Economic Collapse Thread Recovery

[traelin0]

Readers please take note: This thread is a copy of Stay Put's old "When the Economic Collapse hits this fall will you be prepared?" This thread, and others, were so entertaining that I felt it necessary to repost them, so they wouldn't be lost forever. Please also note the timestamps for the posts. Any missing messages in the sequence which are not posted were deleted in the original thread.

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #1 - 07/17/09 01:32 PM

It's sad that many of the same people who have continued to deny all that has transpired with our economy and the government, and only reluctantly admit to the glaring facts that cannot be easily "spun", are also denying the total collapse of our economy this fall. "Recovery" is the only chant that any of them can allow themselves to speak, and in best case scenario, they delude themselves into believing that if they say it long enough it will actually come to pass. In worst case scenario, they are part of the con job to sucker as many as possible back into the markets, so that the elite can drain what little money is left, so as to take care of themselves during a depression that will make the 1929 crash (and the depression that followed) look like a cake walk by comparison.

So I ask you nay sayers of the facts and truths; when did preparing yourself and your family, as much as possible, for what will turn out to be the worst depression in human history become a dirty word? Remember. Those who fail to plan, plan to fail. Hope for the best but prepare for the worst.

If every American were to start preparing for a total collapse of our economy, and fifteen years of what will be called the new dark ages, other than the rich, who does that really hurt? In fact many more Americans could actually survive what is about to transpire in this nation.

Finally, for the sake of argument, if the worlds leading economists, courageous enough to tell it like it is (or will be) were dead wrong, how would preparing for economic meltdown hurt anyone? If anything, it would place more Americans in a stronger position no matter who is right. Not preparing could actually kill millions unnecessarily.

[traelin0]

Tax Indentured {ed. formerly kayaker}
Message #2 - 07/17/09 02:42 PM

Stay Put
Message #1 - 07/17/09 01:32 PM
If anything, it would place more Americans in a stronger position no matter who is right.

They don't want you to be prepared. They want you dependent on the Govt., the well spring from which all flows! ... I am prepared and have been moving that direction for the last 2 years. I have paid off my debts, own my property ought right, and have enough provisions to last several years. I could be in my rabbit hole for quite a while without ever sticking my head up as I have the ability to purify air and water in copious amounts for my family.

Just like the anti 2nd Amendment crowd has done in the past ... they will deny any problem until the sky is falling ... then they will come to those of us that did prepare as if we owe them something for their lack of vision and forethought. I view this no differently than hurricane preparedness when I lived in Florida.

[traelin0]

Chucklemeister
Message #3 - 07/17/09 02:49 PM

I'm not worried, Obama will save me!!

Baaaaaaaa Baaaaaaaaaaaa Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #4 - 07/17/09 03:14 PM

Tax Indentured {ed. formerly kayaker}
Message #2 - 07/17/09 02:42 PM
They don't want you to be prepared. They want you dependent on the Govt., the well spring from which all flows! ... I am prepared and have been moving that direction for the last 2 years. I have paid off my debts, own my property ought right, and have enough provisions to last several years.

kyaker, that's great news to hear. I just wish all Americans would follow suit. The only problem that I can find with your statement, is that unless you have no property taxes, you really do not own your own home/land. Try not paying your property taxes and you will find out in short order who really owns your home/land. The government does not want you to actually realize it, but we are nothing more than Surfs in their Feudal system of government. Not what the founding fathers had fought and died to give to us.

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #6 - 07/17/09 03:35 PM

effthis
Message #5 - 07/17/09 03:22 PM
and if it gets really bad, like is being suggested, gunmen that wanna storm your house will. Being debt free and having a full pantry won't help.

effthis, if your pantry is full of food, and your weapons/ammo are just as full, it is far easier to defend an entrenched position, especially against starving people (armed). Your food will keep you strong both physically/mentally against a half crazed, starving person (even one that is armed) and places your percentage of survival very high.

Most of those unprepared will find themselves inside FEMA camps, being a threat to no one, or standing in the government soup lines getting their days ration of food, and be too busy surviving on govt hand outs, to be a real threat to those of us who are prepared. The stray threat that "may" come, according to your scenario, will be dropped at 500 yards away, and the suppose threat will be over.

