resolution
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Post by resolution on Jul 8, 2013 14:33:30 GMT -5
I don't see it as a free speech issue because the TSA agent was at work. I know at my work I can say whatever I want, and I can be disciplined and fired for it if it doesn't meet our code of conduct. By entering into the employee-employer relationship, I am agreeing to meet certain standards of conduct when I interact with coworkers or the public.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jul 8, 2013 14:36:08 GMT -5
I'm convinced - time to do away with the TSA.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 8, 2013 14:40:22 GMT -5
I think when we're talking about people in positions of authority, the 'free speech' argument goes out the window.
If someone cat-calls you on the street, you are free to walk away. No harm done.
If a police officer pulls you over and makes a sexual comment, is it also no big deal? Would you feel free to leave?
When someone in a position of power makes a derogatory comment toward you - WHILE THEY ARE ON THE JOB - it is not quite the same as someone who posts a Twitter pic of your outfit with an unflattering caption.
Do you think this would've been newsworthy if some random guy walking through the airport had made the same comment? No one called the press when Thyme told that guy to wear pants. You are going to seriously pick apart my post because it doesn't fit the exact OP when you guys have been talking about things like rape?
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Jul 8, 2013 14:40:33 GMT -5
I'm convinced - time to do away with the TSA. I was convinced before this. I still don't understand how making us take off our shoes makes us safer. And how they can miss guns in a backpack, but my half empty Gatorade sets of the emergency alarms.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2013 14:43:13 GMT -5
if the question is just the TSA guy, again he was wrong
no one is denying that.....
but some of the comments have been more in general.....
everyone has a camera now....and they are using them
and there will always be perverts around trying to get the "naughty" shots
you can wear whatever you like....just realize the potential for comments and unwanted attention
and you may become infamous for reasons that you may not like......
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 8, 2013 14:45:01 GMT -5
I'm convinced - time to do away with the TSA. I was convinced before this. I still don't understand how making us take off our shoes makes us safer. And how they can miss guns in a backpack, but my half empty Gatorade sets of the emergency alarms. I think that as an American citizen I should have the right to enter my own country without a passport. someday when I have lots of free time I am going to do it and see what they do. They would still have the right to call me a dumbass trouble maker.
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imawino
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Post by imawino on Jul 8, 2013 14:53:01 GMT -5
The danger to situations like this is that a disappropriate punishment is handed out because of hyperbole. I think a nice turn to this thread, since everything else has been beaten to death, is what should the punishment be for the TSA officer? I'll start: Write up.. No suspension or loss of pay. If he continues to do similar things, then further action required. I think he should be written up and required to attend classes on PC behavior. No really sure what "PC" has to do with anything here. Shouldn't a grown man knowing better than to hassle a 15-year old girl about how much skin she is showing fall under plan old "correct" behavior? It's not some liberal concept.
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Peace Of Mind
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Post by Peace Of Mind on Jul 8, 2013 14:55:14 GMT -5
Holy crap! Explaining it right became explaining it to death with many twists and turns like a who done it mystery movie!
So what did you all decide? Is the kid a slutty Princess or is the judgmental dude an ass? We need a poll.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jul 8, 2013 14:59:47 GMT -5
Holy crap! Explaining it right became explaining it to death with many twists and turns like a who done it mystery movie! So what did you all decide? Is the kid a slutty Princess or is the judgmental dude an ass? We need a poll. Can't it be both?
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Jul 8, 2013 14:59:59 GMT -5
I think he should be written up and required to attend classes on PC behavior. No really sure what "PC" has to do with anything here. Shouldn't a grown man knowing better than to hassle a 15-year old girl about how much skin she is showing fall under plan old "correct" behavior? It's not some liberal concept. Clearly it's not politically correct to mention that a 15 year old girl may be over exposing her "attributes". So he needs to go to PC class. BTW, liberals do not have a monopoly on political correctness.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Jul 8, 2013 15:01:25 GMT -5
Holy crap! Explaining it right became explaining it to death with many twists and turns like a who done it mystery movie! So what did you all decide? Is the kid a slutty Princess or is the judgmental dude an ass? We need a poll. Can't it be both? Yes it can. Hence all the uproar. Each of us tends to read into a situation our own experiences and biases.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2013 15:09:24 GMT -5
No, it's not both. It's one-and-a-half. The judgmental dude is an ass, and she is only a Princess.
