NancysSummerSip
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Post by NancysSummerSip on Jul 2, 2014 11:07:59 GMT -5
Sorry-assed bastard. I would have killed him then and there. Put a hand on a child like that, and I personally guarantee, you will lose that hand, clean up past your elbows. Good for you Apple, for doing what you did. Regardless of the actual number of times, I hope the perpetrator paid the price. In hell.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2014 11:11:35 GMT -5
MPL, i know it is easier said than done. I've been there. It is hard to say no when he says the "right" things. But try to keep busy with your kids, family, friends. The worst time is when you have too much free time and you are bored. I know you are a strong woman, you will get over him and the lonely feeling. Maybe you should go out on a few casual dates.
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Angel!
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Post by Angel! on Jul 2, 2014 11:19:17 GMT -5
Most abusive situations are more like the frog-in-boiling-water thing, anyway. If you go from Brady Bunch perfect to punched-in-the-face overnight, it's probably easy to walk. But if your "normal" has evolved to yelling and emotional abuse - physical abuse may not cross the line, just stretch it a little further. It is totally this. If you are already in an emotionally abusive type relationship, this just stretches it further. And that line has already been stretched & stretched & stretched. It becomes hard to draw the line. It isn't like day one of a relationship you realize this is what it will turn into. It goes slowly over time after you are already invested. First there might be some talking down & snide comments. That might slowly morph into yelling about stuff, maybe throwing something out of anger. But, these aren't even daily events, in the beginning most days are really good still. There might be 2-6 months with no problems & then one day he starts yelling & throws the remote. Then another few months go by & maybe he calls you a bitch & horrible mother. Then another few months go by & maybe he smashes a lamp. Each time you both make excuses... he was drunk, he was having a bad day because his dad just died. But he really loves you & is sorry...and the line stretches. Will continue in a minute....have to work Ok....continuing my post You know things aren't good, but there is always a reason & always a hope it will get better. My ex was an alcoholic & bi-polar. Had he chosen to get treatment for those things, he could have gotten better. He kept talking about getting treatment, would make steps towards it, but eventually everything would fall apart again. Not sure in all cases of abusse, but I actually felt sorry for him...I still do. He is sick, his life is a fucking mess, and he just isn't capable of putting it together. I just kept waiting for it to happen & kept believing this time it will be different. The day he hit me, he was drunk off his ass & barely even remembered later. But, he never defended the choice (at that time). Even the instant he did it he realized how badly he had just screwed up. And then I could defend it by saying I tried to push him before he hit me - I won't, but in the right mindset you could see how a woman might say "it was my fault because I went after him first". It was an escalating situation & I didn't help it. It is just so easy to make excuses as to why this time is different and why it won't happen again. We become codependent and hitting just stretches the line of what is acceptable a little further, just more proof that they need our help and if we just work harder, we can make them better. We become emotionally scarred, we are sick, we walk on eggshells, yet because of the way it all happens over time (frog boiling in water), we stay because we love them & want to help them & this is just one more slip-up, but it won't happen again. Maybe it is still way too hard to understand for those that would never accept being hit, but it is the best explaination I have. And maybe until you live it, some people just can't understand. Fortunately many of you will never have to face the situation.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 2, 2014 11:47:09 GMT -5
I think you said it very well. I think it is easier to understand if you have lived it and you have a personality more likely to putting up with slow escalation. Some people don't, so they will never get it at the level of someone who would.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2014 21:05:29 GMT -5
Your problem is that you are not mad enough. He took 2 years of your life away from you. He frightened you. He upended your view of the future and what life was to be. YOU didn't do anything to cause this. HE has used and abused you. HE has burned 2 years of your life with negative energy, lies and deceit. I think I am angrier for you than you are
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2014 22:08:06 GMT -5
Your problem is that you are not mad enough. He took 2 years of your life away from you. He frightened you. He upended your view of the future and what life was to be. YOU didn't do anything to cause this. HE has used and abused you. HE has burned 2 years of your life with negative energy, lies and deceit. I think I am angrier for you than you are Yeah, I know. I don't have a lot of fight left. It's really hard to not feel like there's something wrong with me at this point.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2014 22:21:56 GMT -5
I'm out of Family Fun Hell! I'll have to say, I was getting a lot more comfortable with the place the last day and a half and was a little bummed the weather was so bad today. The kids and I could have stayed in the park until everything closed even after my parents left with the camper, but it was cold and rainy. Anyhow, now that I have a regular computer back, I want to thank everyone for all the ass kickings, kind words and encouragement. I appreciate all of it, but I really liked hearing from those that have been there, done that who let me know that what I'm feeling is normal. I obviously don't do divorce well, and can't just do the "you're dead to me thing", which is really funny if you knew me in person. Most think I'm pretty cold and hard assed. If any of you are into Meyer's Briggs. I'm a real strong INTJ. The robot. LOL But in reality, I have very strong feelings and I'm about as loyal a person you can imagine. I just am not very good at expressing them...except for writing. I'm a lot better there, which is why I tend to hang out in forums more than bars.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2014 22:30:09 GMT -5
On another note, ex SIL called me tonight and told me that ex-MIL called her husband (DH's brother) and said she thinks that they really should plan something with ex for over the 4th or he's going to be hanging out with the wrong people. So, my suspicions were probably correct that he's back with that crowd. SIL was pissed off that they were supposed to be responsible for him. I told her to not worry about it. It wouldn't make a difference. If they kept him away on the 4th, he'd still go see them on the 5th, 6th and 7th....