[traelin0]

PatrioticStablest
Message #7 - 07/17/09 07:06 PM

We are prepared in every way, have savings, no debt, food, guns, ammo, generators, and fuel, but if this happens and the hordes of starving people start running north out of Houston, don't kid yourselves, you wouldn't be able to hold them off for long.

[traelin0]

hum-ok
Message #8 - 07/17/09 07:16 PM

Thats why you do not tell people what you have and where you have it. Do you have a well for water and if you do do you have a hand pump because without electricity you cannot get it unless you do. Do you have cast cook ware? Do yo uhave basic fishing equipment, do you have basic first aid supplies, the list goes on.

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #9 - 07/17/09 07:27 PM

PatrioticStablest
Message #7 - 07/17/09 07:06 PM
hordes of starving people start running north out of Houston, don't kid yourselves, you wouldn't be able to hold them off for long.

Concrete cowboys, in any mental state, trying to go up against a group of fully trained ex-Marines, soldiers, and avid hunters, which my group encompasses, will not only hold them off but will see a serious decrease in the Texas census.

[traelin0]

PatrioticStablest
Message #10 - 07/17/09 07:32 PM

Do you have a well for water and if you do do you have a hand pump because without electricity you cannot get it unless you do. Do you have cast cook ware? Do yo uhave basic fishing equipment, do you have basic first aid supplies, the list goes on.

No water pump, well is to deep.

Between us, the neighbor behind and beside us we might make it. I grew up the old, poor ways, as did hubby. Our neighbor just happens to be an ex butcher also. But you got to keep the meat so you can use it. I had a bunch of chickens, they hit the freezer and are gone now, about time for more.

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #11 - 07/17/09 07:45 PM

PatrioticStablest
Message #10 - 07/17/09 07:32 PM
But you got to keep the meat so you can use it.

Well with a barn, smoke house, ice house, chicken coop, root cellar, and yes even a hand pump on this old farm, as well as all other necessities, we'll be set.

[traelin0]

PatrioticStablest
Message #12 - 07/17/09 07:50 PM

We can also head out for southern Indiana where I still own 25 acres. My MIL has her mom's house we could stay in also on about 10 acres.

The area up there is teeeming with deer, they are lousy with deer, and lots of places to fish also. We would do better there, its a rural area.

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #13 - 07/17/09 08:07 PM

PatrioticStablest
Message #12 - 07/17/09 07:50 PM
We can also head out for southern Indiana where I still own 25 acres. My MIL has her mom's house we could stay in also on about 10 acres.

Consolidating family, useful friends, as well as all pooled resources is your best bet. Many hands make for light work. This is especially true when trying to survive an economic collapse that is expected to last for up to 15 years. Whether that be planting non-hybrid crops, feeding the animals, cleaning, collecting milk, eggs, etc., or holding off possible hordes of crazed individuals.

Also, I would be worried about the fact that your neighbor is skilled as a butcher. If he gets hungry enough......... He'd be licking his fingers as he states to the police (if they are still around in any force) "Officer, I have no idea where my old neighbors are." ;D

[traelin0]

PatrioticStablest
Message #14 - 07/17/09 09:34 PM

Not to worried about that. He has about 20 horses, if worse came to worse.

[traelin0]

HenryClay
Message #15 - 07/18/09 03:16 AM

I ran across a beautiful piece of "old insight" that I thought was exactly on target when it was made, but has never been widely accepted even as it has been happening. It follows exactly the thought behind something one of our founders said. I'm sorry, but I can't recall who said it or what prompted him to say it. Maybe it was as he was leaving politics. "We have given you a free nation, but it will be up to you to keep it."

This more recent quote was uttered in 1944, and among this persons accomplishments was the co-founding of the ACLU.

Another of his quotes resides as one of her favorites in the Princeton graduation yearbook of Obama's Supreme Court Nominee Sonia Sotomayor; "I am not an advocate for lost causes, but rather for causes not yet won."

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #16 - 07/18/09 12:31 PM

Henry, just curious. Your post has what to do with preparing for the upcoming collapse of our economy?