<You guys have to go to Remedial Math when I go to Remedial Reading.>
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swamp
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THEY’RE EATING THE DOGS!!!!!!!
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Post by swamp on Jul 8, 2013 15:10:58 GMT -5
The 15 year old me would have wet myself if the TSA dude told me to cover up.
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Peace Of Mind
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Post by Peace Of Mind on Jul 8, 2013 15:12:13 GMT -5
The 15 year old me would have wet myself if the TSA dude told me to cover up. From fear or excitement?
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jul 8, 2013 15:13:18 GMT -5
fear.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jul 8, 2013 15:14:04 GMT -5
Fear...of her excitement.
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Pants
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Post by Pants on Jul 8, 2013 15:16:34 GMT -5
Having read through all nine pages...
Wow. Just, wow.
This person has the right to wear whatever she wants. You do not have the right to comment on a stranger's clothing, with the possible exception of, "excuse me, maybe you don't know this but you have toilet paper hanging out of your pants."
I don't give a shit whether your comment comes from "concern" over how she is dressed or anger over her tempting you with her hot young body or whether you feel she is behaving without modesty and "not respecting herself." *Snort* If you are not familiar with the concept of concern-trolling, let me sum it up for you: you believe that she doesn't understand what she is doing/the reaction she is provoking. You are refusing to grant her full agency as a person capable of making their own choices and decisions. Because she is a woman.
The fact that 80% of this thread is about how she is dressed, how he could possibly have been in the right, how she overreacted and how she was clearly asking for it anyway is a sad commentary.
If you don't like the way someone is dressed, don't look. Period. There is no need for comments. If you cannot restrain yourself from making comments or staring at people who are dressed in a way that deviates from your particular perception of appropriate, perhaps you should begin wearing blinders.
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Peace Of Mind
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Post by Peace Of Mind on Jul 8, 2013 15:20:15 GMT -5
Unless a skirt is tucked in the undies or a fly is open, etc. I still feel he was out of bounds for his comments. Even if he was a concerned grandfather type (yeah, riiiight) he had no right to say what he did or in that manner while at his place of employment unless that's in his job description. I'm pretty sure it's not.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Jul 8, 2013 15:23:09 GMT -5
If you don't like the way someone is dressed, don't look. Period. There is no need for comments. If you cannot restrain yourself from making comments or staring at people who are dressed in a way that deviates from your particular perception of appropriate, perhaps you should begin wearing blinders.
It was his job to look. When you go through security, you'd better believe that they are going to look you over. And everyone agrees that his remark was out of line. I just think she and her father over-reacted.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jul 8, 2013 15:23:48 GMT -5
You do not have the right to comment on a stranger's clothing, with the possible exception of, "excuse me, maybe you don't know this but you have toilet paper hanging out of your pants."
Maybe we need to debate what we mean by "rights." There are no laws forbidding you from giving an unsolicited opinion to someone, as long as it does not cause a public safety issue. It is most definitely bad manners. And it may be against the standards for his job. But it is his "right" to express himself verbally within certain limits.
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imawino
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Post by imawino on Jul 8, 2013 15:24:12 GMT -5
No really sure what "PC" has to do with anything here. Shouldn't a grown man knowing better than to hassle a 15-year old girl about how much skin she is showing fall under plan old "correct" behavior? It's not some liberal concept. Clearly it's not politically correct to mention that a 15 year old girl may be over exposing her "attributes". So he needs to go to PC class. BTW, liberals do not have a monopoly on political correctness. It is simply not correct. At all. What's the part that makes it politically incorrect, versus plain old incorrect? If he needs to go to a class, it should teach him that his behavior was wrong - not "wrong" with an asterisk, or "wrong" because some sensitive people might over-react. Wrong, period. "PC" is a term people toss around that implies that it's only incorrect to do certain things because people have gotten overly sensitive, but I'm pretty sure it's never been okay for a man in a position of authority to randomly comment to underage girls about the amount of skin they are showing.
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973beachbum
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Post by 973beachbum on Jul 8, 2013 15:26:40 GMT -5
Having read through all nine pages...
Wow. Just, wow.
This person has the right to wear whatever she wants. You do not have the right to comment on a stranger's clothing, with the possible exception of, "excuse me, maybe you don't know this but you have toilet paper hanging out of your pants."