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2014 23:12:37 GMT -5
^ You did not make a mistake. I got texts like these for years, seemed to come and go, but would get really bad if he was drinking. Then when I'd keep saying no, he'd get pissed at me and I'd feel bad. But I kept saying no anyway. Eventually he apologized, and I haven't gotten any texts like that for several months now. You have to keep saying no. It sucks to remember the bad times, but do it. Force yourself to think of every bad thing he did to you. Now is not the time to "move on" from the bad things because you need to remember them vividly to keep from considering going back. Over time you'll be able to "forgive", and maybe even forget a little. But don't forget now. Don't forget until you are strong enough to say no without having to remember the bad stuff. It sucks. I've been in a similar spot. It still sucks. But don't even be wishy-washy about it. No "I wish it could be different", no "maybe", just keep saying no. Ignore the texts until daylight (yes, this will probably piss him off or freak him out), but things seem to be easier to deal with in the daylight. You're not the first one to deal with this, and you won't be the last. But you CAN deal with it! What she said! And I know sometimes you doubt it and slightly hope it will change. I know, my cousin was there. She wished it would change but it never did. She swore to her mom he was a changed man, but that was a lie. So she avoided family and friends so she did not have to explain herself or fill judge. And that was our fault, we let her down... 2 years later it still hurts, it still hurts seeing her kids that did not have to lose a mother, it still hurts to know she was barely in her 30's and did not have to die, And it hurts even more to know he is out there a free man while he left his wife internally bleed to death on their kitchen floor and disappeared for 3 days... But not enough to lock him up! I know the worse case scenario and you don't want to be it. My mom did the whole stick around for the kids till the abuse moved on to the kids and she left... But she should have left long before. You are on the right path, don't let him make you doubt yourself. And I am serious when I say if at anytime you want to waiver: close your eyes and remember the last time he knocked you out. And imagine your son walking in on that. I still remember clearly being 3 walking in on my dad beating my mom like his punching bag, she thinks I am making it up because I was too young to remember. I do, up to me running out and yelling for help and the neighbors getting involved, I remember all of it now at 29 as if it was yesterday.Stick to your guns! I'm sorry to hear you saw that Carl. Ugh. The worst moment I remember wasn't the punching, even though he was holding our son at that time, DS was only two. I don't think he rememberd it. It was a year later on August 24, 2013. He took our son (there was a no contact order) and was screaming at me in the middle of the street calling me every name in the book and threatening to shoot me. He was holding our son and I was just begging him to please give him back, his brother, SIL, mother, nieces and nephews were all there trying to convince him to just hand him over, but he wouldn't. Our son was calling me "stupid f***ing, b***" and "crazy b***" at his father's coaxing and didn't understand why I was taking him from his Dad. It was awful. Finally he set him in the van and said he was going to get him some water and I took off with the doors all wide open and him chasing me down the street. After I left, he was punching the mailbox, trees, a cement wall.... I don't know how he got away from there without breaking his hand that had just had reconstructive surgery a couple months earlier. It was 5 or 6 weeks later that his noodle completely slipped off the plate and I had 6 months of peace. It was wonderful. I didn't have to worry about him anymore. He wasn't using, he wasn't living in a tent in the cold, he wasn't going to show up at my door, he couldn't even call or text. It was like a detox. He detoxed too. He's gotten a lot of help since then and is being treated for bipolar and is off all the amphetamines they think triggered the psychosis (he was diagnosed with ADHD in 2011 and they had him on a lot of Adderal) He really is nothing like that guy from last summer, but if he can't go back to drinking and smoking weed with the same crowd.