[traelin0]

Reformed DayTrader
Message #17 - 07/18/09 02:38 PM

When the Economic Collapse hits this fall will you be prepared?

Good question but not too sure about an Economic Collapse because we are beginning to see a few companies report good earnings for the second quarter. We should see how more tech companies did this coming week including Microsoft, and Amazon.com..to name just a few. Intel hit it out of the park last week and IBM did better than most expected so I remain hopeful or optimistic that the tech companies will help to restore confidence in our markets along with the banking industry.

[traelin0]

Steve Goober
Message #18 - 07/18/09 02:38 PM

The only question is how long can the powerz hold it together with their illusions. Is there actaully a point at which they will capitulate or are they grasping at straws desperately attemptimg to maintain the status quo?

I honestly think it is probably out of control or near that point. The lies,manipulation, funny money are all that is holding everything together, So it is only a matter of when not if. Perhaps it is best at this juncture to collapse and start over???But who would be in power on the other side of events? Prepare yourselves as best you can. It would be a pretty crappy day if we had to shoot people wanting to take our stores and I do not want to forced into that position. This really pisses me off because it is a replay of a time previous where our government forced the situation on us. There may not be any other viable choices so preparation and forthought are totally necessary. No doubt about it. Let's hope for a better day yet be vigilant..Goober

[traelin0]

Steve Goober
Message #19 - 07/18/09 03:17 PM

I hope to be gone before this all plays out, but have no control over some events and cicumstances. But it occurs to me that communications between like minds would be absolutely necesssary. I doubt that many could stand alone as resolute souls against the powerz especially those that live in the populated areas ....Goober

[traelin0]

Forque {ed. formerly Marshabar}
Message #20 - 07/18/09 05:41 PM

Maybe I'm just tired. I'm beginning to think an actual physical crisis resulting in death is the only thing that will get Washington back to basics. I don't see the humor anymore. They are a bunch of killers in Washington. They aren't playing games and neither should we. They are feeding our grandchildren to Moloch.

[traelin0]

Steve Goober
Message #21 - 07/18/09 09:40 PM

Moloch ?

[traelin0]

Robert Hanssen
Message #22 - 07/18/09 10:02 PM

The money aspect is just a means to an end. The real scenario if it develops is about population control. They want to get rid of useless sheep that cant do anything for themselves. Another key indicator of population control which i think will get out of control in their favor is this so called pandemic swine flu. More people die from anything else than swine flu yet its a pandemic. When the fall rolls around get ready for the bodies to start dropping, along with the scenario of a collapse. If it happens. As to the preparation. Mum is the word.

[traelin0]

PatrioticStablest
Message #23 - 07/18/09 11:36 PM

Per the WSJ China now owns 20% of our debt, Russia and Japan own the other 20%, soon we will not be able to set any policies without their consent. China is now buying short term debt instead of long term so they can it quickly if the need arises. To me that is the scariest scenario.

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #24 - 07/18/09 11:52 PM

Reformed DayTrader
Message #17 - 07/18/09 02:38 PM
Good question but not too sure about an Economic Collapse because we are beginning to see a few companies report good earnings for the second quarter.

Reformed Day Trader, I don't think that you get it. There are tens of millions of Americans unemployed, and those are just the ones that our government is forced to admit to. We have tens of millions more who no longer are counted as their benefits have run out, and therefore are not being tallied by our totally corrupt government. Then there are the tens of millions of Americans who are underemployed (part time minimum wage jobs). A handful of companies posting profits means squat to the economy, and has no bearing on the inevitable collapse that will ensue this coming fall.

We do not have the manufacturing base that we had in the 1930's, 40's, and 50's to pull us out of this total collapse. We have exported our entire manufacturing base over to China, and now import the goods that we use to export to the whole world. Both Democrats and Republicans did this to our people, so that a group of corrupt individuals could go from millionaires to billionaires by paying 10 cents an hour for labor instead of $15/hr.

The corpratestocracy and the traitors in government did this to every American by turning us against each other. Let's pit the Americans DNC and GOP against each other, and push our plans right past their noses. We will get the fascist government before you even know what hit you, because they know that as long as they both can continue to divide us, they will in fact conquer us.

