the mirror to become confident with the words and phrasing. I have a slight stutter which isn't noticeable except when nervous, like interviewing. People get very impatient with stuttering and tend to finish my sentances which is frustrating. I found practicing simple statements to common interview questions helped be more clear during interviews. It also helps with the potential questions you don't want to answer or don't have a good response for, like why you are leaving your current employer.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2014 23:56:21 GMT -5
"My boss certainly isn't bashful about telling others exactly what she thinks of me and the job I'm doing. That doesn't bode well for any potential employers that contact her."
I thought it was illegal to give a bad reference. That is what my old boss had told me. I don't know if it is different for the government though. Hire a lawyer or at least talk to one ASAP!
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Mardi Gras Audrey
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Post by Mardi Gras Audrey on Aug 5, 2014 0:21:38 GMT -5
"My boss certainly isn't bashful about telling others exactly what she thinks of me and the job I'm doing. That doesn't bode well for any potential employers that contact her." I thought it was illegal to give a bad reference. That is what my old boss had told me. I don't know if it is different for the government though. Hire a lawyer or at least talk to one ASAP! It isn't illegal, it just isn't recommended. It opens the door to the employee suing a company for slander/libel? (I can't remember which is which).. Most companies don't want to deal with the possibility of dealing with it and having to "prove" why someone sucks (if that is what the former employer told the new one) so they just make a blanket rule that they won't discuss it (most will just verify dates of employment). Some will get around this by asking if the person is "rehireable" (with the understanding that if the employee was fired for cause, they would not be rehireable).
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 5, 2014 5:18:36 GMT -5
There has to be a reason you haven't hired a lawyer by now. This has been going on for weeks.
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milee
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Post by milee on Aug 5, 2014 6:51:42 GMT -5
I wouldn't hire a lawyer in this situation, either, so not sure why everyone continues to push that point. Phoenix is doing the best, most productive things he can - lay low at work while following the rules and assignments given, handling new situations at work professionally and looking for a new job.
Good luck on the interviews, Phoenix. Sounds like things are starting to open up and hopefully this will be a great new start for you.
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kjto1
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Post by kjto1 on Aug 5, 2014 6:58:56 GMT -5
Good Luck on the interviews! I hope at least one of them works out for you.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 5, 2014 7:20:46 GMT -5
Because its harassment and wrongful termination. For some reason they are looking to get rid of him. Whether he deserves it or not. Maybe he does, I don't know, but if he doesn't, then this is wrong.
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ArchietheDragon
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Post by ArchietheDragon on Aug 5, 2014 7:22:04 GMT -5
Because its harassment and wrongful termination. For some reason they are looking to get rid of him. Whether he deserves it or not. Maybe he does, I don't know, but if he doesn't, then this is wrong. In most states, unless you have a contract, you can fire someone for any reason, as long as it is not a federally protected one.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 5, 2014 7:27:54 GMT -5
He has "issues" that could protect him. If he is telling the truth, she's been out to get him from day one for some reason. Seems like insecurity on her part because she's been given the job due to her being "protected." Just stupid. If I was given a cushy job and just because I was so and so, I'd let him do his job and just smile while I collected my fat paycheck.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Aug 5, 2014 8:34:17 GMT -5
If this background investigation could find out about my past firing that was overturned, won't future employers who do background investigations find out about it? Is this going to be a millstone I have to carry around my neck for the rest of my life? Even if I can get another job, who's to say they won't find out about it and fire me on the spot? What ever happened to second chances?
I got the disciplinary notice expunged from my record in exchange for leaving quietly, but I have had prospective employers ask me why my previous job lasted less than a year.
I worked with a recruitment agency on how to handle answering that question so it didn't give off vibes that something is wrong with me.
How we worked it is I explain that I was hired by a middle man (research coordinator) while the actual boss was in California. According to his piece of paper and my piece of paper I appeared to be ideal for the job. However once it started it was quickly realized I was out of my league since I only had 3 years experience in a working lab, the job should have gone to someone with a master's or higher. So the boss and I agreed it would be best for me to look for another job.
Not quite how it actually went down, this is a much more cleaned up/positive spin version but it seems to satisfy people. I know it didn't stand in the way of me getting this job.
In your case I'd definitely find a career coach or someone to talk to because now you're being fired AGAIN. While you got the last one overturned that doesn't mean there isn't a pattern, you got the last one overturned on a paperwork technicality. You're going to need help putting a spin on the last two jobs you've held and why you left.
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