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Works4me
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Post by Works4me on Jul 3, 2014 0:34:14 GMT -5
MPL - please look at your last 2 posts - you all are just one episode of him "hanging out with the wrong people" away from crazy-ville!
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taz157
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Post by taz157 on Jul 3, 2014 5:21:14 GMT -5
^I'm sorry to hear you saw that Carl. Ugh. The worst moment I remember wasn't the punching, even though he was holding our son at that time, DS was only two. I don't think he rememberd it. It was a year later on August 24, 2013. He took our son (there was a no contact order) and was screaming at me in the middle of the street calling me every name in the book and threatening to shoot me. He was holding our son and I was just begging him to please give him back, his brother, SIL, mother, nieces and nephews were all there trying to convince him to just hand him over, but he wouldn't. Our son was calling me "stupid f***ing, b***" and "crazy b***" at his father's coaxing and didn't understand why I was taking him from his Dad. It was awful. Finally he set him in the van and said he was going to get him some water and I took off with the doors all wide open and him chasing me down the street. After I left, he was punching the mailbox, trees, a cement wall.... I don't know how he got away from there without breaking his hand that had just had reconstructive surgery a couple months earlier. It was 5 or 6 weeks later that his noodle completely slipped off the plate and I had 6 months of peace. It was wonderful. I didn't have to worry about him anymore. He wasn't using, he wasn't living in a tent in the cold, he wasn't going to show up at my door, he couldn't even call or text. It was like a detox. He detoxed too. He's gotten a lot of help since then and is being treated for bipolar and is off all the amphetamines they think triggered the psychosis (he was diagnosed with ADHD in 2011 and they had him on a lot of Adderal) He really is nothing like that guy from last summer, but if he can't go back to drinking and smoking weed with the same crowd. Ugh MPL... I can't imagine going through that! Stay strong! You've seen how dark he can get... He will go there again. Please keep him at a very safe distance and do the minimum to satisfy what the court has ordered. ((Hugs)). No one deserves that... No one does anything to deserve that. You are laying the framework for your kids as they become adults. They deserve better and so do you. Yeah that!
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 3, 2014 7:43:57 GMT -5
SIL was pissed off that they were supposed to be responsible for him
As she should be. It sounds like ex-MIL has a few screws loose as well, be careful around her. I know you've said you want your son to have a relationship with his extended family but she sounds like a serious enabler. Nobody is going to benefit from her coddling your ex.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 10:14:57 GMT -5
SIL was pissed off that they were supposed to be responsible for himAs she should be. It sounds like ex-MIL has a few screws loose as well, be careful around her. I know you've said you want your son to have a relationship with his extended family but she sounds like a serious enabler. Nobody is going to benefit from her coddling your ex. OMG, you have no idea. She is the worst. I wouldn't even know where to begin, but enabler is an understatement.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jul 3, 2014 10:21:28 GMT -5
^ What she said! And I know sometimes you doubt it and slightly hope it will change. I know, my cousin was there. She wished it would change but it never did. She swore to her mom he was a changed man, but that was a lie. So she avoided family and friends so she did not have to explain herself or fill judge. And that was our fault, we let her down... 2 years later it still hurts, it still hurts seeing her kids that did not have to lose a mother, it still hurts to know she was barely in her 30's and did not have to die, And it hurts even more to know he is out there a free man while he left his wife internally bleed to death on their kitchen floor and disappeared for 3 days... But not enough to lock him up! I know the worse case scenario and you don't want to be it. My mom did the whole stick around for the kids till the abuse moved on to the kids and she left... But she should have left long before. You are on the right path, don't let him make you doubt yourself. And I am serious when I say if at anytime you want to waiver: close your eyes and remember the last time he knocked you out. And imagine your son walking in on that. I still remember clearly being 3 walking in on my dad beating my mom like his punching bag, she thinks I am making it up because I was too young to remember. I do, up to me running out and yelling for help and the neighbors getting involved, I