[traelin0]

Reformed DayTrader
Message #25 - 07/19/09 12:03 AM

Stay Put
Message #24 - 07/18/09 11:52 PM
Reformed Day Trader, I don't think that you get it

I do get it and have gotten it for two years. But I don't think we are going to see an Economic collapse this fall despite the high unemployment numbers that are a lagging indicator. But that being said, I spend @40 hours during the work week watching the stock and bond markets in order to trade. And there are some companies who are now beginning to show decent earnings for the second quarter and they are also beginning to give positive guidance for the rest of this year and in 2010, i.e. Intel, IBM, Google, Hewlett Packard, and we should learn about Microsoft this Thursday. Also most of the IPO's that came to market this year are all performing quite well; including Rosetta Stone, Digital Globe, and Solar Winds to name just three of the recent IPO's.

[traelin0]

Steve Goober
Message #26 - 07/19/09 12:14 AM

I don't understand why more people don't see some of the obvious real indicators that StayPut is pointing out. The unemployment figures are well past what is reported and growing every day so why are we being spoon fed the opposite as factual? I guess because people will believe it. The economic atrocities committed and the lies and distortion are completely obvious to any who will look and pay attention.

Of course there can be no recovery given the real circumstances that exist. The lies and distortion are beyond imagination, incomprehensible.

What I really don't get is the end game? Is it total collapse and then domination? Or do these people really believe their own bull shot? I can't tell for sure but some of the take overs and power grabs that have happened make me very distrustful of Obama and his minions. This is way to close to previous times in history for my liking..Goober

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #27 - 07/19/09 12:30 AM

You remind me of the president and all of the current administration patting themselves on the back because they are going to spend $13 Trillion dollars to create 65,000 new jobs. At that rate, this nation will be bankrupt for the next 200 years if they want to put any real number of people back to work.

Unless we stop all bail outs/hand outs, raise tariffs and force all manufacturing back on U.S. soil, and thereby putting America back to work; repeal all NAFTA, CAFTA, Free Trade, etc., and get us out of the One World Order, UN, Council on Foreign Affairs, IMF, etc., we have no hope at all. That will not happen under either the DNC or GOP. It will only happen by cleaning house, and voting in a total majority of independent candidates, oval office, house and senate.

The collapse will happen whether you personally believe it or not. Certain companies will continue to make profits in the midst of the collapse, but that has, nor will it have any bearing on the fact that this nation will be in the greatest depression know to man. Your spewing out rays of sunshine will not help people, as a whole, to start preparing themselves and their families for a future that will be the bleakest that America could ever believe possible in this once great nation, and quite possibly cause some or many to hold off their preparations. Do you really want to be responsible for quite possibly causing the deaths of untold numbers with your sunny forecasts, in light of what the worlds top economists have all reported as a "dire future"?

[traelin0]

Reformed DayTrader
Message #28 - 07/19/09 12:33 AM

I believe firmly committed to high tech companies who I think will lead the way out of this recession. Oracle, Hewlet Packard, Apple, IBM. Intel, Microsoft and etc are doing some good things this year so I remain an optimist and not a doom and gloomier or Obama hater...sorry but that is just one man's opinion.. And there are strong financial reports that indicate our banks are earing big bucks again along with the possibility that Ford and GM might begin to come back this year.

[traelin0]

Stay Put
Message #29 - 07/19/09 12:38 AM

Do you mean the financial reports that have been exposed by all (on the JJ Market board) as being totally contrived and completely unreliable? RDT is either stuck on stupid and can't change gears, or he's a plant.

[traelin0]

Reformed DayTrader
Message #30 - 07/19/09 12:39 AM

Stay Put
Message #27 - 07/19/09 12:30 AM
The collapse will happen whether you personally believe it or not

I don't believe it nor do I ascribe to your silliness which is probably just cut and pasted from Peter Schiff or Dr Doom negative comments, so spare me all of your pontificating. I just don't buy into a economic collapse from my reading of the economic indicators or the stock market. If things were as bad as you claim we would have an S&P at @ 500 and a Dow at @ 3000...or lower...