I don't give a shit whether your comment comes from "concern" over how she is dressed or anger over her tempting you with her hot young body or whether you feel she is behaving without modesty and "not respecting herself." *Snort* If you are not familiar with the concept of concern-trolling, let me sum it up for you: you believe that she doesn't understand what she is doing/the reaction she is provoking. You are refusing to grant her full agency as a person capable of making their own choices and decisions. Because she is a woman.
The fact that 80% of this thread is about how she is dressed, how he could possibly have been in the right, how she overreacted and how she was clearly asking for it anyway is a sad commentary.
If you don't like the way someone is dressed, don't look. Period. There is no need for comments. If you cannot restrain yourself from making comments or staring at people who are dressed in a way that deviates from your particular perception of appropriate, perhaps you should begin wearing blinders. But people do have the right to comment on whatever they want. You may not like the comment and it may be rude but people absolutely have the right to make whatever comments they want. (Of course I'm skipping the part about his job because you made a blanket statement not about the TSA job.) and no I don't have to cover my eyes when people walk around looking foolish. Anyone who doesn't want me to laugh, shoudn't dress like a clown.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Jul 8, 2013 15:28:03 GMT -5
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 8, 2013 15:29:00 GMT -5
If you cannot restrain yourself from making comments or staring at people who are dressed in a way that deviates from your particular perception of appropriate, perhaps you should begin wearing blinders.
That's going to make shopping at Sam's really hard.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 8, 2013 15:35:49 GMT -5
Maybe if other people had stood up to lesser inappropriate behaviors than an egregious one like this would not have happened.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2013 15:37:11 GMT -5
Random strangers may not like what my daughter is wearing, but if they have the nerve to say something to her, then they should be prepared for this momma to "overreact" to their rudeness. If it were an authority figure like a TSA guy, I would most definitely have an issue with them telling my daughter OR son what they should or shouldn't be wearing if what they are wearing is within dress code and the law.
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imawino
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Post by imawino on Jul 8, 2013 15:38:28 GMT -5
If you cannot restrain yourself from making comments or staring at people who are dressed in a way that deviates from your particular perception of appropriate, perhaps you should begin wearing blinders.
That's going to make shopping at Sam's really hard. LOL. Just look discreetly and keep the mocking under your breath. Works for the rest of us.
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Jul 8, 2013 15:41:36 GMT -5
Things I have learned from these 10 pages:
Blaming the victim in harassment is ok, as long as they weren't dressed in whatever you deemed "appropriate"
Women dress only for the amusement of others, and want the attention, even when they say they don't.
Any underage girl is doubly in for it because a) she's a teen, of COURSE she's lying/a princess/drama queen/stupid b) she's female.
If you disagree with the whole victim blaming mentality, you have it in for men/society or just don't understand that everything is not a big deal. Or you think there should never be any consequences for your actions.Maybe some of both.
Attitudes like the ones I've seen here are the exact ones that kept me in massively oversized T-shirts and slouching from the age of about 12 forward.
<<walks away, shaking head>>
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Jul 8, 2013 15:41:55 GMT -5
If you don't like the way someone is dressed, don't look. Period. There is no need for comments. If you cannot restrain yourself from making comments or staring at people who are dressed in a way that deviates from your particular perception of appropriate, perhaps you should begin wearing blinders.It was his job to look. When you go through security, you'd better believe that they are going to look you over. And everyone agrees that his remark was out of line. I just think she and her father over-reacted. It still has not been explained to me how the dad overreacted. What was he suppose to do instead? "Sorry princess some dickwad thought you were slutty. Nevermind that he has legal authority to pat you down. No it's ok kiddo. Just let people in authority say that to you. It isn't right, but you know that is the world we live in." He spoke to the guy's supervisor that seems like a pretty reasonable action to me. Sure he blogged about it because that is his job to blog.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jul 8, 2013 15:42:04 GMT -5
Just look discreetly and keep the mocking under your breath.
True. We saw a lady wearing what we thought was a bathing suit at the State fair last year. Nope, it was an extremely short skirt. . . with no underwear underneath. DH saw it first and made me look to see if he was crazy. Her cootchie flashed every time she walked. Do people not look in the mirror before they leave the house?
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