remember all of it now at 29 as if it was yesterday.Stick to your guns! I'm sorry to hear you saw that Carl. Ugh. The worst moment I remember wasn't the punching, even though he was holding our son at that time, DS was only two. I don't think he rememberd it. It was a year later on August 24, 2013. He took our son (there was a no contact order) and was screaming at me in the middle of the street calling me every name in the book and threatening to shoot me. He was holding our son and I was just begging him to please give him back, his brother, SIL, mother, nieces and nephews were all there trying to convince him to just hand him over, but he wouldn't. Our son was calling me "stupid f***ing, b***" and "crazy b***" at his father's coaxing and didn't understand why I was taking him from his Dad. It was awful. Finally he set him in the van and said he was going to get him some water and I took off with the doors all wide open and him chasing me down the street. After I left, he was punching the mailbox, trees, a cement wall.... I don't know how he got away from there without breaking his hand that had just had reconstructive surgery a couple months earlier. It was 5 or 6 weeks later that his noodle completely slipped off the plate and I had 6 months of peace. It was wonderful. I didn't have to worry about him anymore. He wasn't using, he wasn't living in a tent in the cold, he wasn't going to show up at my door, he couldn't even call or text. It was like a detox. He detoxed too. He's gotten a lot of help since then and is being treated for bipolar and is off all the amphetamines they think triggered the psychosis (he was diagnosed with ADHD in 2011 and they had him on a lot of Adderal) He really is nothing like that guy from last summer, but if he can't go back to drinking and smoking weed with the same crowd. This is bad. How do you reconcile your hope of him getting better and being with you again with a guy who would use his own child that way? Crazy things do happen when people break down, but JMO the good ones just want to be left alone and the not so good ones abuse and hurt others.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 18:21:08 GMT -5
I really don't know how to do this visitation thing without it seeming date-like. He's been texting like crazy since I got back from vacation wanting to see our son and have a more set schedule of when he can "get him". He wants to take him to 4th of July fireworks and/or a parade tomorrow, so if I'm going with to this stuff I'll be tagging along and probably transporting them both. I can't think of anyone else I can ask to just tag along with me. He wants to just come to the house and have visitations here, in some ways that would make things so much easier. I could get my stuff done and wouldn't be wasting an afternoon doing something I didn't really want to and they'd have plenty to do, but I worry that he'd start to get comfortable at "home". I'd worry about him not leaving, or using the kid with something like, "I'd love to stay and tuck you into bed, and watch a movie with Mommy, but she says no", move. I don't know. Maybe it would be fine if there were ground rules and I have more back-up here with neighbors.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 18:47:44 GMT -5
Do NOT let him come visit your son at your house. Remember, avoid the problems of what he might do and how having him "home" for a while might stir up your feelings, by avoiding the situation. Forget about ground rules and having neighbors as back up. Just don't do it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 19:03:29 GMT -5
Yeah, I know. I'm just getting so tired of this and it's only been a few months. I can't imagine doing this for years. Right now, it's lots of meeting in parks. What are we going to do in the winter? It's so much easier to just take him with on what we were going to do anyhow.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 19:09:57 GMT -5
Yeah, I know. I'm just getting so tired of this and it's only been a few months. I can't imagine doing this for years. Right now, it's lots of meeting in parks. What are we going to do in the winter? It's so much easier to just take him with on what we were going to do anyhow. What's easier isn't always what's best. Sorry.
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on Jul 3, 2014 19:17:22 GMT -5
Then tell your ex that he needs to ante up 50% of the fee for the social worker who will help you out. He has not come anywhere near showing that he is responsible enough for unsupervised visits. Put together a schedule, one weekday night and one weekend afternoon and those are his visitations. And I guess you'll just have to write that time off.
This truly sucks, MPL.....but Pink is right, what isn't easier isn't what is best - either for you or your son.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Jul 3, 2014 20:18:23 GMT -5
He just got $5K out of his IRA, he can pay for supervised visits. If he won't, he must not want them too badly.
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mollyanna58
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Post by mollyanna58 on Jul 3, 2014 20:56:00 GMT -5
I really don't know how to do this visitation thing without it seeming date-like. He's been texting like crazy since I got back from vacation wanting to see our son and have a more set schedule of when he can "get him". He wants to take him to 4th of July fireworks and/or a parade tomorrow, so if I'm going with to this stuff I'll be tagging along and probably transporting them both. I can't think of anyone else I can ask to just tag along with me. He wants to just come to the house and have visitations here, in some ways that would make things so much easier. I could get my stuff done and wouldn't be wasting an afternoon doing something I didn't really want to and they'd have plenty to do, but I worry that he'd start to get comfortable at "home". I'd worry about him not leaving, or using the kid with something like, "I'd love to stay and tuck you into bed, and watch a movie with Mommy, but she says no", move. I don't know. Maybe it would be fine if there were ground rules and I have more back-up here with neighbors. No, no, no!! Your worries would become your reality. He will wind up moving in. You cannot allow visitation at your home.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 21:31:57 GMT -5
He just got $5K out of his IRA, he can pay for supervised visits. If he won't, he must not want them too badly. I give that money 6 weeks.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 21:38:33 GMT -5
Then tell your ex that he needs to ante up 50% of the fee for the social worker who will help you out. He has not come anywhere near showing that he is responsible enough for unsupervised visits. Put together a schedule, one weekday night and one weekend afternoon and those are his visitations. And I guess you'll just have to write that time off.
This truly sucks, MPL.....but Pink is right, what isn't easier isn't what is best - either for you or your son. I need to figure out how to squeeze another 10 hours out of my week. I'm seriously that much in the hole. I can't seem to get caught up on anything. It's very stressful having everything pile up. I think my time management skills suck.
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msventoux
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Post by msventoux on Jul 3, 2014 21:39:16 GMT -5
He just got $5K out of his IRA, he can pay for supervised visits. If he won't, he must not want them too badly. I give that money 6 weeks. Not your problem. We all have priorities in life. What he spends it on will tell you what his are.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jul 3, 2014 21:40:25 GMT -5
He just got $5K out of his IRA, he can pay for supervised visits. If he won't, he must not want them too badly. I give that money 6 weeks. Don't you think that money would last longer if he really, really, really wanted to spend time with his son? If it wouldn't, that should give you a very strong suggestion of just how much interest he really has.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 21:50:59 GMT -5
I give that money 6 weeks. Don't you think that money would last longer if he really, really, really wanted to spend time with his son? If it wouldn't, that should give you a very strong suggestion of just how much interest he really has. I don't know. He has a lot of things he has to pay and no income. I gave him the money 5 days ago and he had to pay me $600 (child support and $100 he owed me), $700 for rent, $500 payment to the jail (they charged him $20/day), and he's taking his car in tomorrow to replace the starter or something and the estimate was 4-$500. So, darn near half gone in 5 days. Utilities, groceries and gas for July, then August rent and child support. Yeah, 6 weeks tops if he doesn't get a job.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Jul 3, 2014 22:19:27 GMT -5
Thing is, though, MPL, all these things are his doing. They're not your doing and they're not your son's doing. They're his doing and he's responsible for the results. If he wants to see his son badly enough, he'll do what he has to do to see to it that he's able to do so. It's not your job to see that he's able to do so. Maybe his mommy will want to fix that one for him too? He's got a problem. Let him work it out.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 22:42:30 GMT -5
The only thing that happened when we were dating was he got in a bar fight and ended up spending the weekend in jail, it was the night of the big flood here and nobody knew where he was, so that was stressful, but we dated for two years and he never got so much as a parking ticket besides that. He had been working at the same place as me for several years, made good money, and we liked doing a lot of the same things. Mainly outdoor stuff. Hiking, biking, kayaking, camping...we'd spend entire weekends filled with all those things.
I was more concerned about his being such a devout Catholic when I was agnostic than anything else back then. I knew he drank, but I didn't even know about his love affair with weed or his addictive personality/mental health issues until after we were married.
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Formerly SK
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Post by Formerly SK on Jul 3, 2014 23:37:38 GMT -5
I think requiring him to pay 50% of the supervision fee is an excellent idea and I can't see how the courts would disagree with it (honestly you could try for 100% and see what the courts say). His visitation is not YOUR problem. His desire to see his kid is not YOUR problem. He needs to EARN every minute he has with his son. Don't cater so much to his feelings - they are meaningless now. Actions are the only thing that count.
Part of me doesn't quite understand why YOU would have to provide supervision to someone who assaulted you and threatened your kid. Is there a CASA rep or something that can help you get this settled? It seems like there should be more legal advice for you.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2014 0:00:59 GMT -5
The divorce took 11 days. I didn't know I would need to specify all this stuff. I thought the court handled this. I thought our son would be appointed a guardian ad litem, and there would be social workers or something involved. But, I was just asked by my attorney if I wanted the parenting time to be supervised and that's how it was written. As far as the assault and threats. He was never charged with anything but breaking a no contact order. He has no domestic charges on his record.
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